Lost!
 

Is anyone here watching LOST? I heard they had their season finali yesterday. I saw the first few episodes then tuned out.

Do we know what mysterious thing is killing people in the jungle?

What other (if any) things did you learn?

Thanks.

Been completely hooked on it all season. It is the one show weekly I gotta see.

So many things have happened, it's hard to tell you anything as far as what we learned. I don't know what you know.

The french woman was apparently working with Ethan to kidnap Claire and take her baby. Do you know about Ethan? Did you know about the French woman? Too hard to talk about about what's been resolved without knowing what you know.

Specifically, regarding the monster, we were supposedly shown a small piece of it last night, but I kept rewinding my tape and couldn't figure out what I was seeing.

Scaeagles~


Rest of my thoughts in spoilers



So much more than this happened. My VCR shut off in the middle of taping it. I really need TiVO!

Bartop -

Bummer about the VCR. I've gotta watch this thing a few more times prior to next season. I heard ABC is replaying it Saturday night.

I'll have to try and tape it so I can re-watch it. Thanks!

Perhaps.

I friggin' loved the finale.

There seems to be some sort of biomechanical defense system at work. And a large Underground...world? Something? What?!

Walt!!!!!!!!

My thoughts on the finale:

Tom Cruise's cousin looks like a melting Tom Cruise candle.

I found this link. Apparently if you click on the 'numbers' in order it opens up a preview for season 2.

This site is supposed to be full of hidden info about the show.

I'm gonna have to watch it again. I was not surprised when Artz blew up. While he was talking to Hurley I was thinking, I bet they introduced this guy so they could kill him off...and BOOM! He was gone.

Awww, sad but true!

Good call, as usual. :snap:

MMMM Lobster... Oh wait, you said Losters.
Season 2 preview spoiler whatever that means

OH YUMMMMMMMMMM!!!! I had him as my desktop wallpaper until my boss deemed him not work appropriate. :(



OOO that's a new theory. I like it! The producers already said





Other thoughts:

Everything and everyone is interconnected. Every prop is there for a reason. Interconnections: I know there are more, I can't think of them at this hour.

Is there any chance we can get the title of the thread to say "Spoilers" So we can stop with the tags? Thanks!

:eek: Scary stuff happens when you play around with the seating diagram. :creeped out:

BarTopDancer ~ How did you find it?

Click on the seat numbers in order. I'm not sure if it was my connection or the file but it had to keep caching up.

Also if you click around you can find where the Losters were seated and information about them. The seats will highlight and then you can click on them. When I clicked on Lockes seat I jumped out of mine :eek:. I couldn't find a way to view seats when they wern't highlighted.

With exploration of the site you can find some of the letters that were in bottles. I started finding them at the bottom of the source when I did view source.

There's all sorts of stuff on that site, I know I haven't touched even the beginning.

Robert D. West, of Santa Barbara, California, USA survived a horrific plane crash and is stranded on an island somewhere Northeast of Australia and Southwest of Hawaii. In the event that I am never found, please forward word of my fate to parents, Mr. and Mrs. John West, of Tucson Arizona. Thank you.

Robert

Argh!!!! I do not watch 'Lost', but I've a feeling if I did, your above post would really mean something. To that end, I'm feeling mojacious.....

Well, I would be, if I wasn't being told to spread it around....

I'll be back.

Does that say "Charlie tears ass through the jungle?"

If it does, that's AWESOME! And hilarious! No wonder the show is so great, if that's the script cues! :D

[quote=BarTopDancer]



That's awesome, M. Great post/thoughts.

BIG SPOILER! Do not read unless you want a HUGE spoiler.

Reply to EH re: her reply to me.

I have no spoilers. But Wednesday night I was sitting around not tired yet and the first episode came on in re-run and it's ALL YOUR FAULT that I watched it, my husband watched it, and now it's like some horrible drug and we need more.

Damn you all!

Ha-ha!

Dammit, I still haven't seen the pilot. I didn't realize they were reairing episodes. Rerun schedules are so screwy these days.

Hurry up and come out on DVD, LOST!

I typically don't enjoy watching reruns that I've seen, but this show is different. You pick up a lot of foreshadowing that you didn't see before because you know more about the characters, the island, etc.

Thoroughly enjoyed watching the pilot again.

The finale was so frustrating because I didn't feel I learned anything. In fact, I thought a lot of stuff was sort of pointless like Hurley's running through the airport. I feel like I'm watching X-Files all over again. Nothing ever gets resolved!! Which means I'll be waiting with baited breath for next season!

I taped it. I can get it to you somehow if you want. I think the DVD comes out at the end of the month. Now we need a DVD player so we can watch LOST at the park. :D

I got a portable player for Christmas. Heee.

We did learn a couple of things:



I read a review at TWOP that basically said, "What a great hour of television that would have been," so you're not the only one who thought it was a bit bloated.

Actually, I believe the DVD is being released in early September.

Thanks CStephens!

My friend sent me this for all you Sawyer fans.

And just when I'd gotten that damn llama song out of my head....

OH - a spoiler on my previous big spoiler. Apparently the report was false and I have only just learned of the retraction.

God, I hate that we have to wait for DVDs in September. And new Lost. I want more Lost now.

I'll have to satisfy with this, instead.

http://cdn.channel.aol.com/channels/...0728e-400cb8e1

Destiny calls, bitches!
 

Welcome back, LOST!

I watch it on DVD a year after it airs ... but I can't remember when I last did. I don't remember if I saw Season 3 or not. Is this Season 4 that's starting?

I like the show, but I think it's Twin Peaks 2 with no idea of where it's going and certain to devolve (if it hasn't already) into unwatchable chaos.

So I want to watch, but I'm not compelled. Certainly not to watch it weekly "live." I just want to catch up. Have I fallen 2 seasons behind instead of 1??

I'll still watch it when it airs, but am not as enthralled with it as I once was. Much more excited for 24.

Last season and the first have been my favorite seasons, thus far, so I'm very close to peeing my pants with excitement.

I just started watching my TIVOed shows in anticipation.

Very excited.

It's season 5 that's starting in January.

SciFi is airing all of the back episodes in 4 episode blocks each Monday. This coming Monday will be season 2, episodes 16-19. They should be just about caught up to the new episodes by January 21st (the start of season 5).

The question is: Does anybody care anymore?

I believe my enthusiasm indicates that I do, at least. Heh.

I meant the TV watching public in general.

Each season loses viewers. According to Wiki, there were 13 million last season, in contrast to the 16 million watching the first season. Apparently it's pretty popular Internationally, but so is CSI: Miami. Again: heh.

Ken and I started watching it this summer via NetFlix. We just finished Season 3, and are now watching Season 4 online. We hope to be caught up in time for the Season 5 premiere in January. :)

We're totally addicted to it, so we absolutely share your enthusiasm, EH!

Perhaps I should try the season 1 DVDs again. I think I got to episode 3

I'm gonna try to catch up via Sci-Fi Mondays. Thanks, bewitched.






Now, if you would just send me a PM reminder every Monday, that might actually happen! :D

I do! I do! Pick me!

Enthused!

I think that as it wraps up it will become more popular. There was a period where it was hard to watch because it was so frustrating.

The sci-fi channel is not in hi-def, which looks crappy on our tv.

I will endeavor to remember. :)

However...this is your weekly reminder for next Monday. I intend to be totally drugged up this coming Monday and am hoping that memory of all sorts is wiped from my mind.




Lost? What is this "Lost" you speak of?:D

I just discovered all 4 seasons are currently airing on ABC's website. No more waiting for Mondays!:D

(I've had a lot of free time on my hands lately...)

I can't wait for Lost to return! :)

Ben and Jack = BFF.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2PvsM5Qm50A

I think I just realized something about how I feel regarding internet tie-ins with TV shows and movies.

I don't care to visit a website, or see promo vids, or clues, or planted posts, or whathaveyou, before I have watched the show or movie. AFTER I see the actual entertainment in question I go check out websites, but beforehand, I'm just annoyed that I'm not watching the show already.

While watching 24 hours of Ralphie I had it pointed out to me that Jack's Best Man didn't have yellow eyes anymore:)

3 hours of Lost! tonight. It looks like it will be enhanced versions of the last 3 episodes.

bah. that means what? 10 seconds of show they should have shown last time? Or is this now with bubbles to explain the show as they go?

either way.. :rolleyes:

Probably "pop-up Lost."

BTW, Sci-Fi channel has recently popped up in hi-def! Just in time for the last season of BSG, yay!

Pop-up Lost!

Since I'm not going to watch all of last season before next week I look at it as a good reminder of what happened with enhancements to point out things.

One week! :D

Ran accross this poem by Yeats and didn't know where to post it; thought of putting it in open mic but it's not my poem; thought of putting it in Daily Grind but, well, that's not quite right either;

Seems to me it sorta fits here:

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all convictions, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.



Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
--W.B. Yeats

HAPPY LOST DAY EVERYONE!!!!

Monday.............one day
Tuesday............two day
Wednesday........Lost day
Thursday...........3rd day

:):):)

:D

wow

*sigh*

Anyone else throw their shoe at the TV when Hurley, wanted by the Police and G-d knows who, decided the best place to hide out was home?
-------------------

To go with Ben or not?

1)Claire haunted Kate to NOT take Aaron back.

2)Sayid, who seemed to be doing Ben's bidding last season, told Hurley to not do anything Ben asked him to do.

3)Sun wants Ben dead.

And the most compelling reason to not go with Ben; 4)Jack has decided to go with Ben....Jack is rarely correct about anything;)

But he's so hot....

I'm blanking on who the lady at the end was. Was she the one that freaked Desmond out when he was back from the island that time?

I believe she was. She worked in some store he had run into during some flashback or another, but I don't recall the details.

The lady in the butcher shop that Ben was talking to who took Locke's body....have we seen her before?

She didn't look familiar.

Maybe. I can't remember either.

Goatee dude told Desmond to go find his mom in Oxford. Maybe that's his mom?

Ben's in LA, that probably wasn't Oxford.

Ben and Butcher Shop Lady, L.A., Ben and Ms. Hawking, aka Presumably Faraday's Mother, Oxford. Ben does have ways of getting around.

That's who we think it is. She looks exactly like the lady at the jewelry shop when he tried to buy a ring for Penelope.

That's HER!!!!!!

It's the same actress, so I assume it's the same character... But you never know with Lost!

Well, I do recall jewelry lady making comments that implied that she was pretty much the one in charge, so that jives with what we saw yesterday.

How can I argue with that;)

It is the same actress and the same character:

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ms._Hawking

Interestingly enough, this same actress played, back in 2001, an equally intriguing character in a movie titled.....you're not going to believe this.........The Others

She may also no longer be in Oxford. I think they're all being drawn to Los Angeles. If she's in L.A., Desmond will wind up there, as well.

Or more specifically, Sayid told Hurley to do the opposite of what Ben told him to do.

yeah, I know I am splitting hairs

That's not splitting hairs, it's actually an important point.

I don't blame Hurley at all on this. If Ben came for me, I'd run screaming.

Very good point....although I am puzzled why he decided to ignore the advice of Ana-Lucia and turn himself into the police?

How is surrendering to the police the opposite of going with Ben anyway...wouldnt the opposite of going with Ben be staying put?

But for some reason, when Hurley takes stupid risks/acts (seemingly) irrationally, it usually works out well.

He's regularly ignored his visions of dead people.

True, but then Hurley seems to find comfort in being locked up.

I guess after seeing the look on Ben's face when Ms. Hawking told him he had 70 hours Hurley turining himself into the police may have just been the opposite of what Ben wanted regardless whether or not it was the opposite of what he said.

Although, with Ben, one never knows....after all, he told Locke not to blow up the submarine in order to get Locke to blow up the submarine;)

Ben's face looks the same no matter what is happening, and even if it does register some supposed shock or happiness, he has flipped things on their head so many times that you can't measure anything by it.

IMHO it really hurts the show.

I can't say I disagree.

Now I'm just confused. WTF is up with all of he Charlies? I know the one on the island in the 1950s was young Charles Widmore but who is Penny and Desmond's Charlie? Which also makes me wonder who the crash survivor's Charlie really was (is) (and now I'm wondering about the chance meeting they had when Desmond was in London looking for Daniel).

I think Penny and Desmond named their son after Charlie, since Desmond was there during Charlie's sacrifice in the underwater station.

That's what I thought.

Fun to see Widmore on the Island of the Past.

I actually think what Ben does expression wise is good. My reasoning is that he's always in control and tries to maintain that appearance. When Hurley ran out to the police, he tried to maintain the look, but I think he did a good job of having just a tinge of panic in his expression - like he was trying to hide it and just couldn't quite do it.

I think Penny and Desmond named their Charlie after Charlie, who I believe was who he said he was.

I also don't think that the meeting between Desmond and Widmore in London was by chance... and I think we're going to see that Daniel's mother is the same woman who sold Desmond the engagement ring... and that she was in Oxford but is now in LA.

But it's also what makes him such a good villan. He freaks people out by having the uncomfortable lack of readable body language.

Kinda like a ZOMBIE!! :eek:

That's what I thought but now I'm wondering if maybe little Charlie will actually turn out to be big Charlie.

Coincidences just never end up being coincidences on Lost. And seemingly logical conclusions usually end up being anything but.

Isn't Desmond too young to be Charlie Guitar's Dad ?

In real time, yes. In Lost time...nope.

I agree. I think Ben is the perfect villain.

Hey, shouldn't you be avoiding this thread? Are you guys getting the new season the same time we are?

Might be something to that.....recall back to season 1 in the episode titled White Rabbit?

Charlie, out of breath, came running up to Jack to inform that a woman was drowning out in the ocean.....he told Jack that he could not swim.

Yet later on:

He lists, as one of the top 10 moments of his life, his father(who wasn't Desmond btw)* teaching him how to swim.

He has no problem swimming down to the underwater station.

Maybe what we are viewing of our Islanders is not a single Time-line but several.....which would not only explain how Charlie could Swim in Season 3 but not in Season 1. It could explain lots of things actually; like how the sound of the smoke monster seems familier to Rose or how Sawyer, after getting back from Prison Island had no recollection of Nikki and Paulo.

*Although, it has been reported that just before Charlie leaps into the pool a childs voice can be heard in the background saying "C'mon Desmond, C'mon".....don't know if that means anything or not

I'll have to remember that if I ever write plot holes into my stories I can blame it on "several time-lines".

I do remember that episode but I didn't link A and B together. Intriguing.

Charlie's "father" (i.e. who he grew up knowing as his father) might not be his real father at all.

I'm wondering when it will click for Jack that Aaron is his nephew.

Who is the chick "Ellie" that held the gun on Daniel (when he was going to disarm the bomb) that he kept saying looked very familiar?

I think it's been established in the flash-forwards that Jack knows Claire is his half-sister, so I'm pretty sure he knows Aaron is his nephew.

Maybe......it turned out Kate's step-father was her biological father and her real dad was just some guy......so who knows;)

His mom I bet:eek:

Farday's his own dad! Faraday's his own dad!

May not be safe for work(F-word is shouted towards the beginning, otherwise it' ok)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yk6Ay...eature=related

:eek:

[sings] I'm my own Grandpa... Iiiiii'm my own Grandpa [/sings]

Yeah, pretty much. :)

He learned it when they first got back at his father's funeral. Well, he learned he had a half sister on the same flight named Claire. He seemingly hasn't figured it out yet or I would guess he would have used it against Kate when she refused to see him/go back to the island.

Well, that would be freaky. Even for Lost. :eek:

The woman in the coma?

That's better than my guess of, "no fvcking clue." ;)

I think Ben is trying to force Kate's hand (so she feels like the only option is to return to the island) by making her think someone has a claim to Aaron.

I'm intrigued that Sawyer calls Juliet by her name rather than using a nickname.

Apparently Jack does have a clue about Aaron being his nephew.

Holy crap!

I think it's Charlotte, the woman he said he was in love with, with all of the nose bleeds.

Interesting, especially taking into account the whole "Are you sure you have only been on the island for a short time?" exchange with freaky Asian dude.

I had a guess as to who was asking for the blood tests. My guess was Jack, being someone with a legitimate familial claim, and wanting leverage to get her to the Island. So it turned out to be Ben for the same reason, I wasn't too far off.

I've got a theory.

In last weeks show Juliet was speaking Latin with the other captives....turns out all "others" speak the ancient language.

She said Ricardus for Richard........which got me thinking; what's the latin word for Jack?

I didn't come up with this theory...

Maybe Miles is the baby shown in the premier. He isn't having nosebleeds and Daniel asked if he was sure he hadn't been on the island before.

Well, I like the idea that he might be the baby shown in the Premiere(in fact, I think there is a good chance he is since at this point in the series, with only one more season to go, they should not be introducing too many more new characters) but he Did have a nosebleed.........but that actually proves your point. Had he not had any nose bleeds than he'd be less likely to have been the baby don't you think?

Ya, you're right about the nosebleed.

How much do you want to bet that Richard has only four toes on each foot?

I'll take that bet:

If he does, I will post a 150 word essay on why I love Obama in the Grind....if he doesn't you got to post a 150 word essay on why Newt should be our next President;)

All kidding aside, I still think one of the 815'ers will lose a toe before the end of this season.

Perhaps Locke will lose it sometime while Jack and Ben are playing weekend at Bernies with his body:D

I'm totally serious. I think he’s a member (perhaps the last surviving one) of the island’s original four toed inhabitants. Here's why:

It’s been confirmed now that Richard is very old – perhaps immortal. None of the rest of the “others” has shown that trait.

He seems more connected to the island than even Ben or John.

He’s given a great deal deference by the rest of the “others” – including even Ben. Hell, sometimes Ben seems to be in awe of him.

That's mostly true except Ben never seemed to give him all that much deference though. On more than a few occasions he was barking orders at Richard...in fact, he showed more respect to Jack than he did to Richard imho.

Also, a young Widmore didn't seem too keen on following direct orders given to him by Richard(when told to put the gun down, Richard had to physically remove the gun from the immature Other).

Well, he is freakin' hot!

I have lusted after Nestor Carbonell since I first saw him on Suddenly Susan.

Don't really know what to say except that next week looks like it'll be fun!

Dude, Jin and Danielle, how awesome was that?!

I'd forgotten about the whole "sickness" thing, and seeing the guy point a gun at his wife and unborn child....yow. Perhaps they'd been converted to Others?

Makes me want to go back and find the moment when Danielle meets Jin in the first season. Seriously, after all that, she should recognize him.

For the first time, I decided to visit lostpedia without being linked there. Reading Danielle's page it's amazing how many tiny loose ends I'd forgotten about, and how they did refer to things she said in the first season with this 1988 flashback.

So now I'm guessing that the "Other" woman in the 40s that Daniel said looked familiar is Charolette's mom.

I was right, I was right! YAY! (It's so rare that I'm right when it comes to this show, it's a wee bit exciting ;) )

Some random thoughts...

We know that Ben had contained Smoky in their camp.
What is this "temple" that Robert was referring to that smoky is the security system for? I wonder if Locke is "sick" as well, after his encounter with Smoky.

Locke still wouldn't shoot a pregnant woman...would he??

I love how they got around Locke's promise to Jin. Hooray loopholes!

Odd that Rousseau never seems to recognize Jin in "present day". But then, I suppose The Crazy could be to blame for that. Or maybe they'll come up with something in a later episode to explain it (maybe she runs into C-3PO).

Or the Haitian.

"He's Korean, I'm from Encino."

Still cracks me up.

OMG, Ellie is Daniel's mom, Eloise Hawking (pre-Ben)! That's why Daniel said his mother can help save Charlotte-- because she knows how to find the island. Holy crap this gets confusing...I love it!

I think that also points to what JWB was getting at, I think Richard is the puppet master (since he controlled the "Others" when Eloise was there and obviously, IMO, is the one who carries the secrets of the island, like how to get on and off of it).

Right now, my 2 candidates for Jacob are Richard or Jack.



On another note, something that's been bothering me...

We were told (more or less) that Oceanic 815 was brought down because of the magnetic field generated when Desmond was late punching in the numbers at the Swan station, right? BUT, obviously, there was some reason that flight was brought down otherwise, what with all of the people linked together and with the island....So, which is it? Or was that just a plot device that had no real meaning (which doesn't happen very often on Lost)? I mean, if the island wanted them all there, couldn't it have just made the plane crash (like by generating a magnetic field on it's own without needing the intercession of a human)?

I've been wondering a lot more about Daniel (not sleeping+obsessing). He's an original other, i.e. his mother was there before Dharma ever was and didn't Charlotte say that the man who told her never to come back was old (before she said it was him)? Also, Daniel has to be much older (if indeed Ellie and Eloise are the same people). If the flash to the bomb was, say, 1945, Ellie was about 25ish? Daniel would likely have been born before she was forty, so 1960 or so. He would have to be about 45 or 50. I don't know what, or if this means anything though.

I also think that "original" others can come and go as they please and time jump without ill effect but I wonder if they shift between "times" instead of actually traveling. In other words, they are making parallel time jumps when they appear in say, California, rather than linear ones. How else could they get off of the island and to the U.S. before outsiders came (like when Locke was a child)?

Didn't Ben tell Danielle to take Alex "to the temple" in the episode where the mercenaries killed them? WTF is in that temple?

Also, how did Charlotte know to "look for the well" if the Lotus station wasn't there? Someone in the comments section on E! online that when Locke fell, the well closed up and Christian Shepard appeared, it was like Locke descended into Hades.

Which as an aside, someone else thought Christian Shepard's name was a description of Jesus.

Richard doesn't age, I don't recall seeing any other "old" Others. What's to say Daniel is aging?

Maybe Ellie is also Charlotte's mother?

Daniel and Charlotte could be twins separated at birth to protect them from Richard (who's really the father). Daniel was raised by his uncle on a moisture farm while his sister was raised by royalty on Alderaan.

Richard: Search your feelings Dan. You know it to be true.
Daniel: No! That's not true! That's impossible!

Whoa...sorry. Head rush.

I just watched it twice yesterday. Things are really fun this season.

What if Whitmore is Daniel/Charolette's dad!

Richard told Locke the year, it was 1954.

Then he'd have to be at least about 44. I dunno, I just think he's an "pure" Other, not a Mudblood.

Jack.....remember Juliet speaking Latin? She called Richard, Ricardus. If Richard equals Ricardus then Jacob would equal Jacobus....or Jack-obus:eek:





Try using circular logic and the answer will become obvious.

Remember, Daniel has already told us that Time is like a Record player(and we've seen on numerous occasions thru-out this series hints to that as well).

So you see; the reason they are linked together is that they crashed on the Island and the reason they crashed together on the Island is that they are linked together.

Don't try to think in a straight line......you'll end up with a nose bleed;)

Oooo, the plotus thickenus.





I tend to think that they are approaching time from a string theory or parallel universe perspective. Nonetheless, I hadn't thought about the crash in that way.

I'm beginning to wonder if the island is where all "whens" that exist concurrently collide.

I saw Naveen Andrews today riding a bike around the Kahala Mall parking lot today. I thought about taking a picture but I thought that would be so cheesy to do.

Naveen Andrews is totally hot!

I love the Kahala area and have been to that mall several times (in fact, when I forgot to pack my dress to change into after my wedding, I frantically searched the Kahala Mall for a replacement)...where in Honolulu is your home?

Kailua
:)

Yes, Jumping on top of him and gyrating would have been much better... :evil:

Lucky butt. ;)
(Isn't that where Lost mostly films?)

I'm always one season behind on Lost. When it starts to air, it's just a reminder to me to catch the prior season on DVD.


So I'm only halfway through Season 4 and I'm thinking of stopping with Season 4. It's just seeming like a random bunch of stuff thrown at you to keep things going rather pointlessly.


I think I'm going to hold off watching any more seasons until the show ends. I want there to be an end in sight.

Stick with it. Your patience will be rewarded.

iSm... I urge you not to hold off. Starting around midway through season 2, I began to wonder whether there was any resolution coming. I was concerned that they were going into X-Files territory, with lots of twisty plot threads that would ultimately be unresolved.

Turns out that I was partly right. But now it's OK. From Entertainment Weekly:
They're answering questions now. And this could be the best season since the first... if you're a sci-fi geek.

iSm, I too urge you to keep watching.

They were supposed to be on a 5 year plan from the start, which is one of the only reasons I plodded through the frustrating seasons. I believe this is season 5, and they have been answering questions since the start.

My wife is not a sci-fi geek and is losing her interest. I am a closet sci-fi geek, so I'm finding it really cool. The thing is you can't pick it up now without having seen the earlier episodes from the season. It's hard enough to know what's going on if you HAVE seen the episodes from this season thus far.

AS far as the plan, 5 season was it, but the writes strike forced them to split those 48 episodes from what would have been season 4 and 5 into 3 16 episode seasons.

That's right. But the general idea is still there; there is an end in site.

The Sci-Fi geek in me loved the season 4 episode I left off with (The Constant), which was a great stand-alone sci-fi concept story. The other four eps so far were just stuff thrown at you, and new characters thrown in seemingly just to fill air time with more available backstories.

I'll finish Season 4, since I started it. But if Season 5 ends without the series ending, I will not be watching any more seasons until the series bloody well ends!


Twin Peaks and X-Files were two shows I LOVED that led nowhere despite pretentions to the contrary. Won'T Be fOOleD AgAIn!

As was said, season 5 will end without an ending. Next season is the pre-ordained season end. So while there is no closure yet, there is a firm promise of closure.

Ok, well since I wouldn't be starting Season 5 till Season 6 begins, it should be pretty well known by then if that's gonna be Season Last of Lost.

Twin Peaks is nothing like Lost....I mean, yeah, they both have Characters named Cooper......



and Hurley



and Desmond


and Sarah


and Benjamin


and Annie


and Bernard


But that's it........Lost has the Black Rock which is clearly different from the Black Lodge.....

And a one eyed man is nothing like a bar called One Eye Jacks....

And even though Lost has a guy named Jacob who is obsessed with an Island and TP has a guy named Jacoby who is obsessed with an Island doesn't mean the shows are similar....

And I really don't want to have to get into the differences between dwarves and hobbits....at least I shouldn't have to:D


;)

Actually, Iacobi (hence Jacob) is Latin for James.

Seeing Hurley carrying a guitar case, my money is on Charlie coming back to tell him to catch the plane.

Jack said, "It's weird, I almost think John needed me to read this." Weird? WEIRD?! Two word. SMOKE MONSTER! Jack, you are no longer allowed to call something "weird".

I'm thinking that the flight crew on that plane are freaking out over several people (and a body) vanishing in mid flight. :cool:

So many questions, though.

But have they really vanished from the flight? Or are they on the plane and on the island?

I want next week's episode now!

Just popping in to let you know tonights episode in Australia was the one discussed up to and including post 102 (ie: The one where Hurley surrenders to the police and the whiny sh!t cops a flaming arrow in the chest.)

If they remain consistent with previous instances of time travel, they vanished.

Hey, you're not far behind - awesome! :)

Remember how when they crashed the first time, Jack kept seeing his dad walking around? Well now that Locke is playing the dead guy, I'd bet money that we'll see him up and around again, being all spooky and distant.

Some great twists in that one. Sayiid being brought on as a prisoner, Kate style. The copter guy showing up with the best line in the show. When the pilot says "We're not going to Guam, are we?" you know you're in trouble. :D

Can't wait for the tearful Sun and Jin reunion!

I wonder if "the light" only took those who were on the island to begin with. It's to late to introduce more characters.

The shots of the one other dude in first class (the guy who gave his condolences to Jack at the ticketing counter) were suspicious. If he does show up on the island, I'm sure it'll be because he'd already been there before.

I agree.

I don't have season 1, but was there someone at the airport who gave condolences to Jack then too?

Well, there was Ana-Lucia.

"New shoes"

As in James Sawyer?

:eek:

:snap:

I LOVE Frank. I've long loved Jeff Fahey, so that's probably why. Did miss his scraggly beard and crazy hair, though. Yes, I did.

So...Penny. Dead or alive? I'm hoping we at least get a flashback because that was one HELL of a fight she put up, if she and Ben went one-on-one. Perhaps Desmond was involved, too.

If she's dead...and I'm assuming she is...poor Desmond. Then again, Ben looked pretty damn whipped. Hmm.

I wonder how pissed Jin is going to be when he sees Sun. No baby Sun.

I'm guessing Baby Sun and Baby Claire are somewhere being toddlers together, but who knows?

Oh yeah, messed up Ben. Hmm. Was Desmond in the cargo hold or something?

With Baby Desmond, maybe. It's like there's a LOST orphanage somewhere.

Did I totally miss where they said Penny beat the crap out of Ben?

Also, they have been time traveling all over, and no one else has reverted in their age. What makes you think that Sun, Claire and Desmond would? Or are you referring to their kids?

No, that's my assumption. Ben told the gang that he had a promise to fulfill. (Presumably that refers to when Ben promised Widmore that he would kill Widmore's daughter (Penny), in retaliation for Widmore killing Ben's.) Penny was safe so long as she couldn't be found, but Desmond showing up would alert Ben to her whereabouts; he'd simply have to find the right dock.

So...I assume he found her and killed her. Though it looks like she (or Desmond, or both) put up quite the fight.

And, I'm talking about their kids. Sun left her baby behind. Kate left Aaron. I am guessing that they kept the children together, but I'm possibly way wrong about that.

Excellent point re: Ben and Penny, Eliza

Oooo!!!!!!! I completely forgot about that promise. That makes complete sense.

Oh, that's who the pilot is! The chopper pilot, Frank! I thought I should know who that was, but didn't recognise him.

I'm loving the one-liners.

Last week "He's Korean, I'm from Encino"
This week "We're not going to Guam, are we?"

I hope they keep them up.

But that's only with people actually on the island. What happens if you time travel to the island?

I meant to point out earlier that Locke is an example of this...he is dead in the real world and alive on the island. Both places at one time (well, really 3 years apart, but time isn't moving at a parallel pace). Granted, the circumstances are different but I think it is clear that TPTB's version of "time" travel allows for a person to be in more than one reality (place and/or time). That's part of what I meant earlier when I wondered whether the Others who "left" the island (and then returned) didn't actually just inhabit 2 different realities at the same time.

On the podcast, Darlton said that 316 and the next episode are actually shown out of numbered sequence, so apparently they decided that it would be more interesting to see the effects before the cause(s).

Anyone else watching Fringe? I'm enjoying the little Lost references that are included there, although I have probably missed some. I'll have to find some geeky fan site that tracks them all. :p

During season 3 Kate and Sawyer were working on what we later learned from Juliet was a landing strip.......

Could the plane have landed on the Island(well, the other Island actually) after the O-6 vanished?

The plane was in the Island's airspace. It's like how Jin was blown off the ship then time traveled in the water. The island has a blast zone.

As for how they got from the plane to the land, my assumption would be that you never materialize in time in mid air - though they had it much better than Locke did in the well.

I don't think that's true at all. Locke was alive, then he left the island, and now he's dead. We were seeing it simultaneously because everything on the island was a flashback to just after the 6 left. That's why, now that they're back, they find Jin in a new circumstance, driving a Dharma van, because he's been living on the island for 3 years since they left.

If the Island has always been traveling through time like Eloise Hawking said, how is it that the freighter could stay parked outside of the Island's "blast zone" and venture to it any time they pleased—bearing 300º or not?

She said they were able to predict the when and where it would be, and that it was in a spot for a window, and that this current window was about to close. The island isn't constantly moving, it's still for a bit, then moves, then still, then moves. Remember all the talk about "moving the island"?

I think the island was jumping more because Ben had moved it, but the donkey wheel was off. When they stabilized it the island was more stable in time.

I don't think the island has always been moving through time. It has been moving from location to location. Her words (paraphrased...but I watched it 3 times yesterday so I might be close), "Instead of trying to discover where the island is supposed to be, they found a way to locate where it's going to be...in time." She emphasized "time" which makes it sound like it is time traveling always. But I think it actually means they can predict the where and when. As in, "the island will be located at these exact coordinates at this exact time."

Yes. I haven't gone crazy trying to identify them, because I know there really just referenced for the sake of fandom, and don't really impact the plot of either show. Do think it's a cool that both shows exist in basically the same verse.

I tried to watch it, and like it. I really did. But Olivia's voice annoyed the holy crap out of me.

But that doesn't negate the idea that they can occupy 2 different realities (times/places) at the same time.

I've always had the impression that time moves much more slowly on the island than it does off of the island. I don't remember them ever insinuating or showing that they were just leaving out 2 9/10 years on the island. Jack stated that Locke came to him and Kate a couple of months ago (In There's no Place Like Home), not a couple of years ago.

Hello again from the guy who's always one season behind.

So the 4th season picked up nicely. I'll even buy the excuse of the writer's strike for not being able to develop the characters they added. And the season got better and better as it went along.


So now I don't feel like waiting a whole 'nuther year to catch up. Are season 5 episodes available online anywhere??

Where do you see evidence of that idea?

I'm also still standing by my feeling that I think they are skipping through time based on a parallel universe or multiverse theory, both of which postulate that all times exist concurrently and moving through time would not be skipping forward or backward linearly but moving from one already existing world (not constrained by time) to another. The most reasonable mode of travel between universes on the show, IMO (based on what I've seen) would be through wormholes (which, while not general referred to in most multiverse theories, does provide a means of travel which is not rejected in the theory). In this scenario, one would in effect, exist in two places at one time since the person entering the wormhole would only "appear" to be gone for an infinitesimally small fraction of a second to the people observing (ala the movie Contact). This would also explain why "windows are only open for a finite period of time" (as Eloise stated) since one end of a traversable wormhole in physics is generally regarded as being "accelerated" or to have a higher gravitational field than the other end, i.e. are not stationary. This allows for time at the exit to have moved at a slower pace than time at the entrance (although time within the wormhole would seem to move at a consistent pace).

I once heard someone describe parallel universes as "we are all living and all dying at all times"; in other words, we are, in effect, immortal. One of the guys that writes the show said in an interview that their concept of time travel was rooted in a scientifically accepted theory.

But that's completely inconsistent with Rousseau's account of Jin disappearing when the flash happened.

The "windows are only open for a finite period of time" because the island moves. The room with pendulum tells them, "during the period of time between x & y, the island will be in this location. After time y, the island will move and we don't know where it will be." It has nothing to do with time travel. There has been nothing that says the island itself travels in time, it seems to be moving in space instead.

ABC.com.

I think Lost is probably the one show you don't have to worry about ending abruptly. The small revolt from Jericho viewers will look like child's play compared to the revolt from Lost viewers if they randomly pull the plug.

Not necessarily. Insofar as I know, the people moving through time on the island are only moving through the past. I have never read anything in this theory (although granted, my knowledge is limited to a layman's study) that says people in the past would experience a time/space traveler as a permanent fixture. In my understanding, all times/spaces already exist as do the people and things in them. Someone moving from their own current universe would only occupy another immutable universe for a fixed period of time before moving on to another, or back to their own universe. I also accept the idea that even if this is the overriding theory that they are using, they are not above tweaking it for their purposes.

Parallel universes/multiverses allows for space/time travel. It is still, technically time travel because all times (and places in time) exist at once, including all possible current times. In this theory, the island's movement through space would be the island moving between many possible current times.

As an aside, if you remember at the Orchid station, on the instruction tape, Marvin Candle said the station sat on a store of "exotic matter". Morris-Thorne wormholes are postulated to be held open (or stable) by a form of "exotic matter".

IMHO, you're adding an extra crunchy layer which the show doesn't have any real evidence of, and doesn't answer any questions. Sure, all things are possible. But why try to make it more complicated? ;)

I just got all caught up on Fringe and I haven't caught a single Lost reference. Can you give me some examples?

The only one I've caught was an Oceanic Airlines ticket that was in someone's apartment. There are apparently a lot more.

I just found a LostPedia entry that tries to flesh out the overlaps between Lost and Fringe. Other than the Oceanic Airline ticket and shared cast, everything else is really a stretch.

It's my understanding that Oceanic Airlines is not unique to Lost.

I think both there's a link to Lost's time/space focus and the emerging multiverse focus on Fringe. The evidence connecting the shows may be thin, but the writers/producers have basically confirmed that both shows are playing around in the same universe, however different they are doing so. The "science" of Fringe resembles some of the "science" explored by the Dharma Initiative on Lost. I don't think there are plans to do crossover events or anything similarly obvious or extreme. Seems more a nod to the uber fans of both shows than anything else.

Apparently I need to check out Fringe. I'm not surprised, I'm always behind on these things.

Because I otherwise find Lost to be rather simplistic and boring. ;)

Okay, time passage is warped on the island vs. off (which now that I think about it follows from the episode where Faraday was shooting rockets off the island). So that covers the 3 year discrepancy.

Now, is it just Ben and John who don't time travel or is it the fact that one was severely injured and the other dead?

Does anyone remember how Locke came to know of Ell=oise Hawking?

Wow, this may be the first time that I actually predicted something on this show correctly....though he isn't spooky and distant. CLOSE ENOUGH!

I mentioned on twitter I'd elaborate more here..

I really didn't like how they showed Ben killing Locke. I know it was necessary so there were "no questions" but it still bothered me. I think they could have cut away more and then show the scene where Ben was cleaning up then Locke hanging. But that's my personal preference.

I just presumed that someone who spoke with him (Richard, or Christian) told him at a moment that we didn't see on camera.

I think Ben and John left the island under different circumstances than the Oceanic survivors, and so had to return the old fashioned way? Meaning, they had to crush. That's my guess.

I would also guess that Widmore provided Locke with a file on Hawking. Since Widmore knew about her and her whereabouts (him being the one who informed Desmond.)

I am curious to know if Ben was actually doing Locke a favor. Perhaps a suicide cannot resurrect? And I do think Locke is resurrected - not an Island ghost. I think he's alive. The van where he was being stored (by Ben) anagrams to Resurrection, which is different than what Christian, Charlie, and other deaders are like. I also suspect that Christian was always a part of the island...

Ben took care of Locke's body for a reason. Then again, he killed him just as soon as Locke revealed Hawking's whereabouts, so it's just as possible that Ben's only intention was to keep Locke alive long enough to get what he needed from him. Ah, Ben and Widmore. Both seem to have the island's best interests at heart (? - or not), but both are bad mother****ers.

I think that's because he's resurrected, not a ghost. He's very likely flesh and blood, those he has yet to physically interact with anyone so it's not a proven theory.

To crush? I don't understand. What are they crushing?

Crash.

Ah, sorry. I thought it might have been a typo but I couldn't figure it out.

I should have though because that was a pretty easy one. <smacks forehead>

No, best to check with me. Heh. My brain very frequently takes the word I want to use and replaces it with something totally random and unrelated. I figure I've had a stroke I don't know about.

Hmm, to shoot holes in some of my earlier musings, a friend pointed out that Christian's body was also missing after the plane crashed. And he's able to hold baby Aaron, so he can be corporeal. Hmm, hmm, hmm.

GD, I would assume Daniel told Locke about his mother since they were all together before Locke went back. Daniel seems to know that his mother knows how to get to the island. (Although I suppose Widmore could have also told him since he obviously knows where Eloise is.)

I'm curious why Ben seemed genuinely interested in helping Locke until Locke said he knew about Eloise Hawking then BAM!

Either Ben's reason for killing Locke was metaphysical (a suicide couldn't resurrect, perhaps) or he needed information from him before he could die. Since he killed Ben right after he mentioned Hawking's whereabouts, I'd wager that's the information he needed.

It seemed less that he was waiting for the right moment to kill Locke, and more like a sudden change of plan upon learning that Locke knew of Eloise. For some reason, Ben really didn't want Locke to find her. I mean, when we see Ben and Eloise together later, there's no hint of, "Damnit, how did HE find me?" She seems perfectly fine with Ben knowing where she is.

That's why I'm so interested to figure out how Locke found out about her. Who gave him knowledge that Ben didn't want him to have?

Christian gave Locke her name right before Locke left the island. My guess is "dude from Fringe" gave Locke her whereabouts.

I'm sorry, I continue to not understand why he wouldn't have acquired that knowledge from Widmore. Widmore knew about Hawkings. I assume he supplied Locke with her file, same as the rest.

And that's a good point about Ben not wanting Locke to know about her. That further makes me think it was Widmore who supplied the information.

What is this war the speak of?

You think it's a Ben vs. Whidmore type of thing?

See Steph's quote below. I thought I remembered that much, wanted confirmation.
Dude from Fringe? I'm not watching Fringe, so no idea who that might be. Is it the now-dead driver?

It was either Ben or Widmore who mentioned a coming war on the island to Locke, and that he should be on the "right side".

Yes, the driver.


Widmore said it. The simple answer is that he means a war between him and Ben. On the other hand, nothing on Lost is ever simple.

How does Sun "know" Ben killed Jin?

Only Locke would know this and Locke never talked to Sun.

I think this is VERY important.

Especially given the fact that the second to last thing Locke told Ben before Ben strangled him was the news that Jin was still alive.

I am just about to record tonights episode (as it's 10:30PM and we can't stay up that late to watch it...)

Here's what we're seeing:




10.30pm – 11.30pm
Lost (M)

The Little Prince

Kate discovers that someone knows the secret of Aaron's true parental lineage. Meanwhile, the dramatic shifts through time are placing the lives of the remaining island survivors at risk.

I don't get to see the episode tonight. Our local station is experiencing technical difficulties. Sigh. online tomorrow, I suppose - at least ABC makes them available relatively quickly.

YAY, Sawyer and Juliet!!!

I was happy to see that Sawyer got himself some peace during the 3 years - even if I still cannot stand the actress who plays Juliet.

I LOVED the end of this episode and cannot wait until next week. What a great season this is!

New theory. Ben was injured in the crash. Everyone else (that we've seen so far) was magically transported to the island completely unharmed (and in Locke's case, rejuvenated). This means the island hates Ben, Ben is truly evil, and destined to lose. This does not vindicate Widmore though. I hope both of them go down.

Also, The O6 ended up in 1977 with Saywer (excuse me... "LaFleur") et al. Ben and Locke did not. Interesting.

I figured that much out last week. There's no way Jin arrives in a pristine VW bus and a pristine Dharma jumpsuit unless they are back in time.

Though now that I think about it, my initial theory that being sufficiently injured prevents you from time traveling is shaky, what with Jin bouncing around while unconscious. So there's got to be some other explanation for Ben not making the jump.

Of course, we only know about Kate, Hurley, and Jack. No telling yet where Sun and Sayid are. Am I missing anyone else from the plane?

We don't know for sure that Ben didn't make it. Maybe he's with Sun and Sayid.

We saw Ben last episode. He's unconscious with the injured from flight 316. Locke: "He's the man who killed me."

Oh ya.


Did anyone else catch the name of the woman who gave birth? Pretty sure it was Annie (and what else has that actress been in? It's driving me crazy!)

Amy.

Reiko Aylesworth
(she's been on 24)

So Lostpedia reminded me of some stuff about Horace. I remembered that we'd seen him before in the episode(s?) about Ben's arrival on the island, and the purge and all that. I'd forgotten that he was the one who built Jacob's cabin and whose corpse had the blueprints for said cabin.

Wait, when we see Locke with the New Plane people, they are on the beach, with the canoes. I'm totally lost as to when we saw the canoes there before, timewise, but it's definitely not post-Losties camp. Seems to me the New Plane and Locke are there in 1977, same as the O6, just on the beach side of the island (which we know is far from the Dharma compound).

Locke, Ben, and the rest of the flight 316 are at the Hydra station – the same station Jack was being held at by the Others, and where he operated on Ben. In 1977, this station was (relatively) brand new, and was still fully staffed by DI (and polar bears!). In the scenes with the 316ers, it has obviously been abandoned and looks even more rundown than when the Others were using it. Ergo, the 316ers landed on the Island in “current” time – late 2007/early 2008.

It was in the episode when Sawyer saw Kate and Claire when Claire was giving birth. Remember, they walked back to beach and it was all wrecked and there were a couple of canoes with an Ajira Airways water bottle. They took the canoes part of the way to the Orchid station and got shot at from another canoe.

Looking on IMDB, it was the 4th episode this season, "The Little Prince"

eta: Since it was when they were still time jumping, it was a post Losties camp, we just didn't know (at the time) that it was the Ajira camp...we just assumed it was the Oceanic camp that had been trashed (or at least I did). And personally, I think Locke (and Ben) are current time, as is the Ajira camp.

A review I just read got me thinking (it was about how various seasons seem to be the yin/yang of each other)...and I may be on a totally wrong path...but does Milton's Paradise Lost and Paradise Regained resonate with anyone else? I don't want to really flesh out my thoughts yet since neither book is fresh enough in my mind.

Synopsis:

Here.

And here.

There are so many interweaving references - literary and otherwise - in this show. I have no doubt that Milton is one of them.

There are officially too many things for me to remember. :)

Ken's become quite the Lost philosopher, almost as much as he is on LOTR stuff. I keep trying to get him to post in this thread, but he still hasn't. :(

I found this, and it made me giggle...

^Excellent:snap:

A friend pointed out to me that both Ben and John touched the donkey wheel. Maybe that has something to do with them staying in "real" time...?

Aha! That's what they have in common. Good call.

They have several things in common.

Yes, but that's something A) that they have in common B) that the 5 who DID time travel don't share and C) is linked directly to getting on/off the island. Definitely the best candidate I've seen so far for why the other 5 would time travel but not them.

The O5 were not supposed to leave The Island. Ben and Locke were.

If Locke was in "current time" when he was in NYC, it wasn't late 2007/early 2008. NY got rid of the Statue of Liberty license plates in 2001.

Then that was an editorial mistake/decision because that is the correct timeline as presented (crashed in '05, 3 years passed).

I'm still hoping they tie everything back into a semi-plausible, practical explanation, not just a hand-waving "the Island wants it" mumbo jumbo explanation. I don't expect anything to be scientifically sound or anything, but I won't be particularly satisfied if it all boils down to mysticism. As such, there needs to be a functional difference between those that time travel and those that don't, beyond "supposed to".

Yes, it was a production error. They happen.

And sorry GD... Crashed 9/22/04. Ben, Desmond, & O6 left Island 12/30/04.

Just checked Lostpedia. Best guesstimate is 316 crashed sometime in January 2008.

Who said anything about mystical mumbo-jumbo? I just said that they were not supposed to leave.

Yes, but "not supposed to" isn't enough to explain why the flash didn't cause them to time travel. There has to be a physical difference between them and those that do time travel. Specifically, a physical difference that they both share, and that happened to Locke some time between the time he was on the island before and when he got back (since he USED to travel in time with the flashes). Leaving the island by turning the wheel fits the bill perfectly.

I'm sure that having turned the wheel has something to do with it; but perhaps there is an intelligence at work in this. We still do not know who (or what) Jacob is, and how much control over what happens on (and off) the Island that he has.

There must be. The points in time they would jump to with each flash seem a little more than random. It's almost like Lock or someone else in the group needed to be in some of those points in time for some purpose and that the island (or some intelligence as you say) put them there.

If the series ends with "It all happened because the Island/some intelligent entity wanted it to happen like that" without some explanation of a mechanism as to HOW said intelligence accomplished it, I will be displeased.

Unfortunately I think there are some questions we're just not going to get answers to. The smoke monster being one of them.

We know Smokey is a security system and is somehow tied to the temple. We may even get more information about the origin, purpose, who or what is controlling it, etc. But I doubt we'll ever know exactly what it is. It's just magic smoke that makes a mechanical noise and I don't think it's ever going to be explained as anything more than that.

The donkey wheel. How does it work and what's with the freezing environment?

I don't think the numbers or the true purpose of entering them every 108 minutes will ever be revealed in any more detail than we already have.

J.J. Abrams has made it known that he likes unopened boxes of mystery. He got the ball rolling in that direction.

I don't expect, or want, every question answered. As long as we're left with some semblance of a sensible universe that this happened in that allows for us viewers to fill in the blanks ourselves, and not just a bunch of "It was fate to happen" hand waving.

I agree - although I would like more info on the smoke monster in particular. I don't need a blueprint or anything - but I want more then it's a "security system" made of smoke that sounds mechanical and appears to "look" at you.

This is the shows oldest mystery and the one that hooked so many people to the show........it's one thing to not answer a question like this in a short 2 hour movie(Cloverfield for example); the audience has not invested a lot of time and dare I say....emotion in the answer. To not answer this one satisfactorily would be a huge slap in the face.



I rate this as a mid-level type question....I am curious and want to know the answer but I wouldn't consider it a deal breaker if they didn't address it further.

I think the reasons given as to why they needed to enter numbers every 108 minutes has been sufficiently addressed.....but as to why those specific numbers and how they are connected to Hurley winning the Lottery we'll probably never get any more answers.

Because the unopened box, no matter how infuriating, frustrating, and maddening it can be is always less lame than the opened one;)

I just realized that Frank Lapidus (the pilot) didn't touch the donkey wheel either....

I despise open endings. It's the main reason I did not like Cloverfield. I wanted (still do) to know what that stupid thing was, where it came from, yadda yadda yadda.

I'm really trying to prepare myself for an open ending to Lost, to not expect answers to the smoke monster*, beyond what we know. To the numbers, beyond what we know, to why polar bears were on the island and those who touch the donkey wheel end up in Tunisia. But I'm still gonna be annoyed.

We know that smokey can be controlled by Ben and is a security system to the temple. But what is the temple?

I've been catching some of the reruns on Sci-Fi during the day and it's hard to remember what has and hasn't been answered yet. Right now Kate and Sawyer are being held captive and Mr. Friendly just came out.

Oh, that reminds me! I'm assuming the temple is connected to the giant idol we saw briefly this last episode. How awesome was THAT?!

I would be shocked if they don't give a little bit more insight into the #'s and smokey. Even if the answer to the numbers is something as simple as, "Those are the intervals that the time jumps happen on, so we use them as easy reference points," or even, "They don't 'mean' squat on their own, we just planted them to f*ck with Hurley." As long as it's something. As sleepy said, those were the 2 key mysteries that the show was built around, it would be ludicrous/lazy to just ignore them.

I don't expect them to lay out a technical blueprint of the donkey wheel, but I do expect we'll know more about exactly what it means to "move the island".

They appear so much.

I do wonder if the numbers are the intervals the time jumps happen. I'm not patient enough to go back and watch prior episodes, but did it did seem that the pauses between jumps got longer, then shorter as time went by?

Didn't they already reveal that they were brought by DHARMA for genetic and learning experiments?



I can't believe that they won't explain the numbers since they have been such a big part of the mythology of the show.

My theory is that the numbers are just self referential. Let's see if I can explain:

Hurley uses the numbers and wins the lottery. Bad things happen to him so he begins to believe the numbers are cursed. (We keep seeing the numbers pop up everywhere but that's just coincidental or people see what they want to see or the producers are messing with our heads.) He goes to Australia and ends up on the island where he finds the numbers marked on the outside of the hatch and are being used as a code to reset the 108 minute clock.

Hurley goes back in time to 1974. "The incident" occurs requiring them to enter numbers into a computer to reset a 108 minute clock. Hurley chooses to use the cursed number sequence because he was "supposed to." (This is an unchangeable time line, not the Back To The Future type of time line.) In order to keep the number sequence available for all generations to use he etches it on the outside of the hatch and records it to tape to be broadcast by radio (that sounded an awful lot like Hurley's voice on the transmission the Frenchies picked up).

Hurley's friend from the mental institution (can't remember his name) hear's the numbers on the radio broadcast. Something eventually causes him to go insane (possibly number and/or island related). He goes to the loony bin constantly repeating those numbers. Hurley uses the numbers and wins the lottery.

:snap: :snap: :snap:

I think you've got it..........once you learn how to think in a circle this show is a lot easier to understand...:cheers:

I'm listening to the Lost Podcast w/ Jay & Jack (show 4.16). I've attached an interesting side-by-side comparison that a caller mentioned on the podcast. On the left is Ramses II. On the right is the statue from Lost.

Hmmm... And ol' Ramses's legs are broken off right about where the 4 toed statue was broken....

When did we see the full statue?

There is so much to remember! :(

After John fell down the well. In the first episode that we saw that happen, they showed Sawyer holding the rope, coming out of solid ground, then they cut away. Then they showed the scene again in the next episode (or was there an episode in between?), this time, instead of cutting away, we see them look up and see the statue. Then they flash immediately (I think that's the last flash).

So I'm reading a biography of Timothy Leary. There are a lot of names in it, I'm pretty bad at retaining names when I'm reading biographies. So when I reached the period in Leary's life when he became a faculty member of Harvard's psychology department, I assumed the familiar name of a fellow faculty member and ally to Leary through his controversial psychedelics experiments was someone from earlier in Leary's life that I had forgotten about.

It took me about 50 pages for it to click.

Richard Alpert.

Interestingly, the real Alpert went on to become a spiritual leader, known as Baba Ram Dass, and taught, among several other things, Buddhism. With the show's many other references to Buddhism, I don't suppose that's mere coincidence, though I assume it's more simply a clever nod and doesn't imply that the character has any actual relation to the real Alpert.

Ram Dass was also apparently the inspiration for the roller skating guru disguise in Fletch.

I wonder how many toes Richard has.

Holy crap, I think Pirate Bill figured it out. :eek:

Now STOP THAT, I want the series to be a surprise. :p

The decorative carving doesn't match up. Also, I don't believe that Ramses II was depicted with hair in the statue you've pictured. (nor does Rameses have pointed, doglike ears)



I think a better choice for the statue (which appears to have pointed ears) is Anubus, one of the Egyptian gods of the afterlife whose specific role was to watch over the dead and guide lost souls on their trip to the afterlife. Anubus is half human/half jackel (which would also explain the 4 toes) and carries a flail, which the statue appears to be holding in his right hand.

And how about this (which I just thought of while typing):

What if the island is the Egyptian afterlife and the Others are, in fact dead, ancient Egyptians (which would explain why they don't age; they are whatever age they were when they died-- it would also explain Richard's eyeliner)? The Egyptians considered those who reached the afterlife to be immortal. Looking up Aaru (the afterlife) on Wiki, it is often depicted as a series of islands (which I didn't remember, but hey...). Interestingly, the gates a soul has to pass through to get to the afterlife are guarded by demons (smoke monster, anyone?) There are several other Egyptian gods the statue could depict such as Bast or Mut that have pointed ears and are male (female gods generally had rounded shoulders; that said, I'm just guessing it's male) but they don't fit as well into what we know so far.

It may also explain why Ben killed Locke...so that he could be eternal leader of the Others.

Finally, I think it may explain why the Islanders can't have babies/die. In Egyptian mythology, whether or not you go to the afterlife and become eternal depends on the weight of your sins. If you have little to no sin, you go to Aaru. But what if you go to Aaru and then sin (say, by killing or purging a bunch of people)? Maybe the punishment is no babies in eternal world. As an aside, I don't remember anyone saying that the original Dharma people couldn't have babies (and as Sawyer said to Juliet, "maybe whatever made the Others unable to have babies hasn't happened yet"), we just see the 21st century Others as not able to have babies. Also a good explanation for why Claire and Sun were able to have their babies...because they weren't Others.

Now I want to go look up the hieroglyphs we've seen around the island to see if any of the symbols depict specific gods.

Hmmm...

(The Hanso Foundation was behind the original Dharma Initiative)

And before you ask, sadly I don't have anything better to do tonight...

This is likely where the idea that the statue is Ramses II came from:

Repeat!?! Booo.

Stupid March Madness.

I'm glad I watched a bit of it though. This time I noticed Amy pull something (earplugs) out of the control box of the sonic wall. I was wondering how she could have been hearing perfectly fine up until then.

I'm not necessarily sold on the Lost statue being Ramses II. I just thought it was interesting that both statues have a very similar stance and were also broken off just above the foot. Another difference between the 2 is Ramses has the left leg forward but the Lost statue appears to have the right leg forward.

However, they both seem to be about the same height, hands down to the side holding objects, facing forward with one leg in front of the other.

Another caller (in the same Lost Podcast episode) mentioned that it looks like the statue is holding an ankh (which also supports your Anubis idea). Interestingly, Amy's husband, Paul, had an ankh necklace.

Yeah, the ankh necklace plus large statue equals Egypt. Which is kind of insane. WTF, writers? WTF.

How far away is Tunisia(aka ~The exit~) from Egypt?

Well, there is a connection with Egypt and Atlantis.

I'm still set on the whole Atlantis theory. :)

Lost is an anagram of Slot. The whole show is nothing but a metaphorical representation of the programming of a modern Vegas slot machine. The numbers are the seed for the random # generator. Each plane crash or capsized boat represents a new player inserting their player's club card. What the donkey wheel represents should be obvious, I'm not going to bore you with that.

It's probably at the Luxor, thus Ramses.

Egypt was once a member of the Carthaginian Empire(Carthage is in Tunisia).

The Egyptian god of War((Charles Widmore told Locke "War is coming")) carries an ankh.

Poor Sun! They had me for a while there. The plane definitely time traveled (it went from night to day, noticed by the copilot), so they had me believing that they all were back in '77 afterall. But that just didn't make sense with the abandoned Dharma station. So now I wonder WHEN they actually are.

And, what is going to happen to Ben next. The other passengers still on that island know that Frank and Sun took the boat. Which means Ben regains consciousness and tells them. And when we saw him in the hatch/sickbay, he was in WAY worse shape than a bump on the back of his head. Someone or something messes him up good.

Good episode. The only thing I didn't like was that last conversation between Jack and Sawyer. The conflict there was forced and heavy handed. It just didn't make sense to me that the two of them would so instantly be hostile to each other. I understand it's a continuation of the power struggle theme between them, but in that situation it just didn't make sense for Jack to be such a dick. Or even for Sawyer to be so snide in response.

I'm scratching my head as to why Sun didn't warp back to 1977. What was different about her?

Yeah, there goes the donkey wheel theory.

Hmm, she's the only other one who saw Widmore in person, isn't she....

Interesting...!

Hahaha, I've just figured out where I know Caesar from. He's in I [heart] Huckabees, as the translator for the old lady singing about olive trees. Hahaha. I also remember his role in Three Kings, but Huckabees is definitely why he's familiar.

No, Lapidus, Ben, and Locke have all met Widmore..........oh, snap, they're with Sun:eek: Nice catch maybe:snap:

Nevertheless, I am thinking Sun having had a baby may have more to do with it than meeting Widmore.

Or it could just be a simple matter of the Island sending people where they need to be to obtain a desired outcome.....:confused:

Precisely, thus my use of "other".
I thought of that, but I'm still trying to think more in terms of what the ones who stayed with the plane had in common, and I'm pretty sure Locke didn't have a baby.

Could be, but even if it turns out to be someone/thing making stuff happen, I continue to hope for a more satisfying conclusion that provides some clues as to the mechanics behind it all, rather then some omniscience/omnipotence.

That's what it looks like to me. Their encounter with Christian makes it seem like they have a job to do. (Paraphrased: "You've got quite a journey ahead of you.") Are they going to somehow rescue the "Neithers"* from 1977?

*Neithers - the name my son gave to the group of Losties stuck in 1977. They're not Dharma, they're not Others, they're Neithers.

Another theory(not mine, I read it on another board) I like is based on the orchid orientation video with the rabbits: In that video Dr Candle/Chang/Hallowax freaked out when a second rabbit, identical to the one he was holding, appeared. It was more than just a "oh no, now my video is ruined" type freak out.....more like a "oh no, the world will end if they touch each other" kind of fit.

So, we know that Ben is already at Dharmaville circa 1977.........could Sun be there? We know that Widmore(an other/hostile) did have business dealings with Sun's father(could he also be an other/hostile?)

If Christian takes them to some lever and says "push this to travel back in time and save your friends" I'll be very annoyed. But...how do you travel back in time on purpose?

That poor kid who plays young Ben. Yeech. Enough with the lipstick.

It's occured to me that Sun gave her baby up to go find Jin, knowing full well she'd probably never be back. That's f'd up. Am I forgetting something there?

That scene has been bugging me a little;

1)Why would there be a torn and ragged Dharma sign hanging around in 2007? Ben and the others surely would have took it down back when they killed off Dharma......to me this suggests that something changed in the time line and the others never took over Dharmaville. Although, clearly, Dharma wasn't there so something still happened...I am stumped:confused:

2) How did Christian show Sun the picture from 1977?


He used a flashlight........:eek:

Don't know if they're in the past or the future, but I'm certain the plane and those who remained on it did travel in time, just not to 1977. Perhaps they are in a period between the purge and when the Others claimed the barracks as their own.

Or perhaps it was just a sloppy creative decision made in case it wasn't obvious where they were.

Did anyone else notice the black smoke coming in the building when Sun was talking to Christian?

Also, It would appear that Ben has always known who (at least some of) the Losties are.



Nice catch sj, so I guess we know Christian isn't Jacob. I'm still sticking with the Jack is Jacob theory.*









*Subject to change with plot twists or per my whim.

After reading E! online, who the fvck is the person behind and just to the right of Sun (right after the smoke enters) in the room where she's talking to Christian?

I'd have to see, but wouldn't that be Frank?

If they did(and I guess they must have at least a little since night did turn into day right before the crash) it couldn't be by more than a year*.....so my question as to why that Dharma stuff is still hanging around remains a valid one.



*1977 plus 30 years equals 2007....Unless we can't even trust the on screen narration

Good point. So:

1) alternate reality caused by time travel
2) for some reason there are Dharma sign still around, even though it had been Others' land for so long
3) wrong/misleading info when we're told it was 30 years ago
4) stupid production decision because they wanted to be sure it was obvious where they were.

My guess is option 4.

I fear you are probably right.

Nope, Frank is standing right next to her (on the left). There is someone (it looks like a woman) sitting in the shadows behind and to the right of Sun.

I bet it's Claire....she was last seen hanging with her Dad, no reason to be surprised she's still with him.

They need to make the episodes something more along the lines of 3 hours.


Someone on E! also mentioned Richard saying that the sonic fence couldn't keep them (the Others) out. That would fit nicely with the theory that the Others are all dead and the island is Aaru.

The Others seem to bleed a lot when shot, for being dead.

Hmmmm, good point. Maybe the ones who got shot are are Dharma people who were assimilated into the Others as Ben was and now Ethan seems to have been? (And thinking about it...it seems as though there's a better than average chance that over the years more than a few people have been shipwrecked and/or crashed on the island, survived and never got off; which also makes me wonder if we'll eventually discover Mr. Eko's brother amongst the Others or hanging out w/ Christian.)

I dunno, but if the Others can get through the fence, there must be something special about them.

They could simply know the island well enough to know ways around it.

Or have really good ear plugs.

Or under it...

So, with Ben meeting Sayid in 1977, and therefore likely to at least know who Sawyer is, I'm forming an idea. Ben somehow becomes beholden to the Losties, to where he's basically forced, once he grows up, to play things out the way they do to keep them alive and make things happen again as they've already happened. Probably not because he wants to, more of a self preservation sort of thing. Thus his pissy attitude the whole time, not wanting to save the jerks who are blackmailing him, but having no other choice.

Just a hunch.

In that same scene there is speculation that there is a woman in the background, behind Sun.


I really want to know about the Others. Why are they considered hostile? Where did they come from? Why did Richard want them killed?

What is Smoky guarding? Where was it kept when Ben let it loose last season? Where did it come from?

Probably Claire, as she was with spectre Christian before (see above).

Richard IS an other, he doesn't want them killed. They're considered hostile because they want to kill the people in Dharma because they feel it's "their" island.

I was posting and running before.

I mean why do the Others consider it "their" island.

My personal working theory is that the island is part of Aaru (the Egyptian afterlife) and the Others are dead souls who now have eternal (after)life. Hence the island is the purview of those dead souls...the Others.

I think Smokey is the guardian of the gates or temples that souls have to pass through to reach Aaru.

There is what appears to be a woman in the shadows behind Sun just as the doors fly open and tendrils of what appears to be Smokey enter the room. As to who it is, I agree with GD that it is likely Claire.

They were there first.

Well, that too. ;)

Bleh to the afterlife theory. It's a good thought, but I will be sorely disappointed if it all turns out to be afterlife.

I rewatched it last night looking for this woman in the background and saw what you are talking about. Unfortunately, I think in this case it's a production mistake. It looks like a cameraman (or camerawoman) to me.

I have Lost saved to my computer. Unfortunately I can't get a screenshot since it plays back in a video overlay. But I did blow out the brightness to try to get a better look and it definitely looks like someone leaning over a camera with the camera resting on their right forearm, in a handheld shot sort of way. Looks like he (or she) is getting the reverse shot of Christian from behind Sun but wasn't hidden well enough.

If you can find a screenshot then crank up the brightness and you'll see what I'm talking about.

As for the afterlife theory, this came up in season 1 and the writers said that it isn't. Doesn't mean that dead people aren't walking around. It just means that the island is not where the dead go.

Didn't the producers say early on that this is not "purgatory" nor are they all dead?

Ya.

They also said it's not a dream and won't end with it being in a snow globe.

Sure...crush my dreams of having figured it out. Thanks. A lot. ;)




(Thanks for the info on the woman. I wonder if they will just dismiss it as the production error it appears to be even after so many people seem to have seen it; or if they will build it into the story.)

My theory being right or wrong notwithstanding...

Aaru is not a sort of purgatory in the general sense that we think of the word. It is more of a parallel world where dead souls go to have eternal life.

Also, clearly at least some number of the people roaming the island are dead, which makes me really hope that the guitar Hurley was carrying means we get to see Charlie again.

I wonder if the people assumedly stuck in 2007, who logically should have ended up in 1977, were "dead". Maybe Frank and Sun "died" in the plane crash but were alive on the island. I get the feeling to come back to life, so to speak, you have to have been to the island before. I know this doesn't explain Ben but I think he might, for some reason, be an exception to the rule.

And yes, I think about Lost way too much.

I have a very old cassette tape I made back in college. I used it to tape lectures and when done with a class I would tape another lecture over the top....finally, I taped some music on it(Shonna Laing).

As you can imagine, after all of these years the sound on this tape is awful....you can hear whispers in the background almost all of the time and once in a while one of the whispers will come in loud and clear as if it were part of the song.

Perhaps the Island is nothing more than that piece of Scotch tape one puts on the bottom of a cassette so one can record again;)

Fvck! :eek: