Accidental or not?

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by Moonliner

Probably intentional. Hopefully It's a good reminder that Islam/Muslim's are not the enemy.

Originally Posted by SzczerbiakManiac

They are if you're gay.

Originally Posted by SzczerbiakManiac

Be that as it may GD, can you point out to me a non-MusIslamic nation that punishes homosexuality by death?

Seems to me, SzcerbiakManiac is directing some ire at the general Muslim / Islamic population for the actions of their governments. Governments that are not even representative, as our government purportedly is.

So are we to blame as a people for the horrible actions of our government? Some might say, yes, since ultimate power in the U.S. is supposedly vested in the people. I'm being a bit sarcastic, but I'm asking SM his opinion on collective responsibility for government actions. Because unless all Muslims are responsible for the policies of their governments when it comes to executing gays, then Muslim people should not be considered his enemy.


IMO.

[Alex]

That's a defense of your blanket statement how? All countries where homosexuality is a capitol offense are Muslim therefore all Muslims are the enemy?

Majority Islam countries where being gay is not a crime punishable by death (I'm sure it is illegal in all these places but that is hardly unique to Islam). Bold means it is an outright Islamic state, italic means it is the state religion, all others are simply countries where the majority of the population is Muslim:

Afghanistan, Algeria, Azerbaijan, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Brunei, Burkina Faso, Chad, Comoros, Djibouti, Egypt, Eritrea, The Gambia, Guinea, Indonesia, Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Lebanon, Libya, Malaysia, Maldives, Mali, Morocco, Niger, Oman, Pakistan, Palestine, Qatar, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Somalia, Syria, Tajikistan, Tunisia, Turkey, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan.

ETA: Whoops. Homosexuality is not even a crime in Jordan, Mali, Indonesia and Turkey. Homesexual acts have been legal in Turkey approximately 30 years longer than they've been nationally legal in the United States (that is, approximately 40 years as opposed to our 6).

[BarTopDancer]

Oh geeze Alex. Stop putting logic into arguments of the outraged.

But if you must, I blame Monica Seles.

[innerSpaceman]

In SM's defense, I have a knee-jerk reaction against Germans.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

Seems to me, SzcerbiakManiac is directing some ire at the general Muslim / Islamic population for the actions of their governments.

My ire is at the religion of Islam, the Muslim people who practice it, and the theocratic nations which are run by it.

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

So are we to blame as a people for the horrible actions of our government?

Yes, we are. As a nation we elect our leaders and ultimately it's our problem when they fück up. And in the long run, we usually try to make it right.

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

unless all Muslims are responsible for the policies of their governments when it comes to executing gays, then Muslim people should not be considered his enemy.

We elected Dubya, Clinton, Regan, and Joseph McCarthy. But there were plenty of Americans who protested their policies. Point out to me one single non-gay person in an Islamic-run nation who has protested his/her government's treatment of gays and I might change my opinion of them being the enemy of gays.

Originally Posted by SzczerbiakManiac

can you point out to me a non-MusIslamic nation that punishes homosexuality by death?

Originally Posted by Alex

That's a defense of your blanket statement how? All countries where homosexuality is a capitol offense are Muslim therefore all Muslims are the enemy?

All Muslims subscribe to a fücked-up religion*. Obviously, some Muslims are worse than others. I'm not suggesting that each and every Muslim would shoot me on sight if we passed on the street. But I am saying that each and every one of them, assuming they are following the tenants of their religion (and if they don't, they're not really Muslims are they?), see homosexuals as evil. Ergo, they see me as the enemy. And I see anyone as "the enemy" when they attempt to deny me basic civil rights. Rights such as, oh I don't, the right to live! Again, that's not the only thing I don't like about Islam, but it's significant.

Originally Posted by Alex

Majority Islam countries where being gay is not a crime punishable by death <list snipped>

Okay, but is there a nation that punishes homosexuality by death that is not either majority Muslim or an Islamic theocracy?


*No! Not all religions are valid. That concept is bullshït!

[Not Afraid]

WOW!


Just, wow.

[innerSpaceman]

In truth, I don't know if the actual tenets of Islam are any more anti-homo than the tenets of Christianity are. Certainly, plenty of Christians point to passages of their holy text that they claim condemn homosexuality, and others disagree with those interpretations.

Is the same not true of the holy text of Islam? Or is it far more cut and dried? I confess I do not know, but I suspect the Koran is similar to the Bible, in that it can be used to "prove" any point under the sun.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I'm definitely not a fan of Christianity, but even nutbag "Christians" like Fred Phelps and his batshït-crazy family aren't out killing homosexuals or passing laws to make the state do it for them.

[€uroMeinke]

So gay bashing in America gets a pass from having any religious motivation?

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Absolutely not. But are the gay bashers electing officials who openly promote gay bashing? Have any laws been passed which compel the state to "beat up the faggots"?