That you probably do, and I agree it sounds like crap. The iPod rocks. Don't get me wrong, I love it and I will be buying a 40gig as soon as my finances allow. I just don't see this one taking off when it is behind the times technology wise and below the game with included accessories. I think that Apple is putting to much weight on the iPod name (which is a great branding method) but I think in the end it will bite them on the butt.

It comes with a neck strap, which is something I would rather use than an arm brace, eaiser to change songs and volume.

Humm.. Maybe it's me, but I don't think I could run with a MP3 player around my neck. Bouncie bouncie, that would hurt. That's why I'm talking about an arm band.

And really, in the grand scheme of this thread, or the new iPod what it comes with is at the bottom of the things I'm not liking about it.

Just my opnion. I do hope it takes off and I am proven wrong, I never want to see any decent product fail.

Here's the way I see it:

The $499 Mac is a great way to upgrade a PC. As it seems to be saying on it's literature, it's an upgrade kind of thing. Someone with a perfectly functioning PC likely isn't going to be purchasing this. Someone with a PC clunking around, and who's heard things about Macs is probably who will purchase this. I think that for my general needs, it would need a serous memory upgrade, but otherwise it's a dandy little machine. It comes with a G4 Processor, which works pretty fast. My old laptop, though I have it laden with all sorts of things, and it's processor isn't as powerful, is a G4 with that much memory, and it rocks a lot of computers, particularly those that have become sluggish. It targets the market that maybe got hit by virus after virus. It also targets a Monorail Man market who just wants to have one because he's a techie, however, if MM gets one, I suggest a memory upgrade, because he really knows his computers!!

The iPod Shuffle, I would never use in a million years, but again, that's because I'm used to a certain "standard" of things, and I've been into MP3s for a long long loooong time. I need to carry a LOT around. However, someone who's new to this, who just might want to carry that "Book on MP3" or a few songs, and wants the iPod name will carry this around. The neck thing, in a word: stupid, if you're running, but maybe not so bad if you're on a bike.

There are plenty of PC's already on the market from name brand guys like Dell for $499 or even less that also include a monitor and keyboard etc...

I understand that, but I guess what I'm trying to say is this:

From my experiences, quite a few people seemed to have been affected by the last few major viruses, my mother included. I have never suggested to my mom that she get a Mac, and she came up to me just the other week, and said "Erica, I think my next computer is going to be a Mac. I'm tired of watching out for every little virus, and my computer hasn't really ever recovered."

While I gently let her know that I run virus checks on my Mac at least 2-3 times a week, we talked about it, and I actually had her stick it out a little longer. The $499 Mac is perfect for someone in her shoes.

She didn't need the investment of a Mac, even though eMacs and most iMacs aren't too expensive. That's your market for the Mac mini. Someone who wants to give it a try.

However, I'm still not going to jump and have her rush to get a Mac. I'm not into pushing people into doing something. I'd like to see her with one, but no push, no rush.

Wouldn't the mini Mac cost as much as an iMac after the moniter, mouse, keyboard?

She could just run antivirus software coupled with some firewall software. Or just not use outlook.

She does.

The computer that had the virus never recovered from the initial incident. Her other PC just becomes more sluggish with each "Service Pack" I mean, give me a break! Each time one of those comes out, her computer is more sluggish...

And she never used Outlook. But isn't that called Outhouse?

If you buy all from Apple, it would be a LOT more - their least expensive monitor is a $999 20" flat screen (KB & M are only $58). If you go to the Apple On-line Store, there isn't even an option to add a moniter to your Mini order (but you can add the Apple KB & M). (On a side note, I use both a Mac and an HP PC. I will say that the Mac has a much better feeling KB than the HP. Not saying that just because I like Macs, it really does have a nice feel to it.)

But Apple is (presumably) recognizing that people either A) already HAVE a M/KB/M, or B) can get them inexpensively through a local resource (such as Fry's). I wouldn't be surprised if they have less expensive monitors at the brick and mortar Apple Store.

Just for giggles, I configured a Mini with an 80 GB HD, 1 GB of RAM, a Superdrive, Bluetooth, Wireless G card, and a wireless mouse and KB: $1,352