Anti-flag burning amendment passes first hurdle

[Ghoulish Delight]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8318974/

The House has passed the amendment by the required 2/3 majority. All signs seem to point to the senate to do the same. After that, it's on to the states.

What a blatant disregard of speech. Disagree with it all you want, but to ban it? Of course, passing it as an amendment automatically makes it Constitutional, by definition. But that doesn't mean it should be done, and it doesn't change the fact that it goes completely against the spirit of the first amendment. Is the patriotism of these people so weak that it's threatened by what happens to a piece of cloth? Is their faith in this country's ideals so shaky that they need to silence a method of expressing a dissenting opinion?

Magician Penn and Teller performed one of the most moving acts I've ever seen that last time this idiotic amendment made the rounds. They burnt a flag saying (I'm paraphrasing, I don't recall the exact script), "We're doing this not because we don't like what this flag stands for, but precisely because we love what this flag stands for and that we have the freedom to do this." And, to alegorically, metaphorically, and magically drive their point home, they, of course, produce said same flag, undamaged, to signify that burning a flag does no damage to what that flag stands for.

If and when this assault on freedom of expression reaches the state polls, I'd urge all patriotic and freedom loving Americans to vote against it.

[SacTown Chronic]

But Rep. Jerrold Nadler, D-N.Y., said, “If the flag needs protection at all, it needs protection from members of Congress who value the symbol more than the freedoms that the flag represents.”

Amen, brother.

[Prudence]

I predict that this will pass. Fully and completely.

Because the American people have apparently decided that they no longer want liberty. They've grown up in a privileged society, so far removed from true tyranny that gosh, a benevolent dictatorship doesn't sound that bad, does it?

Gosh, there could be rules and laws to make sure your neighbors didn't paint their house the wrong color, or invite any of THOSE people over to play in the neighborhood pool, or park any older model cars where they might actually be seen.

And everyone could be monitored to make sure they didn't have any bad habits that might have a social cost down the line. After all, if we erradicate junk food, we'll erradicate disease! If you get cancer or diabetes, you must have been sneaking in some black market junk food and you deserve your fate.

Personally, I long for the days when we can rid our country of our most pressing scourge -- activist judges. All those black-robed commies giving aid and comfort to our enemies by support flag desecration. Why, let's impeach them! Let's show them what we do to national traitors!

Let's go back to those Puritan ideals this country was founded on. Let's be the shining city on a hill, the model of a fully functional Christian theocracy. Let us return to mandatory church attendance and public shaming.

And with those activist judges out of the picture, let's bring back trial by ordeal! After all, God loves this country best and will spare the lives of all TRUE innocents.

It truly is better when everyone knows their place. And the only people afraid of unannounced surveillance or national ID cards are criminals. After all, if you just follow the very simple rules you'll have nothing to worry about! Just speak when spoken to from this script of pre-approved phrases.

Let us scrape away the stain of the sin they call "progress." Because progressive thinking is permissive thinking. And if people can do whatever they want, they they'll do things we don't like. They'll talk to people we don't approve of. They'll say things we don't want to hear.

And that would just be un-American.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by LoT

You must spread some Mojo around before giving it to Prudence again.

.................................................. ...........................................

[Cadaverous Pallor]

You must spread some Mojo around before giving it to Prudence again.

You continue to improve my views of lawyers. (Oh right, there is iSm too... )

[Prudence]

Just wait...tomorrow I'll tell you how I *really* feel!

[FEJ]

TITLE 4 > CHAPTER 1 > § 8

§ 8. Respect for flag

Release date: 2005-05-17

No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.
(a) The flag should never be displayed with the union down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property.
(b) The flag should never touch anything beneath it, such as the ground, the floor, water, or merchandise.
(c) The flag should never be carried flat or horizontally, but always aloft and free.
(d) The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free. Bunting of blue, white, and red, always arranged with the blue above, the white in the middle, and the red below, should be used for covering a speaker’s desk, draping the front of the platform, and for decoration in general.
(e) The flag should never be fastened, displayed, used, or stored in such a manner as to permit it to be easily torn, soiled, or damaged in any way.
(f) The flag should never be used as a covering for a ceiling.
(g) The flag should never have placed upon it, nor on any part of it, nor attached to it any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture, or drawing of any nature.
(h) The flag should never be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, carrying, or delivering anything.
(i) The flag should never be used for advertising purposes in any manner whatsoever. It should not be embroidered on such articles as cushions or handkerchiefs and the like, printed or otherwise impressed on paper napkins or boxes or anything that is designed for temporary use and discard. Advertising signs should not be fastened to a staff or halyard from which the flag is flown.
(j) No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart.
(k) The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning.

Source: US Flag Code


so then that would become illegal also?

I find it more disrespectful when others fail to follow the other codes, like wearing upon clothing/uniforms of sports teams, or a dirty flag that has been out since September 11th.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Ah the flag code. AKA, "The Guide to Flag Idolatry". Interesting thing about the flag code. It's not a criminal offense to break it.

[sleepyjeff]

I have a deep hatred for anyone who burns the American Flag.....it shows a complete lack of respect for those who died for it and in most cases is done out of hatred towards this country..........but a ban on burning it doesn't sit too well with me either.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Thing is, I totally dig the flag code. I respect the flag as much as anyone. But that's my own POV - I don't think it should be the law.

The idea of jailing people for doing something to a piece of cloth is ridiculous to me, even if I wouldn't do it.