This is some sort of sick joke, right?

[BarTopDancer]

I believe CP was replying to MousePods comment, not about the morality of the shirts.

[€uroMeinke]

Originally Posted by BarTopDancer

I believe CP was replying to MousePods comment, not about the morality of the shirts.

Perhaps, but her earlier posts - and maybe even yours, seem to contain a moral judgement in them beyond the aesthetic or economic valuations. I'm just checking my assumptions.

[BarTopDancer]

Originally Posted by €uroMeinke

Perhaps, but her earlier posts - and maybe even yours, seem to contain a moral judgement in them beyond the aesthetic or economic valuations. I'm just checking my assumptions.

No moral judgement from me. I think most of them are cute; and the ones that aren't cute to me certainly aren't immoral. Just a bit of shock that such shoddy workmanship can warrent these prices.

[€uroMeinke]

Well - I've mousepod to thank my research expedition about Sumptuary Laws (So far I've linke this link best) which sought to curb the extravagence of fashion which was seen as "wicked" if not "sinfull."

Personally, I'm fascinated by the subject of fashion becasue I think it has a far greater influence than we let on and tend to react to fashion as to what is "trendy" or "fashionable" at a given time.

I tend to see fashion as one of our primary forms of communications - telling others about our position, beliefs, occupation, or alliances all without speaking a word. So to me, it's not a stretch to see how someone might want to judge, criticize, or condemn for fashion's sake since we do it all the time with people's words. But perhaps that's still in the subtext.

[flippyshark]

"We are the goon squad and we're coming to town - beep beep"

[€uroMeinke]

Originally Posted by flippyshark

"We are the goon squad and we're coming to town - beep beep"

Heh - that was going through my mind all evening long yesterday

[Alex]

iSm:

Based on my mom's years as a seamstress and duplicating designer clothes brought in by customers and listening to her comments, the correlation between price and quality is weak. Generally you'll get more expensive materials but unless it was sewn specifically for you (unless it is a very small line) it'll have still been sewn by the same textile places where everybody gets paid more for sewing faster, not better. Essentially the same treatment as the equivelant clothes at Target. Though if the line owner really cares you may see it slowed down and better stitching used, there really isn't much you can do to improve the quality of a t-shirt to justify a 500% increase in price on quality alone.

However, if people are willing to pay more for the label, more power to them. My method of fashion shopping is this:

1. Decide I need, for example, three new shirts for just casual wearing.
2. Decide which department store is closest that would sell shirts appropriate for casual wearing (only Target and Wal-Mart are, a priori, disqualified).
3. Go to store and enter.
4. The first three shirts, closest to the door, that I do not find repulsive will be tried on and purchased.
5. Go home.

No comparison shopping, no second store unless it turns out the first store doesn't have the kind of clothes I'm looking for. Little consideration for price. Ideally, no clothes shopping expedition will last more than 15 minutes total time in store.

Fashion is almost totally irrelevant to me personally, it is all about avoiding the actual pain of shopping. Thus I've been wearing the same model of Saucony sneakers, Rockport casual shoes, and Florsheim dress shoes for about a decade. No shopping necessary when new pairs are needed.

There's no sin in fashion (except for the ugg boot/mini skirt combination) unless you view it as an actual presentation of a person rather than possibly a representation. The clothes a person wears can tell you something about a person but you have to remain aware that the clothes frequently lie.

[€uroMeinke]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

Fashion is almost totally irrelevant to me personally, it is all about avoiding the actual pain of shopping.

What about Tattoos?

[Alex]

I don't consider them fashion (it is only incidental that one of my is somewhat visible to others). Each of mine is a statement to myself, not to the external observer. Similarly, my toenails are almost always painted, but nobody ever sees my toes but me and Lani (I am rarely without shoes outside of the house). But if you consider them fashion then I wouldn't really be able to argue the point.

For a certain type of tattoo getter they are most definitely fashion and that, in my opinion, is the type of tattoo getter most likely to have regrets down the road.

[€uroMeinke]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

I don't consider them fashion (it is only incidental that one of my is somewhat visible to others). Each of mine is a statement to myself, not to the external observer. Similarly, my toenails are almost always painted, but nobody ever sees my toes but me and Lani (I am rarely without shoes outside of the house). But if you consider them fashion then I wouldn't really be able to argue the point.

I'm not sure that fashion needs to be public - while public displays of lingerie have become more comonplace, I think I number of people still limit that viewing to their intimates.

In agreement with you (I presume), I think people are happier when the dress "for themselves" and not for the external observer - AKA Posseur.

But again, I appear to use the term "Fashion" a bit broader than most, who seem to use it a synonymous with "trendy." I think many people come to think of "fashion" as having a negative connotation as a result of that, which unfortunately prevents or limits the discussion of what our own "fashion" might be.