POTC Johnny Refurb
 

I'm officially worried about the Pirates of the Caribbean: Johnny Depp-orama refurb.

:argghh: < Warning. Thar be spoilers ahead in the link, mateys.
:decap:

Here's a link to Al's latest article.


I know, I haven't been on it yet and there's nothing that can be done about it now... but... arrrrgh!

:argghh: < Ruined, it be?
:decap:


Also, as a side note, in the same update Al talks about the Sub refurb.

I'll officially worry once I see the ride...

I love how Al mentions the "Remember" fireworks show has been the kiss of death for so many classic Disneyland elements it featured. Nearly everything non-musical that still existed when "Remember" premiered now remains only in memory. Seems the title of the show has taken on a rather sinister double-meaning.


As for Pirates, I've never been too upset about Johnny Depp making a few appearances. It's always been about the travesty of removing the Pirate Captain's and the Auctioneer's iconic performances. It's little comfort that they are taking out the World of Motion robots and the gluttony scene when, at the same time, they are removing so much of the original acting that is the heart and soul of this attraction.


No more, "What be I offered for this winsome wench?" or "Pound 'em, lads, pound em!!"

No more, "No fear have ye of evil curses, says you ... aaarrrrhh. Properly warned ye be, says I."


Properly warned, indeed. All the pretty lights and crisp sound in all the world won't make up for what they've done to Walt Disney's masterpiece. They'll rotate in hell for this, mark well me words.

I found this part particullary amusing.

And if that doesn't work I expect they will implement regular whippings until moral improves.

I understand that Barbosa and Jack are supposed to be very life like. What about the rest of the shows "actors"? They were always charmingly cartoonish. It would seem odd to have two realistic characters and the rest not.

I had to click a link to MiceAge. . .

The beating heart is still in the attic of Mansion..

Sink the boat! :argghh:

Couldn't agree more. I read all of the spoilers and now I'm sad. :(

The good news is that it doesn’t sound like the damage is permanent. They can easily restore the ride in a few years when the movies are forgotten, and WDI and TDA come to their senses.

^ Exactly.

Actually, the one thing that worries me more than any of the stuff in Al's column is the promise by Disney that they're going to add music from the movie soundtrack. My timbers shiver at the thought.

Ohhhhh, the places I could go.

*sigh* - I don't like the sound of that, and I do mean sound. Altering the soundtrack will have a big impact on the feel of the experience, for better or for worse. But, perhaps when it comes along, I'll love it. But that worries me.

I'm awfully glad I have all the original audio tracks on that CD from the Main Street Music Shop.

SOMEONE gets to ride Pirates tonight and have dinner at BB at 50% off. PLUS, they get to stay in the area during the premier on Saturday and not be bannished to Tomorrowland.

SOMEONE is very lucky! I'm hoping to get a review of the ride tonight.

SOMEONE can kiss my jealous ass.

I know someone who ate at both Blue Bayou and Cafe Orleans yesterday (two somebodies actually) but no luck on the PotC riding.

SOMEONE sure has moved up fast in the world of Disney, and moved up fast and well as a person. I'm very GLAD for someone (and envious only of the 50% of Blue Bayou ... where I doubt I'll set fork for a good, long time).

Please tell me SacTown did not make such a temptingly expicit invitation to SOMEONE.

Is that CD still available by any chance? Or one of the original Haunted Mansion?

Sorry, all the CDs have been burned in the new fire effects on the ride.


(Actually, they are selling the Pirates CDs - including one I've not seen before - in the redesigned Pieces of Eight shop. I can just imagine Little Johnny wondering why he never heard any of that cool pirate dialogue on the ride, and how neat an attraction it might have been.)

Thanks! Hopefully still in stock when I next pass through NOS.
:iSm:

Well, SOMEONE better post a review because I'm not going to be able to ride it until September maybe. I'm dying to know what they did.
:)

I'm sure SOMEONE would love to.

Wouldn't that SOMEONE have to had signed something saying that SOMEONE won't share details of the ride yadda yadda and go through the proverbial stripsearch for cameras and recording devices including cell phones?

I also want to say I am so very proud of SOMEONE too for how far that person has come. I <3 you SOMEONE!

SOMEONE in this post is not to be confused with a general someone, or general you (or general ewe)

Crap. I shoulda known my choice of words would come back to bite me, uh, right where SOMEONE might be willing to put their lips.


I'm also very proud of SOMEONE.

I'm proud of SOMEONE, too. SOMEONE totally rocks. :)

I'm guessing I'm the only one with no idea who SOMEONE is?

I have no idea either, you're not alone.

Well, SOMEONE works for Disney, SOMEONE wants a piece of SacTown, and SOMEONE is of undetermined gender. So that narrows it down to....shoot, the whole of West Side operations and a good chunk of TDA.

You mean they don't do that already??

I'm glad there are some changes, but the idea was that the movie was based on the ride and not the other way around. I prefered that the movie had the cute tie in's to the ride and not the ride has the tie in. It's frustrating to think they'll change the classic. But then they also ruined it when they did the PC change. This at least will be BETTER not worse.

I have no issue with the idea on the surface. If it's done well, it stands to be great. My confidence that it will be done well, however, is only marginal.

In the future we will all be SOMEONE for 15 minutes

When it's my turn to be SOMEONE, I'm totally going to do me.

I can't wait to be SOMEONE! (Don't worry, Sac... you're safe)

I'm anxious to see the new AA characters. The Wicked Witch at the Great Movie Ride in Orlando ROCKS and that figure is years old. I wonder what they've come up with since then.

I don't know. Why do I have a sneaking suspicion that we're going to see skinless Country Bears wearing pirate costumes?

... and there was (Twang) Buh-luhd on the saddle, and (Twang ) buh-luhd all around..

Exactly. Rumor has it that Big Al was turned into Oogie Boogie for Haunted Mansion Holiday. And I must say, it kinda looked like poor Al.
:D

SOMEONE just grabbed my ass. Which one of you was it?

Okay, I admit it. It's me.

It's okay Steph, you don't have to cover for me.

SOMEONE said they might call tonight with a report.

SOMEONE ELSE may be riding it at this very moment!

Let's home that SOMEBODY gets a phone call soon.

I LIKE YELLING TOO! :cool:

I'm guessing that SOMEONE is Lashbear.

He flew up from down under just for the night

First words - AMAZING!

It's clean, there are 3 Captain Jack's, a Barbossa (at least one) and an amazing Davy Jones effect that I can't get any more information about (loose lips sink ships?).

They are showing the film (testing) as CMs are walking through. There are only about 500 people riding the attraction and it is a virtual walk-on. As we were speaking, they brought a giant mast-prop into the area.

But, nothing but a VERY impressed SOMEONE on the phone earlier.

Cool!

The first appearance by Captain Jack is by the "Carlos" area.

I'm looking to both the movie and the ride.


Change does not scare me!

Well, except when they had the pirates chasing the women for food.

But other than that, do a good job and change is a good thing!

~Bob

:D arrrr!

all is well. goodnight SWEETCHEEKS!

while i am uncomfortable posting details ( i really love my job) i will agree with one MC poster that says if you like the movie, it's there. if you like the original attraction, it's there.

the bayou is enhanced with a added details... example, old man's cabin front porch landing comes within inches of the ride vehicle. other details bring more life to the area.

security was tight, so no pictures.

but, after three journeys, i have the images in my mind forever.

there were CM's all over the place, hidden in the darkness, watching for shananigans.

three Jack Sparrows are in the attraction now... the first being amazingly life-like, capturing the movie character's natural movements perfectly. the details of the face make you blink at first - wondering if maybe it is the real deal.

the final jack was disappointing as the lips come nowhere close to matching the very cool monologue. but, the scene looks great.

the middle Jack has no "lines", but makes a comical appearance that i approve of.

Barbosa looks very very very much like the actor.

Davy Jones will blow your mind the first time for sure. that's all i'm willing to say.

the musical enhancements are subtle, but, for me, added alot of drama, suspense and atmosphere. do not worry about the music.

the virtual walk-on experience was a huge thrill and those of us in it had a great time in the queue. imagine a typical LoT meet in the queue, moving aLoT faster, and ten times the fun. everyone all smiles. i doubt there were more than 500 of us all together.

to my surprise, the movie began playing across the river. O M G!

saw glimpses of a few scenes and i am now incredibly excited to see the film saturday. the sound system is friggin incredible.

stayed around to ride Rockit Mtn amd see the Grad Nite firework show. very fun rope-drop ceremony!

then - on my way to the truck, all i could see was a literal sea of school buses - as far as the eye could see bringing in thousands of graduates.

i hope that you will understand why i won't post more details...but, you will enjoy the experience more without me spoiling the fun.

i am truly grateful to all the dedicated Cast and craftsmen that have worked on both the attraction and the film.


(you should see all the stuff i deleted from my post!)

ok, STC, you can roll-over now.:cool:

Awesome report! Now I'm just dying to fly out there right now!

I think my hopes are a little higher. I can't wait to see this now.
:)

Now what was that bit about SOMEONE being hot for Sac... :evil:



BTW, I'm jealous as HELL of SOMEONE. :)

Got a text message from SOMEONE ELSE (iSm's SOMEONE ELSE) last night..."I'm undecided". Well, if you've figured out who SOMEONE ELSE is, the you know that "I'm undecided" is akin to a rave review. I'm really excited now.

SOMEONE ELSE needs to post more.

Meh. That's all good but I'll hold my enthusiamsam in check until I get the real review... WWISMD is my mantra...

I LOVE you SOMEONE! Thank you hun!

I'm all a-twitter now. When are we going to the park? Huh? Huh?

Dang it! Now I'm reconsidering my winter plans of not going to DL.

You and me both!

Tonight

But it is doubtful that you will see it :p

BTW, I need to experience the ride AND the movie before the 8th, when I have a pirate-themed party to attend. So ... if anyone out there also can't freaking wait ... howza 'bout a meet-of-sorts one night next week.

(It's looking doubtful that soft openings will be happening on Sunday ... can anyone really picture that movie premier set-up being down in 12 hours?)


BTW, undecided is undecided. I don't hold that to a rave review, but I'm encouraged that it's not a total horror story.

Me three!

BTW, can anyone confirm if they took out the PC additions with the Pirates chasing the women for food?

~Bob

I saw your avatar, and then your name, and then I thought, "Captain Jack is named Bob?!" Then I noticed that you just have the same avatar he had for a while. BTD's has been confusing me too.

His Aviator is different, and if he had the same one and it is confusing, I'll make a nother. No problem there.:D

~Bob

It is good to know you had different pilots

:snark:

Welcome to ChanelSwank News.

The Stars have arrived at Disneyland and backstage is full of Limos. Johnny is giving interviews to the major press before he, and the other stars, walk down main street, thru adventureland and board the "Black Pearl" (the Columbia has been decked out). The Black Pearl will sail, with the stars on-board and will put down its gang plank so the passengers can disembark and go to the seats. The film will be shown. The Haunted Mansion and Pirates are both open for people to ride

Following the film, there will be a Pirate Ball taking place in NOS.

I'm so jealous right now.

Singing off for now.

Oh don't get me wrong. It's a good avatar, and by all means keep it. I'm just scatterbrained and anytime I see a pirate avatar I think it's capt. jack. I'm just blonde is all. :p

I can just picture you singing off. :p

This is why I love Lisa !

Not only does she hae a fine appreciation of all things Chanel, but she can sing too !

**Big Bear Hugs**

I'm watching the webcast on MSN. The video of the ride they've shown looks awesome! Depp looking at and trying to touch his AA was hilarious. :cool:

we can fix that....


presenting! Jolly Mickey

<---<<

The streaming comes over WAY too jerky for me due to my poor dsl connection :mad: - does anyone know if there's a downloadable version available instead of streaming?

Surely not everyone has a superfast connection :( ? Disney & MSN need to think a little better about this.

Yo Ho, Yo Ho, a jolly good avatar Capt. Jack!:tiki:

An angel sent me these. Don't click if you don't want to know. Spoilers ahead, spoilers ahoy! :)

i don't know anyone who has ridden it and not been happy with the changes... even the people i know who were talking **** before it opened changed their tune after riding! if anything they are indifferent to the changes and additions...

i got to ride it this morning and i must say that i am completely satisfied with everything :) i mean there really isn't anything missing from the ride... barbossa says the lines that the old captain did... the jack sparrow aa's are amazing! the davy jones effect is so crazy! the new music in the battle scene really makes it feel more adventurous... the sound quality throughout was so much clearer and easier to understand... overall it was good show...

all i have to say is ride it before you decide you hate it!

if you liked the old ride, it's still there... (really!)
if you wanted new stuff, it's there... (just enough!)
it all just works together amazingly!

My tune has changed. A little... I still need to see for myself.

We got to ride twice last night. Awe were at HOB for Nina Hagen and decided to hit the park at 11:27 pm. Pirates was nearly a walk on the first time and, at 11:56, was definately a walk on. We took advantage.

My thoughts? Eh. Some good, some bad. ISM's going to hate it.

The first Sparrow animatronic is simply amazing. I'd do him. The others, not so much, and I actually HATE the Barbosa. Plus, the whole set- up there doesn't make sense to me. He's attacking the mainland to find Sparrow and the islanders are protecting him? Maybe I'm missing something.

The sound is great but the new soundtrack bugs me. It's so clean and clear some of the mystery and atomsphere is taken away. The new Davy Jones effect is pretty darned cool though.

Maybe I just miss my old familiar Pirates, but the new ride sort of made me sad. I wasn't expecting to have this reaction at all. I figured I'd be rolling with the changes just fine.

Interesting, my experience was just the opposite. I expected the ride to be butchered and figured I would be depressed afterwards. Instead, I thought it was quite tasteful and didn't feel that the original had been compromised enough to bother me.

I would say that Barbarrosa was the only change that I wasn't pleased with. I thought that the soundtrack, while definitely different, worked well.

But yeah, iSm will probably be livid. ;)

Remember, iSm didn't like "Black Pearl" the first time he saw it. :p

Yes, I WILL hold that over his head forever

I felt the same emotions MBC did, pretty much.

I need to ride it some more. Although for the most part I walked away feeling relatively appeased with a tinge of nostalgic diappointment, I'm a bit worried that the "looking for Johnny" syndrome and over-done soundtrack has removed some of the relax-factor from the ride. Only time will tell if that feeling returns once the newness wears off.

OK...I risked it with the Tiki room, so now I'm really risking it.....

Pirates is OK, but eternally repeatable? How many times does one need to see the same treasure filled room or ghostly skeleton at the wheel of a battered ship or wench bride auction or whatever? I don't get it. Once a trip does it for me, and I wasn't heart broken that it was closed while I was there.

I bet you don't know how many bottles of rum are offered for the buxom wench. I bet you're unaware that there's a small row boat tied to the rear of the ship in the battle scene. Have you ever noticed just how detailed and impressive the autcioneer AA is?

I don't mention these to "out geek" you. Just demonstrating that there's a lot to that ride. Detailed to an amazing degree. Something new to look at every time, not to mention 15-20 minutes of relaxation.

You don't have to try to out geek me, GD. As another thread has already demonstrated, you are twice the geek I am.

I admit to not being a Disney Geek. But I like Disneyland not so much for the attractions. Atmosphere. Watching my kids enjoy it. Typically top notch customer service. The attractions? Enjoyable, most certainly. There are two I consider to be highly repeatable, and those are for far different reasons, and I'm sure one of them would cause conniption fits among the Disney Geeks here.

As far as the detail, yeah, cool. Bu an audioanimatronic figure is pretty much the same every time I look at it. Cool, yeah, but how many times do I need to look at it?

...and glorious air-contitioning!

I'm still on the fence, I liked some of the new additions, but the new soundtrack bother's me in places. The Barbossa animatronic's voice just doesn't do it for me. There seems to be a lot less Paul Frees in the ride, and I miss that. Also, the inclusion of the movie soundtrack doesn't work for me as well - it's kind of "there" in places but doesn't really set the mood for me. This could all be nostalgic sentimentality on my part - but I'll have to ride it a few more times to get comfortable to this one.

Agreed on all those points, €. On the one hand, I was glad that at least they kept a good chunk of the battle spiel...but I was very underwhelmed by the performance it was given. The energy is just gone from it.

I thought the movie soundtrack worked in the first scene, after the second drop. But in the battle sequence, it just produced cacophany and an unnecessary chaos.

Bah, I'm talking myself into hating it. Gotta ride it again.

The Power of ISM compels you!
:iSm:

I would agree to some extent. I was impressed with the first batch of movie music, I thought it worked as well and that's pretty much what I based my opinion on. To be honest, I was so focused on Barbarossa in the battle scene that I didn't pay much attention to the music at the time.

Big surprise coming from the guy who has never ridden Haunted Mansion.

Fraidy Pants.:p

Geek.

Jeez Grandpa, it's like you're an adult or something :p

I am perhaps the oldest 37 year old there is, while at the same time the most immature. Go figure.

We may have to compete for that title, sir.

:eek: BS you're 37! Really?

Should I be insulted that there is no shock that I am 37?

::Curtseys::
As I told my co-workers: It does me no good to lie, you can look it up!

But yes, I am... Thank you for the compliment.

Its the facial hair. ;)

Yeah, but with all the stretching, you've got the sphincter of a 21 year old toaster whore, so you should be proud.

Can I claim oldest 31 year old? Tacking it along with the "Oldest X year old" titles I accumulated previously?

What sucks is that I am starting to catch up to the age people guess. It is sad when you realize that you are no longer smart for your age but just smart.

Someone change Grandpa's diaper, he's getting fussy again :evil:

I have to be honest here - I had no clue that you were 31, or rather, that you and I have only two years between us. :blush:

I'm only 24, in case anyone was wondering.

That would make Matthew 6, I think.

And I second this, sort of... Alex, I thought you were older. :blush: In fact, I assumed you were older than I.

Now that we've totally derailed the thread, how old is ML?

geez, makes me almost afraid to ask how old y'all think I am

I thought the same too :rolleyes:

17 ( but i swore to Sactown that i am 18):evil:

Ah, now, I'd need to see a photo of you to figure that one out.

Shirtless is good.

Only if you like back hair.

No married man should have back hair.

Sorry, I just swooned for a second.

Now, you were saying you'd like to send a pic of BOTH sides shirtless ??



...why are all the good ones straight ?? :rolleyes:


And to keep it on topic, I think the new AA's look very realistic. I'd like one for the bedroom, in fact.

No Married man should ever have back hair. That is his tragedy.

No Married woman ever does have back hair. That is hers.



...I've been reading Wilde again...

Let me rephrase: No married man should have back hair that they'd rather not have.

I have been comtemplating a back wax. Sounds worse than the surgeries I've had, frankly.

You should watch what you say to someone with the word "bear" in his SN. Or, do you need further education?

He lives in Austrailia. I'm still more afraid of you.

Hmmm - not a Brazillian, and it seems according to Lashbear calling it an Australlian would be inappropriate - so what shall we cause this little cosmetic tweek?

A deforestation?

Sorry for the re-rail, but I'm completely heartbroken over Pirates. I finally got to go on it last night, and finally read this thread.

I don't want to use spoiler tags, so take this as your warning.

I entered the Park just after 6 pm. The plan was to ride Pirates and eat at Cafe Orleans because my SoCal pass turned into a pumpkin the next day. The evening started out okay enough. First thing was to get a fastpass for Space Mountain - 10:55-11:55, perfect. Then I had dinner at the new Cafe Orleans, which I enjoyed. Hideously slow service - and they ran out of ice. Took about 20 minutes after seating to get an iced tea. Note to Lisa: I'm jealous of a certain bulldog named Lulu. The food was good, the presentation was beautiful. The bonus was that the cutest boy in Disneyland came over and talked to me for about 20 minutes after I mentioned that I'd seen him hosting at the Blue Bayou. I gave him my card, I hope he calls.
I got in line for Pirates. Maybe a half-hour. Fantasmic was beginning as we entered the building. Having seen the picures from the LoT attempted boat sinking, I knew that they'd overloaded our boat. Sure enough, we got stuck at the first drop. 10 minutes of the Jolly Roger is quite enough for me. But, I'm thinking, I really like the new drapes they've given him, this bodes well. Eventually they turn on the lights and come shove us over the drop. Wasn't Tyler the guy that had to push the LoT boat too? Maybe this is his specialty, fat people boat pusher. So we make it down the second drop with no problem and I'm hearing new music. Interesting, kind of gives the island a more somber mood.

Interesting.

I love the new thunder and lightning effects in the storm vignette, gorgeous. For the NEXT 30 MINUTES! The ride was completely backed up. Announcements eventually came reminding us to remain seated blah blah blah. When did they drop the usage of "host or hostess" and switch to "cast member"? At some point they finally turned off the sound. Another ten minutes of sitting in a boat. By this time we had a couple of cast members standing off to our left waiting to help us evacuate the attraction. Well, I've never been walked off a ride before, so this seems like fun. Fun like the Bataan death march. I don't think they could have done this slower. Handed out front-of-line passes for any ride but pirates. At 10:45, I'd call this a somewhat empty gesture.



I take a walk over to Mansion, and, guess what, its closed! The ride may be open in 5 minutes, maybe 10, maybe a half-hour, we don't know. No, its not related to Pirates.

Phooey.

I take a walk around the Park. The new cement work in Tomorrowland looks right out of an industrial park. The future is poured concrete.

My entire goal for tonight, now, is to ride Pirates. I decide to go wait outside the ride on the chance that they re-open. What can I lose? Well, as soon as the second performance of Fantasmic ends, they open the ropes. Suddenly its a Rage Against the Machine concert. I'm buying myself a poking stick, "This is how far away from me you have to stand, poke-poke." 5 minutes of line, onto another clearly overloaded boat, and awaaay we go. This time I see the shooting star and notice that they've added a phrase of "Yo Ho" to the banjo picking. Sweet. First drop, guess what? Yessireebob, we get to wait for the lights to come on and CMs to push us over the drop. This time I notice that no pirates are singing, after the first drop the music is entirely instrumental. After the second drop, I get to hear the moody island music again - still interesting. In a suicidal way. This time we get all the way past the Treasure Cave and through Davey Jones (wasn't he the cute Monkee?) and into the Battle scene. Love the set dressing in the vignettes, not sold on Davey Jones, completely not sold on the change in dialogue. Battle scene, how can I describe it? The Geoffrey Rush AA looks like it had a stroke. The cannon effects are impressive.

The music.

The music sucks. The sucking music is the real first indication that I'm not liking this re-do at all. Ths scene does not need music, sucking or otherwise. The boat gets stuck at the exit of the Battle scene, ensuring that I get to listen to the sucking music for the next ten minutes.
The boat is facing the Dunking scene, which I can see, but not really hear. From here, I can see the first Captain Jack, and the animatronic is impressive.
At about ten minutes in, they shut off the sound, and cycle us through the rest of the ride with the sound off. The sound comes on for the Jail Scene.

Did I mention that on this ride-through my seatmate was a brand-spankin' new CM who was eager to tell me all the things I was about to see, the changes that had been made, and counted down "3-2-1, IMPACT!" everytime another boat bumped us?

WTF is that last Captain Jack scene? Anyone know? A slightly off-key, slow, moody version of "Yo Ho" is not the way to end the ride. Show biz rule number one: Give 'em a big finish, and they'll forgive almost anything. This show ends with a mortally wounded whimper.

Okay, as we're floating up to the unload dock we see people lined up outside the closed attraction. Clearly they're about to let people in. An effort was made to clear those of us exiting out of the building, but I stood my ground. In 10 minutes my AP won't be good until August, I'm going on this damn thing again. Fortunately my outside voice was on its best behavior.

Reload, "NO ONE IN ROWS 1 OR 6," they're finally getting a clue, and we're off. A row to my fat-a$$ self, how luxurious. The drops occur without incident, I don't like no pirates singing, I'm beginning to dislike the Moody Island Music, I'm hating the change in dialogue and mood in the tunnel, the sucky music in the Battle scene is now making me very sad. The town scenes look great, the Captain Jack animatronics are fine, thanks very much for restoring the impending rape scene, and then we're back to Downer Jack at the lift hill. I hate Downer Jack.

I exit the ride at 11:58, Space Mountain FP still in my wallet, and walk into Mansion as the closing spiel is playing. Hey, the ghost horse is back!

They've ruined Pirates. Iconic dialogue has been removed throughout the attraction, the theme doesn't get sung until after the Auction scene, the new music is heavy and morose, and, as the ride ends, Downer Jack is there to underscore the fact that, for whatever reason, they've decided to suck the fun out of the ride. Pirates has always been the heart and soul of Disneyland for me, I'm starting to wonder if its time for this 43 year old adult to get a new hobby.

:(

:iSm: :iSm: :iSm: :iSm: :iSm: :iSm: :iSm:



Never a one to disappoint ... I have to report after my inaugural ride this morning that ....I HATED IT!!! :mad:



This will come as no big surprise, but perhaps some will be astonished that I actually liked parts of it - - though seemingly not the parts that most everyone else seems to like.

The Good
Though the "classic" version of "Yo Ho" is no longer heard anywhere in the attraction, I rather like just music in the space between the two drops. It's noteworthy, however, that this is authentic Pirates score from 1967 ... because I don't like the music in the main waterfall cavern after the second drop.

Perhaps I just got a bad part of the loop for this area, but it did nothing for me. I preferred the natural cavern sounds. I distinctly dislike the illusion that I am in a movie about a pirate cavern rather than that I am in a pirate cavern. It's a subtle difference, but the mysterious musical score that now pervades too many areas of the attraction is more akin to a movie of an experience - instead of portraying a facsimile of an actual experience.

Admittedly, there has always been an outburst of musical score further along in the cavern, so perhaps it's just the particular music I don't like. In any event, too much underscore is, imo, a poor choice in both movies and rides.

But back to the good stuff. More skeletons on the beach? Fine. New lightning bolts in the stormy sky? Coolness. Skeletons playing chess in the tavern lair? Good stuff.

:snap: The Captain's Quarters looks great. I love the touch of the parrot skeleton perched near the ghostly harpsichord. And, oh the Treasure Room! It's absofreakinglutely gorgeous. Stunningly beautiful, in fact. This room has never looked better.


And that's the end of the good stuff. How much trouble will I get into if I take up the habit of getting out of my boat at this point??


The Bad
The Davy Jones mist waterfall does nothing for me. I simply do not understand why everyone is so impressed with this. It's a flat film projection and it doesn't look like anything but.

It's a cheap-shot effect in the Haunted Mansion, and it's a cheap-shot effect in Pirates. Am I supposed to be amazed by film on mist two decades after Fantasmic premiered a few hundred yards from here? Am I supposed to be pleased with a flat film effect in the attraction that is the veritable Mecca of dimensional illusion?

I think not.

And that's to say nothing of what's now missing. The mysterious, dark tunnel with the suddenly vaulted ceiling and the ghostly intonations that are so unbelieveably classic - - not simply because they are traditional, but because they are unsurpassably excellent

No fear have ye of evil curses, says you?
Aaaaarrh.
Properly warned ye be, says I.
Who knows when that evil curse will strike the greedy beholders of this bewitched treasure?

To say that this ride has been diminished is an understatement!

And, I'm not sure after only one ride, but is there even a curse anymore? And was it my imagination, or did they ruin the sightline "reveal" of the battle scene with the lame placement of that cheesy waterfilm effect?

Gak, I hate it!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:


The Ugly
The battle scene with movie music is completely STUPID. Am I in a pirateship battle or am I in a pirate movie??? Why is there a musical score to this event?

This has now gone the way of Indiana Jones and Star Tours by putting recognizable movie music over the experience - - and guests are meant to feel as if they are in the Pirates of the Caribbean movie, much to the detriment of their experience of a real pirate adventure of their own.

And, oh, they should not have had Barbossa say the same lines as the actor he replaced. His delivery is pathetic. Another iconic and excellent performance cast aside for something substandard. Bah.


I have the least amount of problems with Johnny Depp. I really don't care that he's here and there, or that he looks like a real human - in contrast to all the other characters. Of course, he pops up in the barrel a little too quickly after you've seen him at the well. If you crane your head, you can see both Depps at the same time. It's absurd. (Kinda reminds me of the time two Plutos caught sight of each other in DCA, heheh.) There's a reason characters appear only once in all other Disneyland attractions. That lesson was ignored, and the result is laughable.

Oh, and far from reversing the last disastrous set of Pirates revisions, the pirates are still, to the last man, being chased by women. So much for the punchline created by the brilliant imagineers of '67. And so much for the politically incorrect and naughty ways of Jack Sparrow having any good effect on the dumbing down of this ride. :rolleyes:


The treasure closet in the powder-keg room is also a stupid idea. WTF? And yeah, I'm pretty sick of Johnny Depp at this point.



But Depp's nowhere near the worst of the problems. The heart of the ride has been butchered. The spooky tunnel and the pirateship battle have been ruined:( - yes, I say Ruined.



After the obligatory round of introducing everyone to this travesty, you will find me avoiding this ride in future. What a frelling shame. I hope to live to see the removal of all this movie crap when memory of the all-but-guaranteed-to-be-inferior sequels fades to dust.


:iSm:

Wow! Two thumbs down reviews in a row. :eek:

'Row'. HA ha. :D

Must. ride. for. myself! .... Arrrrrrgh....

Did anyone else notice the voice of Davy Jones on the lift? He says a few different things but we caught a lame impression of "You may not Sur-VIVE" from the cavern.

Gosh! Those two reviews are so thorough and compelling. POTC for me, and I'm sure for many (most?) of you, is THE DL experience. I was upset enough over the PC changes...but still I rode. These reviews, however, have brought me into a territory previously reserved for the Star Wars Special Edition releases: the "I will not sully myself, and color my experience, by viewing same" realm.

I don't have anywhere near the Disney-Geek knowledge that most of you have, but I do have a loooong history of the park experience, as it used to be nearly in my backyard, and the previous generation in my family made up some of the park's earliest CMs. Still and all, some changes can be good -- I'm not an anti-change Nazi -- but some things, particularly in a place that evokes nostalgia purposefully, ought to be left alone.

I am not surprised that after such repeatedly horrific experiences - being stuck on the drops, sound problems, walked off the ride, annoying CM next to you - that Gn2Dlnd didn't enjoy it.

As for iSm - yeah, I figured you'd say all that. :)

Did either of you actually head to City Hall?

I realize I only posted a few things earlier, so here's a few more.

The Davy Jones waterfall is really cool because it looks like a real waterfall. I can't tell you what Davy said at all, because I was busy being impressed by boats passing under what appeared to be a waterfall. I enjoyed going under it myself. I agree that he looked 2D....but the waterfall!!

Is it just me or did they NOT get Depp and Rush to do their own voices? WTF?

The Depp Treasure Closet is dumb, totally thrown in there.

I enjoyed nearly all the other changes and boosted effects, and do not think that the ride has been ruined. I have to admit, screaming bloody murder because they put music in a scene seems a bit over the top to me. I love all y'all to death but come on, it's a bit of music. The only point I'll concede on that is that there's too much sound in the battle sequence and it makes the dialogue hard to understand. But just the concept of adding music doesn't make me freak out.

That said - I've only ridden it once, opinions subject to change without notice ;)

I have a question for you all (particularly those who do not like it) that may not be possible for you to answer.

If you were a first time rider, what would you think of it? Nothing previous to compare it to, just what do you think of it as an experience.

I was never a fan of the Country Bear Jamboree - it was OK, I'd see it once a trip with the family - but not repeatable. They replaced it with something that sucks all by itself. Without reference to the CBJ, I can say that Pooh sucks.

Compared to a boat ride at a carnival, it is incredible! It is still an amazing attraction, it's just not as amazing as it once was.

To answer scaeagles question ... yes, the things that bug me most would still bug me. The Davy Jones effect is 2-D flat and worthy of Not Afraid's traveling carnival. The music makes me feel like I'm supposed to be in a movie.

I had the same reaction the very first time I rode Phantom Manor in Paris. Where is the orchestra? Why is everything lushly scored? Am I supposed to be in a haunted house or in a movie about a haunted house?

All it takes is plausible deniability. In the original Haunted Mansion, there is creepy organ music which I can imagine eminating from the organ I see played later in the attraction. When things get more musical in orchestraion, it's because 25 animatronics are actually performing a musical number.

I suppose it's possible that there's a ghostly symphonic orchestra hidden somewhere between the walls of Phantom Manor. The music they play is indeed creepy and beautiful.

And I suppose there's a ghostly naval orchestra doomed to play strings and horns and bass and drums and flutes and tuba down in the waterlogged caverns of 18th Century New Orleans, and were already dead long before that so they can also be playing from their gig on the Spanish fort, with ethereal precognition of a movie score we all readily recognize as being composed in the 21st century some 400 years later!


Yes, even if I didn't know that a handful of irreplaceable vocal performances were removed, I would be bugged by the new Pirates of the Caribbean. It would still be better than a finger in the eye, but I would never have pegged it as the best theme park attraction ever created.


The mighty have fallen, and I pray it's only temporary.

there once was a time when people bitterly complained about the changes made to Walt Disney's original Fantasyland. without consideration to the historical value or guest reaction, imagineers did the unthinkable: moved King Authur's carousel back away from the congested area behind Sleeping Beauty Castle and relocated the Mad Tea Party near a friggin mountain! and they didn't stop there- oh no. the colorful carnival and medieval design of the area was transformed into a Bavarian Village!!!




um, Walt was always about "addin' and a plussin'... "as long is there is imagination left in the world..."

i give the New Fantasyland a thumbs up. and Harold in the Matterhorn. and the new scenes/effects in Pirates. I really enjoyed myself on each ride.

It's not a museum!

ok, ok, i'll admit, now it's time to fix Tomorrowland:rolleyes:

ML, you know you're not gonna change iSm's mind.

Just because people became accustomed to and grew to appreciate the new Fantasyland (even if they didn't like it at first) does not mean that people will/must become accustomed to and grow to appreciate every change that is made to a Disney park. I can only speak for myself here, but if I don't like something, no amount of "as long as there's imagination left in the world" and "it's not a museum" is going to make me appreciate something I don't like. Case in point: I will never, ever, like the Tiki Room Under New Management. I understand why they changed it; I accept that fewer people walk out of the show now. But I don't have to like it (and I don't have to go in)--and nobody can change my mind.

I haven't been on Pirates in FL yet (and it may be a long time before I get back to CA), and I'll make up my mind when I see it. I expect that I won't really LOVE it, and I know that if they put a monkey in there, I may never ride it again. We'll see.

it was not my intent to change his or anyone's mind. i respect everyone's reaction to the changes.

does it make me sad that everyone is not pleased? yes.

i have no desire to make anyone like it or change their mind. i only want all to be happy and gay;)



and i hope you enjoy the WDW version.:)

I hope so, too. I'm not optimistic, but then again, it's much easier to be pleasantly suprised when one's expectations are low.

There's no monkey, is there? Please say there's no monkeys in Pirates! Pretty please?

I have witnessed a Sea Monkey or two. :cool:

I just wish they'd add something to toss any flash picture takers into the water...

My wish is that imaineerin once aain turns its attention into creating NEW attractions and experiences - I'm gettin tired of all the overlays and tweeks. I like Monsters, I'm looking forward to Nemo subs - I'm hoping this marks the change to the new and away from the "imporved."

i agreee. well moistly.:cheers: :D

Is not Finding Nemo Subs essentially an overlay and tweak? I long held out hope that they would eventually fill in the lagoon and do something completely new. Or at least find another water-based attraction to do.

From the video I've seen, I really don't care much for the projection of Davey Jones either. But I love the waterfall effect. Pretty cool.

I could have sworn that I heard that Depp and Rush did the voices for their AA's. :shrug:

I would agree that Disneyland isn't a museum and shouldn't be. But tweaking rides that need tweaking is fine with me. Adjusting rides that are doing just fine, kind of worries me. I mean the lines for POTC are always long (but they do move fast) which indicates that the ride wasn't going stale. I understand that the ride tweakage had everything to do with the movie, which doesn't really bother me either. (As much as we love SB castle, it was/is a giant ad for the 'Sleeping Beauty' film.)

I'm hoping that certain things added aren't permanent. It seems that where they placed the Johnny Depp room is a place that has changed a couple of times already. Maybe it's a cursed spot, like the desk where Murphy Brown's secretaries sat. No one will be permanent there... :D

Well, I guess I simply have to reserve any commentary until I board the boat at Lafitte's Landing. I do have to say that I'm grateful that Johnny does not make an appearence in the Jail scene. While I am of the opnion that Pirates probably needed tweaking only to repair an aging attraction, I'm on the fence about messing with the ride. But I can't form an opinion for myself until I ride it.

I think Euro's comment on moving from refurb and tweaking to NEW attractions is a great point. Let's hope the management is moving in that direction. I love the AA technology and think another really great AA themed E-ticket ride is in order. Just what that would be or be based on or imagineered, too early for me to speculate, I've not had tea yet this morning ;)

I'm glad the World of Motion figures are gone.

As for "is there even a curse anymore?" - Davy Jones only mentions it in 3 of his 6 or 7 different clips and because of the silly spot they placed it, with any sort of boat back up - you get to hear it at least once...

The only thing of this rehab I really don't like is the music in the battle scene -but they change sound levels ALL over the place in this ride through the years, so I'm not too worried about that... After all, a big chunk of the music in the caves was missing for nearly 30 years.

According to the press materials the voices of Barbossa, Sparrow, and Davy Jones were done by Rush, Depp, and Nighy.

So is/was there a hidden pirate choir somewhere after the first drop and before the second one then? Just curious how this part plays in your music logic on the ride. I guess I had never really thought of it before, but it does seem like you're in a movie in Phantom Manor... :)

With all due respect to ML, whose intent this was not .... I hate when the "museum" card is played.

It's such a cheap shot. No one is complaining about change. Floating Madame Leota was one of the best changes ever! New Fantasyland - great example of fantastic change for the better. The new Space Mountain music - what an excellent change!

Please don't change the subject! People who are complaining about the changes made to Pirates are not complaining about change itself. But there's improvement and there's detraction. They don't have to be the same for everyone, but people know for themselves which they perceive in any given instance.




* * * * * * * * *

GC - I always find voices defensible as ghosts. I don't know why I can accept an unseen ghostly choir more readily than an unseen ghostly orchestra. I just can. So this part was never a problem for me. I will admit, though, that - because the music was is so awesome, I never had much of a problem with an orchestra suddenly appearing at the treasure room.

Fact is though, that with new music after the first drop, new music after the second drop, old music at the treasure room and new music in the battle scene ... there's just too much frelling underscore for me to accept anything I'm seeing as "real."


CM: Huh? What music was missing in the caves? Oh, and I know Davy tells (some guests) about a curse on the way back up .... but does he say anything about it as it's about to happen??

While a whole new ride concept would have been preferable, at least it's a ground-up redesign with completely new technology (not just a few bits of new technology squeezed amongst the old technology), and a completely new story. That doesn't, of course, guarantee quality, but at least it presents the opportunity. If they do it right, it stands to be a fair sight better than if they ahd glued a lucky fin to the sea serpent in the cave.

I was really looking forward to a Davey Jones AA. That would have been cool. Moving tentacles and all that.

I'm cross posting this from the WDW Pirates thread, 'cause I posted it there and still want it as my response, but it belongs more to this thread.

now i get it. and the "museum card" should not have been used and was not needed.

honestly, for several days, i waited with high hopes that you would report back that you loved the changes. it kinda makes me sad that you aren't pleased.

ML, do you know the date of the pic you posted?

Spoken like a CM who wants the guests to have the best experience ever each time they enter the park. Here's to ML.:cheers: Would that every CM was like him.

One of my Disneyfan coworkers saw Pirate on Friday with her kids and they loved it, thought the screen was really cool and can't wait to see the movie.

I would guess this is the reaction you'll get from most non-Disney geeks like us.

No doubt. It remains an enjoyable ride. Only time will tell if it remains a timeless ride.

no, sorry... guessing by clothing and hairstyle, circa 1965'ish?

I was actually dating it a little earier. There's a full skirt in brown at the lower left...
But before I saw her, I was at '65 as well.

If it makes you feel any better, I still think the folks who do art design and set decoration are aces. The tavern, Captain's quarters, and treasure room are all top notch. These are great improvements, and the kind of "tweaking" that Ghoulish Delight referred to above. So were the big canon splashes added last summer.

I submit it is, in fact, the height of folly to radically change an attraction that has remained ultra-popular for nearly 40 years. And if you must change to keep things fresh - - always add; never subtract.

Part of the wonderful old music in the treasure scene was absent for nearly 30 years, according to press releases from the 97(?) rehab.

One of the Davy Jones projections does say "If you be brave or foolhardy enough to face a pirate's curse, proceed"

Ah, a Disney press release ... the height of integrity and factualness.


Sorry, in this case (as with the deleted Haunted Mansion dialogue), I will trust my own extensive personal experience of the ride since 1970. In all that time - till last week - I've never heard a smidgeon of music added back in. So, unless it was removed during the first 3 years....*




* not an impossibility: the Ghost Host dialogue that was just recently again removed from the Corridor of Doors was originally deleted in the early 70's, just a few years after the attraction's premier.

I'd wait and see as far as how much of this rehab stays in it's current state before forming too solid an opinion.

That's all I'll say about that ;)

OK, my review.

I avoided all spoilers, I had no idea what was to come.

We went to the park yesterday to camp for the pretty fire in the sky goes BOOM and found ourselves in a near empty park.I had no intentions of going on anything (July 4th in DL? Are you crazy?!) and figured that everyone in the park was in line for Pirates. But it had a posted wait of 45 minutes at the info booth, and it was maybe 15 minutes when we got in line.

Love the Johnny on the wall. Yum. Loved the ride. I swear you heard words to the music after the drops, but it may have been our boat singing. Lightning was awesome, the new shiny was amazing. I loved the chess scene. Nothing like drunk pirates playing chess. The waterfall was AMAZING until you got right close to it. I kind-of miss the foggy caves but the fog always gave me breathing issues so it's not a huge loss for me. I also swear the original voices were in the caves. It took me a minute to realize it was Barbossa on the pirate ship, and I don't think it ruined it. Loved the score but I love the score in general. It made me feel like the townspeople were defending their island against attack. Johnny was amazing. I loved all of them, including the one at the end where he got the treasure.

I am very happy with the changes. I was bored with the old Pirates and while I think it was silly to re-do a ride that a movie was based on to fit the sequel of the movie I don't think the changes were bad. Kinda random maybe, but not bad. They seem easy enough to remove if they choose to. And who knows, maybe they'll re-do it for the 3rd movie.

Yeah, they're fudging - big surprise. Isaac could probably play you the specific bit of music, but, if I remember correctly, the slightly abbreviated "Scare Me" music was replaced with a more complete recording during the PC rehab.

I listened to a ride-thru recording on Window to the Magic dot com to get a better idea of why the new music additions don't work. Well, with the exception of the extended banjo picking, which I think works fine. It has to do with the split-personality of the ride now. Is it jolly fun adventure, or is it moody self-reflection?

Later on, when my brain isn't so hot, I'll try to expound. One thing I can point out, the new music in the Battle scene completely slows the rhythm of the scene, same with Downer Jack at the end. Remember how by adding music to Space Mountain the Imagineers made it seem as if the ride goes faster? In this case they've done the reverse.

Unhappy...unhappy...
Very very very very very
Very very unhappy

I have no idea why Disney couldn't have just been happy with their great/fun/fantastic pirates ride and the great/fun/fantastic movie based on the pirates ride. Why did they have to go and marry the two? I honestly thought they were adding in Jack Sparrow into one or two scenes. I didn't really understand that it was a complete re-do. I didn't know they were going to change the narration, change the music, etc., etc., etc.

I'm tempted to not see it for myself, to keep in tact the memory of the ride I love, and continue to enjoy its derivative film.

God. It's like that time I was in a book store and saw the book adaptation of Little Women that was based on the movie Little Women that was based on the *actual* Little Women book.

What. The. FRIG? Read the original book, dammit. Don't read the book based on the movie based on the book.

Just like that, I don't want to ride a Pirates that's based on the movie Pirates that's based on the ride Pirates. I JUST WANT TO RIDE THE ORIGINAL PIRATES. And watch the movie now and again.

Bummer!

EH - It is pretty much a Johnny in two/three scenes (depending on how you classify a scene). There is a some music re-do but the original base of the ride remains unchanged. I was staring at the pirate captain trying to see if it was Barbossa or not, and someone had to tell me it was.

I really liked it, but I get the feeling I'm in the minority. I'll live.

Having been on two more times in the last two days, I have a few more observations about the music.

Whether it was ever there way back when or not ... they have now started the "Scare Me" theme the minute you pass the storm vignette ... whereas it used to start only upon approaching the treasure room. Now the harpsichord is not the sole source of music ... it's score (albeit authentic PoC score) all the way through.

In fact, from the first drop until the well-dunking scene - - the entire experience is musically scored .... radically changing said experience, imo.

Some of the music I like, and some I don't. But there's just too frelling much of it. Just as it's inartful when a movie is wall-to-wall score, so is this ride in its new incarnation, says me. Movie score is most effective in the transition from non-score to score. It's the starting points that pop out most. If you never stop having music, there's no opportunity to start it up again.

I think the start of the music AT the treasure room was a great sound effection. Lost.


On the plus side, I sorta see where they were trying to go ... and some of it works in an observorish kinda way. The ethereal music in the big waterfall cavern, for example, is not completely unpleasant or without psychenautic effect in that most trippy environment. But the non-stop musical score makes the whole thing seem like more of a diorama presentation, and less like a pretend adventure.

Bah, says I, to that!

I don't think I've ever thought of Pirates as an adventure instead of a ride-through. Maybe that's why I grew tired of it, same ride over and over and I bet that is why the changes don't bother me.

I'm sure I'll be on it again on the 9th and again on the 17th.

I've gotten more than a few huffy comments (not here) that my opinion is in the minority.

Cuz you're a girl. :p

Thank you, sir. Now I have 'The Producers' in my head...
:D

Most of the guests we rode with seemed to think that "they didn't really change much at all"

The average guest who only rides once every couple of years may not notice much of the changes. There is so much to look at that they may even miss some of the Jacks in there.:rolleyes:

If "average guests" were allowed to design attractions, everything would be go-kart races. The "average guest" takes what is given, few questions asked. The de-imagineered Tiki Room in Florida is an example of the "average guest" accepting sheer crap as quality entertainment. I went to a performance of Les Miserables here in L.A. a few years ago. The show was dreadful. Most of the actors had gone on auto-pilot years ago. At curtain-call, the audience dutifully rose to its feet in a standing ovation. WTF? All I could figure out is that most of these people don't see much theatre, they paid 80 bucks to see this, therefore it must be brilliant!

If Light-Magic hadn't premiered at an AP exclusive event, we'd probably still be enduring it.

Have you not noticed my avatar, status, and sig line? :p

Thou hast spake of That Which Shall Not Be Named. Thou needs must now be banished (or spanked).

There's no mistaking that most people will accept a lower quality. We, on the otherhand expect perfection. I don't think the suits are allowing Imaginering (or what's left of it) to do the best job possible the way Walt lead them. So no, I don't realy expect perfection any more. But if they make a choice like changing a ride, I just hope they do the best job they can.

Just adorn thyself in the safe color, and offer a dead animal as a peace offering. That should apease the evil. :D

Why, thank you!

I do look good in yellow.

Does evil like cheese?

Evil must be appeased with 1000 boxes of thin krisps, and a couple kegs of beer

Ugh, worse than accepting it, the loudmouthed nimrods we rode with on July 4 were ecstatic about everything new. They loved Davy Jones, were agog about Jack Sparrow x 3, and loved the Pirates movie theme playing over the battle scene. Everything I despise is loved by the unwashed masses, I fear.


Anyways, I confirmed my worst about the long, dark tunnel. The mist waterfall does indeed cut far short the reveal to what I've always called the "get it" room (i.e., a vast chamber filled with water, projected clouds upon a faux sky, and a looming pirate ship firing its cannons upon a Spanish fortress. If you haven't gotten it by then, this is where you frelling "get it.")

And it's not simply that the tunnel does not become lofty and vaulted because they now fail to light the loftiness .... its because the loftiness is no more! The contraption that creates the mistfall descends 20 feet from the roof of the tunnel. Look backwards next time you pass through Davy Jones cheapcrap projection effect. The machinery is huge, and the lofty tunnel is humbled.

You know what I think is missing - that I love - is the lighthearted pirate-theme music that plays after you come up the rise. I'm not sure I remember it being there - biut not sure it is gone. I always LOVED that fact that, you come out of this "adventure" and you are back in reality, but there is music still playfully playing.

DOes anyone else know what I am talking about?

I do! It's one of my favorite parts of the score. :) And I am almost positive that it is still there.

^ It's there, just hard to hear because of Downer Jack's "singing" and Squiddly's incessant yammering coming up the lift.

BTW, the movie reviews are starting to come out. Uh-oh.

Did anyone go to City Hall yet?

Seriously, guys, Disney may or may not read this board, but if you actually take a moment to put your signature on a piece of paper, you will be heard (perhaps not heeded, but heard).

As has been stated here, the average joe will not understand this, and it's up to us to make a stink if something's really wrong. I myself may put pen to paper at City Hall in order to help get rid of the final Jack and the cacophany in the battle scene. NOW is the time, because if it sits there for 6 months and no one complains it is there for good.

</PSA>

It was nearly midnight by the time I walked off Pirates the night I went. I was too tired to stand in line at City Hall and try to be pleasant, and not be irritated by a condescending CM. Mickeylumbo's (all due respect) replies here on the board are sort of what I expect to hear at City Hall. Right now, even if the powers that be know they've made a mistake, they don't want to look like chumps. The answer is always going to be some variation of "It's not a museum, Disneyland was meant to grow, I'm sorry your day wasn't magical, wank wank wank."

As my pass is a pumpkin until August, I won't be stopping into City Hall anytime soon. I might write a letter. I might make a phone call. I don't know. What I'd like is to buy John Lasseter a cup of coffee and sit down with him for 10 minutes.

That is a shame. I use to marvel at the size of the cave they made. It gave it a beliveability. But also the long quite tunnel, with a faint "Dead men tell no tales" in the background told you things were changing, IE from the present to the past. It was that long wait that made you anticipate what was ahead. I will miss this part. And now indure the fog machine and movie soundtrack instead.

Perhaps they will show clips from POTC 3 on the walls of the cave soon!?? ;)

I intend to visit City Hall today.



NA, that exit music (the best piece, imo) is still there. It's hard to hear over Davy Jones's lame rendition of "Ye may not surviiiiive," but once you clear the lift, it's louder than ever and gloriously restored. So loud, in fact, that you can hear it fine from the queue as you enter the building. That's one of the few genuine improvements. The cool jazzy rendition of Yo Ho is the supreme musical moment of the experience, imo.

I'm not a fan of the new stuff.

The new things have a certain amount of entertainment value but clash with the Marc Davis style. The new music is annoying in a DCA kinda way. The two scenes that had new music added were more striking & evoked more feelings when they were silent. You don't need an underscore to stir emotions. I agree with iSm that the new stuff sticks out like a sore thumb and throws off the delicate balance of the ride. Why the hell is there a giant crate full of treasure inside the armory?! I doubt pirates hid their treasure in the same place they kept their gun powder.

My problem is not that they changed the ride, but rather, how they changed it.

It's lame.

I will be filing out a 'conern' form at City Hall real soon, just as I did after I saw the new bride inside Haunted Mansion.

After seeing the film, I'm sad that there will be no Davey Jones AA. That would have been truly something to see. :)

I totally agree!!!:snap: I'm looking forward to seeing the projection special effect, but an AA woulda rocked my world. Maybe they'll rethink this and add it later on... in a perfect world.

Yes, an AA might have been better. The projection effect is so flat ... I'm more impressed with him in G.C.'s avatar than I am with him on the ride.

I enjoyed the new Pirates. The first two CJS AA's were AWESOME - almost a little too realistic. I like the screen, but saddened by what we lost. Curses.

The music is a bit overbearing in places, but overall, I am happy with the improved audio. Being a sound guy, this is a HUGE improvement IMO.

Other than Barbosa in the battle scene and the new Depp lair, there really aren't significant changes. Tweaks and adjustments, yes. But nothing terrible.

So, I guess I am odd man out.

As a member of the unwashed masses, I liked the painting of Jack Sparrow at the entrance, I think it was tastefully done. I liked the skeleton parrot. I miss singing with the Mellowmen between the two drops, that was a boat bonding experience.

That would be CAPTAIN Jack Sparrow

He's the worst pirate I've ever heard of.

I'm with you. I enjoyed it... thought the changes were great.
LSPE and I were wondering, are the two pirates close to the waters edge in the bar new? The ones playing a game, all hunkered over? Neither of us remember them.

But otherwise, I also thought the improved sound was a plus.

Yes, they are playing chess and they're new. As is the parrot in the bedroom.

yes, they are new to the attraction.

i LOVE the new music, and new additions... the only time i grit my teeth* is the final Captain Jack AA... facial features don't come close to the perfection captured in the first appearance. i hope this will be improved.



*and just before the first waterfall when i am in the front row.

He was cute..... has someone taken his picture yet? (Illegally, with a flash?)

I was fairly certain the parrot was new, I've taken pics there before. But the chess game... I could have missed. Thats my least favorite sequence.

Other things, were much eaisier to pinpoint.

the one thing I would have liked to have seen in addition to what has already been mentioned is the ship Barbosa is on to be more 'Black Pearl' like. that is, black sails, skells manning the cannons, a little more 'crewed by the damned' to go with the 'captain so evil that hell itself spat him back out' sorta thing.

Overall, loved the changes.

oh well hell, it could have LOOKED like Barbossa and I'd have been happier. I have no idea who they thought it looked like.
The old Capt was scarier.

Just to argue with Jack.. can someone (who has seen the second movie) tell me what ship Barbossa is on is the second movie? I wouldnt think that he had the Black Pearl.
(and I dont think that they would have shown their 'damned' selves to the town. Moonlight or not)

Barbossa doesn't appear on a ship in the second film.

Well!
That just blows MY argument right out of the water.

Does anyone else say 'Potsie' in their heads when they see 'POTC'? Or is it just me...
:D

I always end up with 'Po-Tic' for whatever reason.

I like it. 'Po-Tic'... that's almost 'poetic'... :D I'll stop now...



I don't understand why Davey Jones is an apparition in the ride. He's not a ghost, he doesn't appear to people. He's just a squid-faced pirate. And why does he get a close up? Wouldn't a full head to clawfoot projection have been better? Seems cheese-ola, to me...

I liked some of the changes, and others fell flat. I liked the first 2 Sparrow AAs, but the last one left a lot to be desired. I was not impressed with the "Barbosa" figure in the battle scene. It doesn't look like him, and I have fond memories of the original captain (a little boy, 3, on his first trip through Pirates, trying to stand as he screamed and waived "Hi Captain Hook"). I hated having to duck in the battle scene because I kept getting splashed. The shadow projection on the wall is now a bar fight scene that is not nearly as well done as the sword fight.

I asm glad to read that the 2 skeletons playing chess are new, because I just wasn't sure, same with the parrot skeleton.

I am glad to see the plates of food gone in the chase scene, but not impressed with how they redid it.

I'm not upset that they redid things, just wish that they had done them a bit better.

I also didn't like getting my side soaked on the first drop.

Whether you're a Disney fan scrutinizing over every detail or a regualr Guest who will accept anything in the ride, the "slow reveal" of the ship/fort battle scene is ruined--by adding the Davy Jones projection.

The dark, unknown size of the mysterious cavern is no more. It's now too bright in there with the projection lights. Upon passing the wall of lit-up smoke, you instantly see the ship with POTC movie score blaring too obviously in the background. The surprise effect of a life-size pirate ship in open-skies--magically appearing at the end of a dark, mysterious cavern with spooky pirate voices--is gone.

Another comment I have not read or heard: With the three Audio-Animatronics of Jack Sparrow, all I see is "Johnny Depp." All of the other AAs in the ride are simply classic, timeless pirates. But the updating and modernizing of the ride with a prominent, contemporary AA fails to suspend my disbelief. I see a modern-day actor immortalized in the ride, and that ruins part of the ride experience. "Look, there's Johnny Depp in the ride."

Yes, and I think it's your fault--did you post this same thing a long time ago on a message board far away?

Just you. ;)
I hear pee-YO-tee-see. From high to low.

Excellent point!

I didn't before but now I do. Right up there with Movie Mushings.

YES! Every single time I read it....Mushings!

(I knew I liked you)

Yes. Yes, I did. :D

From what I read on Mice Chat, Disney is having the same type of problem with the walk around character.

What other live action stars have they had walk around characters of?

Mary Poppins and Bert. I'm sure there are others.

Technically speaking, Cruella de Vil could be said to qualify.

No one has ever for one minute thought 'Glenn Close' when seeing Disneyland's Cruella deVil. She's the cartoon Cruella, through and through.

I'd also wager that not many think 'Julie Andrews' when seeing Mary Poppins. It's hard to relate that to Johnny Depp because I wasn't visiting Disneyland on any regular basis in 1964. Perhaps people did associate her strongly with Andrews at the time. If so, I think it's as much of a bad show distraction as the 'Johnny' character is today.

Good point that Disney Daniel raised. With all the other ride atrocities that have captured and tortured my attention, I never questioned the value of me thinking 'Johnny Depp' at every single AA appearance, and even the painting on the wall.

In the movie(s), with a performance being played, I can - at times - think 'Captain Jack Sparrow' ... but the robots have never, for an instant, made me think of anything but 'Johnny Depp.' I've never even heard of anyone calling them the 'Jack Sparrow' AAs. Even from the people who love the changes, I have heard universal reference to the new 'Johnny Depp' characters in the ride.


Interestingly, the robot who only barely resembles Geoffrey Rush is being referred to as "Barbossa" by everyone I've heard. We'll have to wait till next year to find out how the new robots are regarded, but so far they are certainly being called the Keira Knightley and Orlando Bloom AA figures.


Bad, bad, bad, bad show. In fact, no show at all.

Thus I said technically. Which is correct for the question asked. They've also at times had Tom Sawyer and Becky characters which have only been presented in live-action form in Disney movie. But again only technically correct since they weren't intended to invoke any specific movie role.

Out of curiosity, since you hate it so much, will you no longer go on it?

Well, they've also had Davey Crockett and Zorro, and I'm sure those were meant to reflect Disney characters. But when the characters also have a "real" counterpart - either literary or biological - I think guests' perceptions are not channeled towards specific actors.


As for ever going on Pirates again ... I'm very sad to report that - - once the spate of riding with newbies is over, it will no longer be a ride I suggest riding. I will never be a stick-in-the-mud and refuse to board if that's a group's choice. But I will never be the one to encourage it.

Likewise with Haunted Mansion.

Hmmm, the two Disneyland masterpieces off my ride-desired list. That's a crying shame. If Space Mountain really becomes unavailable at night next year, I'm going to seriously be questioning my desire to go to Disneyland at all. As most of you know, I'm not really there for the rides ... but changing my three absolute favorites into experiences I'd rather not have puts a damper on the whole Disneyland experience for me.

Bah, sad, sad, bah!

Um, iSm... Space Mountain is gonna be "Rockin'" during the day too - they solved the problem of switching over. :(

That's exactly where I find myself now. Pirates is the only attraction on my must-do list when I'm in the Park.

Was.

The space in the Park that used to be home to a magical time machine is now host to a movie set from 2006.

BTW, still haven't seen the movie, but I feel like I've seen it five times already. The overpromotion of the thing is exhausting. Is anyone else getting weary of seeing Johnny Depp's mug peering out of everything from cereal and fruit rollup boxes to film development kiosks?

I've seen some of that, but not as much as you describe.

Depp may be stalking you.

I knew it. I tried to find it on the pad, but was unsuccessful. Must have been a victim of thread pudding.

Well, when will they be "switching over" then? Is it going to switch hourly or something?

I think he means that they fixed the switchover problem by not having to switch over. In other words they'll just run Rockin' Space Mountain all the time.

I hadn't heard that yet but then I obviously don't hear everything.

Well, I may be in the minority but there is just too much I love about Disneyland to let these changes sour my entire experience. With HM especially, the ride is still about 90% intact. I don't dig the attic like I used to, but there is more than enough of the original ride there to keep me coming back. The changes to Pirates are certainly more drastic but I'll keep riding to enjoy the parts that haven't changed or that have been enhanced to my satisfaction, such as the lightning scene. To discard the entire ride over these alterations makes as little sense to me as discarding the Jungle Cruise, which bears far less resemblance to the original than is the case with HM.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not particularly happy with many of the changes and it does diminish the magic, especially to have a human face among the other pirates. I'm just not going to let my AP lapse as a result. :)

Just my .02, of course.

I could be mistaken, but I think that projection has been there for a while (a couple of years).

The way I see it, you get a more "startling" first view of the ship after passing through a waterfall. Different to be sure, but still good in its own right.

I think the waterfall effect is a great addition, albeit with a price to pay (a small price to me, an unacceptable price for others).

Quite possible. I hadn't been on it in a while. I usually skip riding it if I am tired. I tend to fall alseep during the ride.

Just a theory from a distance-challenged bear....

I think the problem with the "It's Johnny Depp" syndrome is this:

When you have a face character, you dont run up to them and say "How do you do, lady that plays Mary Poppins" or even "How do you do, Julie Andrews Lookalike" No. You wave madly at her and yell out "Yoo-hoo, Mary !! " (actually, I do that to an awful lot of people, not all of them ladies, but I digress)

When you see an AA, however, it's like going to Madame Tussauds waxworks. You see it and say "What a good (or lousy) likemess of Johnny Depp" The fact that it is a mannekin and not a real person is what causes the interruption in your suspension of disbelief. When you see the live actor, you want it to be that character, and so your inner child kicks in and *voila* the person becomes the character for you (unless they're breaking character, which is another story).

There. Now I've said it. I feel better now.

:D

Some see Mary Poppins and want to be her... :D

My Dearest Master Cricket, If you insist on administrating inflammatory remarks like that, I shall simply have no choice but to put you over my knee and give you a taste of the hairbrush !

Do not tempt me, child.

Yours Faithfully

M. P.

Winds in the east, mist coming in,
Like somethin' is brewin' and bout to begin.
Can't put me finger on what lies in store,
But I fear what's to happen all happened before...
:D

But, she does have a point, GC.... :p

...anyway, off to bed now. Anyone have any Rrrrrrrrrrrum Punch? :D

Lashbear? Where did you come from? I was just having a conversation with... Whaa?!! She's gone! But Mary was here and now she's... Oh I don't know...
:D

I love you two.

Three.

The projection has been there for years, but they've changed it from a sword fight to (I guess) a bar brawl. I admit, I had no idea what they were trying to convey in shadows with the new projection. The old projection has the tinging sound of swords hiting.

That projection is one of my favorite things to point out to POTC newbies. People miss it all the time. In fact, I remember it when it was in the fire scene. It was projected up one of the alley walls.

But hasn't it been a brawl for a while? I know I've seen a chair being broken over the other person. Since I haven't seen the new ride yet, unless it is a made-up memory, it must be at least 8 months old.

I guess I need ride it again and pay more attention.

You know, I remember seeing both a brawl and a sword fight. (I know the sound effects were louder when the projection was on the fort near the Wicked Wench.) Maybe they are both part of the film loop? I also remember at one point there's a fist fight going on and one of the two gets hit with a barrel by a third person. But we only see the arms of the third person.

I recall the chair part, and I haven't been on the new POTC, nor do we have the projection in Florida (unless it was added in the refurb, which I have not seen yet).

Whatever it was, it's naught but a shadowy blob now.

It's gone through phases of clarity and shadowy blob since it's inception - so hopefully this is just a phase

Hehehe, seems they had to rush a few things in the zillion-dollar rehab.

Nope, it wasn't.

this must have been a bit bizarre for him:

Johnny Depp meets Captain Jack

:eek:

I hope it gave him nightmares.





Forever.

no doubt it did.

in his dream, the wheelbarrels of aztec gold keep comming and comming and comming.

Thanks for the link. I'd only seen pics. How weird is that? Too bad they didn't have him interacting with the first Capt Jack, it's the best one.

Now that I've finally been on the "updated" ride, I have an opinion. I'm sure you've all been waiting anxiously for my verdict.

I have mixed feelings. I don't think it's ruined, and I'm still going to want to go on it just as frequently as before, but I can definitely see why some would be irked.

I'm not opposed to the concept of adding a movie tie-in or two. There's a lot going on in there, and I'm sure there's room for a new animatronic or two. I think adding just the one Captain Jack with the dress forms (or possibly the one in the barrel instead, since the original barrel occupant is already gone) would have been cute. It's a good animatronic, it doesn't get in the way, and it would have been a suitable nod to a very successful film.

However, I think they went way overboard. I am giving a big two thumbs down to the Barbossa animatronic. Not only did it replace the iconic pirate captain, but it sucks. That's two strikes for the price of one. And geeze Louise what is up with all the references in the soundtrack? WTF? In my opinion, that's what tips things from "nod to the film" to "changing the ride." The ride is not about looking for Captain Jack. It's one thing to have Jack appear in the pirate town - he does go there from time to time, it seems. But to change the plot of the ride? Egads!

And that last Jack? Ewww! It's one thing to have anonymous, slightly cartoonish pirates whose movements aren't totally natural - but an animatronic based on an actual person? Not cool.

So, I'm not totally thrilled with the rehab, but it won't kill me. I hope that in a year or so there will be some sort of festive restoration of the original soundtrack.

So I take it you don't like the Mr. Lincoln attraction, or the hall of presidents in WDW?

I'm not keen on some parts of the Hall of Presidents, for much the same reasons. I give a pass to those attractions starring long-dead people, as we don't have video footage of their movements to compare. I realize you may not see the same distinction I do. This is just my opinion, which is essentially worthless. But I can suspend my disbelief long enough when either it's cartoony - or at least I don't have newsreels providing a comparison. Actually, it's more than that - the first Captain Jack is "neat", possibly because the motions are limited enough that they can appear realistic. The last one exposes the limitations of the art (or budget) and looks stupid. The face doesn't look the same, the movements are jerky, and instead of thinking "Wow! that's pretty realistic for an animatronic!" I think "Wow! That's stupid!"

No, no, no, no. Your opinions are not worthless! In fact I share the same opinion about the AA Jacks you do. The first two look real enough, but that last one never should have been installed.

However, being a big fan of both POTC movies and ride, and a Johnny fan, I find it hard to say that I don't like the change. To me the ride was getting old and dated. I liked the changes they made in the past, with the exception of the pirates chasing food.:rolleyes: