No BBQ's in Apartments

[katiesue]

I read about this law a few months ago but now it seems, at least San Diego, is enforcing it. We got an addendum to our lease yesterday. You can't have charcoal or other open-flame cooking devices within 10 feet of combustible construction in multifamily buildings. It also prohibits using gas grills (effective Feb 1) having a gas container with a water capacity greater than 2.5 pounds.

It's California Code of Regulations, Title 24, Part 9, Section 308.3.1. I'm not very good a a web search apparently because I'm not having a lot of luck finding the actual code.

This (http://www.sacbee.com/103/story/1176816.html) article from the Sacramento Bee sums it up.

Now it says multifamily dwellings so I'm assuming this would include condos as well? Anyone else get any kind of notice?

[Ghoulish Delight]

We haven't gotten one recently, though I remember hearing about it a few years ago when we were still living in Irvine. I don't think anyone's bothered to enforce it

[Kevy Baby]

I received no such notice (we live in a condo), but this law would seem like common sense. I know some people won't like it, but having seen the effects of such a situation (burned out balconies due to BBQs), I initially support the ban (and I am actually surprised it wasn't law before).

[katiesue]

Our apartments already had banned any open flame except gas grills. I think I'm actually ok because I can use the camping size gas bottles with my road trip which are allowed, as far as I can tell.

[Morrigoon]

I remember apartments forbidding it. I have heard no such thing at my condo. Hope not, because our grill is charcoal!

[Alex]

Our complex sent out a reminder of this several months ago. Didn't know if it was new law or just a reminder of existing law. Our complex as communal grills but it didn't impact me at all since I have never, except when camping, come close to actually using a BBQ.

In looking around I too can't find the law online (the California Building Code seems to be something you have to purchase to read in full but maybe I'm just stupid) but it looks like the exceptions are for charcoal grills only at SFRs or duplexes, or if you're patio has automatic sprinkler protection.

[JWBear]

It's California Code of Regulations, Title 24, Part 9, Section 308.3.1. I'm not very good a a web search apparently because I'm not having a lot of luck finding the actual code.

You can read it here (http://www.scribd.com/doc/3812739/Title-24-Part-9-Slice-1-2007-California-Fire-Code). Scroll down to page 35. (I have no idea why certain words are covered in yellow.)

Basically, no BBQs on combustible balconies in buildings with 3 or more units unless said balconies are equipped with fire sprinklers. (It says nothing about patios!)

[Alex]

Most apartment patios probably don't provide the 10 feet of clearance required ("or within 10 feet of combustible construction") especially if a fence would count as "combustible construction."

[Not Afraid]

My yard doesn't provide 10 feet of clearance.

[LashStoat]

Hi KatieSue,

Having read page 35 as provided by JW, you can put an LPG-fuelled BBQ hard-up against a dry brush fence as long as the bottle doesn't exceed a 1 pound gas capacity.

Just why a 1 pound bottle is less of a risk than a 1.001 pound bottle, and why it's OK to (potentially) burn down a 1 or 2 family dwelling (as opposed to a 3 family dwelling) with it is anyone's guess. It always amuses me that the more detail that is put into this kind of document, the more loopholes are accidentally included...so I guess you could use a 50 pound butane bottle without issue, as butane isn't mentioned.

Glancing over other parts of the document, it appears that you Americans can thank the Darwin Award nominees that put whole frozen turkeys into boiling oil and recreate the Pompeii eruption (as can be seen in many a YouTube clip).

Anyways, as my cheesy footer says, it's all for the grater good.

Love and hugs,

The Stoat XXX.

[RStar]

My yard doesn't provide 10 feet of clearance.
I think you'd just make it if you cooked at the end of your front walk just by the sidewalk. :rolleyes:

There are pretty good grills out there that meet the fuel requirements, but they still have an "open flame" so I don't know if they can be used.

Like this one (http://www.amazon.com/Weber-Portable-Propane-Grill-Silver/dp/B00008RC2Q)

There are some electric grills, like the George Foreman Indoor/Outdoor Grill (http://www.amazon.com/George-Foreman-GGR50B-Indoor-Outdoor/dp/B00004W499/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1231105562&sr=8-3)

Or this full size electric job (http://www.electricfireplacesdirect.com/EFD/dimplex-powerchef-electric-grill.html?gclid=COyU9p_x9ZcCFQ4NDQodb0t1DA) that claims to cook as good as gas, although it is a bit pricy.

[LashStoat]

Dear All,

The California Fire Dept. wishes to advise that all BBQs and fireplaces must comply with the recently published building code. Due to loopholes in the previous regulations, approved "Flame Containers" will be described by the brick count.

As an indication, the brick count for a BBQ/Fireplace as deemed safe for a single family residence is 12,792. Officers have been instructed that structures constructed of a brick count less than this number for a single family residence are to be considered in breach of the regulations.

Furthermore, the required brick count increases proportionally to the number of families living in the annexed dwelling as follows:

1 Family = 12,792
2 Families = 1 Family's brick count times 1.5 (this is known as the coefficient of safety, as prescribed by Dolores Umbridge, Director of California Fire Inc.).

..and so the scale goes.

As Dolores so eloquently put it: "The fuel used does not matter - it's all about the brick count".

Below is a picture of a compliant 1 Family BBQ/Fireplace:

[Strangler Lewis]

The regulation does carve out an exception for one and two family dwellings. The right to burn your house down-another benefit of home ownership.

[Stan4dSteph]

I thought this was actually going to be about grills inside houses. It happens every year when there is a power outage -- some idiots try to cook on their grill inside their house or attached garage and get carbon monoxide poisoning. I suppose it's a modern form of natural selection.

[LashStoat]

The regulation does carve out an exception for one and two family dwellings. The right to burn your house down-another benefit of home ownership.

Yup..and I'm gonna get me a 5 pound bottle, some marsh mallows and some LPG...and if that don't work, it's off to Walmart to buy a deep-fryin' can and a frozen Tur-Ducken.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I wonder how they define "combustible construction." Our condo is obviously not fireproof, but the exterior is covered in stucco, not particularly combustible. And our fences around our patio were just replaced by vinyl. So there really isn't much exposed flammable construction material back there, so perhaps we are in the clear?

[mousepod]

Last night, I saw a cool episode of Deconstruction on the DIY Network that talked about fireproof materials. This link (http://www.diynetwork.com/diy/pac_ctnt_988_leader/text/0,,DIY_26336_70702,00.html#) may or may not work...

[Prudence]

Back home the BBQ restriction is coupled with a Christmas tree prohibition. Is that also the case in California? (Doesn't matter for me personally, as mine is fake.)

[Alex]

I've never had building management indicate that Christmas trees aren't allowed (though I've never had one so maybe a warning was never triggered). But based on the idiots throwing theirs in the dumpsters every January if it is a rule it is widely ignored.

[katiesue]

In my complex Christmas Trees are allowed. They even provide a special dumpster for recycling them after the holidays.

[Disneyphile]

Our complex doesn't allow charcoal grills. However, if the law is finally enforced, then it just means we won't be getting a large tank for our Road Trip.

The small cans seem to last forever though, so I'm not too worried about it. :)

[Ghoulish Delight]

The small cans seem to last forever though, so I'm not too worried about it. :)
Forever, or through one morning's worth of bacon for LoTters.

[Morrigoon]

I wonder how they define "combustible construction." Our condo is obviously not fireproof, but the exterior is covered in stucco, not particularly combustible. And our fences around our patio were just replaced by vinyl. So there really isn't much exposed flammable construction material back there, so perhaps we are in the clear?

Ooooh, vinyl fencing is nice stuff. I'd love to put that in around our patio. Some of my neighbors have it and it looks great.

[Ghoulish Delight]

At the very least it's a massive improvement over the rotted wood that it replaced. I'd still prefer a quality wood fence over vinyl, but to install and maintain a good one is obviously pricey so the vinyl's a decent 2nd option. Especially when paid for by the association.

[Kevy Baby]

Forever, or through one morning's worth of bacon for LoTters.The tank I started with was at best 1/4 full and I only had to replace it for the last batch.

[LashStoat]

Back home the BBQ restriction is coupled with a Christmas tree prohibition. Is that also the case in California? (Doesn't matter for me personally, as mine is fake.)

You've got to be kidding me right? What next...no Santa?

...or even worse, no eggnog? <hiccup>........</hiccup>

[LashStoat]

In my complex Christmas Trees are allowed. They even provide a special dumpster for recycling them after the holidays.

Dear KatieSue,

It took a while for the penny to drop - now I know exactly why they are called "Complexes"...and I think it should be called "The USA of C".

Love and hugs,

The Stoat XXX.

[LashStoat]

Dear All,

Just so as you don't think I'm pulling the p1ss out of your regulations (as easy as it may be), there is one Ashtrayan one that comes to mind.

I can't remember the exact detail, but it is still illegal to drive a car (anywhere) that is not carrying a bale of hay or fodder under some circumstances. Obviously the regulation was created just as cars hit the roads here...but it has never been updated.

So if you have ever wondered just where the saying "Well that's the last straw" came from, it was Mrs Gwendolyn Briggs of Little Hartley telling her husband to pull into the nearest LiveStock supplier.

Rumor has it that he got the required bale, but ran out of gas shortly after and ended up having to push Gwendolyn and the car the remaining 15 miles. When he finally got home, he constructed a bridle system so that his old nag could pull the car along, fed by the hay...which made Gwendolyn irate, as she hated the taste of horse fodder*.


Love and hugs,

The Stoat XXX.

*An original fractured fairy tale by The Stoat.

[Kevy Baby]

What about Prince Leonard of Hutt River (http://www.snopes.com/legal/prince.asp)?

[LashStoat]

Dear Kevy,

I thought a man of the world such as yourself would know about this.

"Prince Leonard went on a walk one evening, when an apple dropped on his head as he passed under a tree. The computer was broken but that is quite beside the point. It made him reflect that his walk had been quite constitutional, and in the same moment, he decided to secede from his state (having been hit on the head, I'd have thought he was in no fit state) by using an antique but nonetheless effective constitutional right".

And so (note I started with And - if C.S. Lewis can do it, so can I - Narnia, Narnia, Narnia) the Hutt River Province came into being.

So far, he has a hut, a river, a lion, a witch...of crap, wrong story. It does however have its own taxation laws, governance and people that wear funny bonnets, ride in carts and farm stuff.

I think they are called The Hamish (the "H" is for Hutt).

Anyway, it was a constitutional thing, not a regulatory thing, so don't try to obfuscate.

Hugs from

The Stoat.

[Tref]

What about BBQ sauce?

[wendybeth]

As long as it's room temperature.

(Hi, Tref!)

[RStar]

What about BBQ sauce?

Well, this is my favorite (http://www.hotsauceworld.com/pamomabasa.html) but you still may have to deal with fire codes as it claims Pappy's Moonshine Madness Barbecue Sauce - So Friggin' Hot, You'll go Blind! Nutritional Note: If you can stand the heat, cook with it. If not, leave it the hell alone.

I like real, real hot, so to me this is just kinda hot. But it is real tasty, too!

[Betty]

Cooks Illustrated recently did a bbq sauce taste test of brands you can buy at the grocery store. While none compared to their homemade sauce, they chose Bullseye bbq sauce. (then they showed you how to doctor it up a bit by adding some mustard, kethup and molasses to it.)