When a debate ensues (for all of three posts) about whether a "girl" should be allowed to wear makeup at 35 or 40, I would hope the sarcasm is apparent.

There is a far cry from allowing a girl to wear makeup and a ponytail for a dance recital and allowing what is seen in the highly publicized photos of Jon Bonet or the pix posted by Alex above. What I see in the pagent shots/footage of 4-8 year olds (a la Jon Bonet, et. al.) is (IMHO) abhorrent and negligent behavior on the part of the parents. I DO judge them without pause.

A little makeup and a ponytail in a dance recital does NOT fall into the same catagory and I really am ambivalent about it.

It was- same as when my dad told me I could not date til I was 35.

....and some people do not. I just put it out there as an example.

I think it depends. As someone who was heavily involved in the competitive dance world as a teenager I think it can go one of two ways. You can go to a studio where they wear makeup for performances (which is a must with the wash out lights on stage), but the costumes cover more than a bikini would and the dances are age appropriate. Age appropriate meaning they don't have ten year olds doing crotch shots and dancing to songs about hookers. In my experience, you can't become as advanced a dancer at those studios (at least not out here), because the better teachers know how the fiercely competitive dance world works and what it takes to win, but it can be found.

My studio was the opposite. Little girls in skimpy costumes dancing to songs about sex and prostitutes. But the teacher was very talented and the studio won a lot of competitions. It also had the added bonus of being one of the few studios that didn't start telling girls that they were fat at the age seven. The girls were all extremely nice and so were most of the parents. Very few "stage moms." They grew up very very fast though. Very fast. These girls acted like teenagers by the time they were eight. And with 12+ hours of dancing a week from the time they were five or six, I guess I don't blame them. Not for my kid, but I didn't see any abuse going on. Outside of competition they dressed like normal kids.

Stage moms are possibly my biggest dislike. I've seen moms, berate, shame, and even hit their kids for messing up a routine. What are they thinking? When does a kid get to be a kid?

And yes, I do judge child beauty pageants pretty harshly. I think it is nothing short of robbing your daughter of her childhood and putting her on display like a demented knick knack. But perhaps there are those cases where the child begs to be in a pageant. So what? I think as a parent it is their job to figure out what need a little girl is trying fill. The desire to compete? Put her in sports! Wants to get dressed up? Go to club build a whore. (Or better yet, go to one of the many Victorian tea houses that are cropping up everywhere for little girls). Socialization? Join Scouts, or have slumber party, or something. As a parent it is their job to look out for those little girls best interests. I can't fathom a single reason why putting your child on display like a sex object could ever be in their best interest.

And that guy is creepy whether or not he murdered her.

Well said, Traci!

What pagents and dance performances have become at this point is time is something I would NEVER get my own child involved in - and I was heavily involved in them in my childhood. It was pretty bad then but what it has become is disgusting. I actually stopped inviting a certain child dance troup to perform at an annyal Youth Arts event I put on for 10 years because what they performed was not appropriate for a children's event.

Any parent who tarts up their child for a pagent or a pole dance performance needs to be investigated by CPS.

Totally agree. The issue with the 3 year old mentioned earlier wasn't that a 3 yeard old was wearing makeup. It was that a parent doesn't understand that they have the rigth, and the responsiblity, to say "no" to their child.

OMG! You mean parents can actually guide their children? Who woudda thunk?

Obviously, I'm not an expert on what is considered to be "sexy" on a females, but I have never heard of a ponytail being considered a sexy/sexual hairstyle. Am I missing something here?

No-

..but that was not my point.

So, what was your point?