Sondheim wonders if Johnny Depp has the vocal chops for Sweeney Todd film
 

From the (UK) Sunday Times

Well, he's a bit too young for the role right now. Physically, at least. And though he has the charisma, it's really quite a difficult singing role.

I don't always like Burton, and I don't know if he'd add to or harm the material. Damn, I do love Sweeney, though.

I can understand the concern. I also understand Depp being bemused. But Gerard Butler (who sang in some rock bands, I think) couldn't even cut a pseudo opera like Phantom. After that musical hit the big screen, I'm not surprised a composer is demanding more of a vetting process for cinematic versions of their stage musicals.

Who else is supposed to be in the cast? I've seen many Todds ruined by an annoying Anthony (though the character is annoying on purpose, I think). And Mrs. Lovett, so far nobody can touch Angela Lansbury, though Patti Lupone isn't bad.

...and what about the Italian?

We're voting for Traci Ullman for Lovett. (Not that we have any say.)

Neil Patrick Harris makes a great Toby.

Niel Patrick Harris kicks serious Sondheim ass. We saw him in the B'way revival of Assassins. Wow.

Crap.

There is a movie where a young girl (I think) sees Sweeney Todd on stage in New York and then wants to redo it in her school talent show (or something like that).

And now I can't think of what movie that is and it is driving me bonkers.

Kevin Smith's bomb Jersey Girl. Ben Affleck plays her dad (and Sweeney).

Ah yes. Well, that is embarrassing.

In my defense though, I only saw the movie because it was one of the four movies on in roation during my Disney cruise. I never actually sat through the whole thing in one sitting but over the course of the week I ended up seeing it all in various bits and pieces.

Then you also saw Alex (who was in my graduating class at U of M.) He was Hinckley. He was also in the NY revival of Sweeney (which opened the week after we were in NY. Damn. It was such a cool concept, and we're big Sondheim fans.)

I'm sure you're right... if I can dig up the Playbill I'll let you know for sure. The Hinckley/Squeaky duet was great - "I am unworthy of your love..." Now I've got the darn thing stuck in my head.

I saw Doggie Howser play Mark in 'Rent' in LA. He was good. :)

Is he the Hinckely on the new soundtrack too?

I agree with what LSPE said originally, I think Depp is too young for the role.
But, far be it from me to say he cant do it based on age.
Though I do wish they would consider a man with a bit more age behind him to pull off that role.

And Landsbury... in order to come close to her, they will need to find a woman willing to make that role her own.
I have sang that role, never performed it, but sang. And that would NOT be a character I would like to attempt.

I'm curious to see where this goes.

Yep, that's him. (His father is the regular music director for Sondheim-- but he's quite good so I wouldn't call it nepotism.)

Well, I've been wrong about controversial casting choices before ...but, to me, Depp = Sweeney = blech.

All I can think about is his singing at the end of the Pirates ride. It always makes me grimace.

It's a-melodic and off key. Sounds perfect for Sondheim [/snide] (I actually really like Sweeney Todd, which is a rare thing for me and a Sondheim)

Riiiiight! (hee hee ;) ) IMO Jersey Girl is a cute movie. Not Kevin Smith's usual style, and made during the Bennifer years, but still a cute movie. Don't be embarrassed you saw it. I still respect you.

Jersey Girl is actually my first exposure to Sweeney Todd. I had heard of it, but never seen any production. I caught Patty and the revival cast's performance on the Tony's and it looks pretty interesting. (I don't really care about the awards, but record and fast-forward to see all of the performances). I was not surprised to hear Burton was making the theatrical version.

I love both Burton and Depp, they are a proven team, but I would like to see another actor in the part. Depp can be serious, silly, slashed, Sparrow, a snitch, a soldier, a sibling, psychadelic, sweet, silent, a sleuth, a sniffer, scary, sexy, smarmy. I just don't know if he can be a singer. (Cry Baby doesnt' count) We'll just have to wait and see.

(P.S. My friend saw Doogie in a play and he was NAKED!)

I think Burton could do a great Sweeny Todd - maybe they should just ditch the music?

Um, no.

Sweeney Todd the straight horror flick and Sweeney Todd, the Demon Barber of Fleet Street, the nearly operatic musical are two different animals ... and the former would likely be a mere shadow to the genius of the latter.


But for god's sake, ditch Depp.

<ignore>

It looks like Johnny got the part.

"Here Mr. Sondheim, we've arranged a demonstration of Mr. Depp's vocal skills. For acoustical reasons we'll be doing it over here next to this very large suitcase full of money. Sadly, Mr. Depp pulled a muscle while carrying it in so hopefully you won't mind but he'll be leaving it behind for you to dispose of."

Apropos of nothing, I once performed the role of Pirelli in a production of this brilliant musical.

I'm with those who don't see Depp as a good choice. Maybe Depp will surprise me, but I really can't imagine his often fey speaking voice having the kind of blood and thunder Todd would need. I really hope this movie won't suck, because it's one of the greatest musicals of any era.

Oh, D, we are completely of one mind. Please, god, let this not suck.

Well, at least there's a DVD of the George Hearne / Angela Lansbury version out there. I was initially bummed that it didn't include Len Cariou in the title role, but Hearne was pretty darn good...
If the Burton version sucks, at least we'll have something to watch.

Any word on who will play Mrs Lovett?

I've seen nothing, and just searched and still see nothing.
Tons of rumors, but nothing even near as concrete as Depp.

Who's playing the role on Broadway? Is it still LuPone?

Nope. Not a rumor. Story in the Times today.

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment...,5853643.story

My guess would be Helena Bonham Carter

and my guess is certain suckitude.

I'm not basing that on the obvious miscasting of Depp ... I and many others have been wrong before with "obvious" miscasting that turned out to be brilliant.

Instead, I'm basing it on Burton's record of adapted works vs. original works. He sucks at adaptation, imo. And so, dear friends, this.will.suk.

NNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Never fear - I just heard they got Jennifer Tilley instead ! :evil:

Catherine O'Hara?

I'm extremely curious to see where this all goes. I have many doubts, and like most of you can't picure Depp in the role, but at the same time I'm intrigued.

I don't necesarily think Depp is to young as far as actual age, just in the way that we are used to seeing him as more youthful and attractive. My problem is that I picture Sweeney being a bit larger and much more imposing physically. Interestingly enough, my local community theater just cast a production of the show with a guy who youngish, attractive and built like Depp. So perhaps seeing his performance might give me a slightly different perspective.

Reading things about Sondheim's protectiveness over his work actually gives me a bit more hope than I had when I first read about a possible film a few months back. The way that the remainder of the cast is filled out will most likely steer a bit more towards either optimism or skepticism. It's a shame Wlaken just signed on to Hairspray, because I could see him fitting in well with a Burton Sweeney.

Walken would have been an excellent Sweeney (if he had the vocal chops.)

Where's Marni Nixon when you need her?

Have Angela Lansbury do the Marni Nixon memorial voice over. One of my most treasured thater memories was seeing this in SF with Lansbury and Len Cariou.

Oh wow - I remember Marni Nixon. This is a true nostalgia week for me. Bing bong bang it's boomerang!

We saw Ang and Len do "A Little Priest" last summer at the Hollywood Bowl's celebration of Sondheim's 75th birthday. It was thrilling, but she doesn't have the range anymore, sadly.

I have seen the trailer.

And me personally? I will have vengeance. Particularly if so much of the songs has been changed into dialogue. And for the record, sir, it's not "vennnnnnnnnngeannnnnce," it's "veeeeeeeeengeaaaaance." Nasal much?

(Also, through a strange and fortuitous coincidence, I have heard the last third of the film's audio. Maybe not the last third. It sounded to me like it was missing a bit of a reel: it didn't end the way it usually does. God I HOPE it was a missing reel, and not revisionist resolution.)

If you can't tell... the musical is... kind of... my favorite thing ever.

Have a little Priest, LSPE

I saw this in SF with Lansbury and George Hearn in 1981 (I think) in the original staging. It was awesome.

I love Depp, but now I need to go back and re-read this thread, oput of sight, off my radar and all that!

And I can't watch videos at work any longer.....1984 all over again! At least I can still post on LoT.

The clip seems to de-emphasize that this is a musical. Hmmm.

It looks pretty.

I can't find it now but I read something from Sondheim a few days ago saying that the movie "isn't a Broadway musical."

I may be misremembering the quote since I am not finding it again but whatever it was I came away from reading it with the expectation that "musicalness" was seriously curtailed.

Urg.....Trailer looks inappropriately pretentious....and yet Alan Rickman is in it, which means I have to see it.

Ding Ding Ding........Alan Rickman and Timothy Spall

Saw that too. Yes, he was :snap:

I'm withholding judgement on this. It could be the best movie musical since Chicago, or the biggest dissapointment since Phantom (or even Evita). I've done Sweeney twice, on a small stage, and a big stage, and I do love the piece, so I'm hopeful.

I like Depp, Burton, Carter and Rickman. Whether they have the musical chops or not has yet to be seen. (Okay, I think Burton does.) On an encouraging note, the bulk of the cast seems to have been pulled from West End stages rather than movie people, so at least some of them should know what they're doing.

ron

My thoughts exactly. If it's any good at all it stands to be this generation's lightning rod for gothness. It's so nice to see Depp in spooky makeup again. :)

I'm no expert in ST (saw a high school production) so I'm sure my opinion will completely differ from the dedicated fans.



Hey, was that Sasha Baron Cohen I saw briefly in there??

Yep. He is playing Signor Adolfo Pirelli (at least according to IMDB)

This looks fun, actually.

But count me in the camp that wants to decapitate the next Hollywood person to decide that sung lines should be spoken over their music. Little Lotte indeed.

I'm reserving judgment too. But Chicago was the worst movie musical of the last 20 years (or at least the worst well-regarded one) so I think we're both reserving very different judgments.

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA?!?!!?

I thought they did an awesome job with Chicago! I mean, yeah I missed "Me and My Baby", which was reduced to background music for a montage, BUT, I thought the director did a terrific job of giving it a theatrical feel without making it look like they just filmed the stage play.

(Though that can work too, Into The Woods being a good example, speaking of Sondheim)

As did I. Twice, as a poor student.

If I could have afforded it, I would have gone twice! but I spent many a morning putting the soundtrack on in the morning and singing along as I got ready for work.

Woah.... I *almost* agree with Alex on something :P Chicago was not *the* worst, but I definitely felt it was vastly VASTLY overrated. I like the music (from the movie), I freaking LOVE the staged musical.... but the movie was sort of meh. A pale imitation of Chicago, with none of the fun or the emotional oomph. Not particularly cast well IMHO either. I went to a sing-a-long of Chicago (the movie) once which was fun, but that was because it was a singalong!

Back to Sweeny:

I think it is wierd that the trailer tries to veer away from the fact that it is a musical. There are a LOT of songs. There is a LOT of singing. I had read that it was to get people to see the movie that wouldn't normally go if they knew it was a musical. (yeah, that's a good way to make people happy, people just love being taken for a bait-and-switch).

I think it looks good, but I still see Johnny as so pretty boy, not scary or imposing at all -- but I'll reserve judgment until I've seen the whole movie. Sascha Baron Cohen as Pirelli is just awesome.

Actually, it appears there may not be a lot of songs OR singing. I found Alex's quote in question here: http://www.chud.com/index.php?type=news&id=11953

I know from my accidental overhearing of the film that, as of this cut, "Not While I'm Around" is in. And presumably "A Little Priest," seeing as the reprise is in place. And presumably "By the Sea," presuming that the technicolor seaside scenes in the trailer are in Lovett's mind.

Yes, I agree it looks well-shot and interestingly designed (and I totally love the chair design in particular.) I guess my sadness is that I so deeply love the entire score-- from "attend the tale" to "fleet street"... and I, as yet, have no evidence that the prologue/epilogue will be included.

I always say-- I can judge the potential of a production of Sweeney by the quality of the factory whistle. I guess I will wait to hear it before I really make any judgments. I know it isn't going to be the original production-- nor is it supposed to be-- but it's hard to see your favorite thing (a favorite thing you very much want to do, yourself) in the hands of someone else.

Worst pies in London, anyone?

I thought the musical was okay, other friends LOVED it. Of course, I prefer the 1927 silent film version, ahem. :blush:

This is me as well. I love the show, and I'm so far loving the look of the film, but what matters most to me is the music. I'm reserving judgement until I hear more of it. I am a bit concerned about the lack of the prologue/epilogue though. I know there were several actors cast as "ghosts" early on and the rumor was that they would sing those bits, but then those characters got cut somewhere along the line. I have no solid evidence other than the castings and the cuttings, but it does seem scarily plausible.

I admit I'm a huge fan of Sondheim's Sweeney Todd. I saw the original production on Broadway with Len Cariou, and have since enjoyed a number of different revivals and "re-imaginings".

While my love for Tim Burton has vanished since the atrocious Planet of the Apes remake, I like the look of this movie (or at least the trailer). And if it even has a bit of the original musical in it, I'll bet I'll enjoy it.

And if the music doesn't hold up, there's still the George Hearn/Angela Lansbury DVD from "Great Performances," so at least this won't be the only video recording of the show.

(and I still love Alan Parker's Evita)

Wow, and I thought that Evita was unwatchable (even tho I do like the music, especially the orchestrations, to the movie version). Montage, anyone? Oh wait, let's have another montage. Oh oops we almost had a scene, but just kidding we're going to make it a montage. It's a textbook case of "what works on stage may not work cinematically".

Plus Morrigoon and I emphatically agree that whoever did Jonathan Pryce's makeup in that movie made him look like an anthromorphic turtle. :cool:

Back to sweeny: Tim Burton stuff is so hit-and-miss (The good: Batman, Edward Scissorhands, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. The bad: Corpse Bride, Planet of the Apes)... it's hard to tell from the trailer.

But I agree with others, it is all about the music. I think that "Not While I'm Around" is just as important as the Prologue ("Attend the tale of Sweeny Todd...") and "A Little Priest" (the end of the trailer seems to show the lead in to that song), so I seriously hope they don't cut it.

Movie musicals are always a weird thing with me anyway -- it takes a bit for me to get away from the "oh, that's different than the play and I like the way they did it in the play better" type mentality. I don't expect them to film the play either (again what works on stage may not work cinematically) but there's a point at which you gut the underlying work so much that what made the underlying work good is lost in translation entirely.

But, for example, would you like Hello, Dolly! better onstage, do you think?

I agree about Evita. I enjoyed it well enough because of the music, but it struck me as having too many unnecessary cuts to prove it was a realistic movie, not a stage play.

I liked Chicago. I thought it did justice to the stagey, Brechtian, blah, blah, blah of the story.

To be fair, if I think about it in a vacuum it is merely a thoroughly mediocre movie musical. But it receives 5 billion additional demerits for accumulating so much thoroughly unwarranted praise including one of the great Best Picture boners of all time (though not the greatest).

Wow. So much hatred for Chicago. It's almost enough to make me sad if I cared about other people's opinions. Perhaps this is a discussion better had elsewhere so as not to derail this thread, but why is it that so many of you don't care for the film version. Is it because the stage version you know and love is the current incarnation? Because frankly, I don't care for the concert style staging they've been doing for the last 10 years or so. I much preffer it done in period, as it was originally and again in the movie. But I could just be completely biased based on my own experience with the show.

I've never seen the stage version.

I like movie musicals, I just found Chicago to be boring, poorly performed, horribly choreographed, a really stupid story (this likely being a flaw in the stage version as well), and I didn't like a single person in the movie. In other words, my only coherent response I can make to the question "why don't you like it is" is "I don't see how anybody would."


And before the "but that's just you're opinion" I'll just say of course it is just my opinion.

As far as Sweeney Todd, if it has gone the way of a halfway musical that probably isn't a good thing (go balls to the wall or go home is my general opinion such things) but I'll wait and see. I also have never seen the stage version of this. All I know about Sweeney Todd are the bits in Jersey Girl.

I loved Chicago. In fact, I'd say the exact opposite of Alex - wonderfully performed, tight story, great choreography, timely issues. Just sayin'.

Yes, almost no musical in the trailer. This will be interesting to say the least, oh yes, I will see it, no question about it. It looks lush, that's for sure. Spall as Beadle will be great, as well. Rickman, I will enjoy, tremendously.

Now to break out the Sweeney Todd soundtrack (original) which will color my opinion of the film, no matter how good/creative or well done it may be.

I'm not a fan of the musical but I am looking forward to seeing Tim Burton's take on Sweeney. From what I've seen in the preview it looks fun! Who needs great singing when Johnny is slashing?

Not very good sound quality, but here's some audio from the sneak preview last week. "Johanna."

I am not unhappy - and that's saying a lot!

LS: you can find the original with Angela Lansbury in 16 parts on YouTube :)

Very cool! Thanks for the tip!

Or, in our DVD rack! ;) Heh, thanks- you never know when you might need to pull out a little Sweeney. (Or a little priest.)

Saw the new (very musical) commercial on TV. I got chills. This could be good...

I HAVE to see this film now. ...and the one with Angela.

1997 posts. Yay. A good year.

The full website is up - complete with a music player which offers A Little Priest, as well as some of By the Sea, Epiphany, Green Finch and Linnet Bird, Johanna, No Place Like London, Pirelli's Miracle Elixir, Pretty Women, and Worst Pies in London. So basically... everything. Or nearly.

And I think it sounds pretty good, all things considered. I miss "The Ballad of Sweeney Todd." I'll get over it.

Just the cinematography alone would be worth the price of admission- it's gorgeous. I am not a musical fan, but I will definitely be seeing this!

Of course you're not a musical fan. This is a musical fan:

Quote:

Press the big red (sic) button to experience a cooling breeze accompanied by music.

Butthead.;):p

I just loaded a Sweeney Todd screensaver- looks very cool!

They are simply advertising that the thing won't work: they tell you to push the red button to make it work. But since there is no red button, it won't!

Hmmph - I listened to "Priest" - and I'm a little more optimistic about Depp's vocal performance (not as muscular as I'd like, but better than I was expecting), but Carter's Mrs. Lovett leaves me worried. She's so slight on her delivery here, it sounds as though she doesn't even get her own jokes. Ugh. The gorgeous orchestration is doing a lot of the heavy lifting here, as well.

VH1 had a great 30 minute piece on ST. It looks to me like it will be very good, and surprisingly, Depp looks to pull off singing! Now, I have never seen ANY ST before (just the little mention of it in Jersy Girl :blush: ) so I hardly have an opinion. But as a stand alone movie this looks good!

I just listened to the complete soundtrack. I'm still looking forward to the movie, but I now know where the edits lie and the deficiencies are...


All that said, I'm still excited to see the movie, but at least I have a better idea of what to expect.

Friday, Friday, Friday! Who's coming with me?

me

Will it be playing in the Dome??

We know it's in the Arclight - not sure about the dome.

Here's a review from the AP critic