Should children be forced to stand and say the Pledge of Allegience?

[Alex]

One of the great things the Jehovah's Witnesses did for this country was, I thought, settling this issue back in 1943 in an example of one of the Supreme Courts fastest reversals of itself and was part of the key bits of Supreme Court case law that have established the modern understanding of the First Amendment.

In 1940 they issued a ruling that creating just the communal civic pride was sufficient interest for state schools to require recitation of the pledge of allegiance.

That ruling was viewed by many as official sanction of the idea that Jehovah's Witnesses were un-American and traitorous. In the next two years thousands of children were expelled from schools and there were a couple thousand recorded cases of violence against Jehovah's Witnesses (in Kennebunkport, Maine, for example, the sheriff assisted in burning down a Kingdom Hall though he thoughtfully assisted in evacuating it first).

In 1943 the Court reversed itself and ruled that the state could not force recitations of the Pledge of Allegiance. And as someone who hasn't said it since I was 8 years old (for religious reasons then and now because I view it as one of the great piece of poppycock we've ever come up with as a nation) I'm quite glad for that.

From the video, though, I'm not clear on if she was simply forced to stand during the Pledge of Allegiance or forced to stand and say it. It is hard to believe that there is a school in the country that doesn't know about West Virginia SBE v. Barnette so I lean towards assuming it was just standing. I don't know if that has been settled completely yet but I believe all of the lower court rulings that have ever been handed down have ruled that Barnette would extend to any requirements of participation, even standing.

[bewitched]

All I have to say is that if any school or organization tried to (or actually did) force my child to stand or to stand and participate in the pledge, they'd have some splainin' to do.

And Alex, I'm sure there are many schools in the country that are unaware of West Virginia SBE v. Barnette. Hell, school districts across the country still try to ban books, Board of Education v. Pico notwithstanding.

[blueerica]

Originally Posted by Alex

One of the great things the Jehovah's Witnesses did for this country was...

Agree.

[wendybeth]

Here's something for the Quotes: I agree with Scaeagles. No one should be forced to say the Pledge, and no one should have to say it in school without at least a rudimentary understanding of what it is and means. At the same time, I don't think anyone should be forced to not participate. Personally, I don't have a problem with it, but should my kid decide she does I would support her taking a stand, provided she knows it might be a lonely one.

[lashbear]

Originally Posted by wendybeth

Here's something for the Quotes: I agree with Scaeagles.

Done !

[BarTopDancer]

Originally Posted by wendybeth

Here's something for the Quotes: I agree with Scaeagles. No one should be forced to say the Pledge, and no one should have to say it in school without at least a rudimentary understanding of what it is and means. At the same time, I don't think anyone should be forced to not participate. Personally, I don't have a problem with it, but should my kid decide she does I would support her taking a stand, provided she knows it might be a lonely one.

I agree.

Patriotism is a great thing; however forced, blind patriotism is extremely dangerous, and there is a fine line between the two.

The Pledge and National Anthem means more to me as an adult then they ever did as a kid.

[Kevy Baby]

Yes

[Betty]

Originally Posted by Kevy Baby

Yes

Are you sure?