The random political thoughts thread (Part Deux)

[€uroMeinke]

Speech is best answered with speech - monologue with dialogue - shouting down speakers is censorpship. You cannot respond intelligently to something you refuse to listen too - that is my obejction to these sorts of portests - there are censorship by the masses.

[lizziebith]

While I agree in theory with Euro...where is the forum for a person like me to GET that dialogue with a person like Condi other than on the streets? She and her ilk are completely shielded from actual dialogue with normal Americans. We shout to gain a whisper in the modern world.

[innerSpaceman]

Who said anything about shouting her down? I'm not approving heckling. Protesting is different.



(And double plus ditto on what lizziebith said)

[€uroMeinke]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

Who said anything about shouting her down? I'm not approving heckling. Protesting is different.



(And double plus ditto on what lizziebeth said)

The I appologize for jumping to the conclusion - but I find most "protests" of late have been more heckling than anything else which does nothing to advance the cause.

[€uroMeinke]

You have the internet, you have this message board, the ability to express your opinions is unprecidented. I think the characterization that these speakers occure in a vacuum is a rather inaccurate notion in todays commnication revolution. Perhaps you get no one on one dialogue, but it's not like your message cannot be heard.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by €uroMeinke

You have the internet, you have this message board, the ability to express your opinions is unprecidented.

But express them to whom? I happen to prefer expressing them here, but not if I want to have an effect on the world.

I'm told that if I want Disney to hear my complaints about the new Haunted Mansion bride, I'd best post them on micechat. Well, I'd rather be dunked in skunk ... but I'd have to change my communicating mode if I want to change Disneyland ... and even moreso if I want to change the world. My rantings on message boards won't quite cut it.

3 seconds of airtime on ABC of a 50,000 person march will get me more change-the-worldness than every post I've ever made on every message board I've ever posted on. The best use of the internet to foster change-the-world communication is enabling people to arrange a mass in-person protest with ease.

[sleepyjeff]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

. My rantings on message boards won't quite cut it.

Don't sell short your rantings.....seriously.

[Gemini Cricket]

I know someone who is graduating and is going to be at that ceremony. He's Catholic and feels that his views of anti-war (that are Pope blessed) gives him the right to protest at his Jesuit Catholic school. More power to him. Contributing factors to this is that no one asked the students who they wanted at their own commencement and that Bono was initially supposed to be booked for the speech but prior committments took him out of the running.

Despite that, students are not allowed signs, shirts or any kind of visible words of protest to be displayed anywhere. (Even words on the top of their caps are not allowed.) Talk about not being able to present another point of view...

I disagree with Euromeinke. Moxie is defined as skill and 'know how'. Rice was our National Security Advisor when we were attacked. Her 'historical document' comment is legendary. She pushed for the failed war in Iraq. I have never trusted her abilities and have been proven right time and time again with her buffoonery and participation in the worst administration of our country's history.

My advice to the student, who asked me about what to do at his commencement as a protest, was to turn his back on Rice. It's not a boo, it's not heckling, it's not a written protest sign, but it is a definite statement. I don't know if they'll do it. But I feel they should plan something and have every right to do so.

There are two degrees of separation between Rice and myself. She's an idiot.

[scaeagles]

I find it interesting that in a world where tolerance and openness to ideas is supposed to be a sign of enlightenment that people are unwilling to listen to those who think differently.

GC, we share differing opinions. Would you turn your back on me should I be speaking because of that?

Let's say (purely hypothetically, of course) that BC invited an openly homosexual speaker. As the position of the Catholic Church is not a pro homossexual position, would you find it acceptable or offensive for students to turn their backs?

[Gemini Cricket]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I find it interesting that in a world where tolerance and openness to ideas is supposed to be a sign of enlightenment that people are unwilling to listen to those who think differently.

That seems to be something that's learned isn't it? I mean, this is one of the most secretive and stealthy administrations in US history. I'm sure they can recognize their own tactics of not paying attention...

Originally Posted by scaeagles

GC, we share differing opinions. Would you turn your back on me should I be speaking because of that?

It would depend upon what you were speaking about.

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Let's say (purely hypothetically, of course) that BC invited an openly homosexual speaker. As the position of the Catholic Church is not a pro homossexual position, would you find it acceptable or offensive for students to turn their backs?

Yes. If that's what they believed. I don't agree, but I understand it.

I have come to learn that there are grey areas in the CC. Not everyone agrees on everything. I'd cling to hoping that not everyone in the CC agrees with the CC on homosexuality and marriage equality. Our intern, for example, is Catholic and is pro-marriage equality. So is my dad. Good for them!

ie. I don't know where I stand as far as this immigration fight goes. But as I posted somewhere else here, it is nice to see people expressing themselves. I saw the Boston Common protests live. I didn't agree with everyone, but I would fight for their right to speak out as they were.