Haunted Mansion Changes - Slowly Unveiling!

[Disneyphile]

Found out that some of the Haunted Mansion changes are already being uncovered, and supposedly will be fully displayed by the weekend, according to one person who just rode it this morning.

From what I've heard - the most recent visible stuff is really cool!!! :D

[Not Afraid]

I am going to the Park tonight! I'M EXCITED!

[scaeagles]

I'll be going to the park on XXXX XX-XX, 2006.

Of course, I've never been on the HM, so I wouldn't notice any changes.

[innerSpaceman]

^ We are going to hunt you down like the dog you are.



Well, I'll just ride the Mansion after MouseAdventure. I'm not particularly excited about the new changes.

[Disneyphile]

I am going to the Park tonight! I'M EXCITED!Can't wait to hear your update on it! Details! Details!!! :D

[Janie]

wow! Can't wait to see it for myself in October!:snap:

[Not Afraid]

Well, there were a few things uncovered in the attic. And still more things under wraps. I can tell they are trying to "make a story" but it is not clear yet what is going on. There is what appears to be a wedding album with a oddly glowing lamp upon entering and other things have been moved about, but there's not really enough to see what they are going for.....yet.

[Gemini Cricket]

Cool, NA!

If anyone wants to post pictures, I will gladly look at them. :)

Help a Bostonian out, will ya?

:D

[Janie]

Awesome, Not Afraid!:snap:

[Motorboat Cruiser]

It's much darker inside now, especially when you first enter and during Madame Leota, which was a pleasant surprise.

[Gn2Dlnd]

I can tell they are trying to "make a story" but it is not clear yet what is going on.

These are the wedding gifts that never got returned...

The Bride and Groom's names are on the album, too. Did you catch them?

[Not Afraid]

The Bride and Groom's names are on the album, too. Did you catch them?

No. Next time.

[Disneyphile]

Her name is Constance. That's all I could catch yesterday.

[Gemini Cricket]

You can see a picture of Constance here (http://www.micechat.com/forums/showpost.php?p=614398&postcount=565). Interesting.

Also, there are rumors at MC that you can hear axe swooshes in the attic.

But, of course, they're rumors...

[Gn2Dlnd]

The attic is complete (I think). Apparently, Constance has been very busy.

[Disneyphile]

The attic's been unveiled, along with the new bride. (No pun intended. ;) )

While I do like the new changes, I'm a little sad they didn't keep the old bride and just swap her candle with an axe. I'm going to miss that glowing beating heart.

To me, it's more creepy, and possibly too much for little kids to handle. The old attic was whimsically frightening just like the rest of the ride, but the new attic is just frightening. (Albeit very cool.) Just my opinion. :)

[Gemini Cricket]

Pictures! Pictures!
:)

[AllyOops!]

Trivia that no one cares about: I've actually never seen the Mansion after the dining room sequence. I re-open my eyes at the end when the doombuggy drifts by the mirrors. I'm a pathetic fraidy cat. Except for Holiday Mansion. I keep my eyes open during that.

I so want to see the changes! That will require me keeping my eyes open, though!

I like how I went through the Northridge Quake living near the epicenter, 9/11, and yet I can't cope with the freakin' Mansion. Loser much? :(

[Gemini Cricket]

Video of the changes:
http://www.micechat.com/forums/showpost.php?p=623255&postcount=1509

[flippyshark]

So, is this bride a bigger version of the "Little Leota?" (and is the face projected from within or from without?) This looks really cool to me. And, it would have completely freaked me out as a kid.

[Ghoulish Delight]

This just in: Zapppop is not a fan.

[Disneyphile]

This just in: Zapppop is not a fan.I can't wait to hear his report on it. I've yet to see it complete in person.

[Gn2Dlnd]

This just in: Zapppop is not a fan.

It's hard work, being a purist. ;)

[AllyOops!]

WOW!!! Thanks, GC!!!! :snap: :snap: :snap:

I was excited, then nervous, then sad, then sentimental about the new attic changes!

I'll just say that the creepy new bride looks wicked homicidal (I guess that is the point, afterall)! I used to love the glowing, heartbeat bride of yore (yes, I've opened up my eyes long enough to see her. Briefly) but now she seems sort of..dated and shoddy.

They can send the old bride to live out her retirement years in Fantazyland, Egypt.:p

[Not Afraid]

This just in: Zapppop is not a fan.

You got the Text Message too?;)

[innerSpaceman]

I got text and voice ... and, though he didn't give away the farm, I bet when I see it tomorrow, I will likely not be pleased.

[Kevy Baby]

You got the Text Message too?;)I knew I couldn't have been the only one ;)

[Not Afraid]

I got text and voice ... and, though he didn't give away the farm, I bet when I see it tomorrow, I will likely not be pleased.

Well, harumph!

[Gemini Cricket]

I don't particularly like her voice, but I love what she says. She says at least 4 or 5 different things. Her voice coule be more menacing and less school teacher-ish.

I haven't been on the ride, but I like what I'm seeing. I'm a fan as of this moment. My next trip to the park is going to be in September, I think. I hope they don't wimp out and take it out before then because of parental complaints etc...

[CoasterMatt]

The old bride had MAN HANDS!!!

[Gn2Dlnd]

I saw it Wednesday, the only parents that would complain are those that can't deal with the Mansion being updated. It's not like the hatchet is dripping blood or anything!
I think it's a wonderful reference to the Hatbox Ghost, while being a completely new take on the idea. My only issue? Constance and her grooms are so photo-realistic, while the rest of the Mansion is pure Marc Davis.

[innerSpaceman]

Yeah, matching the existing style is a very important thing.


Sorry, but those World of Motion figures stuck out like a sore hook on Pirates of the Caribbean.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Sorry, but those World of Motion figures stuck out like a sore hook on Pirates of the Caribbean.

I agree.
I never liked the "Two Brothers" segment of "Great Moments with Mr. Lincoln" for the same reason. The lighting in the attic, however, masks the style difference to a degree.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

I knew I couldn't have been the only one ;)

Likewise. :)

[Gemini Cricket]

After years of things like:

The Pooh ride
Safety tape around the Sleeping Beauty statue
The 'New' Tomorrowland (Crap-o-ventions, HISTA, Rocket Rods)
Rededicating the Partners Statue on Walt's 100th birthday
Non-spinny teacups
The Snow White stage show
The abandoned Chip-n-Dale treehouse
Tarzan's Treehouse with Disney Store figurines
The dumbed down Tom Sawyer Island w/ closed fort
DCA

I'm thinking that the addition to the HM attic is a welcomed show of creativity. I think with this, the Sub Lagoon and the promising sounding POTC refurb, Disneyland's heading in the right direction.

And I'm sure Isaac would agree with me, him liking it or not isn't necessarily the deal breaker of whether something is good for the park or not. I say this and I love Isaac to death. :)

[Isaac]

I rode the Haunted Mansion this weekend & experienced the new attic scene.


WHAT THE **** WERE THEY THINKING !?!?!?

I am not opposed to changes to the attic scene in this ride if they can match the style & tone of the attraction. The new attic scene simply fails to do so. So what went wrong ? Let me tell ya:

1) Scale.
The size of the new bride figure is significantly smaller than the previous one. from a distance she looks okay, but up close, she's simply too small. She's a midget bride by comparison to the other figures inside the mansion. Had she been placed in a corner, further from the ride vehicle, then this illusion could have been passable. She is simply too small to be so close to the doom buggies.

2) Visibility.
The bride's bouquet of flowers (which later turn into an axe) are too distorted. They appear as a cloudy mess. Even up close it's very hard to tell just what exactly you're looking at until it morphs into the blade.

3) Style.
The art styling of the character is a mismatch. The axe that appears in her hands appears too quickly & sharply. The edge of her hatchet shining in the light gives it the feeling of a type of adventure role play video game ("You've gained the axe of Gerudo !"). The original idea of having blood on the axe was ..well.. axed. Such a shame. Another part of why this character is out of sorts is the:

4) Performance.
The actress who filmed the bride's performance did not know at the time what her footage would be used for til after it was recorded. Perhaps had they told her in advance she would have given a better performance. Her facial expressions are too silly & cartoonish. Although the Haunted Mansion is meant to have a certain level of humor, her performance is a different style of humor. It's far too cartoonish. Her expressions are too much. She even appears cross-eyed at times in a way that just looks dumb. Of course, facials expressions were only a portion of her performance she also has some:

5) Spoken Dialogue.
Her dialogue is the standard wedding vows. If read properly, they have potential to be eerie. They are not read in an eerie manner. Her spoken dialogue, much like her facial expressions, are too silly to evoke feelings of dread, yet not silly enough to make you laugh either. It's lame.


Simply put, the bride is lame. The attic changes leading up to her are pretty cool. They set the stage for a possibly eerie encounter that turns out to be very mediocre & dissatisfying. I was so thoroughly annoyed I filed a complaint at City Hall. I ended my statement by saying "If this is the future of the park, I shudder to think what's being done to Pirates Of The Caribbean."

The idea had promise but the execution sucked.

Sorry TDA & WDI. You get no kudos from me for this tripe.



......and that's what I think!

[innerSpaceman]

I never thought I'd be saying this .... but .....








I can hardly wait for Haunted Mansion Holiday.

[Gemini Cricket]

......and that's what I think!
Here's my theory on at least some of the snafus zapppop noticed.
I noticed the cross-eyed thing, too. (Granted, to truly review this I should see it live, but that's not going to happen for me for awhile.) It doesn't work if the cross-eyed thing is on purpose.
I'm thinking that they most likely did have a spookier version of the bride. I bet they had a version where she did deliver her lines as creepily as possible. I also think they tried to match the mood of the Leotas. But seeing as how they prevented blood from being on the axe, I think a couple of suits or higher ups decided to dumb the bride down. 'Make her more cartoony! Make her make a funny face. Make her sound more Barbara Billingsley-like.' That's my theory. The build up is right on the money, but the pay off has been altered.
As for the scale, they should totally fix that. IN fact, they should take heed to all of zappp's comments.
I think the park needs as much feedback on this as possible.
There have been stirrings from reliable people on MC that the Mouse is monitoring their boards. I think it would be wise to place your review there at MC in its own thread, zapppop. That's just my two cents.

iSm - Did you ride it, too? I'd love to hear your review as well.

[Gemini Cricket]

The bride unveiled:
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b268/braddoc310/kat2.jpg
For what it's worth. Someone on Doombuggies.com figured out who the actress is. Kat Cressida.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Rode it yesterday...ugh.


To start...I love the wedding album, and the portraits are incredible. But the bride? Terrible. On top of all that Zapp points out, I'd add that the technology used is pathetic. She looks 2 dimensional and distorted, and like a video screen instead of a ghost. I mean, it's one thing to have a simple effect that looks a little cheesey, which is a fact of life for most of the ride. But when it's a high-tech effect that still looks cheesy, they've failed.

And, as iSm pointed out, it was completely ridiculous of them to do what they did. Think about it. Why did they decided to focus on this scene as teh genesis for creating a story line? Because everyone loves and is creeped out by the bride. And why does everybody and get creeped out by the bride? Because she stood there silent, with a loud beating heart. Creeeeepy. She is no longer silent, she no longer has a beating heart. Good job, idiots.

Of course, all that being said, the attic has made me want to vomit ever since they added the stupid piano and the lame "I do"s. There was nothing creepier then entering a dark attic where the only sound you hear is the beating heart, wondering where it's coming from, and then seeing the bride. So this change hasn't "ruined" it for me...'cause it's already been ruined.

[Gemini Cricket]

So there is still the sound effects of her heart and no visual beating heart on the AA? That's bad.

[Ghoulish Delight]

So there is still the sound effects of her heart and no visual beating heart on the AA? That's bad.
Are there? I didn't even notice.

[Gemini Cricket]

Are there? I didn't even notice.
I believe the link to the MC post with video that I posted above has the sound. But I can't verfiy that because I can't play it now at work. (Blocked. Bleh.)

[Not Afraid]

I just watched the video since I can't seem to get to the park. There are heart beat sounds as part of the soundtrack.

I can't see a hat box ghost reference. Is the bride on the left now? So, I guess the story is completely changed and she is a crazy murderer. Whatever. I hate the fact that there's no mystery left.

[Kevy Baby]

Damn - I'll miss the bride's flashing boobs. I have been trying to talk GusGus into getting something like that.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I can't see a hat box ghost reference.I haven't watched the video, so I don't know if it's visible, but there's a nifty effect on the portraits.

Is the bride on the left now? Yes.

So, I guess the story is completely changed and she is a crazy murderer. Whatever. I hate the fact that there's no mystery left.Yeah, that's what really bugs me. I felt like I was being beaten over the head with this story. It's like they figured that a woman in a wedding dress holding a bouquet wasn't quite getting the message across that she's a bride.

[Ponine]

I believe the link to the MC post with video that I posted above has the sound. But I can't verfiy that because I can't play it now at work. (Blocked. Bleh.)
It has sound, I'll verify that.

[innerSpaceman]

Everything iconic that made The Bride as popular a character as to inspire making her the breakout Star of the New Haunted Mansion has been eliminated in translating her character from bit player. This is absurd.

No beating heart? WTF? Worst of all, no menace, no dignity, no eerieness, no spookiness. Gah. She's a goofball with an ax. The transformation of attic from a scary scene to a comedy scene is now compete.

Visually, the new Bride is a travesty. In an attraction replete with projected images, what were they thinking in projecting, not just a head, but an entire figure ... and onto a flat surface?!?!??! It looks horrible. She's a freaking screen!!!!!! Um, could they have bothered to look around the premises at how the effects of Madam Leota, little Leota, and the Singing Busts were successfully achieved? Gaghkk!!! What blithering idiots designed this?

I suppose the decision to video-project her body as well as her face was because of the morphing ax. Feh, the ax might look more convincing if it was a dimensional ax and not a flat video image. What the frell ever happened to audio animatronics? This is an intrusion of Star Tours cheapout story technology onto Pirates of the Caribbean waltdimensional storytelling style.


Further, New Bride's performance is atrocious. She's a ditz! The part of her loop where she speaks her "vows" cross-eyed is painful to watch. This is NOT Captain Gracey's mysterious Bride. Since New Bride is on the other side of the attic, I'm going to assume she killed the Original Bride with her video ax and hid her body under the floor boards.



Lest anyone say I'm a stubborn purist .... I find the new attic portait effects preceding New Bride's appearance to be delightful and creepy and a stunning tribute to the Hatbox Ghost. I think Leota's floating crystal ball is about the best improvement ever made to a Disneyland attraction. Purist my eye! The New Bride simply sucks!!!


Not since TIXE has something so dire invaded the Haunted Mansion. Oh, and she's the thousandth ghost, by the way. The Mansion's done.

[AllyOops!]

Whoa, whoa, whoa nelly!! :(

She's a projected image?? I thought she was an actual figure, like the old bride, but with a Leota-like imaged face!!

And CROSS-EYED whilst reciting her vows?!?! Nothing against the cross-eyed population, God Bless them, but..why???

I bet when I finally get married one day, I'll be cross-eyed, too, but for different reasons. Not because I'm an axe wielding maniac, but because in order to traipse down that aisle, I'll be crunked on cosmopolitans, at Whiskey Pete's no less. :( :p

I have a feeling that's not the hidden back story for Haunted Mansion. Gun-shy bride tanked on the sauce.

I'm actually sitting here laughing over this! Also somewhat sad, because..sometimes change scares me. Okay, almost always.

Maybe I'll keep the tradition of keeping my eyes closed. :(

However, the statement "she's a goofball with an axe" made my morning, iSm! Hahaha! :D :snap:

[Gemini Cricket]

One thing I just thought of was I was never happy with the Bride that was blue and moved. (I think she was the one before the current projection one.) Her movements were too jerky. The best part about the Bride I remember as a kid was that her face was shadowy and mysterious and her eyes glowed.

See the bride pics here (http://www.doombuggies.com/myths2.htm). The top one is great, the bottom one not so much...

The whole cross-eyed thing bugs. It's someone putting up a neon sign saying, 'This is supposed to be funny!' That's not how comedy works.

Here are my fixes for it:

1. A projection on a 3D moving animatronic.
2. The bride whispers her lines, almost to the point that you can barely hear it.
3. One hand should carry a real bouquet, the other should be behind her back. As you pass, you see her gripping the axe behind her. If you see it, great. If not, great.
4. We should see a beating heart.
5. Her face should be shadowy and dark. No crisp image, no crossed eyes. In fact, her eyes should be looking downwards. As you pass, she could give a DoomBuggy or two a wide-eyed look. That would be creepy.

[Gemini Cricket]

I know one way we could get Disney to change the bride...

We could tell the American Family Association and Pat Robertson that Disney is making an fun of the sanctity of marriage with their murderous cross-eyed dinglecheese bride.

:D

[Moonliner]

Damn - I'll miss the bride's flashing boobs. I have been trying to talk GusGus into getting something like that.

Too bad the time for that has passed. However if you try, you might find she is amenable to imitating the habits of the new bride for you...

[Gn2Dlnd]

This is NOT Captain Gracey's mysterious Bride.

Who's Captain Gracey? Is that George-groom's last name, is he George N. Gracey?

Bwah.

Haha.

Shifting gears ever so slightly, as a kid I was always bothered by the missing Groom in the attic. There he was, in my Haunted Mansion Story Record, but all we got in the ride were screaming heads and a swaying bride. You'd come into the attic after the amazing ballroom scene, and, if you were familiar with the version of the story I enjoyed on the other 364, you'd go, "Hey, still no groom! I wonder if they're ever going to finish this." The screaming heads used to scare the Hell out of me - I would usually go through the attic half-covering my eyes. I've always been a bit disapointed that they softened the scene, adding the pianist and replacing the screaming heads with "I dooooo." Also, when they added piano-ghost, didn't they move the bride to the other side of the track?
I want the screaming heads back, at least in the graveyard. I want the torn scrim in front of the graveyard band to be replaced. I want the ugly green rubber faces on the graveyard band restored to the ugly blue rubber faces. I want the stretching room walls to be fixed. I want the Raven to be explained in the ride the same way it is on the album, "It seems the spirit of an old nag has taken up residence in that poor, wretched raven. Be on your guard, it may want to better itself."
I'm pretty happy with the attic. The images in the morphing pictures need to be caricaturish, to match the rest of the ghosts in the Mansion, but now I can ride through without wondering if they're ever going to finish this room.

BTW, the Gracey nonsense has never been part of my experience of the Mansion.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Blech. SPOILERS AHEAD, no more need for spoiler tags in this thread, I think.




I will first say that I could only see her extremely briefly, as she was on the left and I was in the right side of the buggy. Problem number one.

Two, she looked entirely two-dimensional to me, in stark contrast with the rest of the Mansion's residents. Where the hell is the Leota style head? If it was there (which I don't think it was but I'm still not sure of, can't view vid at work) it was poorly set up.

Third, the contrast between her obviously real look and the Marc Davis caricature style used throughout the attraction is a joke.

I dig the concept of the axe and all that but again, her whole body looked like a plasma screen. :rolleyes:

I did only see a few seconds but what I saw was dismaying. The attitude was all wrong, all cartoony and goofy, like the others said. Compare that to Leota's chants...ugh. They made the same cartoony mistake with the HMH Leota spiel, which is also on the silly side, and which I also dislike.

Boo, I say. Lame. :mad:

The rest of the stuff in the attic was cool. I liked the wedding gifts and the portraits were very well done. Much cooler than the un-scary pop-ups and annoying piano guy. But that bride has a lot of work to be done on her.

God, I hope they're already working on it.

[Gn2Dlnd]

...what I saw was dismaying.

A "dismaying observation?"

[AllyOops!]

Boo, I say. Lame. :mad:

The rest of the stuff in the attic was cool. I liked the wedding gifts and the portraits were very well done. Much cooler than the un-scary pop-ups and annoying piano guy. But that bride has a lot of work to be done on her.

God, I hope they're already working on it.

Wait!! The pop-up ghoulies are all gone?? Really? :D

Whew! I might finally get to open my eyes like a big girl! :)

Golly, I'm a lame-o. :(

[Not Afraid]

Everyone keep refering to the piano shadow as "annoying". I like him! I think he's a greeat creepy effect.

[Gemini Cricket]

Everyone keep refering to the piano shadow as "annoying". I like him! I think he's a greeat creepy effect.
I love the shadow effect. He's still there, right?

[innerSpaceman]

Nope, he's gone. And I really liked his effect, too ... though I thought they were already hammering the wedding theme over guests' head too much when that was added.

But it's a creepy effect, perhaps better employed elsewhere. Now it's employed nowhere and plasma-screen bride has taken over.


(Btw, I would have enjoyed the portraits more if they had looked to be scattered around the attic, instead of perfectly propped up on poles along the Doombuggy route.)

[Gemini Cricket]

Nope, he's gone.
Bummer. They could put him in a hallway somewhere...

[Gn2Dlnd]

He was there on Wednesday.

[Gemini Cricket]

He was there on Wednesday.
Well he does have a couple of gigs. I hear he's the guy playing the piano (oops, I mean harpsichord - don't tell MBC) in POTC, too.
:D

[Ghoulish Delight]

I don't dislike the piano effect...I dislike the piano effect in the attic. Total silence except for the beating of the heart was the ultimate in creepy. The piano was just unnecessary.

[Gn2Dlnd]

But it wasn't total silence, it was the bride's beating heart, puctuated by the screams of the jumping heads.

[Ghoulish Delight]

But it wasn't total silence, it was the bride's beating heart, puctuated by the screams of the jumping heads.
True that...even better that was.

[€uroMeinke]

I like the paino player, but the jumping heads scared the bejezus out of me as a kid, and thus are missed in my jadded adulthood.

[Prudence]

I never liked the jumping heads. And I did like the piano music. I think I'd like the photographs, but that's just based on the photos.

[CoasterMatt]

Would anybody object if they changed the ride to this (http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,18989227-13762,00.html)? :evil:

[innerSpaceman]

At this point, anything would be an improvement.





Heheh, I am reminded that we have this inexplicably huge pair of scissors at work for everyday cutting jobs that could be done by a pair of small clippers. But this giant pair of hedge-clipper-sized scissors is all there is, and everyone calls them "the Bobbits."

(I guess not a man alive at the time is likely to ever forget that story.)

[NirvanaMan]

Nope, he's gone. And I really liked his effect, too ...

I know we were in the buggy in front of you, but I doubt the imagineers came in between our two cars, completely removed the effect just to taunt you a second time, and then turned it back on. He's still there dude.

Overall definite thumbs up to the changes! The bride never made any sense before and just reminded me of one of those cheesey moving Santa statues people put out at Christmas time. Nothing in the entire mansion was ever even mildly scary. The story needs to be expanded but this is a nice start. The portrait effects are extremely cool. I didn't see the cross-eyed bride though, it happened so fast perhaps we saw the only decent part of it but we liked it overall. It's no phantom manor of course, but its a step in the right direction...removing all those ridiculous screaming heads on tracks.

[€uroMeinke]

You know, I'm glad I just forgot my PIN number right now...

[flippyshark]

You know, I'm glad I just forgot my PIN number right now...

It's late and I'm tired,but I just can't make sense of this post. How does your PIN number relate to anything that has come before? (It's probably obvious and I'll smack my forehead when I find out.)

I'd love to see the naughty ghost train ride, even with the Bobbitt scene. Heck, back when that was in the news, I had already seen IN THE REALM OF THE SENSES and DESPERATE LIVING, so it wasn't anything new to me.

[€uroMeinke]

Hmmm - should have rephrased that - recently I had a senior moment forgetting my ATM PIN number - so I am gratefull that so far this is the extent of my memory loss - or so I can recall anyway...

[innerSpaceman]

Yeah, it seems I'm having quite a few Alzheimers moments myself.

Maybe I just didn't notice the shadow player because the doombuggy route is crowded with all those portraits.


(as for those AP Lounge sofas ... )

[Ghoulish Delight]

The bride never made any sense before and just reminded me of one of those cheesey moving Santa statues people put out at Christmas time. Nothing in the entire mansion was ever even mildly scary. See, this is why, while I still dislike what they've done, I can hardly consider this the "ruin" of the attic...'cause that was already achieved. You never saw the old attic, with the creepy faceless bride and pop-up skulls that scared the living hell outta people. That was awesome.

[innerSpaceman]

Repeatability relies, I believe, on having the story be vague, and having it seem to be happening somewhat to YOU, the observer.

Once it becomes a definable tale that you see happening to a repeating set of characters, it becomes boring to see more than 20 times.


How many times have we ridden the Haunted Mansion? What about Pirates? Note that no character appears more than once in each. That's about to change in Pirates, and is changing before our very eyes on the Mansion.



I think one of Phantom Manor's weak points is its definative storyline. And I really don't need to see the Phantom five times, thanks.

[flippyshark]

A big amen to iSm's theory of vague storyline as being more repeatable. I have long held this to be the case. Open-endedness allows the imagination to run wild, but narrative specificity can really put a stopper on it.

The media-based attractions are probably the best example. HISTA is very specific, and not very repeatable. Once the surprises are known, there's no reason to go back. Even Star Tours gets old, once it starts to seem like a film you watch while being flounced around, rather than an actual journey.

I think one of the key elements to the endless repeatability of Pirates and Mansion are their open-ended non-narrative nature. They are atmospheric, with individiual little moments of humor and character,but no forward narrative drive. This is a good thing, as it allows one to simply relax and wallow in the moment. Once there is a strong narrative pull to "get to the end" of a story, everything else becomes something to get past, not something to linger on.

I don't know how much the changes to POTC and HM will alter their non-narrative feel, but I can see where this kind of thing can shortchange the experience a little if they aren't careful.

[NirvanaMan]

You never saw the old attic, with the creepy faceless bride and pop-up skulls that scared the living hell outta people. That was awesome.

True. Perhaps I would have liked that. I particularly think I might have liked the time you mentioned when all you heard was a beating heart....and that was it. No pop-up heads etc. Of course, I just have to go by what I've seen myself.

[Ghoulish Delight]

True. Perhaps I would have liked that. I particularly think I might have liked the time you mentioned when all you heard was a beating heart....and that was it. No pop-up heads etc. Of course, I just have to go by what I've seen myself.
Actually, the Commodore corrected me. There were pop-up heads. But they were nothing like the lame ones that you've seen.

[Gemini Cricket]

They should bring back the faceless bride! So much more creepy. You would see the paintings of what she's supposed to look like, and with her shadowy face, you could only speculate what she looks like now... Ooooh spooky!

[CoasterMatt]

A faceless bride, and a pantsless groom - my kinda mansion! :D

[Mary Blairiffic]

After years of things like:

The Pooh ride
Safety tape around the Sleeping Beauty statue
The 'New' Tomorrowland (Crap-o-ventions, HISTA, Rocket Rods)
Rededicating the Partners Statue on Walt's 100th birthday
Non-spinny teacups
The Snow White stage show
The abandoned Chip-n-Dale treehouse
Tarzan's Treehouse with Disney Store figurines
The dumbed down Tom Sawyer Island w/ closed fort
DCA

I'm thinking that the addition to the HM attic is a welcomed show of creativity. I think with this, the Sub Lagoon and the promising sounding POTC refurb, Disneyland's heading in the right direction.

And I'm sure Isaac would agree with me, him liking it or not isn't necessarily the deal breaker of whether something is good for the park or not. I say this and I love Isaac to death. :)

I agree! And for the same reasons!! Eisener's out and it looks like the new powers that be are remembering the imagination that went into Disneyland in the first place, and how Walt sid that, basically, it will never be completed as long as there are fresh new ideas. And I'm sure he also meant QUALITY ideas.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I agree! And for the same reasons!! Eisener's out and it looks like the new powers that be are remembering the imagination that went into Disneyland in the first place, and how Walt sid that, basically, it will never be completed as long as there are fresh new ideas. And I'm sure he also meant QUALITY ideas.Yes, but Walt also fairly emphatically worked to cut out any semblance of a literal story line in the Mansion during its development. That's one of the reasons it took so long to finalize. After Walt's death, there was a drawn out battle between imagineers who wanted to create a storyline and those that wanted to leave it open-ended as Walt envisioned it. While I'm not opposed to change, I agree with Walt (and iSm and Flippyshark) on this one that the Mansion is better served as a spooky house of mystery than as a storybook.

[BarTopDancer]

I was going to stop in on my way home from the game on Sunday but the sunshine stole my brain. I'll have to attempt to remember to ride it on Thursday. Before my nap of course...

I guess this post says it all about how I feel about the changes. In fact I forgot all about them until I ran into DP at MA and then this post.

[€uroMeinke]

Yes, but Walt also fairly emphatically worked to cut out any semblance of a literal story line in the Mansion during its development. That's one of the reasons it took so long to finalize. After Walt's death, there was a drawn out battle between imagineers who wanted to create a storyline and those that wanted to leave it open-ended as Walt envisioned it. While I'm not opposed to change, I agree with Walt (and iSm and Flippyshark) on this one that the Mansion is better served as a spooky house of mystery than as a storybook.

Hmm this seems a bit revisionist to me - I think the main conflict was between scary versus goofy /Claude Coates atmospherics that make up the mansion's begiinings versus the Frank Davis charicatures that make up the second half...

On another note - I love Phantom Mannor, and presume it to be repetable even if I can't repeat it.

[Gemini Cricket]

On another note - I love Phantom Mannor, and presume it to be repetable even if I can't repeat it.
I see iSm's point on this one, though. I liked PM and rode it twice. But I don't know if I love it enough to ride it over and over (you know, if I had an AP and lived an hour away from DLP). The ghost town confuses me. :D

[innerSpaceman]

I'm gonna be chastised for this ... but I find Phantom Manor to be inferior to the Haunted Mansion in many ways. One of which is certainly the telling of a story that I would become tired of .... if I had the opportunity to become tired of it.


And I don't find G.D.'s history to be revisionist. Certainly, € is right that main argument was between scary and comedic ... but the better part of the decades-long gestation of the Haunted Mansion was the steady pruning of anything resembling a definite storyline. Since Walt was around for all but the last 2 years of that gestation, I find it safe to assume that the storyless direction was the one Walt desired.

I'm not one to say that Walt was always right and it's Walt's way or the highway. But let's face it .... Walt was nearly always right, and the Haunted Mansion was one of Walt's attractions - - and a tremendously successful one.

I would suggest the Imagineers go build their own attraction if they want to veer away from Walt's philosophies for the Mansion. Put Phantom Manor in DCA for all I care. Don't fu ck with the Haunted Mansion. They piss me off at their peril. I have to die sometime, ya know.

[scaeagles]

OK....I'm going to sound incredibly ignorant here, but what is Phantom Manor?

[Scrooge McSam]

OK....I'm going to sound incredibly ignorant here, but what is Phantom Manor?

The version of Haunted Mansion at Disneyland Paris

[innerSpaceman]

It's a western-themed Haunted Mansionesque attraction at Disneyland Paris. It pretty much follows the Haunted Mansion progression of scenes - Foyer, Stretchroom, Doombuggies, Hallway, Seance Room, Ballroom, Graveyard - - but it does so while telling a definite story of a meloncholy bride and the murderous Phantom who killed her groom.

The Bride and the Phantom appear again and again throughout the attraction, grafting a definitive storyline onto the haunted house experience.

It's not as absurd as having your 80th "first flight" Star Tours pilot, but it does give the impression (to me, at least) of the same thing happening over and over .... not altogether inappropriate for a haunting, mind you.

[scaeagles]

Thanks to both of you, Scrooge and Ism.

[Gemini Cricket]

In hindsight, iSm, I must say that I regretted not riding Space Mountain again the night we were there at DLP. Insted of Space, we rode Phantom Manor again. Now that version of Space is gone. So, for the very first time ever, you were right. :D

[innerSpaceman]

Other major differences are the Western Ghosttown where our graveyard would be, the absolutely terrifying moments in their smaller graveyard where the Doombuggies go below the ground to find rotting corpses emerging from coffins, the bride's boudoir in place of our attic (although that change is becoming less pronounced, per the topic of this thread), and the presense of a full symphony orchestra somewhere in the Manor - rather than the pipe organ hidden somewhere in the Mansion.




So, for the very first time ever, you were right
:iSm:

[Gn2Dlnd]

This is your on-the-spot reporter coming to you, live, from Disneyland's Haunted Mansion. I'm happy to report that the insanely bright EXIT signs in the graveyard have been extinguished! Also, oddly, Paul Frees' narration in the hall of doors and séance room have been cut.
This is gn2dlnd, signing out, from New Orleans Square.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I would ride Phantom Manor over and over and over

[Not Afraid]

This is your on-the-spot reporter coming to you, live, from Disneyland's Haunted Mansion. I'm happy to report that the insanely bright EXIT signs in the graveyard have been extinguished! Also, oddly, Paul Frees' narration in the hall of doors and séance room have been cut.
This is gn2dlnd, signing out, from New Orleans Square.

So, is the piano-playing ghost in place again (after they took it out to piss off ISM). :)

[Gn2Dlnd]

Yep, PPG was, once again, not removed.

[innerSpaceman]

Is that true about the Frees narration?

Those bits in the Endless Corridor and the Seance Circle played for only a few years after the Mansion opened in 1969, and then were removed for well over a decade - reappearing in the late 1980's. It would be interesting if they were removed again.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Is that true about the Frees narration?


?

[Ghoulish Delight]

It may have just been a glitch. There have been several times over the past few years (ever since they added the Spanish safety spiel) that one or more of the audio sections between the endless corridor and the seance room haven't played for me.

[innerSpaceman]

The Paul Frees narration lines:

"All our ghosts have been dying to meet you. This one can hardly contain himself,"

"Unfortunately, they all seem to have trouble getting through," and

"Perhaps Madame Leota can establish contact. She has a remarkable head for materializing the disembodied."

... were cut from the Mansion's playback systems for nearly 15 years, rougly from the early mid-70's to the late 1980's.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

The Paul Frees narration lines:

"All our ghosts have been dying to meet you. This one can hardly contain himself,"

"Unfortunately, they all seem to have trouble getting through," and

"Perhaps Madame Leota can establish contact. She has a remarkable head for materializing the disembodied."

... were cut from the Mansion's playback systems for nearly 15 years, rougly from the early mid-70's to the late 1980's.WTF?? Why on earth did they do that?

[€uroMeinke]

Yeah, and can we have someoen else confirm it ;)

[CoasterMatt]

I had an Imagineer friend confirm that one today

[NirvanaMan]

Phanton Manor is like great sex. You can never get enough. Except there are rotting corpses and stuff.

[innerSpaceman]

I had an Imagineer friend confirm that one today
Heheh, yeah, since I'm 0-for-2 on the piano ghost and the AP lounge sofas, I don't expect anyone to take my word. But I was confident that it would be confirmable, as it's the absolute truth.

I don't know why on earth they removed those lines for nearly 15 years, but I remember quite distinctly the day they returned them to the Mansion. My friend Laurie and I had been listening to a bootleg Haunted Mansion run-thru on cassette in the car on the way to Disneyland, and were talking about the missing lines and how cool it would be to actually hear them in the Haunted Mansion.

Imagine our surprise, delight, and eerie freakoutness when the lines were heard in our Doombuggy not a half hour later!

[flippyshark]

We still do not have those lines here in WDW, in spite of the fact that they exist and would completely fit in the same spots as the original Mansion. There is a lot of call from fans and staffers-who-care for a complete audio overhaul of our Mansion (it really needs it!) so perhaps we will get those very spiffy lines ourself at last.

[innerSpaceman]

Well, we got your "hmmmmm" in the Stretch Room, so perhaps you'll get our stuff one day.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Getting a "hmmmmm" in the stretch room gives a whole new meaning to the phrase, "stretch room."

Hmmmmm?

[Matterhorn Fan]

Yes, well, we still have shrieking heads in the attic.

Oh, and the bride doesn't photograph well--she must be a ghost or something. All that came out without a flash was a small red dot.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

I'm happy to report that the insanely bright EXIT signs in the graveyard have been extinguished!

I'm happy to report that not only are the exit signs at the graveyard extinguished, but it appeared to us that ALL exit signs in the ride have been extinguished. No reflection in the ballroom. No sign in the noticably darker* hall of doors, no exit sign near Leota or anywhere in the final room. Nada.

I was far more excited about this than the changes, which, although I thought had some cool effects, I just didn't like the new bride.

* noticably darker to the point that I was completely unable to see the chair across from the knight at the beginning of the ride.

[innerSpaceman]

Yeah, I just got back from the Park and, well, having all the exit lights out makes me think "malfunction" rather than salvation.

On the othe hand, the hallway of doorways Paul Frees narration looks to be purposefully gone ... perhaps for another 15 years. I don't suspect malfunction on this. These are lines which Disney has removed in the past, and the Ghost Host does come off very chatty in that all too brief creepy section of the ride.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yeah, I just got back from the Park and, well, having all the exit lights out makes me think "malfunction" rather than salvation.Actually, I noticed on another attraction last week (Monsters? I don't recall now) that the signs were off. Seems someone finally figured out that if you leave them off and tie them into the alarm/electrical-backup system, they can be set to turn on either A) when the alarm sounds or B) when the power fails, the only times they need to be on.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

That's my take as well. If a emergency system in HM were actually malfunctioning, meaning that the exit signs weren't working at all, I would think that they would be required to close the ride completely until it was fixed. I don't think they would say "Ah, let's run it anyway and if a fire breaks out, we'll take our chances". A scenario like that would be a lawyer's wet dream.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

On the othe hand, the hallway of doorways Paul Frees narration looks to be purposefully gone ... perhaps for another 15 years. I don't suspect malfunction on this. These are lines which Disney has removed in the past, and the Ghost Host does come off very chatty in that all too brief creepy section of the ride.Interesting. I suppose I agree he is a bit chatty, especially when you enter Leota's room and he takes up half of it introducing her.

I would miss "hot and cold running chills" though.

[Gn2Dlnd]

"Hot and cold running chills" comes just before, "Listen," which is still part of the spiel.
I spoke to City Hall regarding the EXIT lights and they confirmed that the lights are, indeed, extinguished. I was told that they are looking for a solution, but this this what they're doing for now.

[innerSpaceman]

Huh? A solution? To what?

"Extinguished" means they shut them off purposefully. Are they admitting they don't have any emergency lighting system in place? If that's not the case, then what's to solve?

Methinks this merits further investigation. As romantic as it would be to die in the Haunted Mansion, I don't recommend the Park be allowed to encourage it.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Lord, "extinguished" and "solution" were my words. Her words were to the effect that they're figuring out a way of having the lights on, but dimmed and better themed. I didn't ask her what the technical specifications were on the current emergency EXIT light situation.

Far be it from me to discourage you from going all Carl Kolchak on this if you want, though.

[Not Afraid]

The Mansion changes don't bother me at all. I rode it twice today and actually liked looking at the new portraits, ephemera and effects. I tried to get some pics with my new camera but I need to go back and get more tips from the owners manual. Plus, it is damn dark in there now and I love the spooky darkness.

[€uroMeinke]

Yeah, perhaps the darkness and being on the far side of the doombuggy helped, but I though the effect worked quite well - as it does in Tower of Terror. I miss the beating heart bride, but she always was a bit klunky. Anyway, I'll probably ride it again.

[Mousey Girl]

The attic scene went by too quickly for me. I need to go back and reride it. Something that I did notice on Saturday, which bugged me, was in the graveyard. I noticed a couple of months ago that there was glass running between some of the effects. Saturday it was really hard not to notice it. It seemed to be very spotted and dirty, making some of the ghost behind it seem streaked.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I find the fact that you only see her for a split second because she's been placed in the corner to be telling.

[Not Afraid]

I saw her for quite a while. Long enough to get 4 blury pictures of her.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I found myself curious as to what Al said on this and checked out last week's update.

He's saying he'll reserve judgement until the whole package is installed....and what a humongous change it'll be! I've been avoiding spoilers, but now I've been informed. My reaction?

:(

R.I.P., Old Haunted Mansion. I'll miss you.

[Alex]

Ultimately the ghosts will decide. I've seen enough Haunted Mansion movies to know that when the ghosts get sufficiently pissed off the house will implode, sink into the ground, and disappear forever. So, if they're truly unhappy with the changes the Haunted Mansion will somehow end up falling into the Matterhorn sinkhole.

[Not Afraid]

LOL!!!!

[Matterhorn Fan]

Will we need 999 pairs of red long johns for that, or none?

[Gemini Cricket]

I saw this (http://www.grimghosts.com/secrets/SClayout.html) today. Pretty cool, no?

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I saw this (http://www.grimghosts.com/secrets/SClayout.html) today. Pretty cool, no?Definitely cool! Reminds me of what I wish the Olszewski Mansion was like.

[innerSpaceman]

That's fer awesome.

[Gemini Cricket]

I bought the blueprints for the HM and the POTC on eBay, but with the move, I have no idea where they are now.

[DreadPirateRoberts]

On the othe hand, the hallway of doorways Paul Frees narration looks to be purposefully gone ... perhaps for another 15 years. I don't suspect malfunction on this. These are lines which Disney has removed in the past, and the Ghost Host does come off very chatty in that all too brief creepy section of the ride.

We rode twice last night, the first time, in a pavlovian way, I missed the Paul Frees lines. Once I got over that, I liked it better the second time because I wasn't getting the sensory overload of the narration, which intrudes on the creepy mood set by the haunted door knobs, etc..

[alphabassettgrrl]

I got to see the new changes Monday. Two days ago.

I hate the missing narration in the hall of doors. Tell me the ghosts are having trouble getting through- it was faboulously spooky.

I love the portraits in the attic. I hate the bride but I love that she talks. I love that she repeats part of her vows. I love that she giggles (kind of) during "here comes the bride!".

I love the growling, gurgling, snarling ghost at the very end. After the turnstile on the exit. You can't see him only hear him.

[Gemini Cricket]

There are rumblings at MC that the new effects (the husbands' ghosts appearing/disappearing) in the seance room have been installed. Anyone see them yet?

[DreadPirateRoberts]

I bought the blueprints for the HM and the POTC on eBay, but with the move, I have no idea where they are now.

If you find them here's a link (http://tinselman.typepad.com/tinselman/2005/08/_latest_populat.html) to the Standard Operating Procedures so you can run it.

[Ghoulish Delight]

There are rumblings at MC that the new effects (the husbands' ghosts appearing/disappearing) in the seance room have been installed. Anyone see them yet?
Nothing different as of Sunday.