Mac peeps, what am I missing?

[Ghoulish Delight]

Okay, it's getting close to time to buy a new computer. Our dell is almost 4 years old. It's still useable, but it's at the point that it can't handle the newest software, and it's having general performance problems that can probably be attributed to things like the age of the hard drive.

I'd LOVE to buy a Mac this time around, but I don't know. I priced a Power Mac G5 vs. a Dell. I can get a mid-range Power Mac for just over $3k, vs. a high end Dell for under $2k. Yikes. But then I took a peek at the iMac. Here's where I need to know what I'm missing.

I looked at the iMac. I looked at the highest end iMac (the 20"). Added a little RAM, added a wireless keybaord. It's a 2.0Ghz processor whereas the Power Mac I priced is only 1.8Ghz. Everything eles I speced out the same for the Power Mac and the iMac. And the iMac is about $900 cheaper! Same everything, same size display, faster processor, $900 cheaper.

So what am I missing? Is upgradeability the only sacrafice? What about things like number of USB ports? Reliability (I priced Apple Care into both of them)? What gives? What makes the Power Mac $900 better?

[DisneyFan25863]

Upgradeablity, FSB, Graphics Card, Disc Drive and a few others.



Though I've heard the 20in iMac's screen is simply amazing.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Actually, I was looking at the low end PM, so the iMac FSB is faster (667 vs. 600) than that. If I start looking at the models with faster FSB, that $900 inflates real quick. By Disc Drive, do you mean floppy drive? Because I don't really care, and if I did I'd just get an external (or, more likely, just use USB sticks). I was comparing like graphics cards. I know the PM has the option for a higher end card, but I'm cheap and wouldn't get it anyway. The Radeon 9600 is good enough for me.

[blueerica]

While I may not be quite as tech savvy as others here, I notice that Steve's PowerMac G5 is considerably faster than my iMac, and my iMac is pretty fast.

I dunno -- having something more than the iMac isn't really important (IMHO) if you're doing anything less than working with large media files, as Steve does. Heck our roommate just cut his film on his iBook, which isn't nearly as fast as my iMac, so you can do the home movie thing on the iMac, too. Macs don't need to be expensive unless you *need* them to be (for the specs).

I say, get the iMac, unless someone more genius than I (nearly everyone here) says otherwise. ;)

[Ghoulish Delight]

What about gaming?

[Fab]

Mostly, it's the label. "I paid more for this computer than you did. I'm one of the millions who 'think different'. I'm a loner, Dottie, a rebel...." It's the difference (esp. after spending a long romantic weekend with the Inspiron 9300) between getting a t-shirt at the Gap and getting one at Abercrombie and Fitch. The salespeople are hotter and it's a lot more expensive, and you'll look a lot trendier using it.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I prefer Macs for several reasons. If I can afford one, I'm going to get one. But this wasn't a "Mac vs. PC" question. My mind's made up on that. It's just a question of whether the Mac that I can afford is worth affording.

[surfinmuse]

GD, PowerMacs are generally faster than iMacs, even with the same processor speed because of other factors like something called the L2 Cache I believe, among others (like BUS speed too). Also, the video card (and VRAM) might differ as well. I don't have the specs to compare side by side, but I do know that there are other variables involved besides processor speed.

[Ghoulish Delight]

There's no doubt that anything other than the lowest end Power Mac, with the 1Ghz+ front side bus and dual processor is no comparison to the iMac. But those just aren't in the budget, so not even on my radar. The low end Power Mac that I MIGHT be able to afford has a slower processor AND a slower front side bus, so on the surface, the iMac should be a faster machine. I just want to make sure there's no other major compelling reason to go with the low end Power PC over the significantly cheaper high end iMac.

I suppose I'm also wondering how the high end iMac compares to a high end PC. But that's a harder comparison to make since it's comparing Apples and, um, PCs.

[DisneyFan25863]

Actually, I was looking at the low end PM, so the iMac FSB is faster (667 vs. 600) than that. If I start looking at the models with faster FSB, that $900 inflates real quick. By Disc Drive, do you mean floppy drive? Because I don't really care, and if I did I'd just get an external (or, more likely, just use USB sticks). I was comparing like graphics cards. I know the PM has the option for a higher end card, but I'm cheap and wouldn't get it anyway. The Radeon 9600 is good enough for me.


Actually, I ment the DVD+/-RW drive. But looking at it now, they are both 8x.

The iMac doesn't have DVI or ADC output like the Powermac does.

The iMac comes with a 250 GB drive compared to the Powermac's 80.

The iMac includes Bluetooth and 802.11G, the Powermac doesn't.

The powermac has some added on doohickeys that no one really needs.


If I were you, I would go with the iMac.

BTW...a computer guy like yourself can probably get away with no Applecare. I didn't get it on my Powerbook, and everything is just dandy. The stores also have free support, through the genius bar. I brought in mine (out of warrenty) with one broken key, and they replaced the entire keyboard free of charge.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Hmm, perhaps I can get away without Applecare. I'm a bit gun-shy as my previous Mac required 2 monitor replacements under Applecare. Of course, that was 6 or 7 years ago.

[surfinmuse]

GD, you know how the Applecare deals works right? You are covered for all parts & labor w/in the first year; I've gathered from other posts that you probably live in OC, so if anything unbecoming happens to it, you can take it to the nearest Apple Store (2 in OC that I know of, South Coast Plaza, and Fashion Island), and they'll fix whatever needs to be fixed. A couple of months before the end of year 1, you will get a letter in the mail (provided you register the iMac upon startup) and they will try to sell you Applecare then. You can decide if you do need it then, after a whole year with it.

Since you're computer-savvy and probably will not have any need for tech spt calls, I would forego the AppleCare for now, but know that you have the option to pick it up w/in the year. You might get a feel for how service-prone your iMac (coupled with your usage) is by then. My friend had to take his roughly 8-month-old iMac in to replace some mechanism in the slot-load drive.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Oh yeah, I'd forgotten that they allow you to add on, that's a good point.

[FEJ]

A creative ad agency on my route are adding a couple iMacs instead of PowerMacs. They seem real happy with them.

[blueerica]

I have found that my gaming hasn't been as affected by the mac. In fact, the quality of game that's available on a mac is pretty good, however, if it's a multiplayer game, there just aren't many options in terms of voice comms for mac that everyone can use. The more I think of it, certain games are PC only, like The Matrix games, but I don't really care. There are enough options out there for me to play on a mac, that it only stung for a second, and then I though "Their loss."

DF25863 & surfinmuse are right, however -- add it on later, get the feel for it. You're far more tech-savvy than your average user, even your average mac user...

[mousepod]

As a dyed-in-the-wool mac geek (we have three working desktop macs and a laptop in the house, plus and an old PowerMac and Powerbook in the "throw away" pile in the basement), I'll toss in my .02:

If you're looking at an iMac vs a single-processor PM, then iMac is the way to go. If you wind up wanting to add more drives (optical or otherwise) and don't mind a bunch of firewire or usb cables, then no big deal.

If, on the other hand, you want to do any serious processor-intensive work like editing video or working with massive graphics files, then a dual-processor PM is the way to go. Another obvious plus to the PM is the ability swap drives and upgrade your RAM. You can also have multiple monitors work seamlessly with a PM.

As far as my recommendation on applecare, I say buy it. You can wait until 365 days after you purchase your computer to take the plunge, but it is absolutely worth it. Speaking as a long-time mac owner who almost never calls any tech support, the extended warranty on parts and labor just can't be beat. My iBook G3 developed a problem with the firewire port a couple of months after the first year. Due to some boneheaded design, the firewire port was soldered directly to the logic board and the only available repair was a complete replacement of the logic board. The replacement cost with AppleCare - $0. The out-of-warranty charge to fix it - $900. The cost of a new iBook (at the time) - $1200. Buy AppleCare.

[surfinmuse]

I'm an AppleCare advocate myself, esp. for the portables. I'm not "gentle" with our laptops, so I've always purchased AppleCare for our Powerbooks and iBooks.

MousePod, a friend of mine had the IDENTICAL problem to yours on his iBook G3. I think it happened within the first few months, and after that incident, he went ahead and purchased the AppleCare extension.

[Kevy Baby]

Not much to add to this conversation: I think things have been well covered.

Except to warn you about one little detail on the latest iMac (I have the 17" model). Because everything is crammed into a relatively small case, temperature was of course a concern in design. I don't run into overheatng problems, but when the fan kicks on (which with me is quite often due to processor use), it is quite noisy. Since it sits on your desktop instead of under your desk, it is even more noticeable.

It's a cool looking machine (if you get extra RAM, install it yourself - it's simple and worth it to look inside the cse!), but I think there might have been better choices for me - the noise issue is very bothersome. I use an eMac at home (actually do video editing, but probably not to the extent that Tramspotter does) and it keeps me quite happy for the investment I made. Although I do wish I had an LCD instead of the CRT.

A couple other notes on the iMac: since it is slot load CD, you cannot put the small CDs into the machine. With all the other Macs currently out, they are tray load (at least I think they are), and you can use the small discs. Also, it is a good thing that floppies are not an issue: no Mac is available with a floppy drive. (although external USB drives are cheap).

Mostly, it's the label.Yeah, that's why I have a Mac. :rolleyes:

[Ghoulish Delight]

If I get Applecapple care, it will be for the replacement aspect. I'm sure my old trouble shooting skills will return to me with use, and if not I have many many people I can count on for help. But, as mousepod points out, all it takes is one minor hardware problem to make it worth it (like I said, my monitor needed to be replaced twice under my old Applecare, it was a damned good thing I had it).

We have no plans on doing anything particulary intensive with this. Gaming and simple photoshop work (for Mouseadventure shirts, of course) are the most demanding things I'll be asking of it, and it appears to have the specs to handle those. And considering how much desk space will be saved, a few extra cables and external peripherals hardly seems like they'd be a big deal. Thanks for the heads up on the noise issue, Kevy. I wonder if the extra volume the 20" affords mitigates that at all, or if they've perhaps improved the fan since you got yours.

[Tramspotter]

I'm on my phone so bear with me...

You nailed it upgradeability is the main difference.

The memory is a different form factor and harder to come by... as always with macs buying the memory elsewhere (not from apple) will save you qite a bit just be sure with an I-mac to get the correct type. with an I-mac you have to expand externaly with hard disk space periferals and the built in monitor is your main think that it is more dificult to go dual fool (if your not planing to then is not a problem).

sounds to me like all you will need is photoshop and if you want server space for easy hosting/bacup/free usefull software a mac dot com account.

Call me if you want further details...

as for software if it was written opensource in C++ you can probably compile it with OS X's BSD like guts... if you know how to abuse the Gimp for instance don't need photoshop....

thake care man and GL.... BTW I didn't get the Apple Care and you don't need to take the upsell after the one year you can go bare and then change your mind they just require a inspection to make sure it is in working order then yer GTG wish I had with my old G4...I mean my high tech doorstop

[Stan4dSteph]

Silly me, I thought this thread was going to be about Peeps.

http://www.marshmallowpeeps.com/images/about/peeps_all_seasons/peep1.jpg

[Ghoulish Delight]

Actually, it looks like they've standardized and the the G5 iMacs now have 184-pin dimms just like Powermacs.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Many thanks to our Mac community for all the info! You people rock, per usual. :)

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yes, thank you indeed.

Of course, after all that, I'm now in the process of talking myself up to the dual proc. Powermac.

I had one important goal for whatever we end up with next, and that is that is to make sure it's not obsolete tomorrow. That's what had me looking at Macs, because while you can get a PC for waaaay cheaper than any Mac, to get one that's not just good enough for today's applications but powerful enough to keep up with a few generations of applications, I'd be spending in the $2000 range anyway. So why not look at Macs.

And while it was obvious that the extra $900 for the single proc Powermac over the iMac wasn't going to be worth much to me, it's not so obvious that the extra $1000 for the dual proc isn't. The iMac would certainly serve us well for now, but for how long? Whereas the 2.0Ghz dual Powermac, with its increased expandability would certainly have a significant shelf life.

It's only $1000, right? If that buys an extra year or two, it's totally worth it, right? C'mon, talk me into it. :D

[DisneyFan25863]

Remember if you buy the dual proc powermac, you will also have to buy a screen for it. Dell offers a 20.1 inch widescreen that is identical (same panel and everything) to the Apple screen for under $400 shipped, however, and it is quite a deal (trying to save up enough money for one myself, but Florida and Tiger are on the tops of my list now).

Remember with the dual proc powermac you also get the faster FSB, a dual layer 16x DVD drive, faster memory, and a better graphics card.

About the iMac's fans: In the 2nd gen (released a few weeks ago), they fixed the fan problem, from what I've heard at least.


If you decide to go with the PowerMac, wait until WWDC (early July). Rumor has it that dual core processors will make their way in to the line, and prices will be cut by as much as $500 :)

[Ghoulish Delight]

Good to hear. I've already been looking at monitor elsewhere. Is the Dell one really the exact same monitor? Sweet, because I really like the quality of the Mac ones and was considering shelling the extra $400.

Yes, I'm aware of the faster FSB (as I mentioned above). I'm having another set of dilemnas, though. Where to begin...

1) Graphics card. I'd really like to upgrade to one of the two higher end graphics cards (the GeForce Ultra 3800 or the ATI 800x). I have several questions though that I can't seem to track down answers to.
- Is there a difference between the versions of these cards sold through Apple/Apple resellers vs. the "PC" version generally available? I believe I found that the "only" difference is that the Mac ones are firmware keyed, but that reflashing is a bit of risky business. Is that correct?
- What's the difference between the GeForce Ultra 3800 and the GeForce 3800 GT?

2) I've looked at Mac catalog sites, including macconnection.com. I found something odd. Take a look at this system (http://www.macconnection.com/ProductDetail?Sku=5138199) vs. this one (http://www.macconnection.com/ProductDetail?Sku=5777530). What gives. Here's what I see:
- System A has a crapier vid card (not a problem since I plan on replacing either of them.
- There's some odd difference between the CD/DVD drives. What's a super drive, is that just a marketing term for a CD-R/DVD-R drive? Is the drive on one of these two systems significantly better than the other?
- The important thing that caught my eye, for some reason system A has the PCI-X and PCI-100 slots that aren't supposed to be with the 2.0 Ghz system, only the faster ones. Whereas system B has only standard PCI slots. (why the heck hasn't Apple graduated to PCIe yet? Anyway) That's nifty, it'd be nice to get that.
- System A seems like the better system (due to the PCI ugrade) for $100 less. Score, or do I lose something I'm not seeing?

I think that's it for now. Mucho thank yous in advance if any of you can decipher my babbling and give me the answers I crave!

[Ghoulish Delight]

Wait, where do you see a Dell 20" for $400? I see it for $750.

[blueerica]

Two things:

1.) Look for any special rebates if you're looking at buying a mac. I have a bevy of catalogues and resources available to you, if you'd like.

2.) Next time you get a chance (or are in the area) come and play with our variety of macs. New and old. Though there are probably slightly better out there with newer versions than the ones I have, I know that Steve's PM is top of the line, so you should get a good feel with that. And I've never felt "out of date," even with the laptop I bought in Aug of 2001.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Okay, figured one bit out. System A above has a "combo drive" while System B has a "SuperDrive", the important difference being that the SuperDrive can burn dual layer DVDs. Hmm, worth it or not?

Thanks, E, I will definitely be sampling the merchandise next time I'm around your way.

[Jazzman]

Since everything has been pretty much covered already, I'll just throw in my always leading argument for choosing a Mac.

I'm using an old graphite iMac DV from like, seven years ago? Six or seven, I can't remember exactly. I'm even still using OS9, which is nothing compared to OSX. I've upgraded the RAM, of course, and threw in a much bigger hard drive, but other than that it's pretty much exactly how it arrived from the Mac store, and it still works beautifully. Yes, I drool over the newest iMacs, but that's just from being a Mac geek. I still have all of the capabilities that I need from my Mac now, and will for the foreseeable near future. I know that no other machine would have lasted me this long, and definitely wouldn't still be working well for me now. In fact, in the time that I’ve been using this Mac, my sister and best friend, both die hard PCers, have both gone through three or more machines each just to keep up with technology. So, if longevity is what you’re looking for, you’ve definitely made the right choice, as Macs are far superior to any other machine in that aspect.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I wouldn't go that far. Our Dell has served us for 4 years, and it's still a good machine. I think the hard drive is getting a tad flakey, but otherwise, it's in good shape. I'd say it's only within the last year that software requirements (gaming, really) have finally completely outpaced it. And considering that it was mid to low end when we bought it, and that other than installing a second hard drive that I don't use, I haven't upgraded it at all, I'd say 4 years is a pretty good run. Had we spent a little more, investing in a slightly faster processor, a better graphics card, and more RAM, it could easily have served us for the forseeable future. But at this point, putting together those components would start to approach the price of replacing the thing outright, so it's just not worth it now.

So this time around, the plan was to make that investment. And since we were considering upping our price range, that put Macs on the radar. The fact is, I could STILL buy an equally powerful PC that would be just as far from obsolecense (maybe even with a little longer life seeing as I can get PCI-Express in a PC) as a Mac for far less. But Macs have other advantages that make that price difference worth it to me. To others, it's not worth it, and that's fine.

But the argument that one is technologically superior to the other is mostly anecdotal. Yes, PCs seem more unreliable and shorter lasting in the long run, but that's because they are commoditized and MOST people (myself included) get the cheapest one that will do the job. The mid to low end is the bulk of the PC market. Mac's the opposite, it's the mid to upper end that most Mac users go for. eMacs and iMacs and the Mac-mini are a relatively new phenomenon in the Mac world. And even much of that product line isn't truly low end. So you're going to see a different reliability and longevity profile in the market between the two, that doesn't really prove anything.

[Name]

Have to concur with GD on this, I built my PC no less then 2 yrs ago, up to 3 yrs ago, and it is still a strong machine, I don't think there is yet a game or program(PC Version, I am well aware that tiger will not run, nor any other mac program :p) that will not run on it. Of course I bought the best components available at the time, and I don't forsee having to replace it anytime in the next couple years, in fact I will probably use it in one way or another for another 8 to 10 years. One of my first computers I built is still going strong running freebsd and functioning as a file server (did it because I can). I will probably eventually transition to a mac, but that is purely for photoshopping reasons (considering getting a few mac mini's to spread around my place; for studio, and a few photoshop and print stations).

[DisneyFan25863]

Good to hear. I've already been looking at monitor elsewhere. Is the Dell one really the exact same monitor? Sweet, because I really like the quality of the Mac ones and was considering shelling the extra $400.

Yup, exact same panel (both are LG). Only thing is that the Dell has some rare backlighting problems (caused by the manufacturing process). But, other than that, identical. And the Dell has RCA and Svideo in also, so you can use it as a TV.

- Is there a difference between the versions of these cards sold through Apple/Apple resellers vs. the "PC" version generally available? I believe I found that the "only" difference is that the Mac ones are firmware keyed, but that reflashing is a bit of risky business. Is that correct?

Firmware and Dual Dual DVI Capibility, I believe.

- What's the difference between the GeForce Ultra 3800 and the GeForce 3800 GT?
I think the GT has more memory, better airflow, and the Dual Dual DVI.

I've looked at Mac catalog sites, including macconnection.com. I found something odd. Take a look at this system (http://www.macconnection.com/ProductDetail?Sku=5138199) vs. this one (http://www.macconnection.com/ProductDetail?Sku=5777530). What gives. Here's what I see:
- System A has a crapier vid card (not a problem since I plan on replacing either of them.
- There's some odd difference between the CD/DVD drives. What's a super drive, is that just a marketing term for a CD-R/DVD-R drive? Is the drive on one of these two systems significantly better than the other?
- The important thing that caught my eye, for some reason system A has the PCI-X and PCI-100 slots that aren't supposed to be with the 2.0 Ghz system, only the faster ones. Whereas system B has only standard PCI slots. (why the heck hasn't Apple graduated to PCIe yet? Anyway) That's nifty, it'd be nice to get that.
- System A seems like the better system (due to the PCI ugrade) for $100 less. Score, or do I lose something I'm not seeing?

Could also be the new and old versions of the 2.0 GHz PM (its been around since 2003 in various different forms).



Okay, figured one bit out. System A above has a "combo drive" while System B has a "SuperDrive", the important difference being that the SuperDrive can burn dual layer DVDs. Hmm, worth it or not?

I got a combo drive on my powerbook, and I'm kicking myself about it. Literally weeks after I bought it, I had to transfer a 4 GB file to school. I ended up having to split it on 4 or 5 CDs. Quite a pain. I ended up buying a LaCie 16x Dual layer firewire DVD drive for $160. I use it all the time now for backups and such.


Wait, where do you see a Dell 20" for $400? I see it for $750.


Rebates and such. Give it 2 or 3 weeks, and a deal will come along. Good place to check for them is MacRumors (http://macrumors.com).
I saw it on sale for $327 a few weeks ago.



Also, CP qualifies for an educational discount, doesn't she? Saves you a few hundred there.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Also, CP qualifies for an educational discount, doesn't she? Saves you a few hundred there.Not too sure about this. I'm not a certificated teacher nor am I an actual librarian. I can check into that...I have no idea where to look, though.

[surfinmuse]

CP & GD, educational discounts can be found by going to the Education section of the Apple Store: http://www.apple.com/education/store/

Then under "Shop For Yourself" you'll be presented with a list to search for your academic institution you're associated with, and then when you get onto the online store proper, you will see all the stuff at reduced prices. The discounts, which range vary based on the price of each item, vary from $50 to $200 and up, depending on what you get.

Alternatively, I *believe* they will honour these EDU prices at the retail locations, if you provided some sort of Student or Teacher ID, or some other sort of documentation that states you are associated with an academic institution in some shape or form.

Hope this helps.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Thanks, surfinmuse! You rock.

At my first uneducated (get it?) glance, it seems we'll save something like 100 bucks with the discount.

[mousepod]

One caveat on the education discount from Apple: you still have to pay tax and shipping.
When I bought my G5, it was cheaper to buy from a catalog at full price with no tax than to get it from Apple with my discount. Plus, the catalog threw in a free printer and 1GB of RAM. Shop around.

[surfinmuse]

You're most welcome CP & GD.

MousePod's right, you do have to pay CA sales tax, but I believe Ground Shipping is free on Apple Store online orders? At least it was when I last ordered some stuff a couple of months ago.

MousePod is right, places like MacMall often sweeten the deal with free printer and RAM (with installation fee of $30 or so), so you do have to comparison price & shop. Someone told me that it's their way of discounting the product, because Apple won't allow them to sell it at under a certain price.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yeah, shipping's free through Apple. But the tax and the lack of rebates is still enough that a site like macconnection would be a better deal. Even if the 10% discount makes the system $100 cheaper through Apple, tax is like $140, the memory upgrade, free at macconnection, is $100 through Apple or like $80 if I buy the memory retail. So that's already enough to make macconnection cheaper. So we'll see. We're not going to buy for at least a few months, right now I'm just nailing down what's what and what to look for. Once we're more clear on what we want and are making a decission, we'll have to do a complete price comparisson.

[Name]

Of course legally you have to pay California use tax no matter where you buy it from.......(I dislike California sometimes)

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Of course legally you have to pay California use tax no matter where you buy it from.......(I dislike California sometimes)When a retailer says there's "no sales tax" what they mean is that they are paying the sales tax. It's essentially a masked discount.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Actually, no. Legally, you only have to pay sales tax on something from a catalog if the company is located within the state you are purchasing from. I think it has something to do with the provision in the Constitution regarding interstate trade and the fact that neither state has the authority to tax a business transaction from another state and since the transaction is in both states, it can't be determined who would have the authority to tax. Or something like that.

[€uroMeinke]

My understanding is that the State - in this case California, requires you to pay tax - many out of state Company's won't facilitate that, so the state expects you to report (and pay) it on your own. Of course, they never enforce this - Here's some FAQs (http://www.boe.ca.gov/sutax/faqusetax.htm#9).

[DisneyFan25863]

Re: 20.1in Widescreen.

Right now, for instance, it can be had for $397 (http://www.slickdeals.net/#p6118). You just have to keep your eyes open.

[Kevy Baby]

As far as where to order, I'll put a plug in for Powermax (http://www.powermax.com/). They are in Oregon (skirt the tax issue, but still pay for shipping). They usually have deals (like most online retailers). But what I like about them:

When you call them (during normal business hours) you get a LIVE person. If you start working with one person, you almost always can ask for that person on return calls.
They actually know what they are talking about. The people who answer the phones are not just order takers.

The last three Macs I've bought have been from them. Had a return issue once and it was handled quickly and painlessly.
____________________

Every once in a while, I like to go into the Apple Store and configure a rediculously expensive. The current configuration (http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/71207/wo/FD6P037LlIDI3k4Jp1G2jPhtLuF/2.0.11.1.0.6.3) includes:

Dual 2.7GHz PowerPC G5
8GB DDR400 SDRAM (PC3200) - 8x1GB Eight friggin gigs of RAM - yeehaw!
2x400GB Serial ATA - 7200rpm
NVIDIA GeForce 6800 Ultra DDL w/256MB GDDR3 SDRAM
Apple Cinema HD Display (30" flat panel)
Apple Cinema HD Display (30" flat panel) Yes; dual 30" Monitors
Bluetooth Module + AirPort Extreme Card
16x SuperDrive double-layer (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
PCI-X Gigabit Ethernet Card
Fibre Channel PCI-X Card (w/SFP-SFP cable) Why I need Gigabit Ethernet and Fibre Channel on a standalone Mac is beyond me
Bluetooth Module + Apple Wireless Keyboard & Mouse - U.S. English
Mac OS X - U.S. English
Mac OS X Server (Unlimited-Client) Why TF do I need Server SW?!? Because I can in my dreams!!!
Final Cut Express HD preinstalled
AppleCare Protection Plan for Power Mac (w/ or w/o Display)


Just a measly $14,717 - pocket change

[Kevy Baby]

One last thing: I would make sure you get the Dual Layer DVD. I'm not even that big into a lot of DVD (I do have a Superdrive), but I am sure Jonesing for a Dual Layer. I want to start looking into what it will take to get iDVD to run an external Dual Layer.