The Oscars

[innerSpaceman]

The 79th Annual Academy Awards show is this coming Sunday night, February 25th. The glamor, the stars, the fashion faux pas!

Here's (http://www.oscar.com/nominees/?pn=list) a list of the nominations.

This year I'm uber Oscar-prepped ... and nowhere to go. I've seen more of the nominees than ever ... but no one's invited me to an Oscar party. Waaaaaa!

Last year, zapppop and I won a Best Costume award at an Oscar Masquerade party with our interpretation of Brokeback Mountain. Hahaha.

This year .... zip. :(



Despite the fact that Netflix is stiffing me on Half Nelson before the Oscars ... I've still managed to see:

All the nominees for Best Picture and Best Director. All the noms for Best Animated Feature, Best Supporting Actor, Costumes, Editing, Sound Editing, Sound Mixing, Visual Effects, Song, and Original Screenplay. I've seen 3 each of the Best Actor and Actress noms, 4 of the Art Direction noms, 3 of the Cinematography, 2 of the 3 Make-up nominations, 4 of the Adapted Screenplays, and heard 4 of the nominated Music Scores.

I've only seen one of the Foreign Films, but it's the one that's going to win. So far, only one of the animated shorts ... but I'm going - with other swankers - to a screening of various nominated live-action and animated shorts on Saturday. And I've seen 2 of the nominated documentaries, but none of the nominated documentary shorts.

The four nominated lead actor/actress performances I've missed are glaring omissions. I've not seen Volver, or Last King of Scotland, or Notes on a Scandal or Half Nelson. But it's still the most Oscar-ready I've ever been.


Isn't anyone having an Oscar party????? It seems such a shame to watch at home all alone.





And here's (http://youtube.com/watch?v=x174dxrkiVs) my favorite moment from any Oscars ever - Bette Davis presenting the Best Actor award, 20 years ago! (It's a six minute clip, but the fun stuff is at the end, once Robert Wise hits the stage to accept the award on behalf of Paul Newman .... Oh.My.Gawd.)

:snap: :snap: :snap:

[Bornieo: Fully Loaded]

Isn't anyone having an Oscar party????? It seems such a shame to watch at home all alone.

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.... that's me every year!! I went to one great one last year but typically I"m home with my remote, score card and a gallon of Dryers Mint Chocolate Chip Ice Cream.

No sympathy here! :p

[€uroMeinke]

I'm sure there will be a virtual party on IM that night - BYOB

[CoasterMatt]

Mint Chocolate Chip Ice Cream is the best....

[Alex]

I've never been to an Oscar party of any type. In fact, now that I think about it, this weekend could be the first time I actually watch the Academy Awards in years (I saw Halle Berry wins hers on a TV in the bar while we were eating dinner at Chevy's in Emeryville, CA. (Have absolutley no idea why I remember that).

Since I probably won't be doing something else, I should see if the Parkway Theater in Oakland (couches, beer, pizza) still does a viewing party.

[Not Afraid]

No party this year! Well, we'll just have to do a giant IM conference, won't we?

Or, how about someone clean my house, everyone take their allergy meds, Kevy put the TV in the trunk and bring it over and we'll have a party here?

[BarTopDancer]

I'll be at a Ducks game.

I wonder if they will show the winners during the breaks and tv time outs like they show scores.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I think I've only gotten together with friends to watch the Oscars once or twice. Freakin' Sunday night, lame. :(

As it is, the Oscars always reminds me of being a kid, watching the show with family. It was one of very few TV events where we brought our dinner into the living room. I think the only other shows we did that for each year were the Miss America/Miss Universe pageants. My family was pretty strict on the family dinner table standard.

I still love parking myself in front of the TV for a three hour event, though now with TiVo, things are much more flexible. And to think - never again will we yell "IT'S ON" at someone in the bathroom.

[Snowflake]

Is is too soon to annouce you're all invited to the 2008, 80th anniversary Oscar party?

By that time I should have a larger TV and the menu planned ;)

[Morrigoon]

Gawd, I haven't been to an Oscar party since a little debacle of a party involving an uber-liberal transgender chick/man yelled at anyone wearing red, white, and blue ribbons on their lapel while everyone else kept their lips politely zipped for fear of inciting him/her into a political tirade. Good times, good times.

[innerSpaceman]

Well, this will be my first non-Oscar party year in five years, and I'm going to have withdrawals.






ETA: I take that back ... there was one year in that 5-year span that I watched at home alone.


We all know not to try and capture lightning in a bottle twice ... but when we do eventually have a Swanker Oscar Party, I wholeheartedly recommend the costume variety ... where guests are encouraged to come as nominated movies or characters from.

This year, you'll all be missing my drag turn as The Queen.

[Babette]

I was invited to a swanky party this year, but had to decline due to NASCAR. We should be back to mom & dad's place in time for pizza and Oscars with the family. That is how we usually watch them. Mom orders the pizza when Dad & Ubergeek cell in their ETA from Fontana (I don't always go to the race). iSm - you want to come? we can call you, too!

[Alex]

Well, having watched Babel last night I have now filled out quite a few categories. It won't have much of an impact on my preferences, though, since there is pretty much nothing I liked about it. The only film nominated for a major award that I think is completely unworthy (for the most part, even if I don't think they were in the top five, it isn't unreasonable that others would).

So, my rankings from actual nominations (best to least):

Best Picture
1. The Departed
2. Little Miss Sunshine
3. Letters from Iwo Jima
4. The Queen
27. Babel

(My pick for best picture, Children of Men, wasn't even nominated.)

Best Actor
1. Peter O'Toole - Venus
2. Forest Whitaker - The Last King of Scotland
3. Leonardo DiCaprio - Blood Diamond
Unseen - Ryan Gosling - Half Nelson
Unssen - Will Smith - Pursuit of Happyness

Best Actress
1. Penelope Cruz - Volver
2. Judi Dench - Notes on a Scandal
3. Kate Winslet - Little Children
4. Helen Mirren - The Queen
5. Meryl Streep - The Devil Wears Prada

Best Supporting Actor
1. Jackie Earle Haley - Little Children
2. Alan Arkin - Little Miss Sunshine
3. Mark Wahlberg - The Departed
4. Djimon Hounsou - Blood Diamond
5. Eddie Murphy - Dreamgirls

Best Supporting Actress
1. Jennifer Hudson - Dreamgirls
2. Abigail Breslin - Little Miss Sunshine
3. Cate Blanchett - Notes on a Scandal
4. Rinko Kinkuchi - Babel
5. Adriana Barraza - Babel

Best Director1. Paul Greengrass - United 93
2. Martin Scorcese - The Departed
3. Clint Eastwood - Letters from Iwo Jima
4. Alejandro González Iñárritu - Babel
5. Stephen Frears - The Queen

Best Original Screenplay
1. Michael Arndt - Little Miss Sunshine
2. Guillermo del Toro - Pan's Labyrinth
3. Iris Yama****a - Letters from Iwo Jima
4. Peter Morgan - The Queen
5. Guillermo Arriaga - Babel

Best Adapted Screenplay
1. Alfonso Cuarón, Timothy J. Sexton, David Arata, Mark Fregus, Hawk Ostby - Children of Men
2. Patrick Marber - Notes on a Scandal
3. Todd Field, Tom Parrata - Little Children
4. William Monahan - The Departed (loss of points for adapting a movie)
36. Sacha Baron Cohen, Anthony Hines, Peter Baynham, Dan Mazer, Todd Phillips - Borat (major loss of points for being essentially an unscripted movie; this isn't "best outline")

Best Cinematography
1. Emmanuel Lubeski - Children of Men
2. Guillermo Navarro - Pan's Labyrinth
3. Wally Pfister - The Prestige
4. Dick Pope - The Illusionist
Unseen - Vilos Zsigmond - The Black Dahlia

Best Art DirectionI've seen four out of five nominations but I don't even know what is being evaluated when you say "art direction." Is that set design?

Best Costume Designi
1. Patricia Field - The Devil Wears Prada
2. Chung Man Yee - The Curse of the Golden Flower
3. Sharen Davis - Dreamgirls
4. Consolata Boyle - The Queen
Unseen - Milena Canonero - Marie Antoinette

Best Sound Mixing
I've seen all five nominees but again can't really form an opinion since it generally isn't something I notice unless it is really, really bad.

Best Achievement in Editing
1. Clare Douglas, Richard Pearson, Christopher Rouse - United 93
2. Thelma Shoonmaker - The Departed
3. Steven Rosenblum - Blood Diamond
4. Douglas Crise, Stephen Mirrione - Babel
5. Alfonso Cuarón, Alex Rodriguez - Children of Men (I'm sure the editing is fantastic but you lose psychological points when your movie is most famous for not editing).

Best Sound Editing
See Best Sound Mixing (saw five of five)

Best Visual Effects
1. Pirates of the Caribbean
2. Superman Returns
3. Poseidon

No strong feelings here, but I thought the effects in Superman Returns and Poseidon were substandard.

Best Make-Up
1. Pan's Labyrinth
2. Apocalypto
3. Click

Best Song
Saw all five nominations but don't have specific memory of any of them.

Best Score
1. Javier Navarette - Pan's Labyrinth
4. Phillip Glass - Notes on a Scandal
Unseen - The Good German

The other two nominations go somewhere between 1 and 4 but I do'nt have specific memory of noticing the score. Pan's I do and it was good, Notes' I do, and it was bad.

Best Short Film, Animated
Only saw The Little Matchgirl and was not particularly impressed.

Best Short Film, Live Action
Saw none.

Best Short Documentary
Saw none.

Best Feature Documentary
Only saw An Inconvenient Truth and while it may be the most important of the group, I don't think it was particularly well made.

Best Foreign Language Film
Only saw Pan's Labyrinth and it is worthy. Have only heard wonderful things about The Lives of Others but haven't seen it myself yet.

Best Animated Feature
1. Happy Feet
2. Cars
3. Monster House

While the number of animated films has boomed in recent years the number of quality efforts hasn't really seen a similar boom. I'd be in favor of dumping this category.

[innerSpaceman]

I agree with Alex that the best picture of the year was Children of Men. I'm shocked that neither it nor its director received a nomination. The Oscars are bogus as indicators of cinema quality.



That said, a bunch of us saw a screening last night of all the nominated Live-Action and Animated Short Subjects - - and there were some incredible gems in there. I wish there were some way for regular folks to see these films ... and I now regret not going out of my way to find the nominated shorts from previous years.

We ran a miniature Swankies Ceremony afterwards, and came up with winners in both categories. If you find any way to see these films, don't hesitate to go out of your way.

Best Live-Action Short Subject: The Saviour - a funny morality tale involving modern Mormon missionaries in the U.K.

Best Animated Short Subject: The Danish Poet - an hysterical and charming tale of love and fate and chance and oddness in the wonderful world of Scandanavia.


Honorable Mention must go to the Live-Action short West Bank Story, a laugh-out-loud riot spoofing the Israeli-Palestinian conflict via the stylings of West Side Story.






(and Mr. Wise is the winner of two Oscars himself... - Betty Davis, 1987 Academy Awards ceremony)

[Gemini Cricket]

Best Live-Action Short Subject: The Saviour - a funny morality tale involving modern Mormon missionaries in the U.K.

I just thought of something. If they were Mormon, wouldn't they have been passing out copies of The Book of Mormon and not the Holy Bible? Or do they do both? Just curious.

[€uroMeinke]

Best Live-Action Short Subject: The Saviour - a funny morality tale involving modern Mormon missionaries in the U.K.




I believe they were actually in Australia - and "Mormon-like" missionaries

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Yes, it was Australian (accents and credits). They probably didn't want to actually use the Book of Mormon for fear of pissing them off. They did use the term "Elder" which to my limited knowledge is only used by Mormons.

[Alex]

Elder is pretty common in various denominational circles. Among the big ones I blieve that both Methodists and Presbyterians have them, and Jehovah's Witnesses do as well. I believe that the various descendents of the America Restoration movement (e.g., Church of Christ) all have it as well.

Don't konw what role the position plays from faith to faith though.

[innerSpaceman]

But, as far as I know, Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses are the only two groups that proscletize door-to-door. And the guys in the movie were not like Jehovahs.

And it's a become a commonly known thread for young Mormon missionary men to sew some serious wild oats when away from home on their missionarying.

[Alex]

I have no doubt that they were Mormon or "Mormon-like" as that the is the stereotypical image of evangelicals send abroad (though JW's do that too). Just letting CP know that the word and position are more broad than she tought.

[Gemini Cricket]

I loved how you could see hints of their "special underwear" through their white shirts. Those kinds of details make a film wonderful.
:)

[innerSpaceman]

Hahahaah - An Oscars First!!!

For the first time in my roughly 40 years of watching the Academny Awards, I'll likely care most about the Best Animated and Live-Action Shorts contests.

[Kevy Baby]

They did use the term "Elder" which to my limited knowledge is only used by Mormons.And Kevy Baby's

[innerSpaceman]

And, with 3 hours to go ... here's how I'd vote if I were a member of the Academy .... (not who I think will win).
I copied the format from Alex, and I left his "ranking" of my picks ... just 'cause.


Best Picture
4. The Queen
and I also put Babel at 27 or lower

Best Actor
1. Peter O'Toole - Venus
(Forest Whitaker and Ryan Gosling unseen)

Best Actress
1. Kate Winslet - Little Children
an upset (in my own mind even) over Helen Mirren
(Judy Dench and Penelope Cruise unseen)

Best Supporting Actor
1. Jackie Earle Haley - Little Children

Best Supporting Actress
1. Jennifer Hudson - Dreamgirls

Best Director
1. Paul Greengrass - United 93

Best Original Screenplay
2. Guillermo del Toro - Pan's Labyrinth

Best Adapted Screenplay
1. Alfonso Cuarón, Timothy J. Sexton, David Arata, Mark Fregus, Hawk Ostby - Children of Men

Best Cinematography
1. Emmanuel Lubeski - Children of Men
(unseen - The Prestige)

Best Art Direction
Pan's Labyrinth - Eugenio Caballero
- what's being evaluated is set design and, separately, the artistic design of the entire picture (which likely includes preliminary elements of set design). Set decoration, a yet separate and integral element of any picture's "look" is not recognized by the Academy.

Best Costume Design
1. Patricia Field - The Devil Wears Prada
yes, these real clothes were the best costumes of the year ... and far from being authentic high fashion, were very carefully selected for the pop-image of high fashion that the story portrays.

Best Sound Mixing
John Reitz, Dave Campbell, Gregg Rudloff and Walt Martin - Flags of Our Fathers

Best Achievement in Editing
1. Clare Douglas, Richard Pearson, Christopher Rouse - United 93

Best Sound Editing
Sean McCormack and Kami Asgar - Apocalypto

Best Visual Effects
1. Pirates of the Caribbean

Best Make-Up
2. Apocalypto
(Click unseen)

Best Song
Truth be told, I have no idea which Dreamgirls song was which ... 3 were nominated, and each was likely inferior to many of the ineligible songs from the original show. So I can vote neither honestly nor honorably in this category.

Best Score
Alexandre Desplat - The Queen
(Notes on a Scandal - Unseen and unheard)
I found each of the nominated scores fairly unremarkable

Best Short Film, Animated
The Danish Poet

Best Short Film, Live Action
The Saviour

Best Short Documentary
None seen.

Best Feature Documentary
An Inconvenient Truth - which I liked better than the only other one I saw, Jesus Camp

Best Foreign Language Film
I only saw Pan's Labyrinth and am completely confident it's the best foreign language film of the year.

Best Animated Feature
2. Cars
Indicating it was poor year for animated features.


In a couple of hours, we'll see how well the Academy agrees with me .... but it turns out Alex and I agree on quite a lot. ;)

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Thanks for the info, Alex.

I loved how you could see hints of their "special underwear" through their white shirts. Those kinds of details make a film wonderful.
:)I didn't know that about Mormons either. I'm used to the concept of undergarments with religious significance. My father and brothers wore Tallit katan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tallit#Tallit_katan) for years.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

I'll list what I'd vote for and what I guess will win. If they're the same I'll just list the one. (I'm taking some risks this year, but that's fun.)

Best Picture
Little Miss Sunshine

Best Actor
Forest Whitaker - The Last King of Scotland

Best Actress
Helen Mirren - The Queen

Best Supporting Actor
I'd vote for: Alan Arkin - Little Miss Sunshine
Will win: Eddie Murphy - Dreamgirls

Best Supporting Actress
Jennifer Hudson - Dreamgirls

Best Director
I'd vote for: Clint Eastwood - Letters from Iwo Jima
Will win: 2. Martin Scorcese - The Departed
(or possibly Clint. The academy really doesn't like Scorcese.)

Best Original Screenplay
Michael Arndt - Little Miss Sunshine

Best Adapted Screenplay
Alfonso Cuarón, Timothy J. Sexton, David Arata, Mark Fregus, Hawk Ostby - Children of Men

Best Cinematography
Will win: Emmanuel Lubeski - Children of Men
I'd vote for: Guillermo Navarro - Pan's Labyrinth

Best Art Direction:
Pan's Labyrinth

Best Costume Designi
Patricia Field - The Devil Wears Prada


Best Sound Mixing
Dreamgirls

Best Achievement in Editing
Will win: Thelma Shoonmaker - The Departed
Would vote for: Children of Men (non-editing notwithstanding.)

Best Sound Editing
Letters from Iwo Jima

Best Visual Effects
Pirates of the Caribbean

Best Make-Up
Pan's Labyrinth

Best Song
Will win: Dreamgirls, "Patience"
Would vote for: Cars, "Our Town"

Best Score
Javier Navarette - Pan's Labyrinth

Best Short Film, Animated
The Danish Poet

Best Short Film, Live Action
Bintu and the Great Idea

Best Short Documentary
Rehearsing a Dream

Best Feature Documentary
An Inconvenient Truth (but we hope Tom's friend will win for Iraq in Piece)

Best Foreign Language Film
Pan's Labyrinth

Best Animated Feature
Cars

[Alex]

They don't talk about it (Mormons) at all. If you want to quickly and likely irredeemably offend a Mormon try to talk about it with them. Among the most offensive things (to a member) done at anti-LDS events is the public display and desecrtaion of these garments.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

Yaaaaaaaaaaay Danish Poet!

[Alex]

Does Will Smith's son have the world's longest name?

[katiesue]

West Bank story was great but I really thought the Saviour was a better film.

Hurrah Danish Poet!!

[CoasterMatt]

HOORAY ALAN ARKIN!!!!

[Alex]

For those who didn't see it, the text playing behind Melissa Etheridge is straight form the part of the movie where the song was played.

[Alex]

Al Gore is probably still trying to get the Academy slobber out of his ass crack.

Fetal stem cell proponent honored.


Conservative talk radio will have something to talk about tomorrow, but I can't begin to guess what.

[flippyshark]

I'm happy that Ennio Morricone was honored. He's the most idiosynchratic of major film composers, and thus one of my very favorites. I was amused that during the tribute film, we saw titles that would otherwise have no chance of being mentioned in an Oscar ceremony; Exorcist II: The Heretic, Orca The Killer Whale, terrible movies that gain an awful lot from Morricone's adventurous and uncompromising musical idiom.

[JWBear]

I was rooting for Sunshine... But I had a feeling it wouldn't win.

[Gemini Cricket]

I got 16 of them right. :)
Although, I did think O'Toole was going to win...

[innerSpaceman]

Peter O' Toole's loss was my biggest disappointment of the evening. :(


:snap: And the win for The Danish Poet my biggest joy (and the show went downhill from that early height of giddiness.)


Bah, Children of Men and United 93 shut out from any awards. Lame, Pan's Labyrinth losing Best Foreign Language Film. And she's great, but I'm sick of Helen Mirren winning for The Queen. Give someone else a chance!

The deserving best actress, Kate Winslet, was respendently gorgeous. Beating her on the drop-dead-o'meter was Cate Blanchett. Owh.My.Gawd. Gwynth Paltrow also had a lovely gown, as did Humanitarian winner Sherry Lansing. Oh, and Penelope Cruz was devine. Those were the five fashion and beauty winners, imho.

Leo DiCaprio had the best tuxedo. Clive Owen is officially the world's sexiest man.


Did I mention Peter O'Toole was robbed?

And, ho-hum, The Departed ... a good enough film, but a bloody remake. :rolleyes:

Despite all the kudos for The Departed (screenplay, directory and best picture?! Sheesh) ... I think the biggest winner and presence of the evening was ... Al Gore!



Cheers for the two big-award wins for Little Miss Sunshine :cheers: :cheers:

Ellen DeGeneres was fine ... I think I liked her bit with Scorcese in the audience best. Oh, and having Steven Speilberg snap her myspace photo was inspired. As Frodo Potter pointed out, she was channeling Bob Newhart quite nicely during her opening schtick ... and she was pleasantly funny there and throughout the show.


Did I mention Pan's Labyrinth was robbed? No original screenplay win either. WTF:confused: But at least it won in a couple of well-deserved artistic categories (makeup and art direction, were they?)

And I call FOUL and High Fraud :mad: with Babel's win for Best Score. Balderdash! That was a recycle from the composer's earlier works. I call shenanigans!


The Academy knows nothing. Children of Men and United 93 were the best films of 2006. Peter O' Toole was best actor and Kate Winslet best actress.




But at least they got it right with The Danish Poet :iSm:


The show itself moved right along ... but was really rather boring, all things considered. Hmmmmm.


.

[Snowflake]

Having seen The Departed last night, I was pleased to see it win several awards. The editing was crisp and deserved the win, Scorcese, naturally deserved it long ago, but I was happy as heck to see him finally win.

I still can't figure out why Streep was nominated, I love her, but why the nomination. Winslet maybe should have won, but Mirren was radiant.

O'Toole should have won, that made me sad.

Polobolos, cool, Ellen, meh.

[Gemini Cricket]

I was stunned when Pan lost for Best Foreign Film. But I do love that Florien Henkel Von Donnersmarck accepted his award for his film. I just love saying his name. :D

I love that Gore's flick won. His schtick where the orchestra cut him off was hysterical.

I'm not a big Leo fan, but he looked cute.

And speaking of cute... Daniel Craig, Clive Owen and Hugh Jackman... WOW! Hubba hubba!

Helen Mirren looked great, as did Diane Keaton. Penelope Cruz's dress was kinda weird, as was Beyonce's (what was that on her dress? grapes?). worst costume was whatever Meryl Streep was wearing. Bleh.

Yay for The Danish Poet and yay for West Bank Story. :)

For a moment, I thought LMS was going to win Best Pic. I'm glad The Departed won and I'm glad Scorcese's editor won, she edits a lot of his films.

All in all, a good night. I loved that Melissa Etheridge thanked her wife and entreated millions of people to kissing her wife smack on the lips. Awesome.



I loved this year's Oscars. But I'm still still mad at the Academy for their fu ck up last year giving Trash the Best Pic Oscar instead of Brokeback. Shenanigans.

[Not Afraid]

Actually, the dresses were the nice s urprise of the evening. So many beautiful gowns with that 1930's flair that I love so much. Gwynth Paltrow wore my favorite gown, although I'd order it in another color ;). Rachel Weisz's Vera Wang, Penelope Cruz's Versace, J Lo, Helen Mirrin, Kate Blanchett, Kate Winslett and Caterine Deneuve's Gautier gown were all high on my list.

The evening started out exciting. Pan....winnning 3 in the beginning, A Danish Poet winning the animated short......I was thinking this was going to be fantastic. Ellen's Al Gore joke was beautful and she did great, IMHO!

However, I did think Pan was robbed and, as the "big" awards were announced, I became more and more disappointed. I was heartbroken that Peter O'Toole didn't win. I didn't really find The Departed to be the most memorable film of the year - at least of the one's I saw. It was classic Scorcesi, but not very "forward". I was just left feeling flat at the end of the awards.
Oh well. I'm glad I caught the red carpet preview.

THe men.....ummmmmmm there was some goodness tonight. Clive Owen, Daniel Craig, Robert Downey Jr, Hugh jackman - all nice eye candy.

Worst dress, hands down - Sally Kirkland. Why was she even there?

[RStar]

Okay, I know that Hollywood can be a bloated bunch of Baboons at times (sorry, I don't mean to degrade our primate friends), but I love the movies so I enjoy seeing the Academy Awards.

I found it to be much more intertaining than last year, and Ellen did a great job hosting. I really loved it when she worked the audience and particularly when she wanted a picture with Clint Eastwood, so she had Steven Spielberg take it. "Make sure it's lined up, Steven!"

Anyway, there must be at least a few players here. How'd you do on your predictions?

I got 12 out of 24, exactly 50% right. I didn't get a chance to see all of the films, The Last King Of Scotland, Babel, Little Miss Sunshine, Marie Antoinette, and Letters From Iwo Jima mainly. So when those won, I had no idea what their chances were in the first place.

I thought Leo would get for Blood Diamond. Leading Actor, but Forest got it for Last King. And it was nice to see Martin finally get one with The Departed, which got 4 total. He said it was the first film he did with a plot! :cool:

[Not Afraid]

The only award I really felt strongly about was Best Actor and it hurt.

[Not Afraid]

Oh, and ISM.....

James McAvoy (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0564215/)

http://images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/20070225/293.mcavoy.james.022507.jpg

[wendybeth]

Thank you for posting that link, NA! I watched the Best Actor segment and could not figure out where I had seen him before. He's Mr. Tumnus! (And he's adorable).

[LSPoorEeyorick]

And James MacEvoy was absolutely lovely in Last King of Scotland. Couldn't take my eyes off him (unless Forrest Whitaker was on screen.)

Speaking of which, I was surprised how bad I felt about O'Toole losing... but I really and truly thought Whitaker's performance was better. Here's the thing, though, I'm really not fond of awarding a performance or a directing award to someone for their previous work. If you love their previous work that was mistakenly overlooked [ie Laurence of Arabia or Goodfellas], give them an honorary Oscar (which the academy has already done with O'Toole.) I didn't actually think that the Venus performance, or Departed-at-large, were that notable.

I got 13 right, so I did less well than I have in, like, all previous years. But then, I took some risks (LMS for best pic, which I really thought was possible-- plus I hear it got some major late-in-the-game buzz) and got some surprises (Pan's losing best score and foreign film). Tom took less risks, and got 16 right.

When the night ended, we took stock and decided that it could have been worse. Far worse. Far, far, worse. Babel was nearly shut out, and that was enough to make it an acceptable year at the Oscars.

[Snowflake]

I got 16 of them right. :)
Although, I did think O'Toole was going to win...


I got 13, I tanked on the shorts and also voted for Leslie Iwerks to win, and I thought Peter O'Toole would win, too.

Since I did not see as many of the nominated films as I had in the past, not sure if it was my skills in guessing or just how predictable the Oscars can be? ;) In any case, it was fun!

[Snowflake]

Thank you for posting that link, NA! I watched the Best Actor segment and could not figure out where I had seen him before. He's Mr. Tumnus! (And he's adorable).

Smacks self upside the head, OOOHHHH that's right! That's where I'd seen him before. duh...

[RStar]

The only award I really felt strongly about was Best Actor and it hurt.William wasn't nominated!





:D

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I have to admit that this seemed like a very political oscar year to me. Inconvenient Truth, West Bank Story, Al Gore Al Gore Al Gore....blech. I know it's par for the course but geez, WBS was my LEAST favorite of the shorts. And the political song? Lordy.

Looks like we need to see Pan's Labyrinth. And Departed, of course, but Pan would be higher on the list for me.

Ellen was great. That bit with Spielberg taking the picture was killing me.

All the women looked stunning. Hugh Jackman's jacket was cut so that he looked like he had a superhuman chest, which was kind of distracting, and almost not in a good way. We saw Casino Royale yesterday so seeing Daniel Craig in a tux made it seem he stepped right out of the movie.

I loved the moment when that chick from Dreamgirls won best supporting - she really didn't expect it. :)

Like everyone else said, we cheered when the Danish Poet won, yay! I am SO glad we saw those. :D :D :D

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Oh, and how was the IM conversation? We got home too late to join in, as we were watching TiVo style.

[Snowflake]

Actually, the dresses were the nice s urprise of the evening. So many beautiful gowns with that 1930's flair that I love so much. Gwynth Paltrow wore my favorite gown, although I'd order it in another color ;). Rachel Weisz's Vera Wang, Penelope Cruz's Versace, J Lo, Helen Mirrin, Kate Blanchett, Kate Winslett and Caterine Deneuve's Gautier gown were all high on my list.THe men.....ummmmmmm there was some goodness tonight. Clive Owen, Daniel Craig, Robert Downey Jr, Hugh jackman - all nice eye candy.

Worst dress, hands down - Sally Kirkland. Why was she even there?

Best dressed to me:

J Lo
Rachel Weisz
Cate Blanchett
Reese Withersppon
Kate Winslet
Catherine Deneueve
Penlope Cruz

Worst Dressed to me:

Meryl Streep (okay, you knew you had no chance of winning and you showed up, but what were you wearing? Your daughter looked lovely, however)
Jennifer Hudson going in (she looked like one of the flying monkeys from the Wizard of Oz with that horrible jacket)
Sally Kirkland


Jack Nicolson looks scarier every year, the shaved head this year did nothing for him ;) but he's always good for a reaction shot.

Clive Owen looked HOT, so did Daniel Craig, Leo looked cute, as did Robert Downey, Jr.

Sherie Lansing looked classic

The schtick with Spielberg, Coppola and Lucas was pretty funny, even the nod to the Three Stooges.

I think Ken Watanabe was also robbed, should have been nominated.

Overall, I thought the show was smooth, Ellen was Ellen, but almost not even there. Her second outfit of the evening was lovely, though and Portia looked stunning on the red carpet too.

[Snowflake]

I got 13, considering I did not see all of the nominated films, I was guessing. Tanked on the shorts and documentary shorts.

[Alex]

Overall a very boring show, especially once it really bogged down in the second half.

The clip jobs were mostly ok though (Morris's was amazing; Mann's was horrible).

Can't really complain about any of the winners, even when I disagree. I haven't seen The Lives of Others yet, but someone whose taste I have a lot of trust in thinks it is one of the best movies he's seen in recent years (and he did also like Pan's Labyrinth) so I'm confident it is worthy.

Ellen did a nice introduction but everything after that could have been dropped without any real impact. I liked the way she dressed throughout the show but didn't really notice anybody else's clothes.

The 8 o'clock hour was mostly focused on watching The Amazing Race but I still managed to catch the big moments of that hour.

Mostly though, I'm reminded why I rarely watch the actual show. It is just as good to wait until morning and read the winners list online. Also, stop telling the nominees not to read a paper since thta just means they'll waste 5 seconds telling us that they're going to read off paper anyway. Finally, don't thank your fellow nominees. That makes no sense. Acknowledge them, sure, but thanking them is just stupid Ms. Mirren.

[Alex]

I don't think I ever got around to making predictions anywhere. But I didn't do so well with my personal preferences matching reality.

[innerSpaceman]

Oh, and ISM.....

James McAvoy (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0564215/)

http://images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/20070225/293.mcavoy.james.022507.jpg

Yes, that's why I gasped "Ah-Ha" out loud when they showed the Last King of Scotland clip.

Maybe now's the time to talk about men's sexy voices. Such as the above bloke with the the Scottish brogue. Yes, NA, the hack directory of Babel has the sexiest voice of the three amigos (but the least talent). And, oh, just the sound candy of the aforementioned Daniel Craig, Clive Owen and Hugh Jackman. Mmmmmm.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I'm surprised no one's mentioned Nicole Kidman. I mean, I guess it's just not noteworthy anymore when she walks on stage looking absolutely stunning! After they presented, I mentioned to CP that Kidman looked fabulous, and CP replied, "So did Daniel Craid," and that's when I realized I think I had glanced at him once during their whole presentation, the rest of the time I was just transfixed by Kidman.

Hooray for the Danish Poet! The douche they kept showing back stage as they went to commercial called that one a "surprise". Umm, it was only a surprise to anyone who hadn't seen the nominees. It was hands down the best of the bunch.

West Bank Story...eh. I didn't dislike it, I didn't dislike any of the shorts. But I'm really quite surprised it won. I would have picked any of the other before it. The guy's speech was good though.

As for the rest of the awards...I didn't see nearly enough of the nominees to speak to them. But I thought the show was entertaining. Even Jack Black and Will Ferrell made me laugh. I loved the sound effects choir, but whichever director or producer made the call to cut to a closeup of the choir every 5 seconds needs to be shot. That bit was all about the wide angle, seeing the film and hearing the choir. A handful of closeups so we could see them in action would have been nice, but the constant cutting drove me to distraction. Grrrr.

I'm sure I say this every year, but I gotta see more movies.

[innerSpaceman]

I'm really not fond of awarding a performance or a directing award to someone for their previous work.
Technically, I would agree. But on a night where body-of-work awards were being given away right and left (*cough*Arkin*coughcough*Scorcese*), I think O'Toole was unsentimentally overlooked for what was, truly, one of his greatest performances. (Though I'd forgotten he'd won an honorary Oscar at one point - - - meaning it would have been ultra triumphant for him to actually win one after the Academy had essentially ruled him a legendary has-been!)

I have to admit that this seemed like a very political oscar year to me. I know it's par for the course but geez, WBS was my LEAST favorite of the shorts.
Wow, if you can't stop your political views from tainting a silly comedy, I seriously think you might consider lightening up. Just because the Kosher Fast Food Joint was managed a little more obnoxiously than the Palestinian Flafel Joint does not make West Bank Story an anti-semetic piece of Israeli-hating propaganda.

Did you listen to the acceptance speech? The movie was a musical comedy spoof designed to promote peace. Get a grip.

[innerSpaceman]

And since GD mentioned the cool Foley Effects Choir, I would like to give some props to the Shadow Dancers. Best Picture nominees The Departed and Little Miss Sunshine were great ... but the troupe really shone when lowering their standards a bit to give hysterical renditions of The Devil Wears Prada and Snakes on a Plane!! Hahahahah!!

:D

[Ghoulish Delight]

Wow, if you can't stop your political views from tainting a silly comedy, I seriously think you might consider lightening up. Just because the Kosher Fast Food Joint was managed a little more obnoxiously than the Palestinian Flafel Joint does not make West Bank Story an anti-semetic piece of Israeli-hating propaganda.

Did you listen to the acceptance speech? The movie was a musical comedy spoof designed to promote peace. Get a grip.Whaaaa?! Wow, you read a lot into what she posted that's simply not there. All she's saying is that she feels that West Bank Story won because of its political message rather than being the best of the bunch.

[innerSpaceman]

Sorry, that was not based on her post ... but rather on our conversation after the screenings.


It's getting more and more difficult to remember what was posted here, talked about in person, commented on Live Journals, etc.

[Gemini Cricket]

I found it very suspicious that Copolla, Lucas and Spielberg just happened to be presenting the Best Director Oscar this year. Methinks they knew something the rest of us didn't. I found it fishy. Yes, Marty was due but I found it very interesting. Spielberg has been a presenter often, but not Copolla or Lucas.

[Alex]

I'm surprised no one's mentioned Nicole Kidman.

She just doesn't do anything for me. She's model pretty, not pretty pretty and when it comes to ogle-value the latter is the only thing that matters much to me. I'm completely straight and Daniel Craig was still the visually more interesting thing on stage for me.

The douche they kept showing back stage as they went to commercial called that one a "surprise". Umm, it was only a surprise to anyone who hadn't seen the nominees.

I'm pretty sure that was intended as a joke. He listed all of the shorts categories as surprising, meaning, I believe, that nobody knows anything about them. But he was a very annoying man, is he someone I should have recognized?

The shadow puppet people were generally a waste of time but the Snakes on a Plane one was cool.

I think historically the minor awards have been a place for the academy to gets its political groove on. No Man's Land was nowhere near the best foreign language movie of its year but it had a good "war is stupid, can't we all get along" theme.

[Gemini Cricket]

I also found Melissa Etheridge's moment wonderful. She kissed her wife smack on the lips and then thanked her wife in her acceptance speech. It was romantic and classy. :) I also thought she sounded really good live as always. It doesn't seem to be an easy thing to do.

The awards show also made me want to see more and more foreign films. That montage was super.

I also must say that the intro into the show was really dull. A bunch of people we don't recognize by face in front of a white background. It went on too long and was a bad way to start the show.

The Foley Choir was great, but because they did their job so well it made them appear not to be doing the sound effects themselves which they were. The reaction from our home crowd was one of 'are they really doing that or are they pretending to do it while the real effects soundtrack plays'. Their applause was meager which had me thinking that the audience at the Kodak were wondering the same. I thought it was fantastic.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I also must say that the intro into the show was really dull. A bunch of people we don't recognize by face in front of a white background. It went on too long and was a bad way to start the show. I loved the intro. All those non-major nominees getting a moment to say something and have fun, without the nervous pressure of not forgetting to thank someone. And it really drove home that, even if the audience doesn't care about those "smaller" awards, it's still a freaking Oscar and those people are the best in their business. Mixing in the no names with the big names, relating their excitement, accomplishments, disappointments. I though it was wonderful.

[Gemini Cricket]

I loved the intro. All those non-major nominees getting a moment to say something and have fun, without the nervous pressure of not forgetting to thank someone. And it really drove home that, even if the audience doesn't care about those "smaller" awards, it's still a freaking Oscar and those people are the best in their business. Mixing in the no names with the big names, relating their excitement, accomplishments, disappointments. I though it was wonderful.
I would have liked to have seen who they were. CG their names in under their faces. Maybe that would have sold me on it. Also, for me, it showed how some people are way more comfortable behind the camera. ;)

[Strangler Lewis]

I didn't see Nicole Kidman last night, but I always find her beautiful in films and, oddly, somewhat ghastly when I see her in a glamour shot in a magazine or what not. She always looks like every rounded surface in her head--forehead, cheeks and chin--has been pumped full of air and buffed to a high gloss.

[Not Afraid]

The IM party was great. We ended up having a IRL impromptu party of sorts with TicTocDragon and family, The FrodoDisneyPotterPhiles and ISM. On IM, we had LSPE, MousePod (with H chiming in in the background) Coaster matt and Steph. It was fun! I like IM parties because you can actually hear the TV! ;)

[Morrigoon]

Yes, that's why I gasped "Ah-Ha" out loud when they showed the Last King of Scotland clip.

Maybe now's the time to talk about men's sexy voices. Such as the above bloke with the the Scottish brogue. Yes, NA, the hack directory of Babel has the sexiest voice of the three amigos (but the least talent). And, oh, just the sound candy of the aforementioned Daniel Craig, Clive Owen and Hugh Jackman. Mmmmmm.
Scottish brogue= definitely sexiest voice of the night

[Not Afraid]

I could listen to the Babel director talk for ever. He's completely won me over with articulation.

The worst moments of the night were
*the Black/Farrel bit - until Reilly came in and saved the bad day
*Celene Dion

[Not Afraid]

A few other random thoughts or responses:

Kidman looked great in red but I found the dress to be unfortunante. It really distracted from her beauty. (That and Daniel Craig ;))

The Oscars always have a political element. Contemporary films are speaking to what concerns many people and political issues happen to be much-discusssed at the moment. Besides, with 1 billion people watching the show, it's a great tool.


And, God help me if I hear the "they should just act" attitude.

[Strangler Lewis]

I could listen to the Babel director talk for ever. He's completely won me over with articulation.



Articulation?

Which kind? Dental? Labiodental? Linguolabial? Pharyngeal? Palatal?

[Moonliner]

Now that we are here in the post Oscar shadow, what if any movies are you eager to see that you weren't yesterday?

I might have to see "Pan's Labyrinth" which I have to admit I had never heard of before yesterday.

[Not Afraid]

I spent the evening with Netflix open and added quite a few things to my queue. There was plenty I didn't see this year and my queue now reflects that.

[Alex]

Nothing was really changed by the show.

I still really want to see The Lives of Others (and all the other foreign language nominees). But otherwise, outside of the shorts I've seen almost everything that won and don't have much interest in Half Nelson, The Pursuit of Happyness, or Marie Antoinette.

[Not Afraid]

Articulation?

Which kind? Dental? Labiodental? Linguolabial? Pharyngeal? Palatal?


Just the basic act of articulating.

[Morrigoon]

I disagree, NA. I want to see them thank the people in their lives, and who gave them the award, not to preach at me, they can do that on their own time. The Oscars is about film and filmmaking, and they should stick to the subject at hand while at the Oscars.

And as regards voting, if someone made a great documentary about how a house is built, I don't see why that filmmaker deserves any less recognition than one who made a good film about the environment or some culture that seems exotic by American standards. The award is supposed to be about the film,, and the excellence of their work on it. To favor certain subjects is to disrespect the art that went into the others.

[Alex]

Yes, but when the majority of the people voting haven't actually seen a majority of the nominees you're going to end up with less ideal methods of choosing.

And reading the complaints about acceptance speeches I am seeing today, the dominant theme is too much thanking of people we've never heard of.

Overall, I found the show politically tame. But that's to be expected when the only unscripted event seems to have been Will Smith's kid screwing up his line.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I don't mind the winners voicing their opinions. Their speech is their time, and if that's what they want to use it for, no worries on my end. I just get peeved when voting is done based on political motives.

Sure, political impact is one valid consideration, but sometimes it's given too much weight. I felt that the case for West Bank Story. It was good, but in terms of its quality as a film, I thought it was a class below the other nominees in the category. Far enough below that even having a good political message wasn't enough for me to consider it the best (and I did like the message of the film). If I were a voting member, I'd personally try to start with how well a film makes its point, and only turn to whether I think that point was particularly important or impactful as a means to create separation between entries that are too close quality-wise to decide between.

Of course, I say that now when I have no actual voting power. Hard to say how I'd feel actually given the authority to be involved in that decision.

Speaking of which, who was it that pointed out that the Oscars are still the awards show, the one that everyone is waiting for through the whole award season? Makes you realize what an amazing entity the Academy is. I mean, they just kinda gave themselves that power. Before the academy existed, I'm sure there were awards here and there, and small, disparate groups of people who would discuss and decide what their favorites were.

But somewhere along the way, some people decided, "You know what, screw this. We're going to create a group of people and just decide which movie's the best. And we're going to get the right people to give ourselves the clout to do that and everyone's gonna listen." At least, that's how I picture it. Maybe it happened more naturally, that the people with the clout gravitated towards each other and their combined clout grew. But either way, it really says something that, even though there's always disagreement with their choices, the Academy has managed to remain THE source to watch, even if you're watching so you can disagree with them. And in the end, it's all just because they have the attitude and resources to present themselves as such.

[Not Afraid]

Yes, but film (and art) is about subject matter and very often the subject matter is a reflection of contemporary viewpoints and provides social commentary. There is really no separation between films as social commentary and awarding

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yes, but film (and art) is about subject matter and very often the subject matter is a reflection of contemporary viewpoints and provides social commentary. There is really no separation between films as social commentary and awardingNo disagreement here, but subject matter is definitely a secondary consideration. Otherwise, all nominees and winners would always be political statements. Lord knows there are no shortage of short films with political messages, but 3 out of the 5 nominees were quite apolitical (though one was religious commentary which I suppose is a sub/sister category of politics). So it bugs me when politics is given more weight than I feel it deserves. I prefer it when things are weighted more towards the artistic merit end of the spectrum. I'd never expect, or want, politics to be cut out of the process, just not as a defining force.

Heck, Ari Sandel said it best in his prepared speech. The short format Oscars are all about struggling film makers trying to get noticed...and I thought that the other nominations represented the work of better film makers than he.

[mousepod]

After I logged out of the chat last night, I started thinking about why some people were pissed that Peter O'Toole didn't get the award though he might not have been the "best actor" and were equally pissed that Scorsese/The Departed won when they might not have been last year's best Director/Picture. Or to be more accurate, I started thinking about why I didn't care, and was happy for Marty. So I decided to compare Scorsese's filmography to the award winners from each year. Here's what I found:

Year-Scorsese Film- Best Picture
1967-Who's That Knocking At My Door*-In The Heat of the Night
1972-Boxcar Bertha*-The Godfather
1973-Mean Streets*-The Sting
1974-Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore*-"The Godfather, Part II"
1976-Taxi Driver-Rocky
1977-"New York, New York*"-Annie Hall
1980-Raging Bull-Ordinary People
1983-The King of Comedy*-Terms of Endearment
1985-After Hours*-Out of Africa
1986-The Color of Money*-Platoon
1988-The Last Temptation of Christ*-Rain Man
1990-Goodfellas-Dances With Wolves
1991-Cape Fear*-The Silence of the Lambs
1993-The Age of Innocence*-Schindler's List
1995-Casino*-Braveheart
1997-Kundun*-Titanic
1999-Bringing Out the Dead*-American Beauty
2002-Gangs of New York-Chicago
2004-The Aviator-Million Dollar Baby
2006-The Departed-The Departed

*not nominated

What did I learn? Not much except that this year is not really an exception. The "best" doesn't always win. ...and given the choice between watching the Scorsese film from any given year vs the winner from that year, I'll almost always pick the Scorsese flick. Except 1972 and 1974.... and maybe '86 and '93.

[Gemini Cricket]

I thought Taxi Driver and Goodfellas were way better than Rocky and Dances With Wolves.
:)

[Snowflake]

After I logged out of the chat last night, I started thinking about why some people were pissed that Peter O'Toole didn't get the award though he might not have been the "best actor" and were equally pissed that Scorsese/The Departed won when they might not have been last year's best Director/Picture. Or to be more accurate, I started thinking about why I didn't care, and was happy for Marty. So I decided to compare Scorsese's filmography to the award winners from each year. Here's what I found:

Year-Scorsese Film- Best Picture
1967-Who's That Knocking At My Door*-In The Heat of the Night
1972-Boxcar Bertha*-The Godfather
1973-Mean Streets*-The Sting
1974-Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore*-"The Godfather, Part II"
1976-Taxi Driver-Rocky
1977-"New York, New York*"-Annie Hall
1980-Raging Bull-Ordinary People
1983-The King of Comedy*-Terms of Endearment
1985-After Hours*-Out of Africa
1986-The Color of Money*-Platoon
1988-The Last Temptation of Christ*-Rain Man
1990-Goodfellas-Dances With Wolves
1991-Cape Fear*-The Silence of the Lambs
1993-The Age of Innocence*-Schindler's List
1995-Casino*-Braveheart
1997-Kundun*-Titanic
1999-Bringing Out the Dead*-American Beauty
2002-Gangs of New York-Chicago
2004-The Aviator-Million Dollar Baby
2006-The Departed-The Departed

*not nominated

What did I learn? Not much except that this year is not really an exception. The "best" doesn't always win. ...and given the choice between watching the Scorsese film from any given year vs the winner from that year, I'll almost always pick the Scorsese flick. Except 1972 and 1974.... and maybe '86 and '93.


I totally agree with GC here. And mousepod, while I would never give Alice a nod over Godfather II, it was a film I enjoyed a good deal and very different from the (now) sterotypical Scorsese film.

I do not dispute the win last night of The Departed. I thought for a best adapted screenplay, remake, it was a fine film. Richly deserved the editing nod and I was grateful beyond measure that The Queen did not win best picture (although given the Academy history, it would not have suprised me on iota). Having seen The Departed only Saturday night, I thought it was a rock solid film from top to bottom and, in this case to me, let the naysayers complain it's a remake, I still thought it was worthy and long overdue for a best direction nod. Ask me about the remake of Cape Fear and I will give you a different answer ;)

[Alex]

For me, the Scorcese movie loses out to the best picture winner in 1967, 1972, 1973, 1974, 1977, 1985, 1991, 1997, 1999, and 2004.

I love Scorcese for being consistently great but for me with only a few exceptions he has been among the best but not the best. But yeah, this should have been at least his third one.

[Morrigoon]

Anybody else dying to see someone make the obvious connection between Hellen Mirren and Judi Dench? Wouldn't you love to see them present together?

[Alex]

Other than being old British ladies, what is the obvious connection?

[Snowflake]

Other than being old British ladies, what is the obvious connection?

Both are Dames (in the Biritish sense, obviously)

Maggie Smith and Judi Dench would be a more obvious since they're both good old friends and their careers are really quite parallel. At least it makes me think it would be an obvious choice.

[Not Afraid]

No disagreement here, but subject matter is definitely a secondary consideration. Otherwise, all nominees and winners would always be political statements. Lord knows there are no shortage of short films with political messages, but 3 out of the 5 nominees were quite apolitical (though one was religious commentary which I suppose is a sub/sister category of politics). So it bugs me when politics is given more weight than I feel it deserves. I prefer it when things are weighted more towards the artistic merit end of the spectrum. I'd never expect, or want, politics to be cut out of the process, just not as a defining force.


I include political subject matter in the broader scope of comtemporary social comentary. Politics is just one aspect of "hot belief topics", religion, gay rights, and environmental causes being others (there are certainly more). But, politics seems to bring out the "best" (ha) of all of us when it comes to social beliefs.

I think there are quite a few people who view An Inconvenient Truth as a political film even though Gore attempts to catagorize it as "not a political issue but a moral one".

[Not Afraid]

After I logged out of the chat last night, I started thinking about why some people were pissed that Peter O'Toole didn't get the award though he might not have been the "best actor" and were equally pissed that Scorsese/The Departed won when they might not have been last year's best Director/Picture.

I was pissed about O'Toole not winning because I thought he was brilliant and riviting. I couldn't take my eyes off of him the entire film. But, I haven't seen "King....." yet, so maybe I'll feel differently after I see it.


1976-Taxi Driver-Rocky

1990-Goodfellas-Dances With Wolves


Those instances are the only two that I think the Academy chose the wrong film. But, I'm now looking at them as to which I think has stood the test of time.

However, in 1976 I probably would've voted for Network over Taxi Driver.

[Gemini Cricket]

Scorsese dyes his eyebrows, yes?

[mousepod]

NA,

Ordinary People over Raging Bull? Really?

Between now and the time I move to LA, I must refine my movie salon/podcast plan.

I'm thinking we need to have a couple of double features, pitting an award winner against a movie that some think should have won. Differing opinions, especially among opinionated movie buffs like us, should prove to be highly entertaining.

Maybe this needs to be a thread before we start programming our festival.

[Strangler Lewis]

However, in 1976 I probably would've voted for Network over Taxi Driver.

I loved Network, but it stands out more for me as a collection of speeches rather than a coherent story. It's been a while since I saw it, but I think the idea that a network would actually kill someone on the air for ratings would either strike me as extremely silly or unremarkable.

Rocky was the better movie. Whenever I think about films of the 70s, I tend to sum it up as a bunch of men yelling at each other in service of some idea. Rocky, the character, did very little yelling. He was the epitome of cool.

[€uroMeinke]

So what I really want to know is how these Academy Awards were made "carbon neutral" or whatever the buzzword was. Did the stars carpool in electric vehicles? Did they all come in through the closed redline station? Were those spotlights all compact fluorescents? Ot did they just plant a bunch of trees somewhere?

Thinking of the pageantry, the closed metro station and streets, all that Tule - how did they pull it off, or even calculate it. I find the claim hard to swallow as much as I may support the cause.

[Not Afraid]

NA,

Ordinary People over Raging Bull? Really?


Totally. I LOVED Ordinary People when I saw it and Raging Bull not so much. But, remember, I have a hard time with violence and seem to lire (or is it just relate to) f'ed up relationships. (Interiors IS my favorite Woody Allen, after all.)

[Alex]

I too would be hard torn to choose between Ordinary People and Raging Bull. Though ultimately I'd probably go with Raging Bull. But it would shift with my mood.

[Gemini Cricket]

I loved Ordinary People, too. I was/am that kid. And Mary Tyler Moore's character is my mom. Love love that film. 1st time as director for Robert Redford, I believe.
:)

[€uroMeinke]

For those interested - NPR did a piece on West Bank Story (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=7606701&ft=1&f=1008)

[Gemini Cricket]

I'm really curious about Infernal Affairs now. I think I need to Netflix it.
:)

[Stan4dSteph]

Scorsese dyes his eyebrows, yes?I was asking this same question on IM last night. No one would answer me. I say yes, and I think that's just freaky.

[Not Afraid]

I remember having a conversation with someone about this subject recently. Apparently, eyebrows don't always go grey when the rest of the hair does.

I found this little tidbit:

A recent study demonstrated that people 50-70 years of age with dark eyebrows but grey hair are significantly more likely to have type II diabetes than those with both grey eyebrows and grey hair.

[Gemini Cricket]

I remember having a conversation with someone about this subject recently. Apparently, eyebrows don't always go grey when the rest of the hair does.
Thank goodness.
:D

[innerSpaceman]

But what does go grey are the films that won Best Picture. More often than not, they are forgotten in time and are NOT the films best remembered for the various years they were released and awarded the highest "honor."

Sheesh, The Greatest Show on Earth won in 1952, beating out High Noon and The Quiet Man ... while Singin' in the Rain wasn't even nominated. Which films from that year are watched today, and have stood the test of time as great movies?

In 1956, Around the World in 80 Days, beat out Giant, The King and I, and The Ten Commandments (wow, what a Yul Brynner year that was!)


I could go on and on. mousepod has already pointed out some he felt were winners that compared unfavorably with "losers." It's the test of time that counts ... though, of course, movies are rightly judged in their own time as well.


Personally, I don't think The Departed is going to be a film watched generations from now (except as part of the Scorcese canon). I really don't think it's one of his better films, though.

[€uroMeinke]

Aww, I liked Around the World in 80 Days

[Gemini Cricket]

I really don't think it's one of his better films, though.
I do. It's the best thing he's done since Goodfellas.

[innerSpaceman]

That's not saying much, is it? Marty's best days arre long, long behind him.

[Gemini Cricket]

That's not saying much, is it? Marty's best days arre long, long behind him.
I don't know. I thought The Departed was tight. It was a good film.
:)

[Gemini Cricket]

I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this already, but iTunes has the short films on sale on their site. Both animated and live action. I think that's cool. I may buy The Danish Poet.
:)

[Babette]

Phew! Took a while to catch up on this thread and it will probably be killed by now, but here's my reactions.

I only saw a handful of the full length films (Pan, Dreamgirls, Sunshine, Happyness, Cars, Illusionist) this year so I could not accurately judge any category except the shorts. I was so happy when Poet won and today had to defend what people described as rough animation. Beautiful, beautiful movie! I enjoyed WestBank but thought the joke was too dragged out. It was more of a Hot Shots scene. My vote was for Éramos Pocos (grandma!).

I forget now who presented, but the shock when Pan's Labrynth did not win was priceless. She almost said it (the wrong name) without reading the card, and had to catch herself once the actual words processed. (who will be the first LoTr to tell me her name?) I am sad it was not Pan.

I thought Ellen worked, and everyone really seemed to enjoy her and join in on the jokes. It was fun. Not super-entertaining but fun. Myspace photo, script passing, snakes on a plane, I wouldn't want to follow that, America votes for Al v. Jennifer. Considering I was on only 4 hours of sleep and a full day of NASCAR, I thought it was fun.

I love Jennifer Hudson, she is beautiful and talented. I did not see any other nominees' performances so I won't say she shouldn't have won. That said, I feel like she won an acting award for singing. That is all.

I found it very suspicious that Copolla, Lucas and Spielberg just happened to be presenting the Best Director Oscar this year. Methinks they knew something the rest of us didn't. I found it fishy. Yes, Marty was due but I found it very interesting. Spielberg has been a presenter often, but not Copolla or Lucas. It seems a lot of awards were presented by people associated with the winners. I don't remember hearing the rules or seeing the Arthur Anderson guys handcuffed to the envelope briefcase - is it still super-secret until opened on live TV? It felt a little more like the MTV or People's Choice awards where you could guess the winners based on who's attending/presenting.
Kidman looked great in red but I found the dress to be unfortunante. It really distracted from her beauty. (That and Daniel Craig ;)) The gowns were so classy and gorgeous. I can think of only one I did not love (Kidman - the giant red cone on her shoulder was yucky, but the rest of her look was stunning) Many cute men in tuxes, but I kept asking "why is Mark Wahlburg wearing a shirt?" Seriously, he doesn't need one! I loved that they kept showing Scorcese because that meant I got another glimpse of Marky. (Leo doesn't really do it for me.)

And reading the complaints about acceptance speeches I am seeing today, the dominant theme is too much thanking of people we've never heard of.

Overall, I found the show politically tame. But that's to be expected when the only unscripted event seems to have been Will Smith's kid screwing up his line. For some of them I think that is the only time they have to publically thank people important to them, people who supported them and got them to where they are. I think it is sweet. I hate when they list the whole cast and crew. We can read their names in the movie credits! ;)

Does Jaden Christopher Syre Smith know how to read yet? It seemed like he couldn't read the card. How cute were the two shorts delivering the awards for the two shorts :)

I thought Taxi Driver and Goodfellas were way better than Rocky and Dances With Wolves.
:)I agree. But, speaking of Dances with Wolves...I did get to spend Oscar morning with Oscar winner Kevin Costner. We were just discussing his body of work at dinner Saturday. I had the pleasure surprise of hearing his band, The Kevin Costner Band, at NASCAR! Sammy Hagar was there too (yes he sang I Can't Drive 55). Brian McKnight sang the National Anthem as F18s flew overhead. Costner had the honor of saying "Gentlemen, start your engines". I forget now who waved the green flag - someone else we'd all know (It was Gov. Ah-nahold the last time I went) A star-studded day indeed.

So what I really want to know is how these Academy Awards were made "carbon neutral" or whatever the buzzword was. Did the stars carpool in electric vehicles? Did they all come in through the closed redline station? Were those spotlights all compact fluorescents? Ot did they just plant a bunch of trees somewhere?

Thinking of the pageantry, the closed metro station and streets, all that Tule - how did they pull it off, or even calculate it. I find the claim hard to swallow as much as I may support the cause.Ditto! Were the envelopes printed green? The carpets woven green? The golden men caste green? How could the entire show be green!? Besides, the NASCAR event only 50 miles away cancelled out ANY efforts OSCAR made to help our environment. :evil:

Now it is time to catch up on my sleep from the weekend!

[Stan4dSteph]

Most likely they estimated the emissions of CO2 based on the World Resources Institute emission factors for the energy use of the show, then somehow offset them.

[Alex]

But what does go grey are the films that won Best Picture. More often than not, they are forgotten in time and are NOT the films best remembered for the various years they were released and awarded the highest "honor."

That said (and I do agree), with the help of Netflix I have seen most of the best picture winners over the last few years and while they don't necessarily pick the best picture of the year, I've found that they rarely pick a long-term clunker. Yes, there are a few (Chicago, The Greatest Show on Earth, and Tom Jones) being the first that come to mind, but not many.

[Strangler Lewis]

Most likely they estimated the emissions of CO2 based on the World Resources Institute emission factors for the energy use of the show, then somehow offset them.

I assume they wrote a check.

http://www.climatecrisis.net/takeaction/carboncalculator/

[Gemini Cricket]

Holy cow! Babette knows Kevin Costner!
:)

[Gemini Cricket]

Oh, can I also add that while I love Helen Mirren, her "Ladies and Gentlemen I give you The Queen" moment was a little too uppity for me. It didn't play well with me for some reason.

[Alex]

My problem with it was that it didn't really make any sense.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Oh, can I also add that while I love Helen Mirren, her "Ladies and Gentlemen I give you The Queen" moment was a little too uppity for me. It didn't play well with me for some reason.Yeah, somehow I don't think that went quite the way she thought it did in her head.

Babette, don't know who the presenter is, but they gave the accountants/secret-until-envelope-opening-on-stage spiel over the closing credits.

[katiesue]

I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this already, but iTunes has the short films on sale on their site. Both animated and live action. I think that's cool. I may buy The Danish Poet.
:)

I found a compilation of all the 2005 live and animated shorts on Amazon. I'm hoping they do the same for this year. I'd love to buy the whole lot and watch them all again.

[innerSpaceman]

Eh, I think her Queen Oscar thing was ok. A tad flat ... but, by God, it was her umpteenth acceptance speech for that role.

I think it was a nice way of saying that, despite all the previous accolades, the royalty level of Oscar still meant something to her.

I think she may have been fudging that a bit, but I appreciated the sentiment of trying to make the Oscar win something somehow more than her previous seven.

[Morrigoon]

I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this already, but iTunes has the short films on sale on their site. Both animated and live action. I think that's cool. I may buy The Danish Poet.
:)

That little blurb may just be the thing that finally gets me to download the iTunes software I got with my iPod.

[Snowflake]

That's not saying much, is it? Marty's best days arre long, long behind him.

Perhaps this is true, but I thought the Departed was rock solid from top to bottom, a good film and at least he got his overdue Oscar for a good film (IMO, at least) rather than The Aviator.

[Snowflake]

I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this already, but iTunes has the short films on sale on their site. Both animated and live action. I think that's cool. I may buy The Danish Poet.
:)

Oh, great! I'm going to the iTunes store tonight. :D

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Wow, if you can't stop your political views from tainting a silly comedy, I seriously think you might consider lightening up. Just because the Kosher Fast Food Joint was managed a little more obnoxiously than the Palestinian Flafel Joint does not make West Bank Story an anti-semetic piece of Israeli-hating propaganda.

Did you listen to the acceptance speech? The movie was a musical comedy spoof designed to promote peace. Get a grip.

Sorry, that was not based on her post ... but rather on our conversation after the screenings.Well, I didn't say that I hated the short, in fact I laughed just as much as you did. And I said as much the night of. Doesn't mean I thought it deserved to win. And I NEVER said it was "an anti-semetic piece of Israeli-hating propaganda." Just because he said it was "about peace" doesn't mean it should win, either. Is it ok with you if I root for "Wrong Grandma" and be a Jew at the same time?

It's getting more and more difficult to remember what was posted here, talked about in person, commented on Live Journals, etc."Remember"? You quoted me. It's written down. :confused: And like I said above, I never said the things you attributed to me, in person on online. Who needs to get a grip now? :p

Ack, no time to read rest of thread...

[innerSpaceman]

Perhaps this is true, but I thought the Departed was rock solid from top to bottom, a good film and at least he got his overdue Oscar for a good film (IMO, at least) rather than The Aviator.
Oh, and see I thought The Aviator was also a rock-solid film. I didn't like it all that much, but - for the biography genre - it was as rock-solid as just about any (and less than a handful of that genre stand out as fantatastic).

Similarly, in the mob-genre - yeah, The Departed was rock-solid. And only a handful in that genre stand out as fantastic (one of them by Marty himself).

I just don't think rock-solid necessarily qualifies for Best Picture. The Departed was well-crafted. Its awards for editing and screenplay were well-deserved imo. And yeah, before he dies, give the award to Scorcese for any decent thing he's nominated for.

But it rankles that Best Picture went to a remake, just as I bemoan that the best actor and actress nods went to real-person immitators. There was less CREATION in these awarded films and roles, and I think that detracts from their overall greatness.




BTW, the last re-make to win best picture was Ben-Hur in 1959

[innerSpaceman]

Oh, can I also add that while I love Helen Mirren, her "Ladies and Gentlemen I give you The Queen" moment was a little too uppity for me. It didn't play well with me for some reason.
Everyone's noticed the "Quotes" ad campaign the Academy had running all over town, right? Posters proclaming "Frankly My Dear, I Don't Give a Damn" or "I Coulda Been a Contender."

Well, the one right there on the tower of H&H, adjacent to the Kodak Theater, featured on the Oscar broadcast, 40-feet all and a hundred feet in the air was the one blaring "I'm the King of the World!"

Yeah, it's a quote from Titantic. But who can not be reminded of James Cameron's "uppity" yell from the podium upon accepting the Best Picture Oscar? It set a new level for acceptance uppity, one that will reign for generations I think ... and Mirren's was hardly a blip in comparison.




"Remember"? You quoted me. It's written down.
Heheh, that was a subtle jab at your husband. He recently posted a reference to a live journal comment here that no one but he and I would have understood ... and I was just trying to point out in a vaguely humorous way that some of us know each other so well, we are not necessarily responding to merely what's posted when we post a reply on the LoT.


And I NEVER said it was "an anti-semetic piece of Israeli-hating propaganda." That's funny ... according to my notes, that's your exact quote. :p


I thought it was obvious that line was one of my standard exaggerations for dramatic effect. But did you not tell me you had a problem with West Bank Story because you perceived an anti-Israeli stance??

If you hadn't, my mistake ... and I apologize.






(But my notes say otherwise.)

[Snowflake]

Oh, and see I thought The Aviator was also a rock-solid film. I didn't like it all that much, but - for the biography genre - it was as rock-solid as just about any (and less than a handful of that genre stand out as fantatastic).

Similarly, in the mob-genre - yeah, The Departed was rock-solid. And only a handful in that genre stand out as fantastic (one of them by Marty himself).

I just don't think rock-solid necessarily qualifies for Best Picture. The Departed was well-crafted. Its awards for editing and screenplay were well-deserved imo. And yeah, before he dies, give the award to Scorcese for any decent thing he's nominated for.

Hmm, okay, I was only referring (by not really referring) to Scorsese's best director nod. :) I thought The Aviator was okay for what it was, but to me it was not even close to best picture material. Of the nominated films for BP this year, I had not seen all of them, so in all honesty I was unable to make a real personal judgment call on what should win. But, I was very happy that The Queen (fine film that it was) did not score the BP Oscar. Will I think The Departed is still a best picture worthy film 10 years from now, prolly not and not that this matters. I think it's been covered before that the BP Oscar is more often than not awarded to the best picture by someone's standards.

But it rankles that Best Picture went to a remake, just as I bemoan that the best actor and actress nods went to real-person immitators. There was less CREATION in these awarded films and roles, and I think that detracts from their overall greatness.

Well, this has been done before, a lot, meaning actors portraying real-person imitators.

For instance:

Best Actor:
* Yul Brynner -- The King and I {"The King"}
* Alec Guinness -- The Bridge on the River Kwai {"Colonel Nicholson"}
* Paul Scofield -- A Man for All Seasons {"Sir Thomas More"}
* George C. Scott -- Patton {"General George S. Patton, Jr."}
* Gene Hackman -- The French Connection {"Jimmy 'Popeye' Doyle"}
* Robert De Niro -- Raging Bull {"Jake LaMotta"}
* Ben Kingsley -- Gandhi {"Mahatma Gandhi"}
* Daniel Day-Lewis -- My Left Foot {"Christy Brown"}
* Jeremy Irons -- Reversal of Fortune {"Claus Von Bulow"}
* Geoffrey Rush -- Shine {"David Helfgott"}
* Adrien Brody -- The Pianist {"Wladyslaw Szpilman"}
* Jamie Foxx -- Ray {"Ray Charles"}
* Philip Seymour Hoffman -- Capote {"Truman Capote"}

Best Actress:
ACTRESS
* Ingrid Bergman -- Anastasia {"The Woman"}
* Susan Hayward -- I Want To Live! {"Barbara Graham"}
* Anne Bancroft -- The Miracle Worker {"Annie Sullivan"}
* Julie Andrews -- Mary Poppins {"Mary Poppins"} (Yes, she's a real person)
* Katharine Hepburn -- The Lion in Winter {"Queen Eleanor of Aquitaine"}
[NOTE: A tie. The other winner in this category was Barbra Streisand ('Funny Girl').]
* Barbra Streisand -- Funny Girl {"Fanny Brice"}
[NOTE: A tie. The other winner in this category was Katharine Hepburn ('The Lion in Winter').]
* Sissy Spacek -- Coal Miner's Daughter {"Loretta Lynn"}
* Susan Sarandon -- Dead Man Walking {"Sister Helen Prejean"}
* Hilary Swank -- Boys Don't Cry {"Brandon Teena/Teena Brandon"}
* Julia Roberts -- Erin Brockovich {"Erin Brockovich"}
* Nicole Kidman -- The Hours {"Virginia Woolf"}
* Charlize Theron -- Monster {"Aileen Wuornos"}
* Reese Witherspoon -- Walk the Line {"June Carter"}
* Helen Mirren -- The Queen {"The Queen"}

Best Supporting Actress:
* Shelley Winters -- The Diary of Anne Frank {"Mrs. Van Daan"}
* Patty Duke -- The Miracle Worker {"Helen Keller"}
* Estelle Parsons -- Bonnie and Clyde {"Blanche Barrow"}
* Vanessa Redgrave -- Julia {"Julia"}
* Maureen Stapleton -- Reds {"Emma Goldman"}
* Brenda Fricker -- My Left Foot {"Mrs. Brown"}
* Judi Dench -- Shakespeare in Love {"Queen Elizabeth I"}
* Marcia Gay Harden -- Pollock {"Lee Krasner"}
* Jennifer Connelly -- A Beautiful Mind {"Alicia Nash"}
* Cate Blanchett -- The Aviator {"Katharine Hepburn"}

Best Supporting Actor:
* Joseph Schildkraut -- The Life of Emile Zola {"Captain Alfred Dreyfus"}
* Walter Brennan -- The Westerner {"Judge Roy Bean"}
* Edmund Gwenn -- Miracle on 34th Street {"Kris Kringle"} (Yes, I believe)
* Anthony Quinn -- Viva Zapata! {"Eufemio Zapata"}
* Anthony Quinn -- Lust for Life {"Paul Gauguin"}
* Jason Robards -- All the President's Men {"Ben Bradlee"}
* Jason Robards -- Julia {"Dashiell Hammett"}
* Martin Landau -- Ed Wood {"Bela Lugosi"}
* Jim Broadbent -- Iris {"John Bayley"}

Of course, not all of the above may stand the test of time as being Oscar worthy, but playing a real person in screen is not a new thing. There are some stellar performances in this bunch if you ask me (and you didn't). ;)


BTW, the last re-make to win best picture was Ben-Hur in 1959

Another film that, to me, does not deserve a best picture nod (way after the fact). An achievement in film making, yes. The chariot race, psectacular. The film, a crashing bore. And I love Wyler, but this is IMO.

[mousepod]

But it rankles that Best Picture went to a remake, just as I bemoan that the best actor and actress nods went to real-person imitators. There was less CREATION in these awarded films and roles, and I think that detracts from their overall greatness.




BTW, the last re-make to win best picture was Ben-Hur in 1959

Define remake.

1961:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e7/Romeo_juliet_movieposter.jpg
1968:http://www.katalog.artfilm.cz/obrazek/nahled/OBR13688
1997:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/79/Anighttoremember.jpg/200px-Anighttoremember.jpg
2002:http://content.vcommerce.com/products/fullsize/992/5755992.jpg

Maybe if Nicholson had a song or two...

[katiesue]

I have a problem with actors portraying someone who's either still alive or I've seen actual film/tape of, for example JFK or Queen Elizabeth. If they're portraying an actual person, but someone I'm not familair with say Erin Brockavich or Henry VIII then it doesn't bother me as much because I don't have a reference point.

[Alex]

I think there is a distinction to be made between a remake and two movies using the same source material. Sure, it is a fuzzy line but I think one of some distinction.

James Cameron's Titanic was made without really any input from the earlier filmed versions of the story. It is hard to argue that a filmed version of Shakespeare (that is faithful to the play) would be a remake of another faithfully filmed version. 2002's Chicago is a filming of Bob Fosse's book not so much the original Watkins version (which is what Ginger Rogers' is based on ultimately being a remake of the 1927 silent film; the original play was not a musical).

The Departed is most certainly a remake. A Night to Remember is most certainly not. Then things get fuzzier for the others.

[innerSpaceman]

this has been done before, a lot, meaning actors portraying real-person imitators.
Oh, I know!

In fact, Mirren and Whitaker became the fourth actors in the last five years to win for non-fiction roles. I don't like the trend.

[mousepod]

Fuzzy is exactly my point. If one is going to argue that less "creation... detracts from overall greatness," then many of the Best Picture winners since 1959 (the arbitrary year we're talking about) have been based on stories created before the film. Not including the ones I mentioned above, you still have:

1962 - biopic (Lawrence of Arabia)
1963 - novel adaptation (Tom Jones)
1964 - stage musical (My Fair Lady)
1965 - stage musical (The Sound of Music)
1966 - stage play (A Man For All Seasons)
1967 - novel adaptation (In The Heat of the Night)
1969 - novel adaptation (Midnight Cowboy)
1970 - biopic (Patton)
1971 - non-fiction book (fictionalized) (The French Connection)
1972 - novel adaptation (The Godfather)
1973 - non-fiction book (fictionalized) (The Sting)
1975 - novel adaptation (One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest)

etc etc.

[Alex]

I don't remember if I posted it here. A breakdown of the overrepresentation of "mimicry" roles in the recent acting nominations? Something like 40% over the last four years have gone to portrayals of real people where in the previous five years it was more like 20%.

[Snowflake]

Oh, I know!

In fact, Mirren and Whitaker became the fourth actors in the last five years to win for non-fiction roles. I don't like the trend.

Yeah, and I do agree with you here 100%.

Although, going back a few years, one of the few times I leap off my seat and cheered an Oscar win was to Martin Landau for his Bela Lugosi portrayal from Ed Wood. According to reports, it was not a true portrayal of Lugosi, but is was a helluva performance (I thought).

[Alex]

I can't argue with that (and I don't feel that being a remake necessarily hampers The Departed; yes, I know this is inconsistent with my practice of starting mimicry performances in the penalty box) but one big difference, I think, is that with a filmed remake of another film you are provided not just with story or specific dialog but also camera angles, editing decisions, pacing, staging, etc. You can pick what has already worked on film once while tweaking what has already been shown to not. In other words, while those other sources help with story they don't necessary help with the cinematic parts. I think United 93 should have been nominated for best picture (though not win) and there wasn't anything "creative" in the movie; it was intentionally un-creative.

Not having seen Infernal Affairs I don't know how much Scorcese benefited from all of that or if it was essentially like starting from scratch with a screenplay.

Interestingly, though, if the sequel to The Departed gets made it won't be a remake of the sequel to Internal Affairs since the American sequel will apparently focus on the Mark Wahlberg character that doesn't exist in the original version.

[Ghoulish Delight]

but one big difference, I think, is that with a filmed remake of another film you are provided not just with story or specific dialog but also camera angles, editing decisions, pacing, staging, etc. You can pick what has already worked on film once while tweaking what has already been shown to not. In other words, while those other sources help with story they don't necessary help with the cinematic parts.I definitely give more creative credit to films adapted from other media than I do ones remade from another film for this very reason. As evidenced by the early days of film, transferring theatric stage direction to the camera just doesn't cut it. Even dialog and story doesn't survive direct translation to screen. It takes quite a bit of creative effort to take a good play or novel and make it a good movie. With something that was already a movie once, much of that effort is already done for you.

[Strangler Lewis]

It is hard to argue that a filmed version of Shakespeare (that is faithful to the play) would be a remake of another faithfully filmed version.

Shakespeare, of course, borrowed most of his story lines from other relatively popular source material in various forms.

In the broadest sense, there are really only so many stories that can be told, and they get told over and over again.

[Not Afraid]

I guess I don't care much if the story is a remake or the character has a place IRL. I just want a compelling story and quality acting - and great visuals.

[Snowflake]

Shakespeare, of course, borrowed most of his story lines from other relatively popular source material in various forms.

In the broadest sense, there are really only so many stories that can be told, and they get told over and over again.


Everything old is new again.

[mousepod]

I guess I don't care much if the story is a remake or the character has a place IRL. I just want a compelling story and quality acting - and great visuals.


Hear, hear.

[Alex]

Hear, hear.

And I agree as well.

I didn't walk out of Ray saying "well, that would have been a great movie if only it had been a complete work of fiction." It was a great movie.

Where it begins to be relevant to me is when prompted to make qualitative and comparative evaluations. Forest Whitaker and Peter O'Toole were both fantastic and yet we discuss which was best. When asked to make such a calculation, personally, the fact that O'Toole's character had to be created from whole cloth while Whitaker was, to some degree, simply recreating a real person leads me to devalue his performance in relation to Peter O'Toole's. But the Last King of Scotland remains a remarkable movie in many ways (I pointed out my complaints in the random thread after seeing it).

Perhaps that is why I have this discrepancy between acting "remakes" and Best Picture "remakes" since best picture brings it all together and is about the complete package more than its component parts.

[Not Afraid]

I think it would be more of a challenge as an actor to recreate an IRL character then to create a character from scratch.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I think it would be more of a challenge as an actor to recreate an IRL character then to create a character from scratch.
I don't think so. It brings to mind the recreation of the statue of David that stands outside, where the original David used to stand, in front of the Medici palace. It is a truly remarkable reproduction and took an amount of skill that almost no one in the world could have matched...but the creation of the original remains a more impressive accomplishment.

I wouldn't say that a film being a remake/adaptation means I by default enjoy it less. But in terms of selecting a film to award, remakes start on lower footing in my mind.

Though I think I'm the opposite of Alex in that I cut actors portraying real people more slack than films that have been remade. To me, translating a real personality into a character that plays well on screen is more akin to adapting a book or play than remaking an existing film. So I give that process more credence.

[CoasterMatt]

So, just how many people associated with Fast Times at Ridgemont High have gone on to win Oscars?

[JWBear]

The argument can also be made that successfully and convincingly portraying a well known person (either living or dead) can be a more difficult and challenging job than creating a fictional one.

[JWBear]

I think it would be more of a challenge as an actor to recreate an IRL character then to create a character from scratch.

Stop reading my mind (and posting first)!! ;)

[Not Afraid]

LOL! I read your first posts and thought IS HE IGNORING ME!!! (Of two minds, sweetie.)

[Alex]

I can see that argument being made, but I don't agree with it. Since it is fundamentally a subjective view that's ok.

I'm more impressed by what O'Toole did than by what Whitaker did (even if the end results were of approximately equal entertainment value). I won't say anybody who feels the opposite is wrong.

[Alex]

So, just how many people associated with Fast Times at Ridgemont High have gone on to win Oscars?

You can't put a (likely rhetorical) research question in front of me and not get an answer. The Oscar's associated with cast and crew:

Cameron Crowe - Screenplay won Best Original Screenplay for Almost Famous

Sean Penn - Actor - won Best Actor for Mystic River, three other nominations

Forrest Whitaker - Actor - won Best Actor for The Last King of Scotland

Nicolas Cage - Actor - won Best Actor for Leaving Las Vegas, one other nomination

Daneil A. Lomino - Art Direction - nominated Best Art Direction for Close Encounters of the Third Kind

Marilyn Vance - Costume Design - nominated Best Costume Design for The Untouchables

Roger Heman Jr. - Sound Re-recordist - won Best Sound for Jaws, one other nomination

Tom Overton - sound - nominated Best Sound for A Star is Born

[Strangler Lewis]

I can see that argument being made, but I don't agree with it. Since it is fundamentally a subjective view that's ok.

I'm more impressed by what O'Toole did than by what Whitaker did (even if the end results were of approximately equal entertainment value). I won't say anybody who feels the opposite is wrong.

I haven't seen the movie, but from what I've seen of the clips, Peter O'Toole did play a real person: Peter O'Toole. And Forest Whitaker looks like he did his typical Forest Whitaker, weird-eyed, intensity thing. Meryl Streep did her Meryl Streep tics in Prada. Cary Grant always played Cary Grant. Katharine Hepburn always played Katharine Hepburn. Etc.

It's a rare pleasure to find a famous actor who disappears into a variety of roles and whose tics and tricks you don't recognize. Kate Winslet comes to mind among women. Sean Penn and Jim Broadbent among men.

[Alex]

I'd disagree with you on Sean Penn, he almost always plays "godawful annoying." It's his trademark.

[Snowflake]

It's a rare pleasure to find a famous actor who disappears into a variety of roles and whose tics and tricks you don't recognize. Kate Winslet comes to mind among women. Sean Penn and Jim Broadbent among men.

I agree on Winslet and, especially, Jim Broadbent. May I derail this to refer to Emmy Awards for 2007 and I feel that if he does not win for Longford, it will be a crime. Grim story, but he was marvelous. In this case playing an IRL person, but someone I don't know jack about. A remarkable actor, who raises up the quality of the worst crap (okay, not the horrible Bridget Jones sequel, at least he was only required to do a drive by on that piece of crap).

Sean Penn, Mystic River was agonizing for me.

[wendybeth]

Sean Penn's best role was Jeff Spicoli. I can't watch him without seeing Jeff, no matter what the character he's supposedly playing.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

I can see that argument being made, but I don't agree with it.

That's how I feel about the information presented to support the idea that it's harder to create from scratch. I see what you're saying, and I disagree. If you have an original character (and an imagination) you can create whatever you want. You have no restrictions other than the text. You can make them sound or look or be however you want.

If you have the restrictions of a real person's voice, movement, etc, you don't have the freedom to make an easier choice, or ANY choice, in those terms. But you do have to give a layered performance with emotional responses and so on on top of all of those constrictions. In my mind (and in my acting/directing experience) this is harder.

[JWBear]

LOL! I read your first posts and thought IS HE IGNORING ME!!! (Of two minds, sweetie.)

I'd never ignore you sweetie darling..... How could one? ;) ;) ;)

[Cadaverous Pallor]

But did you not tell me you had a problem with West Bank Story because you perceived an anti-Israeli stance??I did. Over dinner I mentioned what had bugged me about the film - that it did not show both sides as equally antagonistic towards each other. As my parents lived in Israel for years, I can hardly say I have an objective view on Mid East doings, but I was hoping for at least a "fair" portrayal, even if the movie was silly. I can't possibly take it seriously enough to think it was "propaganda", however.

Anyway - I thought it was funny, but nowhere near as inventive as the other films. I'd choose any of the others over that one for the Oscar. IMHO, the win was politically motivated. Bah.

Regarding portraying real people, and remakes....most of the movies that win Best Pic are serious, long, and dry.....and that sucks most of all ;) I mean, I've seen so few of them because I really am not a fan of the "horribly depressing" genre.

Oh - and I loved the Jack Black/Will Farrell/John C Reilly bit. They're right, comedians never get a fair shake at the Oscars. :)

[Not Afraid]

There was a commentary in the LA Times about how Eddie Murphy should've been nominated for Norbit, or rather should be next year.

I think a good dumbing down is what the Oscars needs.

[innerSpaceman]

Cate Blanchette is another actress who, imo, melts into every role.


Oh, and as more of the show comes back to me, I wanted to register a bit of appreciation for the Screenwriting Montage. I especially got a kick of out Jack Nicholson's bit from The Shining (but mostly because I had just watched it with zapppop earlier in the week ... he had never seen it before!)

[Babette]

Yeah, somehow I don't think that went quite the way she thought it did in her head.

Babette, don't know who the presenter is, but they gave the accountants/secret-until-envelope-opening-on-stage spiel over the closing credits.Oh, I missed that since I didn't even stay for the whole Departed speech (didn't see the film, no Matt Damon=I didn't care). Thanks for the info.

But it rankles that Best Picture went to a remake, just as I bemoan that the best actor and actress nods went to real-person immitators. There was less CREATION in these awarded films and roles, and I think that detracts from their overall greatness.Not to repeat anything already said about this, but most stories are "remakes" to some extent. It is the new interpretation for a new generation that makes or breaks them. Maybe they should have two best picture categories like they do for screenplays - original and adapted. I agree with those who said it is the lost-in-the-moment, entertainment value that makes a film good.

So, just how many people associated with Fast Times at Ridgemont High have gone on to win Oscars?Haha, Ubergeek said "he's from Fast Times" when Forrest won! Alex beat me to the list. Thanks, A!

It's a rare pleasure to find a famous actor who disappears into a variety of roles and whose tics and tricks you don't recognize. Kate Winslet comes to mind among women. Sean Penn and Jim Broadbent among men.or Sean Patrick Flannery and Ralph Fiennes (hubba hubba)

I can't possibly take it seriously enough to think it was "propaganda", however.Ummmm, yea. That was I who was yelling "propaganda" at dinner. But, I was referring to Binto's Big Idea and not West Bank Story. West Bank was funny, Hot Shots, SNL style. Binto was pure propaganda trying to hide behind a heartmeltingly adorable little girl. The father's proposal was funny and clever. Even the children at school was sweet. But the play ruined it all. Could they beat us over the head any more with the idea the girls need to go to school? Geez! PROPAGANDA!!

[flippyshark]

I especially got a kick of out Jack Nicholson's bit from The Shining (but mostly because I had just watched it with zapppop earlier in the week ... he had never seen it before!)

Did he like it?

[innerSpaceman]

Yes, very much.



And he's very much into catching up on movies that are constantly pop-culturally quoted.

Next week ... likely Young Frankenstein.

[Strangler Lewis]

There was a commentary in the LA Times about how Eddie Murphy should've been nominated for Norbit, or rather should be next year.

I think a good dumbing down is what the Oscars needs.

I don't know about Norbit, but he deserved a nomination/award for The Nutty Professor, as did Jim Carrey for Liar, Liar, Steve Martin for Roxanne, etc.

Dying is easy. Comedy is hard.

[Not Afraid]

Next week ... likely Young Frankenstein.

He'll be ahead of his mom watching that one.

[Not Afraid]

Dying is easy. Comedy is hard.
And most of it isn't very funny. Annoying, yes, but funny, no. (But, I am very hard sell on comedy.)

[wendybeth]

Great. Now I have the 'Sweet mystery of Life' song running around in my brain.

[mousepod]

When I was a kid, I had the Young Frankenstein soundtrack (with dialog) on 8-track. I got it from the Columbia House Record Club and played it on my Panasonic Dynamite player. I can recite most of that movie in my sleep...

[innerSpaceman]

If films remade from other films are the lowest form of creativity ... what then to make of such movies as The Man Who Knew Too Much, The Ten Commandments, Pocketful of Miracles, The Children's Hour, An Affair to Remember, and Destry that were remade by the very same filmmaker?!




Ahem, it was none other than Alfred Hitchcock who remade his own film, The Man Who Knew Too Much. Can we ascribe the lowest sub-circle of creative hell to such a giant???

[Not Afraid]

And the second version of TMWKTM is even better than the first! Imagine that!

[Alex]

If you remake the movie yourself you get to keep all of the creative credit but unless you do something substantially unique in the second go 'round (which is not the case for The Man Who Knew Too Much or An Affair to Remember) then that total creative amount is not much increased by the second movie.

In my opinion, of course.

[innerSpaceman]

But, wow, I love the way that acronym looks!

[Alex]

And NA is right about the second being better. Just not a particularly creative effort.

But I also don't have a problem with remakes. You just don't get full creative credit.

[Not Afraid]

So, what about films based on books? Is that any different/better/worse?

[mousepod]

Yes, the remake of TMWKTM brought us "Que Sera Sera," but we lost Peter Lorre. I like the original.

[€uroMeinke]

But, wow, I love the way that acronym looks!

Indeed - someone needs to make it into a Disney attraction

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Ummmm, yea. That was I who was yelling "propaganda" at dinner. But, I was referring to Binto's Big Idea and not West Bank Story. West Bank was funny, Hot Shots, SNL style. Binto was pure propaganda trying to hide behind a heartmeltingly adorable little girl. The father's proposal was funny and clever. Even the children at school was sweet. But the play ruined it all. Could they beat us over the head any more with the idea the girls need to go to school? Geez! PROPAGANDA!!Seriously. It could have been a much better film if they just hadn't yelled at us so much.

[Not Afraid]

It sure is better than MITLF

[Alex]

So, what about films based on books? Is that any different/better/worse?

I addressed that up above:

but one big difference, I think, is that with a filmed remake of another film you are provided not just with story or specific dialog but also camera angles, editing decisions, pacing, staging, etc. You can pick what has already worked on film once while tweaking what has already been shown to not. In other words, while those other sources help with story they don't necessary help with the cinematic parts.

Who gets more creative credit? The director who is brought it by a producer to make an already cast movie based on a screenplay adapted from a successful stage production or the guy who writes a script, casts it, fights off studio interference and directs it exactly the way he envisioned it in his head?

The latter. That doesn't mean he made a better movie, though.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Indeed - someone needs to make it into a Disney attractionPerhaps they could put it in the WWTBAMPI! building

[Not Afraid]

I've been liking propaganda films lately. They are really fascinating both when seen as a contemporary film and as a historical document. Watching Fuherer's Face, Binta....., An Inconvenient Truth, the recently posted Ward Kimbal shirt and Victory Through Air Power makes me want to watch some good ole Lene Riefenstahl.

[Not Afraid]

I addressed that up above:



Who gets more creative credit? The director who is brought it by a producer to make an already cast movie based on a screenplay adapted from a successful stage production or the guy who writes a script, casts it, fights off studio interference and directs it exactly the way he envisioned it in his head?

The latter. That doesn't mean he made a better movie, though.

Thanks. I obviously missed that part. Bathroom break or something. ;)

[Gemini Cricket]

TMWKTM
MITLF
WWTBAMPI!

I demand to know what you cuckoo birds are saying.
:bangs table with fist Cadaverous Pallor style:
:confused:

Edit: Never mind, Cuckoo Birds. Me scroll 'em up higher and figure out. Ugh. ~ Chief Dances with Crickets