A nation racked with fear.

[Moonliner]

There must be someone, a group, a website, an organization, someone out there. Who are they?

Someone must feel the same way I do. Fear is gripping this country, fear is driving policy, fear is percolating throughout our society and it's all a bunch of hogwash. There are not Al-qa’ida bugaboo's hiding under every rock. We are not "at war". This nation was "attacked" by a grand total of 19 people. Hell that's not even a full platoon. Hardly an invasion force worthy of the "war" cry. We do nothing but give them strength by running around like a bunch of stirred up ants and for what?

The reaction of this country is just loony, we are spending vast amounts of money as a placebo for security. Money that will not be spent, improving roads, on medical research, superfund cleanup, etc.. How many untold thousands will die because a bridge collapsed, a new drug was not developed or toxic waste seeped into that playground?

Has all this airport security had any effect? I don't think so. Given that all the new security has caught exactly ZERO terrorists, and no more planes have fallen out of the sky you have to conclude there simply has been no threat.

Bag checks at sporting events and amusement parks? What a bunch of hooey. Much more stringent measures than that have had little effect on the suicide bombers in Israel. Again, I've never heard of a single case where someone was stopped with a bomb or some such at a bag check and yet nothing has blown up. So again we are left to conclude there just is no threat.

In Minnesota, the school had metal detector plus a security guard. What happened? The psycho kid just shot the security guard first then walked into the school anyway. Killers and Terrorists have a funny way of not following your rules so the type of “security” being used is pointless.

It's time to put some sense back into this country. Yes, we need an effective intelligence service that is free to operate overseas, yes we need some freedom for the FBI to peruse potential criminals here in the US but we don't need an entire economy driven by fear.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Originally Posted by Moonliner

There must be someone, a group, a website, an organization, someone out there. Who are they?

Someone must feel the same way I do.

I'm right there with you.

And so are:

http://www.airamericaradio.com/

http://www.harryshearer.com/

http://www.michaelmoore.com/

http://slate.msn.com/

http://mediamatters.org/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/

Let the flamers flame. Like I give a sh*t.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

I couldn't agree more. Fear wins elections. This is why there have been no terror alerts since then. No need now.

WASHINGTON — The Bush administration periodically put the USA on high alert for terrorist attacks even though then-Homeland Security chief Tom Ridge argued there was only flimsy evidence to justify raising the threat level, Ridge now says.
Ridge, who resigned Feb. 1, said Tuesday that he often disagreed with administration officials who wanted to elevate the threat level to orange, or "high" risk of terrorist attack, but was overruled.

Let's see how airport security is...

Last week, reports from several government departments confirmed what most business travelers and other frequent fliers already knew: after spending more than $5 billion in federal funds on the agency, airport security is hardly any better now than it was before 9/11.

Created to impose tight federal control over commercial airport security after the 2001 terrorist attacks, the agency continues to get failing or barely passing grades. Covert screening tests by the Government Accountability Office and the inspector general for the Department of Homeland Security showed virtually no improvement in overall screener performance since similarly poor performance reviews last year, said Representative John L. Mica, the Florida Republican who is chairman of the House aviation subcommittee.

And the borders and ports security? Well, that hasn't been paid much attention to either. In my mind, this only leaves two options. Either there isn't much of a threat and the administration is just making crap up to scare people into keeping them in power, or this administration is completely inept at handling the security of this nation. Either way, they don't come out looking very well.

[scaeagles]

I see no "nation racked with fear". I really don't. I don't see this - "Fear is gripping this country, fear is driving policy, fear is percolating throughout our society".

I agree that money being spent is not being spent wisely or well. Airport security is a joke. It is the attitude of "we have to look like we're doing something". I think it's all a CYA thing so that if something happens they can say "we were doing everything we could".

Well, they are doing what they can without taking any real stands.

How can a free and open society really be "secure"? It cannot happen. The only thing I really think could be done better is border security, and that is even a painful and unpopular thing internationally. The only thing I can see to do is to utilize imminent domain and purchase all land along the border in order to build a wall - one that cannot be tunnelled under easily not scaled over easily.

As far as monitoring ship yards - it is an impossible task. How many millions of containers come in here a month? They cannot all be gone over. Spot inspections doesn't do it.

I am amazed how those who say "nothing is being done" scoff at the Patriot Act. The phrase "trading freedom for security" implies that freedom is usually without it. Impossible things are expected. Protect us but take away no rights and do not interfere with the free and open society. I say that is impossible.

Though not the "expressed reasons" for going to war in Iraq, the fact is that Al Qaeda is now doing their fighting and plotting there in a survival effort rather than launching offensives at the US.

Do not take this post as meaning that I am satisfied with what is happening security wise. I am simply being honest in the assessment that it isn't possible. The only thing that can realistically be done better is border security, but we have one hell of a lot of borders (north, south, the two oceans, and the gulf of Mexico) to control. Not even that is possible.

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Moonliner

no more planes have fallen out of the sky you have to conclude there simply has been no threat.

Cannot agree with you here. Intelligence works in such a way that it is usually not possible to report on successes or plots stopped. It has the possibility of giving away too much of how our intelligence is gathered.

[SacTown Chronic]

I know lots o' folks who voted for Bush because they perceived him to be "strong on terror". Whatever the hell that means. Keep telling people the sky is purple and eventually a fair chunk of 'em will start to believe it.

[wendybeth]

I stopped being afraid a long time ago. Now, I'm mostly just reallly pissed. So are more and more people- this whole environment of fear that is being perpetuated by the powers that be so that they may remain in power will eventually fail, and result in the inevitable backlash. I've no doubt that there are many who wish us harm, but those threats have always been there, in one form or another.

[Moonliner]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Cannot agree with you here. Intelligence works in such a way that it is usually not possible to report on successes or plots stopped. It has the possibility of giving away too much of how our intelligence is gathered.

I'm not talking about the intelligence folks, they are our best security.

I'm talking about the TSA and all the purse checking dullards that work at baseball games and theme parks. You know you'ed hear about it if a screener at DFW or JFK found a passenger with 30lbs of cimtex strapped to their tush.

[Name]

I've been racking my brain the last couple days to weeks pondering what has really changed on sept 11th, and I don't mean perceptions.

It has occured to me that nothing that was true on sept 10th wasn't true on sept 11th(except the blatently obvious that planes flew into the towers). On sept 10th, Al Qaeda was a threat, on the 11th it was realized, and on the 12th and all days after they were(and are) still a threat, no change at all.

On the 10th we had homeless and unemployment problems, and we still do.

On the 10th we had people dying of diseases that with research we could find a cure, and we still do. etc etc. But in reality, absolutely nothing changed on the 11th, nothing, nada, zero, except a threat was realized, and many more people became aware that there was a threat out there(a threat that has been out there for years, if not decades).

And as it was on the 10th, and the early morning of the 11th, the threat is still out there, and no matter what the US govt tries to do with security regulations, they will probably be in vain. The threats against us seem to be pretty smart puppies, and odds are, no matter what regulations the govt imposes on us to try to prevent another similar event, its always possible that the threat could find a loophole or workaround.

I think its best to just hope that the intel community is able to detect an impending attack before it happens, cause forcing stupid laws on the american people isn't going to prevent anything.

just my opinion.

[Moonliner]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I see no "nation racked with fear". I really don't. I don't see this - "Fear is gripping this country, fear is driving policy, fear is percolating throughout our society".

Well there are load of examples of "percolating" every time a plane crashes, a building colapses or a train derails, what's the first thing you hear? "Was it terrorists?"

Even the disney themed boards we visit are laced with posts about potential threats that in reality just don't exist. 1 2 3
(I especially like the last one where the poster thinks that a mall bag check will stop a nuclear device....)

Policy, from the "patriot act" to the creation of the homeland defence bureaucracy is also all around us.