The death penalty - Page 2

innerSpaceman · 03-02-2005, 05:36 PM

I'm against it. And I'll murder anybody who feels differently.

Not Afraid · 03-02-2005, 06:08 PM

Let's be clear and relatively unrealistic here.

Someone burtally murders one of my loved one - and I do mean brutally - they deserve justice held by the court system and then, if so decided upon by a jury if their peers (like that's going to happen) they deserve to die some awful death. Buh bye. Now, if this person gets off or doesn't get caught, I will possible go Wild West on them and do the justice myself. But, I have genes that go waaaaaay back to former justice systems and, that's beyond my control.

innerSpaceman · 03-02-2005, 06:11 PM

Blind and toothless, anyone?

Not Afraid · 03-02-2005, 06:18 PM

Is that me?
I am blind. But, I di have all of my teeth. And they're in pretty good condition!

lizziebith · 03-02-2005, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not Afraid

go Wild West on them and do the justice myself.

Oooooh. Details please on going Wild West on them...

O.K. I'm sick.

And I really don't want the world to be blind and toothless.

Good reminder, ISM.

Gemini Cricket · 03-02-2005, 06:58 PM

Every life is sacred until he does something wrong and then we get to kill him. (He might have been the right guy...)

I don't understand this logic. Especially when it comes from pious supporters of Bush whom god chose.

Confused? Don't be. Just agree.

lizziebith · 03-02-2005, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemini Cricket

Every life is sacred

Isn't that "every sperm is sacred...?"

Nephythys · 03-02-2005, 07:25 PM

GD-as I recall, given that abortion is a LEGAL Issue- and people get into such a twit about Roe V. Wade and the loss of LEGAL protections to abortion- then I would say the gov't giving us LEGAL permission to KILL the unborn is pretty much the same thing....and IMO a murderer frankly gave up their "right to life" the moment they chose to take someone else's life away.

.....and no one said a damn thing about a sperm being sacred....I made my comment non-personal and by no means snide....but I guess people who think the "right" to kill a baby they don't want is so valuable has nothing better to do than be snide to someone who feels otherwise.

We've been through the death penalty thing before- if used effectively it should be a deterrent, now all it has become is a life sentence to being a drain on the public financially, painful to the family who lost someone they loved, and a cash cow for the lawyers.

There should be a limit to the number of appeals- there should be a time limit to how long you can battle it- and it should be used quickly and efficiently.

All this lovely touchy feely stuff making yourself feel like you are more compassionate because you don't think it's right to put a killer to death (on the offhand chance that they may be innocent-which of course shows so much faith in the justice system) makes zero sense to me in the face of some of the other "values" held so dearly in this crowd.

I'm sorry- I really am..I should never never never have stepped in this thread. My apologies- please, continue feeling good about not wanting to get rid of murderers by giving them the same end they doled out so graciously to others.

I'm genuinely sorry- now I really am done. I think I'll go write a poem for CP.

Gemini Cricket · 03-02-2005, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lizziebith

Isn't that "every sperm is sacred...?"

Great, thank you very much, lizziebith. Now the song is stuck in my head with the singing and many children and the Cleese-ing and Idle-ing...

Prudence · 03-02-2005, 08:01 PM

I'm not sure it's accurate to equate the death penalty with abortion. There are contextual issues. If you're going to argue that killing is killing, then I don't see how you can make exceptions for war. War is killing in context. The death penalty is killing in context. Abortion is killing in context. I'm sure there are more examples I haven't thought of just now. And you will find people on both sides of each of these issues, and I'd wager that most people are on one side for some and one side for others.

Abortion seems to be the biggest hot button, so let's use war and the death penalty as hypotheticals.

Hypothetically, I might frame war as killing in the context of political conflict (let's hear it for understatements!) And I might hypothetically say war X is "good" and that we have the right, nay obligation, to kill if necessary to achieve a specific political end.

Contrariwise, I might frame the death penalty in the context of legal punishment, and hypothetically hold that I don't think death is appropriate when applied as a punishment.

Sometimes I think the only hope for humans as a species is to discuss issues in context and strive to understand why someone has reached a conclusion opposite ours -- especially conclusions that appear to us so clearly wrong as to indicate the other party has taken leave of their senses. The further you trace back your reasoning, the more likely you are to discover the initial kernal of dissention. And you won't resolve anything until you've uncovered and dealt with that. And thus simple solutions never are. Perhaps more emphasis on uncovering essential differences of value and less emphasis on surfance manifestations alleged to be "values" would be more constructive and lead to solutions not yet imagined.

But then again, as was once said about a girl in a rabbit hole: "She generally gave herself very good advice, (though she very seldom followed it)"

03-02-2005, 05:36 PM	#11
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	I'm against it. And I'll murder anybody who feels differently.
	Submit to Quotes

03-02-2005, 06:08 PM	#12
Not Afraid HI! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 17,108	Let's be clear and relatively unrealistic here. Someone burtally murders one of my loved one - and I do mean brutally - they deserve justice held by the court system and then, if so decided upon by a jury if their peers (like that's going to happen) they deserve to die some awful death. Buh bye. Now, if this person gets off or doesn't get caught, I will possible go Wild West on them and do the justice myself. But, I have genes that go waaaaaay back to former justice systems and, that's beyond my control.
	Submit to Quotes

03-02-2005, 06:11 PM	#13
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	Blind and toothless, anyone?
	Submit to Quotes

03-02-2005, 06:18 PM	#14
Not Afraid HI! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 17,108	Is that me? I am blind. But, I di have all of my teeth. And they're in pretty good condition!
	Submit to Quotes

03-02-2005, 06:58 PM	#16
Gemini Cricket ... Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,244	Every life is sacred until he does something wrong and then we get to kill him. (He might have been the right guy...) I don't understand this logic. Especially when it comes from pious supporters of Bush whom god chose. Confused? Don't be. Just agree.
	Submit to Quotes

03-02-2005, 07:25 PM	#18
Nephythys Yeah, that's about it- Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: In a state of constant crap to get done Posts: 2,688	GD-as I recall, given that abortion is a LEGAL Issue- and people get into such a twit about Roe V. Wade and the loss of LEGAL protections to abortion- then I would say the gov't giving us LEGAL permission to KILL the unborn is pretty much the same thing....and IMO a murderer frankly gave up their "right to life" the moment they chose to take someone else's life away. .....and no one said a damn thing about a sperm being sacred....I made my comment non-personal and by no means snide....but I guess people who think the "right" to kill a baby they don't want is so valuable has nothing better to do than be snide to someone who feels otherwise. We've been through the death penalty thing before- if used effectively it should be a deterrent, now all it has become is a life sentence to being a drain on the public financially, painful to the family who lost someone they loved, and a cash cow for the lawyers. There should be a limit to the number of appeals- there should be a time limit to how long you can battle it- and it should be used quickly and efficiently. All this lovely touchy feely stuff making yourself feel like you are more compassionate because you don't think it's right to put a killer to death (on the offhand chance that they may be innocent-which of course shows so much faith in the justice system) makes zero sense to me in the face of some of the other "values" held so dearly in this crowd. I'm sorry- I really am..I should never never never have stepped in this thread. My apologies- please, continue feeling good about not wanting to get rid of murderers by giving them the same end they doled out so graciously to others. I'm genuinely sorry- now I really am done. I think I'll go write a poem for CP.
	Submit to Quotes

03-02-2005, 08:01 PM	#20
Prudence Beelzeboobs, Esq. Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Gavel - I haz it Posts: 6,287	I'm not sure it's accurate to equate the death penalty with abortion. There are contextual issues. If you're going to argue that killing is killing, then I don't see how you can make exceptions for war. War is killing in context. The death penalty is killing in context. Abortion is killing in context. I'm sure there are more examples I haven't thought of just now. And you will find people on both sides of each of these issues, and I'd wager that most people are on one side for some and one side for others. Abortion seems to be the biggest hot button, so let's use war and the death penalty as hypotheticals. Hypothetically, I might frame war as killing in the context of political conflict (let's hear it for understatements!) And I might hypothetically say war X is "good" and that we have the right, nay obligation, to kill if necessary to achieve a specific political end. Contrariwise, I might frame the death penalty in the context of legal punishment, and hypothetically hold that I don't think death is appropriate when applied as a punishment. Sometimes I think the only hope for humans as a species is to discuss issues in context and strive to understand why someone has reached a conclusion opposite ours -- especially conclusions that appear to us so clearly wrong as to indicate the other party has taken leave of their senses. The further you trace back your reasoning, the more likely you are to discover the initial kernal of dissention. And you won't resolve anything until you've uncovered and dealt with that. And thus simple solutions never are. Perhaps more emphasis on uncovering essential differences of value and less emphasis on surfance manifestations alleged to be "values" would be more constructive and lead to solutions not yet imagined. But then again, as was once said about a girl in a rabbit hole: "She generally gave herself very good advice, (though she very seldom followed it)" __________________ traguna macoities tracorum satis de
	Submit to Quotes