Survivor 13: Spics vs. Chinks???

[Ghoulish Delight]

Ummm, so Mark Burnett has unveiled that the next survivor season wil start with 4 tribes...divided along racial lines ("White" "African-American" "Asian-American" "Hispanic"). Wow. Just...wow.

I think this commentary (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14482071/) does a good job of pointing out the pitfalls of this decission.

Start with the fact that it smells like an attempt to "represent" everyone, and expecting five people to be representative of millions or billions is begging for trouble. Consider what happens if, for reasons unrelated to race, four of the first five people to leave are Asian? What if the final four are all black? Or all white? What do those headlines look like?

But does "ethnic pride" really mean the same thing to all people, such that we assume a contestant whose family is Korean automatically feels some special pride on behalf of someone whose family is Japanese? That is not to even consider the enormously sticky issue of whether someone whose great-grandparents are Russian is supposed to have shared "ethnic pride" with someone whose great-grandparents are Irish. It's a big jump to go from understanding that ethnic pride exists to believing it allows everyone to be divided into four teams.

Well, at the very least, Burnett has once again succeeded in creating buzz and print for Survivor. Whether he's created entertainment or not remains to be seen.

[Gemini Cricket]

It seems like a premise to draw press to the show. Yikes.


The Jets vs. The Sharks

(All I know about that is that The Sharks dance better.)
:D

[flippyshark]

Gads! I've disliked this show (and the whole enforced competition "reality" genre) since the beginning, but this idea is truly loathsome. My TV is staying off.

[Moonliner]

Oh great, so now if I want to root for one tribe I'm essentially being raciest against all the other tribes.

Great.

I think that rather than watch this season, I'll just take the dog for a long walk each week.

[DreadPirateRoberts]

Is Survior jumping the shark?

[Disneyphile]

Great. One of my fave TV shows turns into crap. :(

[Moonliner]

And perhaps next season they can break the tribes up by religion.

Christian vs Jews vs Muslims, vs Buddhist. :rolleyes:


Personally I think the buddhist tribe would get their asses kicked but that's just me.

[Mousey Girl]

Is Survior jumping the shark?

It just may be. I think this is a huge mistake. I truly hope there is a major backlash and no one watches.

[Matterhorn Fan]

I want their circumstances to be totally different--like one tribe to living in a cowboy ghost town, and another one on a pirate ship. Once they get to the merge, I want them to find out that meanwhile, two other tribes have been playing in two other themed locales, and that now, the pirates and cowboys have to learn to get along, because suddenly there's ninjas and knights to deal with.

Now that would be good TV.

:rolleyes:





Survivor jumped the shark a while ago.

[Gemini Cricket]

How about gays versus breeders? If the past has taught us anything (and it hasn't), gays win Survivor... and then go straight to jail for tax evasion.

:D

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Burnett sure knows how to push people's buttons. Ring that bell and BAM, everyone does what they're programmed to do - that is, get offended.

I'm withholding judgement until I see the show - if it entertains me I'll be happy, and if it doesn't, I won't. But I won't fall prey to "Ready to get mad? Aaaaannnnnd, GO!"

[AllyOops!]

Is Survior jumping the shark?

Whether it's jumped or not is beside the point. I just need to know if the shark is a "spick" or "chink". :p :D

(edited to add: the filter bans "spick" without a "k". What if I want to post that I do my household cleaning with spick n' span? Just curious..) ;)

Okay, all tasteless kidding aside on my part, I don't find this premise to be clever or interesting. In fact, it's rather despicable. I do agree with GD, however, in that it definitely will create buzz. It already has me discussing it, and I don't even watch the show!

It just seems for every step forward, this is taking us a step back, even if it is supposedly in the light-hearted vein of entertainment. This isn't maddening to me, just silly. I wouldn't watch, but that's because I don't watch Survivor as is. It could be naked firefighters vs. naked actors that Ally drools over, and I still wouldn't tune in. Okay, maybe I would. Okay, definitely would. But that isn't the point!! :D

Here's my main concern and question: So, a hispanic takes the title or prize. Maybe an african-american. Perhaps an asian. Or caucasian. WHAT DOES IT PROVE?!?! Is the message that is being conveyed simply, "look! (Insert race here) are far superior and beat the other ethnicities! Nice message. I'd like to think the person that wins has won based on his/her performance. We all know that to be true, but this premise begs for people to celebrate the skin color rather then the person. I find that gross.

[Scrooge McSam]

Survivor jumped the shark a while ago.

What did it for you?

I stopped watching after they screwed "Savage" over. Sorry, but it's been so long ago I can't remember his whole name.

"The tribe has spoken... unless we decide to override the vote and bring players back" never played well for me.

[blueerica]

I've never watched Survivor, with the exception of bits of episodes here and there - so it just sounds like a gimmick that I'm neither impressed nor offended by. Oh well.

On the otherhand, I can't see the title thinking it almost belongs in the "Controversial Topics Thread." ;)

[Not Afraid]

Gimmick is right - and a poor choice of one at that. But, I don't watch the show nor do I rarely watch TV. This just gives me more justification to not turn it on. I don't get the feeling I'm missing much.

[Moonliner]

How about gays versus breeders? If the past has taught us anything (and it hasn't), gays win Survivor... and then go straight to jail for tax evasion.

:D

Naw, the breeders would just kick their asses, and the gays would like it. :p

[scaeagles]

Survivor, to me, has always been a game about the psychology of human interaction when a group of people is thrown together with a nutually exclusive ogal of winning a million bucks. You have to work with and against people at the same time. It is physical, but more mental, and I have no problem with adding a different social element to it. I think it will add an interesting aspect for a season. In the end, it isn't about four people of the same race winning a million. It's about one person winning it.

[Moonliner]

Survivor, to me, has always been a game about the psychology of human interaction when a group of people is thrown together with a nutually exclusive ogal of winning a million bucks. You have to work with and against people at the same time. It is physical, but more mental, and I have no problem with adding a different social element to it. I think it will add an interesting aspect for a season. In the end, it isn't about four people of the same race winning a million. It's about one person winning it.

I say we all start a letter writing campaign to get Leo cast on the next survivor....

[scaeagles]

I'd do it in a heartbeat.

[Not Afraid]

I might even watch it then.

Actually, I probably wouldn't.

[DreadPirateRoberts]

I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Would you put on your Fonzie leather jacket and ride a motorcyle over the shark tank?

[Moonliner]

I could see Leo on survivor...

I could also see our resident MA masters on amazing race. How hard could a trip around the world be compaired to a summers MA?

[scaeagles]

I don't see this as a jump the shark moment.

[scaeagles]

I might even watch it then.

Actually, I probably wouldn't.

You'd watch. And you'd probably even host a Survivor party to watch it every Thursday.

[Stan4dSteph]

How is separation along ethnic lines more offensive than separation along gender lines?

I'll watch anyway. I'm hoping there will be some hot medics with Kiwi accents.

[Not Afraid]

You'd watch. And you'd probably even host a Survivor party to watch it every Thursday.


Oh God, kill me now!

But, sadly, you're probably right. I just would be in the kitchen while everyone was watching. I love a party and, a wee hour for some bad TV is doable.

[Babette]

I agree that it is the latest "watch me" gimmick, but if you think about it, it makes sense. Survivor has been criticized for the fact that the players are mostly white. I haven't watched in a few seasons, but it seems like the minority players are subject to prejudice and early ousting. This new tribe segregation guarantees that more minorities have the opportunity to play, and will be voted off for reasons other than race. At least until the merge.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

How is separation along ethnic lines more offensive than separation along gender lines?I agree that it is the latest "watch me" gimmick, but if you think about it, it makes sense. Survivor has been criticized for the fact that the players are mostly white.These are both excellent points. Babette's post reminded me of a Chappelle show sketch where he says that anyone who watches reality TV would think that black people are crazy, because they stick one black guy in with the craziest white people they can find and the black guy goes nuts. So in Chappelle's sketch they stuck one white guy in with the craziest black people they could create...pretty damn funny.

[flippyshark]

That was an awsesome sketch!

[Matterhorn Fan]

I agree that it is the latest "watch me" gimmick, but if you think about it, it makes sense. Survivor has been criticized for the fact that the players are mostly white. I haven't watched in a few seasons, but it seems like the minority players are subject to prejudice and early ousting. This new tribe segregation guarantees that more minorities have the opportunity to play, and will be voted off for reasons other than race. At least until the merge.Possibly, but they won't be separated into four tribes for very long. Didn't the whole four tribes thing last for about 3 days last season? All that hype about 4 tribes instead of 2, and it lasted one episode before the show was back to the same old same old.

What did it for you?I'm not sure. When did the "survival" part of the game disappear? Honestly, I have a hard time differentiating one season from another beyond the third season, and even then, I don't remember a lot about seasons 2 and 3.

I think Survivor would have been quite the phenomenon had they only done it once.

Their attempts to add new "twists" and try to make the game so that the people playing it don't know exactly what they're in for are--well, quite lame.

[Sub la Goon]

Survivor is my one guilty pleasure (on TV). I love it. I had to miss a couple of seasons when my work schedule conflicted and I never could tape and watch later.

I think this is an interesting idea.

The show mixes up groups already by gender, age, whatever. When I lived in NYC for a few years (something that always seems to come up in casual conversation), I noticed a propensity for people to group together based on ethnicity and place of origin. Sometimes it's due to language, but not always. How did "Birds of a Feather" get to be a cliche?

I am glad to see racial issues brought out and examined, even with such blatantly materialistic motives. It seems that in order to be PC, you can't touch the subject without being someome like George Lopez, Spike Lee, or Dave Chapelle. And they are brilliant.

Someone white and flabby (like me) can't make any (hopefully) racially insightful jokes without the fear of being misunderstood and called a bigot. So we avoid the subject (unless you happen to be GD looking to stir up some discussion).

I will watch, like I always do, and I am sure they will scramble up the tribes and get everyone PO'd at each other because that's Survivor. And they will probably edit in a few touching scenes with everyone just getting along.

Mark Burnett may be evil but a genius nonetheless.

[Jughead P. Jones]

You know, I have watched Survivor since the first edition was aired in the summer of 2000 (has it REALLY been that long??), and I have to say that some seasons have been good, and some have been boring at best. The first two were awesome, and I think my favourite season was season 7, where they were in the Pearl Islands (though, that was largely due to Rupert). But, I think after the All-Stars season, the show began to get less interesting to me. Some may say that the first season was bad enough, but for real fans of the show, you know that they're always looking for something different so that they'll keep watching.

This new idea that they have is rather controversial, no doubt about it. But, you know, controversy is nothing new in Survivor. In each season, there's always been some detail that people have tried to boycott and each time, they've still aired it.

A lot of people will likely disagree with me, but I see Survivor as the ultimate social experiment. I think it'll be interesting to see how this plays out.

And, who knows? For season 14, maybe they'll have rich people vs. poor people! ;)

[scaeagles]

A lot of people will likely disagree with me, but I see Survivor as the ultimate social experiment.

I couldn't agree more.

[Alex]

I agree to some extent. But then I also believe that some experiments are unethical.

And others are just stupid.

With some of the other splits they've done (young vs. old; men vs. women) I can see a hook for some good natured rootings for "your side." Hard for me to see the good natured rooting for or against somebody because they're Asian.

It also perpetuates the fallacy that a Japanese person would want to root for a Korean simply because they're also Asian. Or that there is some form of affinity between the white guy of Russian extraction and the white Greek guy.

[FEJ]

nevermind...I can't read

[wendybeth]

I don't really watch Survivor, but I cringed at the news of this season's 'theme'. I suppose it might be interesting to watch, simply from the 'let's all watch the inevitable train-wreck' angle, but I won't. I suppose one could view the whole Survivor series as a social experiment, but I don't really give it that much importance. It's entertainment, folks. It's heavily edited and manipulated entertainment, and I think I have enough pulling of my chain going on IRL to want to voluntarily submit my mind to this stuff. Again, I don't watch, so I know I'm missing out on a lot of stuff that probably makes it interesting and worthwhile, but I really can't get into the show. Then again, I'm usually working late that night.:rolleyes:

[scaeagles]

Stan4dSteph, at another site, posted a reminder that it starts tomorrow, Thursday, September 14. Glad I read it or I would have missed it. So, I'm returning the favor and posting a reminder here for all interested.

[Matterhorn Fan]

I've been rolling my eyes at the commercials lately, but I'll be watching tonight.

Unless there's something better.



P.S. What happened on Rock Star last night? I couldn't watch.

[Jughead P. Jones]

I've been rolling my eyes at the commercials lately, but I'll be watching tonight.

Unless there's something better.



P.S. What happened on Rock Star last night? I couldn't watch.

Lukas Rossi is the new lead singer of Supernova...but Dilana, who came in second was offered a chance to record her own album with help from Gilby Clarke and Dave Navarro, so both Lukas and Dilana made out quite well.

Great news...if you like Lukas or Dilana that is.

[Matterhorn Fan]

Ah, good. I liked Lukas. I did NOT like Dilana.

[Jughead P. Jones]

Ah, good. I liked Lukas. I did NOT like Dilana.

Yeah, Lukas did blend well with Supernova...he certainly represented us Canadians well. As for Dilana, I think she probably would do better as a solo artist.

Personally, I'm surprised Toby didn't make it to the final 2. I thought he had a fighting chance as well.

(Oops...look at me, turning a Survivor thread into a Rockstar thread.:blush: I'll stop now.:D )

[Matterhorn Fan]

Not your fault. I'm the ultimate thread derailer. I only posted that here because I figured the people likely to watch Survivor were also likely to have been watching Rock Star.

I, too, thought Toby would have done better. Then again, I thought Dilana should have been gone a couple weeks ago. Maybe they felt like they needed to keep a girl till the end?

Oh, yeah, and Survivor. Lukas was so not on Survivor tonight.

[Gemini Cricket]

So, how was Survivor?

[Moonliner]

I'd say the voulme of posts speaks volumes about the show... ;)

I give it a: Meh.

A few laughs, one or two standouts, I'll watch another episode or two and see if I get interested or not...

[scaeagles]

It never gets that interesting to me until I've gotten to know the people a bit. Too many to keep track of in the early going. In a couple of weeks I'll have stuff to say about it. The only thing I have to say is the old oriental guy is the new Shane (he was the psycho guy from last season, right?).

[Stan4dSteph]

I like Yul. He's a Stanford grad.

[Sub la Goon]

Yeah, I'd say Cowboy is some sort of Dennis Hopper / Yoda hybrid. And he wears a star of David, so he is like a hippie Vietnamese rabbi.

The rest are pretty nondescript, except for the idiot rollergirl who lost the chickens for Caucasians.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I like Cao Boi better than I liked Mr. Miyagi (Bruce) last season. I mean, he did cure dude's headache.

I also like the fact that he takled about not fitting the asian stereotype...but he's a nail salon manager. It does seem that with the pointed "I don't fit the stereotype" stuff, the constant "Asians eat rice"/"boat person" stuff on the raft, and the previewed Asian jokes next week that he's overcompensating just a bit.

I will say one thing for the race division...at least it means a few more non-white faces on the island. It's kinda nice to not talk about the black guy, the black chick, and the miscellaneous other person.

[Alex]

I found it interesting (though I'm not entirely sure in what way) that all the groups commented on the division but only the black group seemed to place a whole lot of emphasis on "representing" their race. Of course maybe they all did and it was edited down to just that tribe as standard reality show foreshadowing of the episode's result.

I was also glad that one of the Korean girls made a similar point as I did. Wihte people, for the most part, don't really care about our race. The other three tribes have a certain cultural homogeneity for differing reasons.

But my experience with Asian immigrants is that they think of themselves first as American, second as whatever their ancestral national origin is, and a distant third as "Asian." That is, because of common cultural influences a black person will probably feel some bond with another black person even if they came from opposite ends of Africa genetically.

But Koreans, Philipinos, and Vietnamese tend to consider themselves as separate races. Outside of academic identity politics programs I don't think there is so much an "Asian" identity.

Whereas as the block identification for black Americans is much stronger because of the historical record. It would have been very interesting (to me, anyway) to have included an African immigrant on the show, someone who has not been part of that block identification.

Another thing of interest to watch will be how the speech styles of the individual groups (but mostly the black tribe) change when the merge happens. (And not that isn't some kind of insult; I am completely accepting of African-American Vernacular English as a dialect of the language.)

[Stan4dSteph]

Another thing of interest to watch will be how the speech styles of the individual groups (but mostly the black tribe) change when the merge happens. (And not that isn't some kind of insult; I am completely accepting of African-American Vernacular English as a dialect of the language.)I thought this too. The African-American group seemed freer in what they said as a group than I've observed on previous Survivors where tribes were mixed.

I also think there will be some friction in the Asian tribe, because Cao Boi appears to see himself as closer to his Vietnamese roots, whereas he commented that the others have lost touch with their identities.

[Gemini Cricket]

the old oriental guy...
Leo! :rolleyes:
Oriental = things (rugs, vases, noodles...)
Asian = people (old guys, young guys...)
Naughty naughty, Leo Schmeo.
:D

[Strangler Lewis]

The polite racist term is "Asian gentleman."

[Gemini Cricket]

Or if one doesn't like the word 'old' one should say: Almost dead Asian Gentleman.

:D

[Strangler Lewis]

The term "Asian gentleman" implies old. Silk robes and beanie or topcoat, walking stick and fu manchu moustaches.

[Gemini Cricket]

You forgot Kung Fu expert...
:D

[Stan4dSteph]

Ancient Chinese secret, huh?

[Disneyphile]

My favorite contestant is Cao Boi. He rules. :D

[Jughead P. Jones]

It's an interesting group. I'm torn between the green tribe (Asian) and the red tribe (Hispanics) as deciding which tribe is my favourite. I think both of them seem to have a great repoire with each other, and they all get along...well, at least on episode one.

Blue tribe (Caucasians) is getting on my nerves, and I'm glad that Jonathan got sent to Exile Island...stealing the chicken from Yul...as if! Oh, and Jessica, the roller girl...some people online on other sites I go to call her Courtney 2.0. You remember Courtney from the last season? The fire dancer? 'Nuff said.

And, I probably would have gotten rid of Sekou too...he seemed useless to me.

(Actually, I would have gotten rid of Jonathan over Sekou...but oh well.)

[Stan4dSteph]

Oh, and Jessica, the roller girl...some people online on other sites I go to call her Courtney 2.0. You remember Courtney from the last season? The fire dancer? 'Nuff said.I was calling her that today too. She is totally Courtney 2.0. She even does fire dancing, according to her bio page.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I was calling her that today too. She is totally Courtney 2.0. She even does fire dancing, according to her bio page.Except she's got Sally's soccer socks.

[Gemini Cricket]

Forget all that. Who are the gays on 'Survivor'?
:D

[scaeagles]

Next year - gay vs straight vs bi vs transgendered.

[Jughead P. Jones]

Next year - gay vs straight vs bi vs transgendered.

Get this one to Mark Burnett's office! New idea! :D

[Ghoulish Delight]

Next year - gay vs straight vs bi vs transgendered.
Jews vs. Christians vs. Muslims vs. Athiests?

[Betty]

I found it interesting that the men on the tribe with african american people didn't consult the women at all about who to send to exile island. Too bad that they didn't think far enough ahead to realize that they'd need one of them in order to not get voted out. Learned that just a little too late.

[€uroMeinke]

deaf vs blind

[Ghoulish Delight]

The Soup's observation (warning, blatant stereotyping for comedic effect ahead)...the first challenge involved paddling a boat, then solving a puzzle. Way to favor the asians!

[Jughead P. Jones]

deaf vs blind

Actually, in the Amazon season, they did have a deaf castaway. Her name was Christy Smith, and I think she made it to the final six. Though she had trouble communicating with the others after the sun went down, her ability to read lips helped her find out what was going on in the game. (And, I remember this because I wanted her to win that year! :D )

...and I know WAY too much about Survivor than I really should. :blush:

[CoasterMatt]

Franciscan Monks vs. Shaolin Monks

[scaeagles]

I've never met Sac, but from the pics I've seen Jonathon kind of looks him. Am I alone in thinking this?

I don't like Ozzy. He thinks he is all that. I like Yul. Glad he found the idol.

[Mousey Girl]

I hate to see teams throwing challenges so early in the game, but I do agree that Billy had to go. I just don't get that after all this time that players don't get that if they are lazy they are gone.

I have a gut feeling that the Asian team may be the next to throw a challenge.

[Jughead P. Jones]

I've been against throwing challenges on Survivor for a while now, but yeah...Billy was losing focus. But, hey...who knows? Maybe after the show, he can hook up with his girlfriend, Candice.:evil:

Yul finding the idol was a good thing...let's hope he'll never have to use it. Right now, he's one of my picks to win it all.

[Stan4dSteph]

So long racial segregation!

That race around the ellipse challenge was much better when they did it the first time. Tom the hot fireman (http://www.cbs.com/primetime/survivor10/) was amazing during that challenge, and it went on a lot longer than last night.

[Strangler Lewis]

My guess is they were afraid that the black team would lose every unthrown challenge, and they didn't want to see their show quoted at length in racial supremacy social "science."

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yeah, that was pretty pathetic. Of course, the one team ended up with ALL buff young guys while the losing tribe had Cao Boi and Jonathan. Cao Boi and Jonathan are no Tom.

[Jughead P. Jones]

Well, as it stands right now, every tribe has now lost a member except for the original Raro team (also known as the Caucasians). Puka's down one, Hiki's down two, and as far as the original Aitu...well, we have Ozzy. ;)

But, unlike past seasons where I've zoned in on a competitor I want to win it all...I can't seem to find a person I really want to win it this time around. I guess if I had to pick one, it'd be Yul, because I liked his gameplay from the very beginning.

[Ghoulish Delight]

mu‧ti‧ny  /ˈmyuthttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.pngnhttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.pngi/ [/URL][myoot-n-ee] noun, plural -nies, verb, -nied, -ny‧ing.
–noun
1.revolt or rebellion against constituted authority, esp. by sailors against their officers.


de‧fect  /dɪˈfɛkt/ [URL="http://www.loungeoftomorrow.com/LoT/"] (http://www.loungeoftomorrow.com/LoT/)[di-fekt]
-verb
1.to desert a cause, country, etc., esp. in order to adopt another (often fol. by from or to): He defected from the U.S.S.R to the West.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

I don't like Ozzy. He thinks he is all that. I like Yul. Glad he found the idol.

Responding to this a bit late because, well, I just got caught up on Survivor this season. Turns out you can watch all of the episodes for free on CBS. com (you just have to put up with one commercial per commercial break).

Have to say that I'm starting to like Ozzy. Granted, he isn't really playing the game strongly from a mental perspective, but damn if he isn't probably the best person I have seen in challenges in a long time, especially in the water. The guy can hold his breath like forever and he is almost unbeatable. If he makes it to the merge, he is going to be hard to beat physically in individual immunities.

I think Yul has a decent chance as well. Him and Ozzie are doing well together and the immunity idol certainly doesn't hurt. Most of the other players this season have seemed as dumb as a sack of potatoes. Still, I'm enjoying this season more than I expected. Maybe it has to do with seeing all of the episodes so far in a matter of 3 or 4 days but I think they found some interesting people and the challenges, for the most part, have been entertaining. Looks like the jury is going to be a bit bigger this time around, as well.

I'll be happier when all of the white people have been voted off. Every damn one of them has bugged me.

[scaeagles]

I will say I'm starting to like Ozzy much more. And I am pulling for those 4 like anything.

I think perhaps the stupidest move I have ever seen in Survivor was Jonathon defecting. What a moron. And the chick who went as well....I really, really don't like her. Or Parvati. Or the other white dude. I'm with you MBC.

[Ghoulish Delight]

"I caught a bird"

Ozzie rules (and I'm not talking about football).

Candace is an idiot. Johnathan is idioter. And the way he just ran his mouth when he arrive...yikes.

[Mousey Girl]

Candace saying she wanted to be over there with Parvati made me laugh. She wanted to "be with" Adam. I liked her much better before the mutiny. Jonathon has bugged me since day one. He is far too self important and it will be fun to see his reaction when voted off.

I was so pleased to see Yul and Ozzie win immunity. I really like those 2. the 2 women on the tribe are just ok.

[Jughead P. Jones]

I think we can award both Candice and Jonathan a "D-uh!" award for leaving.

In all likelihood, with Brad as a juror now, the merge has got to happen soon after...and when that happens, it's bye-bye, original Raro members! :D

I agree...Yul and Ozzy are the ones to beat...and I kind of like Becky as well...but she's been kind of quiet.

[Betty]

I'm really pulling for Yul and Ozzie as well. Ozzie is just amazing in any challenge involving water - really going to be hard to beat in individual immunity for sure. And Yul with the Imunity Idol throws something else into the mix.

I think Jonthan knew he'd made a mistake as soon as he jumped onto that mat. He hadn't had time to think it through because she jumped a the last minute. I think he was trying to stay true to what he thought was an alliance - but at the same time - he had more then one alliance.

I'd like to see the producers scare the contestants at some point. Watching Celebrity Paranormal Project the other day and was cracking up at just how freaked out you can get by 1. dark, 2. being told a scary story and 3. someone making a loud noise somewhere close by but unseen. I guess they do that to some extent on exile island - just by them being alone.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I SO called the double vote when Jeff handed them the bottle. Well, my first guess was that the bottle would just say, "Whoever just got the 2nd most votes is gone," but then guessed that there'd be a 2nd vote. But I knew that 2 were getting the boot. Had to come sometime, since the season started with more contestants than normal and yet there are the same # of episodes.

I'm a bit surprised that they went for Jenny. I guess they must really like fish. I mean, I know a bunch of them had been talking abut axing Jenny anyway, but it's one thing to pick one person to vote out, then dicuss a theoretical future plan. It's another to actually pull the trigger on that plan. I expected them, unable to discuss, to default to "original tribe stick together" rules and get rid of Johnathan.

Besides, while he is getting fish, he hasn't exactly been a powerhouse in the challenges.

[Stan4dSteph]

Woohoo Aitu! That feast looked like a lot of fun.

I was also surprised at voting off Jenny. However, considering the rest of them seem to be doing next to nothing at the moment, keeping Jonathan allows them to be lazy until he gets fed up and calls them on it. Then they can vote him off.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

I thought it was a great episode.

One thing that came to mind, so far the jury is made up of people that each have a pretty good reason to hold a grudge against their former teammates. I think any of them would vote for an Aitu member in the final 2, if given a choice. And yet, if Aitu loses an upcoming immunity challenge, I would be surprised to see a lot of behind the back scheming. They've bonded pretty strongly. I think a vote would be based on a mutually agreed upon decision. Perhaps I give them too much credit. As a result of their dominance in the challenges, they really haven't had much reason to play a dirtier game. Still, I just don't envision a big blow out at any point. I think they will vote for one of their own if placed on the jury.

And if they can at least even up the numbers between tribes before a merge, I think it will will either be Ozzie or Yul to take the whole enchilada.

[Jughead P. Jones]

I admit...I missed the boat with the bottle prediction. (I initially thought that nobody would be going home, and that the person voted out would join Aitu! LOL!)

That said, I really like the "Aitu 4", and would like it if one of the four made it all the way to the end.

As for Raro...well, they had better pray for a merge...because, let's face it...they're hopeless!

[Motorboat Cruiser]

Anyone watch on Thursday? Great episode. I won't give anything away just yet, unless others saw it. Also, a reminder that you can see it for free on cbs.com.

Definitely worth watching.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Freaking Johnathan. But bless him for keeping those that actually deserve to win alive. But, by some token, it may have been a good move for him. I mean, had he not switched back, he had 4 guaranteed votes against him. Guaranteed. By switching back, he stands some slim chance of gaining at least a couple of them back, and, let's be honest, his new tribe can't exaclty claim to be shocked by his lack of loyalty so he doesn't risk a WHOLE lot in terms of reputation on that end. Hmm..

[Motorboat Cruiser]

I think he is somewhat safe in the respect that just about anyone would want to face him in the final two.

Yul rocks for being able to pull that off without having to use the idol. Speaking of rocking, Ozzie looked like he had another couple hours in him on that pole if need be.

[Ghoulish Delight]

* Everybody who got nothing out of that auction is an idot. Just freaking bid! Who cares if it costs you $500? Big freaking deal. Yeah, Johnathan was kind of a dick about it back at camp, but you're all idiots for not bidding on anything.

* Oh my god I want Pavarti to go away. Just dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb. I mean, whining about Johnathan switching sides? Really? Yeah, that one was a real blindside, wasn't it. The dude who just deserted his old tribe deserting you. Gosh, and he was so honest and loyal up until then. Idiot.

[mousepod]

I felt like Woody Allen while watching Survivor last night. When Adam and what's-her-face were insulting Jonathan, they both called him "A dirty... (pause)... rat." I turned to Heather and said, "You know what they want to say." She told me I was being paranoid.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

I love Yul, but I think he talks a little more than he should sometimes. You don't have to let everyone in camp know your plans down to the tiniest detail. I think everyone is starting to realize that they really don't want to face Yul or Ozzy in the final two. I predict Jonathan will make it into the final four somehow.

[Moonliner]

If I was a member of the Yul'ers my next target would be Adam. He has the potential to win immunity so get rid of him as soon as you can. After that it would seem to be:

Parvati then Jonathan (or vise versa)

Leaving just the four and yul with the immunity idol. We know Yul and Becky are tight so who goes first? Ozzy or Sundra? I think they can both see that far ahead and can't be happy with that option so I'd expect one of them, probably Ozzy, to break ranks possibly as soon as the next show.

This four member alliance will not stand the test of time. They never do.

So here is how I'd like to see the next vote go down. Ozzy and Sundra make a power play, bring in Parvati and Adam to vote against Yul. Yul and Becky vote Jonathan, and Jonathan's vote is irrelevant. Yul uses up the idol and Jonathan goes home. I think it's critical that Yul is forced to use the idol next week or he wins. If Yul wins immunity next week you might as well write out the check.

[Strangler Lewis]

If I was a member of the Yul'ers my next target would be Adam. He has the potential to win immunity so get rid of him as soon as you can.

I was surprised to see Adam win immunity in a mental challenge and one that involved having paid attention to events around him. I still don't like him, but it was an interesting development.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

Hmm, anyone watch last week? I finally saw it over the weekend. I'm surprised that they got rid of Jonathan. I can't think of anyone I would rather have faced in the final two.

Next week looks interesting at it appears a plot is underway to get rid of Ozzy. Um, you are going to have to beat him at a challenge first. And going by last weeks challenge, you seriously better hope that water and/or balance don't come into play. He made that challenge look like child's play...once again. I have a feeling that a few of the other players are still nursing bruises from that one. :)

[Ghoulish Delight]

Hmm, anyone watch last week? I finally saw it over the weekend. I'm surprised that they got rid of Jonathan. I can't think of anyone I would rather have faced in the final two. I think 2 things came into play. Fistly, there is the risk of the Hatch-factor. While everyone may have hated him, there's always the possibility that it will flip around and be viewed as good game-play. Secondly, and I think they did a poor job of showing it until this episode, EVERYONE seemed to hate being around him. I mean, for a while it seemed like while bimbo and bimbo (Pavarti and Adam) really hated him while the rest were annoyed but tolerated him. But this episode really showed, they barely tolerated him. After a while, I imagine it was just getting exhausting having to put up with his crap, and be associated with his crap.

And at this point, it's a good numbers move. Assuming no side-plot succeeds, either of the bimbos will be gone next week. Then, the week after, if whomever's left happens to win immunity, you just pick off whomever you were planning on being the first out of the final 4 (I'm assuming Sundra), odds are the same person isn't going to win immunity the week after. So if you're secure in your final 3 (Ozzy, Yul, Becky seem pretty strong), they're in good shape without Johnathan.

I don't think there's much chance Ozzy's going, even without winning immunity. While there's a good case for Sundra flipping and voting with the bimbos, that leaves a 3-3 situation. Yul clearly won't flip, and Becky is doubtful at best. And the track record still remains: since the advent of the "pull a stone from the bag" method of tie-breaking, no one has ever risked a tied vote. And with the Yulmunity still in play, I don't see it happening this time either.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

All good points. :)

[Betty]

I am so hoping that Ozzy or Yule wins this. Ozzy is just amazing in challenges isn't he?

[scaeagles]

What amazes me with the whoile Jonathon thing is exactly what he said at the tribal council at which he was voted out....they are all accusing him of being slime, but after he switched, he could have been voted out three times. They turned on their own to keep him. Granted, I still think he was a moron to turn on his original tribe, and he is annoying, but don't give me this "you turned on us" crap when they turned on their own three times at tribal.

[Mousey Girl]

Tonight is the final episode. I really want Ozzy to win.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

Well, I suppose it is safe to post at this point that Yul was the winner. He played a fine game and was deserving. Personally, I was rooting for Ozzie, although I don't think he came off particularly well in the Q&A session before the last tribal council. That probably made the difference.

Also, I must add that I think it was dumb to have 3 finalists. It was clear as day for weeks now that this was going to be between Yul and Ozzie. She never stood a chance and I'm not sure why they felt a need to change things up.

Oh, and the fire making contest was pitiful.

All in all, I found it a pretty enjoyable season. Lots of interesting twists and a deserving winner. I'll keep watching.

Next season looks interesting.

[scaeagles]

I laughed and laughed watching the fire thing.

I would suppose they had the 3 finalists thing planned out for some time. Why else would the jury have started with Brad? That's 3 earlier than normal (typically 7 in the final jury and 2 finalists). To me it was obvious at that point something different was up, so i don't think they decided to switch it up after it was clear who it was between.

The large rocker dude....I thought he handled his embarrassment well.

Happy to see Yul win, but maybe since I'm caucasion, I don't "get it". I don't understand the whole "represent" thing Ozzie and Yul and a couple of the others were talking about. I was pulling for the group of 4 since the mutiny, and it was never a racial thing to me at all. Maybe that's why I don't get it.

[Stan4dSteph]

Next season looks interesting.Yes, I wonder if they finished filming in Fiji before the latest coup.

I was glad to see Yul win. He was my pick from the beginning. Got to root for the Stanford grad!

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yes, I wonder if they finished filming in Fiji before the latest coup.

No, they hadn't. As the host of NPR's "Wait Wait Don't Tell Me" put it, the leader of Fiji knew he was in trouble when Jeff Probst walked up and snuffed his torch out.

Also, I must add that I think it was dumb to have 3 finalists. It was clear as day for weeks now that this was going to be between Yul and Ozzie. She never stood a chance and I'm not sure why they felt a need to change things up.That wasn't a decision they could change on the spot. Remember, they stared with 20 contestants rather than the usual 18. They got rid of 2 in one episode, but that still left an extra one. So that meant either there would have to be one more episode to get that extra person out, or some change in final format. Remember, they already started building the jury one person early. This was clearly a decision made at the start of the season.

I can't say Yul didn't "deserve" it, but it still bugs me. Yeah, he orchestrated a lot of things...but it's easy to orchestrate a lot of things when you've got guaranteed immunity and don't have to worry about anything. Sure, Ozzy constantly had immunity too, but he had to earn it every single time with a ton of pressure. That, to me, is more impressive than just having immunity and calling the shots from a position of safety. Feh.

But I was still entertained by the season, and highly impressed that those 4 pulled off the impossible. Definitely seemed like the most intelligent, deserving final 4 in a long long time.

[Nephythys]

Yul was my pick from the beginning- I would have been pleased with either of them winning- but I was a little happier that is was Yul.

[Matterhorn Fan]

Hmmph. I've never understood why they change the day of the final show. Why does this not air on a Thursday?

Needless to say, I totally forgot and I missed it.

[Strangler Lewis]

My viewing was spotty, so I thought Ozzy would pitch a shutout based on his challenge performances, but seeing the highlights, Yul probably deserved to win.

I thought that having three was sort of lame. What it did accomplish, however, was avoiding the situation where a strong person (like Tom) takes a lame coattail type to the final two. I did wonder what would have happened if Becky got a vote. Would Yul and Ozzy have split the money? Would Becky's supporter have had to vote live at the award's show? Would there have been a complete re-vote? I wonder if they've considered having a re-vote in the audience after everyone's watched the season.

I also don't know why Adam honored his pledge to Yul unless making the top five now gets you some money.

[Nephythys]

Hmmph. I've never understood why they change the day of the final show. Why does this not air on a Thursday?

Needless to say, I totally forgot and I missed it.



They have been airing the finale on Sunday's for several seasons.

Check On Demand- last couple of seasons you would rewatch the finale there.

[Matterhorn Fan]

They have been airing the finale on Sunday's for several seasons.

Check On Demand- last couple of seasons you would rewatch the finale there.Yes, I know. But I forgot. And changing the day for one episode does seem rather silly.

I cannot check On Demand, as I have nothing of the sort. The only things I can watch on demand are things I own on DVD, and even then, demanding to see them accomplishes nothing! Can you believe that I have to get up and put a DVD in the player? Absurd! ;)

[Nephythys]

LOL- sorry. I should not have assumed.

I taped the reunion- I would be happy to send it if you want to see it.

[Matterhorn Fan]

That's sweet but really not necessary. I can get the gist of it from the posts here, and besides... I've probably only seen about half this season's episodes. Of the ones I did watch, I'd guess I turned them on 15-30 minutes late most of the time, and then I was also doing something else.

It's like the last few seasons of the X-Files. I really loved season 1, and felt I ought to keep watching, but even so, I didn't really care and I wasn't really enoying it anymore. Ya know?

[Strangler Lewis]

You can watch the whole season on the Survivor web site.

[Nephythys]

That's sweet but really not necessary. I can get the gist of it from the posts here, and besides... I've probably only seen about half this season's episodes. Of the ones I did watch, I'd guess I turned them on 15-30 minutes late most of the time, and then I was also doing something else.

It's like the last few seasons of the X-Files. I really loved season 1, and felt I ought to keep watching, but even so, I didn't really care and I wasn't really enoying it anymore. Ya know?


Yes- I fade on Survivor sometimes. Sometimes I watch it all-

Well- you know how it ended- that is all that really matters now right? ;)

[Ghoulish Delight]

They air it on Sunday because they don't want to preempt 2 hours of other weekday programming to accommodate the 3 hour finale.

[Stan4dSteph]

Yes, I know. But I forgot. And changing the day for one episode does seem rather silly.

I cannot check On Demand, as I have nothing of the sort.You can view Survivor online at cbs.com if you have a high-speed connection.

[Matterhorn Fan]

You can view Survivor online at cbs.com if you have a high-speed connection.Still on dialup!

[Stan4dSteph]

Still on dialup!LAME!

[Motorboat Cruiser]

That wasn't a decision they could change on the spot. Remember, they stared with 20 contestants rather than the usual 18. They got rid of 2 in one episode, but that still left an extra one. So that meant either there would have to be one more episode to get that extra person out, or some change in final format. Remember, they already started building the jury one person early. This was clearly a decision made at the start of the season.

Poor wording on my part (thanks, nyquil). I didn't mean to suggest that this was something that they decided after the season was underway. I just thought the whole concept of having three finalists was lame. I kind of felt bad for Becky, having to sit there through all the cheering without getting a single vote.

And I definitely think Ozzie was more deserving, although Yul was a very close second and fine competitor. I just think that Ozzie did an absolutely piss poor job of making his case in front of the jury. Certainly not a dumb guy, but he didn't sound like he put any thought into his answers and I think it cost him. He certainly could have persuaded one person.

[Jughead P. Jones]

The comic moment of the whole finale was the fire-building challenge. 15 minutes later...no fire.

30 minutes later...no fire.

45 minutes later...no fire.

60 minutes later...Jeff Probst, frustrated says. "STOP. MATCHES. NOW." ROTFLMAO!!!

In the end, the final 3 twist was a redundant one, but was thrilled to see the battle go between Yul and Ozzy. They were the most deserving final 2 out there. And, both of them walked away with something (Yul, the million, Ozzy, a new car.)

BEST. SURVIVOR. FINALE. EVER.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Ozzie should have played up the hidden immunity angle more in his answers. Why doesn't Yul deserver it? Because it's easy to play Godfather when you've got the idol in your back pocket, no effort required. You can pull the string all you want with zero fear of backlash. Ozzie didn't mention that once.

Yes, fire non-making was hilarious. I mean...matches. Sundra couldn't do it with matches. That's pathetic.

[Stan4dSteph]

Ozzie should have played up the hidden immunity angle more in his answers. Why doesn't Yul deserver it? Because it's easy to play Godfather when you've got the idol in your back pocket, no effort required. You can pull the string all you want with zero fear of backlash. Ozzie didn't mention that once.This is not entirely true. It was easy for Yul to do it because no one ever actually got the balls to get enough people together and challenge him for it. The only one who did was Adam, but his effort was a half-assed desperation move at the end.

[Ghoulish Delight]

This is not entirely true. It was easy for Yul to do it because no one ever actually got the balls to get enough people together and challenge him for it. The only one who did was Adam, but his effort was a half-assed desperation move at the end.
Yes, there is that fact. But if I were Ozzie, that's the story I'd tell. Yes, Yul did an excellent job of playing the idol to his advantage, but it's easy to be the mastermind when you're in a position where you don't have worry if you're safe or not. Yes, he COULD have been forced to use the idol and lose that position, but the fact was, he wasn't, so every time a decision had to be made, and every time an immunity challenge came up, he had the luxury of guaranteed security that no one else had.