I'm in the same boat with the Oscars. Per my subjective views, winning Best Picture does not correlate strongly with the actual best picture of a year. But winning Best Picture (popularity among a select subgroup) does correlate strongly with picking a good movie. Clunkers, yes; sometimes they actually pick a great one. But almost always a good one.

If we're talking short-term box office numbers, no. Long term revenue seems to be a better indicator of quality (the only one on that top 10 list that I don't consider 'good' to some degree is Titanic).

As for the IMDB "geek herd", I think that's what surprises me most about Shawshank being up there. While I certainly agree that it's got all the elements of a good commercially successful movie, it doesn't strike me as the kind of movie the "geek herd" (of which I'll admit to being a pat of) generally goes for. While I'd shuffle the order and add some that aren't there, I'm more or less on board with the top 20 imdb list. Discounting the ones I haven't seen, Shawshank's the only one that really sticks out. To me it's like seeing a Chilli's at the top of a restaurant ranking list. Sure, it's pretty good, better than most standard chain fair, but THAT good?

Agreed. What struck me about CP's brother was that his argument was, "How can you possibly not like that movie, it's #2?!"

I caught sight of this place on a recent Discovery Channel show on the 1000 places you should see before you die. I hated the show, the couple doing the traveling suck, but I liked seeing Zihuatanejo, the beaches are left unspoiled, it's still a fishing village.

And, count me as one who loved Shawshank, I even bought it on DVD and watch it annually.

popular=good? Eh, everyone filters through their own criteria, especially when it comes to film. I just polled for a future podcast what the top ten, essential silent films would be, the list was amazingly diverse.

I seriously do not understand how anyone can think that Porky's was not a great movie. The sequels less so.

As for Shawshank, while I love Tim Robbins and Morgan Freeman, and while I'm reasonably open to sentiment and magic, I thought the movie had the kind of Maya Angelou self-satisfaction you want to hit in the face with a large cartoon skillet.

Thank you for the reminder about the OP (duh! to me).

Yeah, the argument is lacking in merit. It is right up there with the thought that because someone else liked a movie that I would like it too. I know there are many movies that I enjoy that (for example) I know NA wouldn't. It is just a difference in opinion - nothing more.

A few years ago, we took off and spent about 2 months down there on our boat. It was a nice quiet place, warm clear water. Great little hole in the wall restaurants. Not a place to go if you like fast-paced excitement, more of a slow paced relaxing place.

It is very interesting to see what people think about different movies, this is such a diverse group, I haven't heard about 99% of the movies discussed in the movie thread, but they are fun to read about.

And, Kevy, you bring up a good point about why you choose to watch movies in the first place. Escapism, enlightment, stimulation etc are all valid reasons to watch a film. It's 2 hours of your life, you should have a decent reason. ;)

Or occasionally 15 minutes and an indecent reason ;)

I don't mean to say that every movie at the top of the list is there because of geek herd, but that there is a strong distorting influence on the overall list.

All the Lord of the Rings movies rated at least as well as (and two better than) Citizen Kane? And any list that saves All About Eve for 80 is way out of whack (in my subjective view, of course). That said, I do agree that most of the movies in the top 20 are good.

But while I won't say you're wrong to not be impressed with Shawshank I also don't think the fact that you don't like it (or CP doesn't) doesn't make it a bad movie any more than the fact that millions do makes it a good movie. On this one the popularity indicator fails for CP. But you are probably missing a larger societal feeling. Notice that among the 250 moves in IMDb's list, Shawshank has, by far, the most ratings. So it does have strong cross-demographic response.

Now to the other frequenters of imdb, that ranking is made from our votes and ranking of those of us who log in right?
Combined with how often its looked up?

imo, a great deal of the time popular = there's something interesting here.

Not necassarily good, just interesting.

I would personally never take the rank of a movie on imdb to be a reason to see it. But thats me.

And for the record... I really like Shawshank. (really really like, wierdly so for me for a guy movie)
I think it is totally worth the time at least once.