Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull [use spoiler tags, please]

[lashbear]

Originally Posted by MouseWife

That's right, Lash.

Also, we did not learn the 'meaning' of Indiana until Connery came along, right? Which installment was that?

Indy & the [second-]Last Crusade

I liked seeing Marion again, and I'm glad they got Married. Now Mutt will have to change his name to Pedigree.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

I think there is something flawed about a movie where multiple people separately come to the same incorrect assumption about the plot. All of these years and I (and numerous others with whom I've discussed the film) never knew that there were no aliens in AI. Clearly some sort of clearer dialogue, and design that does not LOOK alien, should have prevented this confusion. Though I still wish it ended at the feet of the Blue Fairy.

Damn you, Jesse, I am going to have to watch AI again.

[Gn2Dlnd]

I loved AI, I understood that the "aliens" were some version of AI millenium into the future. I think it's a beautiful movie, and it makes me cry. I remember walking out of the theater and saying, "This movie will be one that is better appreciated in retrospect."

AI viewing on the biggie TV in our living room? Jesse can vouch for our speakers!

[innerSpaceman]

Hahahaha! Yeah, even though most people don't know about the filmmakers' dogs, the fact that Indy was named for the family dog in the Jones family is explained in the series ... and therefore legit to riff on with humor. A missed opportunity, imo. If they were going to salute Laverne, Mutt should have had a HUGE "M" on the jacket .... because, as it was, I didn't notice it.



And no matter what .... I'm not going to rewatch AI. It is NOT a film with a reputation that has improved with time .... unless you are referring to some of the time spans portrayed in A.I.

[flippyshark]

Kubrick fan that I am, I've still not gotten around to AI. (And how fun that it's become such a lively side topic on this thread without really getting in the way.)

Not long ago, I was at the home of HTHBellcaptain, and we were watching documentary footage of the Nevada a-bomb tests, complete with creepy mannequins and furnished houses. I remembered thinking that this was something that belonged in a movie somewhere, and whattya know, there it showed up, in the unlikeliest of releases. I admit this sequence made me smile, silly though it was.

[Alex]

I actually liked AI the first time I saw it (though I've never watched it a second time).

[Chernabog]

Jeepers! This thread is way too long for me to consume it all right now and extrapolate.

However --

I just got out of the movie and I will from this point on, point blank refuse to watch any other visual medium (film, video game, television show, anything) that has the name "George Lucas" attached to it.

This was, by far, the worst of the Indy movies.

I mean, I wasn't outright BORED by the picture (except at the beginning.... too much freaking exposition). But it was truly cringe-worthy (I'm pretty much in complete agreement with NA's assessment of what was totally awful in the movie so I won't reiterate). At the end, all I could think was, that's IT? Where was the plot? How could Indy figure out this ridiculous BS so quickly in a manner that makes the old Batman shows look intelligent in comparison? And why did they purposefully make every single set look like a stage play of Indiana Jones? I've never seen a movie before and thought "oh, there's the wall at the end of the soundstage that the backdrop is painted onto". What awful special effects. What awful lighting and camera work on Harrison Ford, who they keep showing in this bizarre soft focus like he was Lucille Ball in Auntie Mame.

Suspension of disbelief is one thing, but at least in the other films you felt that at least one or more of the characters was in danger (even if Indy would make it through alright). In Temple of Doom (which I did enjoy greatly) there was that implausible raft sequence, sure. But not EVERY SINGLE STUNT IN THE ENTIRE FILM was like -- oh if that happened, they'd all die. Crystal Skull crossed a line there in every single action sequence to a point where every single good character was completely and totally indestructible. "Oh give me a freaking break!" can be a reaction to a few stunts, of course, but not every one, before the movie goes into complete suckage.

Even the trailers before the movie -- that new CGI Star Wars thing looks awful. People (including me) booed and groaned audibly in the theatre. So I refuse. I cannot give Lucas the Hutt any more of my money, not ever again. He's made me feel horrible about one of my all-time favorite series. He makes movies that actually diminish the quality of far superior films in the same series. For the second time.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by Chernabog

He makes movies that actually diminish the quality of far superior films in the same series. For the second time.

See, I just don't get how that's possible. Bad Indy films simply point out what's great about great Indy films (of which there is one). I don't see how making a lousy film does anything but highlight the missing quality that was once (and only once) there.



* * * *

By way, the purpose of the Mac character was that a constantly double-crossing traitor pal can have Indy's reversals of fortune turn on a dime, without any story effort whatsoever. It's lazy, but it has a purpose.


* * * *

Oh, I've neglected to mention my favorite bit. Believe it or not, it's a sound effect. At the start of the Peruvian grave-robbing scene, they reprise the distinctive "Yaquoia" bird sound from the Peru beginning of Raiders of the Lost Ark.

Not only is it a wonderfully distinctive sound that is a great Easter Egg .... it was a very significant sound for Steven Spielberg. Though he trusted Ben Burtt to do the sound work on Raiders due to his Star Wars brilliance, Spielberg was only convinced his film was in fantastic sonic hands once he heard the bird sound that transformed his Hawaii footage to an evocative South American jungle.

[Morrigoon]

Well, I thought it was cute.

Maybe I was mentally prepared for it after the "expect cartoon action" reviews. Because I enjoyed it.

Oh, and Mutt DID react to the scorpions, Alex. Not a phobia, per se, but he did fear something.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Sans spoiler tags, per above posts.



The worst thing about Mac is that his constant greedy cowardice makes Indy look like an idiot for being his friend for years. Was he really able to hide his evilness for that long, until this moment when he let it all hang out?

I thought the kid's name was Mud too, meaning I missed out on the joke until days later. Grr.

One thing that bugs me when people say "I hate CG, bring back traditional filmmaking" is that there are plenty of movies that used CG for good, not evil. The Matrix and Jurassic Park immediately come to mind. CG is a tool, and it can be gaudy or gritty, depending on who wields it.

That said, there wasn't a single stunt in this movie that tops Indy being dragged behind a car in the original. I loved the ants scene, that was classic.

I did like Mutt's character. I thought his attempts at a tough guy front were balanced enough to make him seem vulnerable and yet streetwise. I thought Shia did a great job and he's make a great Indy. (yes I said it)

HOWEVER - they have dug themselves a hole. There cannot be an Indy later than the late 50's, it just doesn't make sense with the shifts in our culture. All the mentions of Indy's exploits in the last 18 years only made me feel like I missed out. Where are THOSE movies? They waited too long, and now we get old Indy and young new Indy but at very tail end of the era when Indy works. Bastards.

The only way out is to do what they did with Superman Returns, with a pinch of Casino Royale. Don't make "sequels" per se. Take Mutt and send him back in time to 1935. Don't explain it, just start over. It's the same character but different, it's the same time but different, alternate universe style. Otherwise, it's not going to work (and even then it won't work because Spielberg and Lucas will be involved).



The moral of the Indy series is that everyone is right - Jews, Christians, voodoo worshippers, and rednecks who claim to have been anally probed. All magic is real, all gods coexist, including the god of "we couldn't have invented this, it must have been godly aliens". Indy is equal opportunity. I kinda like that.