The Rumsfeld memo

[Nephythys]

He did not say we are losing.

Asked point-blank by Sen. Carl Levin, D-Mich., whether the U.S. is winning in Iraq, Gates replied, "No, sir." He later said he believes the United States is neither winning nor losing, "at this point."

Stalemate- not losing.

[Motorboat Cruiser]

Where is your quote from, Nephy?

This is from the Washington Post:

Asked by Sen. Carl M. Levin (D-Mich.), the ranking Democrat on the committee, whether "you believe we're currently winning in Iraq," Gates answered, "No, sir." He repeated the assessment when asked the same question by Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.).

[Nephythys]

Originally Posted by Motorboat Cruiser

Where is your quote from, Nephy?

This is from the Washington Post:

Apologies-

Link

Appears the other source edited the quote.

[Not Afraid]

Originally Posted by Nephythys

Appears the other source edited the quote.

I'm shocked and appalled!

[Scrooge McSam]

Originally Posted by Nephythys

Appears the other source edited the quote.

That could be true, of course, but there may be another explanation.

The 2 times Gates was asked if the US was winning and answered "no" were in the morning session before they broke for lunch.

After lunch, Gates came back and said he wanted to extend his comments on that subject so as not to give the troops the impression he thought they were failing in their mission.

Could be the WashingtonPost wrote their story before the panel reconvened for lunch.

Link

[Nephythys]

Plausible.

Bottom line- he did not say we were losing. So to use him as some kind of proof that we are losing- or that no one believes we can or will or are succeeding in Iraq is inaccurate.

[wendybeth]

Could also be that he was spanked for saying what he believed, and later revised his position. Just a thought.

[CoasterMatt]

Originally Posted by wendybeth

Could also be that he was spanked for saying what he believed, and later revised his position. Just a thought.

WOW! That lady on the bus gets around!

[wendybeth]

Lots of boys behaving badly these days, eh?

Oh, and it's an obvious observation, Neph- one you apparently already made for yourself.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by Nephythys

Plausible.

Bottom line- he did not say we were losing. So to use him as some kind of proof that we are losing- or that no one believes we can or will or are succeeding in Iraq is inaccurate.

Well, I have a little bit of a different take.

He was asked, twice whether we were winning. He emphatically and unhesitatingly said no. Later, he was asked, do you agree with the general who said that while we are not winning, neither are we losing. THAT was what he answered not "at this point" (and with a bit of a hesitation, to my ear).

So, what's with the qualification? What could that have indicated? To my mind, considering there was absolutely no qualification in his answering no to whether we were winning, then he must be qualifying the losing part of the equation. Basically, "We aren't winning, we aren't losing, but we're probably closer to losing than we are to winning and WILL be losing if we don't fix something." Which is a far cry from the Bush and Rumsfeld doctrine of plugging their ears and going "lalalalalalala" anytime someone suggests that our strategies MIGHT lead to losing.