We knew they'd start chipping people some day... - Page 5

DreadPirateRoberts · 07-25-2007, 09:27 AM

I think LoT should create a designer line of tin-foil lined clothing, the "Faraday Cage" series, to fund the commune.

Cadaverous Pallor · 07-25-2007, 10:00 AM

What Alex has said is right on the money. RFID chips/tags only have a range of 6 inches or so. As soon as you're away from a reader, you're as anonymous as a person with an ID in their pocket. Even if someone walks around surreptitiously with a reader, if they don't have access to the database, all they have is your barcode number.

Every system has weaknesses and strengths. I'm sure none of us can imagine a time before photo ID, but it existed, and it had it's problems, even while people were freer in certain ways.

As for "I can leave my cell at home", yeah, you can, but do you? Would you? I think it would take a mass misuse of the locator technology for me to actually give up owning a cell phone, and I don't see it getting to that point. If it did, I'd have to move to a different country. Cell phones and other similar devices have already become mostly indispensible...almost as if they're attached to your arm.

BarTopDancer · 07-25-2007, 10:10 AM

I've been leaving my cell phone at home, or in the car more and more these days. There is no reason that I need to be reached at every moment of every day. It took a few times to not feel naked without it. But it happened. And it's an awesome feeling to not have a leash 24/7.

Prudence · 07-25-2007, 10:19 AM

I frequently leave my cell phone at home. Or I have it, but I haven't looked at it in three weeks and the battery's been dead for 2.5 of those weeks. None of those devices are indispensable to me.

And no matter how short the range for the implanted chips is - they're still implanted chips. Implanted. In my body. If you want me to carry a special card or wear a special bracelet or don a silly hat or whatever, fine. Want to implant a chip for "ease", no thanks.

Kevy Baby · 07-25-2007, 11:09 AM

Could you imagine NA without a cell phone? I shudder at the thought.

Not Afraid · 07-25-2007, 11:35 AM

I wouldn't want a chip implanted in my body, but I'd be all for a cell phone. Now THAT would be useful for me.

Betty · 07-25-2007, 05:51 PM

Of course I'm not afraid of bar codes. Don't be silly!

But the idea that you have something trackable in your tires isn't much the point as how far it can be read and how many readers are around. Just in the store for tracking isn't as big of a deal as readers all over the place or ones that can read from long distances. I don't want the manufacturer of my tires, or anyone he sells that service to, to know where I when my car drives to. Or how fast the tires are going. Or anything else big brotherly like that.

It's not being paranoid. I just don't want to be the stupid frog.

JWBear · 07-25-2007, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betty

....I don't want the manufacturer of my tires, or anyone he sells that service to, to know where I when my car drives to. Or how fast the tires are going. Or anything else big brotherly like that....

The only way they could do that is to line the roads with readers. Ain't going to happen.

I have no fear of RFID chips. The technology simple doesn't allow the kind of tracking that people seem to fear. I don't even have a problem with having them implanted - as long as it is voluntary. Regardless of how innocuous the technology, I would oppose mandatory implanting.

My work ID has a RFID chip implanted in it. It makes opening the security doors so much easier than the old system; Id cards with magnetic strips that you had to swipe multiple times before the door would unlock. We all love it.

Morrigoon · 07-25-2007, 07:58 PM

The issue is not with the concept of RFID itself, it's the concept of putting it in people's bodies and the idea that someday down the road, such a thing might become a government mandate. That someday you might be required to have something under your skin, in, say, your arm or forehead, that would be required in order to, say, hold down a job or buy food at the supermarket.

NO problem with RFID in my driver's license. No problem with RFID in my library card.

Alex · 07-25-2007, 08:05 PM

That's fine. Doesn't bother me but I agree that governmentally mandated implantation would be bad (not so much that it is unacceptable in private employment practice) and would generally oppose it.

I can't see why the idea of implantation itself is such a problem, as it doesn't bother me but that's a different issue from the "permanently tracked" one. Regardless of implantation we're already approaching permanently tracked status for people who have access to the right databases. And if implanted RFID doesn't come along we'll just slide towards other built in identification markers such as fingerprinting (which is what I was referencing earlier, we have a fingerprint scanner for access to our data center; if I don't submit to it I don't have my job), physiology (WDW's park entry machiens), retinal scanning, facial recognition, etc.

I don't much care if the RFID chip is in my arm or on my arm, but personally if offered the convenience I'm going to choose in.

07-25-2007, 09:27 AM	#1
DreadPirateRoberts Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,483	I think LoT should create a designer line of tin-foil lined clothing, the "Faraday Cage" series, to fund the commune.
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07-25-2007, 10:00 AM	#2
Cadaverous Pallor ohhhh baby Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Parental Bliss Posts: 12,364	What Alex has said is right on the money. RFID chips/tags only have a range of 6 inches or so. As soon as you're away from a reader, you're as anonymous as a person with an ID in their pocket. Even if someone walks around surreptitiously with a reader, if they don't have access to the database, all they have is your barcode number. Every system has weaknesses and strengths. I'm sure none of us can imagine a time before photo ID, but it existed, and it had it's problems, even while people were freer in certain ways. As for "I can leave my cell at home", yeah, you can, but do you? Would you? I think it would take a mass misuse of the locator technology for me to actually give up owning a cell phone, and I don't see it getting to that point. If it did, I'd have to move to a different country. Cell phones and other similar devices have already become mostly indispensible...almost as if they're attached to your arm. __________________ The second star to the right shines in the night for you
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07-25-2007, 10:10 AM	#3
BarTopDancer Prepping... Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Here, there, everywhere Posts: 11,405	I've been leaving my cell phone at home, or in the car more and more these days. There is no reason that I need to be reached at every moment of every day. It took a few times to not feel naked without it. But it happened. And it's an awesome feeling to not have a leash 24/7. __________________ Spork is the new MacGyver Postcards From My Edge
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07-25-2007, 10:19 AM	#4
Prudence Beelzeboobs, Esq. Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Gavel - I haz it Posts: 6,287	I frequently leave my cell phone at home. Or I have it, but I haven't looked at it in three weeks and the battery's been dead for 2.5 of those weeks. None of those devices are indispensable to me. And no matter how short the range for the implanted chips is - they're still implanted chips. Implanted. In my body. If you want me to carry a special card or wear a special bracelet or don a silly hat or whatever, fine. Want to implant a chip for "ease", no thanks. __________________ traguna macoities tracorum satis de
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07-25-2007, 11:09 AM	#5
Kevy Baby Chowder Head Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Yes Posts: 18,500	Could you imagine NA without a cell phone? I shudder at the thought. __________________ The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot verify their validity. - Abraham Lincoln
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07-25-2007, 11:35 AM	#6
Not Afraid HI! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 17,108	I wouldn't want a chip implanted in my body, but I'd be all for a cell phone. Now THAT would be useful for me.
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07-25-2007, 05:51 PM	#7
Betty Kicking up my heels! Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: The Silver State Posts: 3,783	Of course I'm not afraid of bar codes. Don't be silly! But the idea that you have something trackable in your tires isn't much the point as how far it can be read and how many readers are around. Just in the store for tracking isn't as big of a deal as readers all over the place or ones that can read from long distances. I don't want the manufacturer of my tires, or anyone he sells that service to, to know where I when my car drives to. Or how fast the tires are going. Or anything else big brotherly like that. It's not being paranoid. I just don't want to be the stupid frog. __________________ Nee Stell Thue
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07-25-2007, 07:58 PM	#9
Morrigoon I throw stones at houses Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Location: Location Posts: 9,534	The issue is not with the concept of RFID itself, it's the concept of putting it in people's bodies and the idea that someday down the road, such a thing might become a government mandate. That someday you might be required to have something under your skin, in, say, your arm or forehead, that would be required in order to, say, hold down a job or buy food at the supermarket. NO problem with RFID in my driver's license. No problem with RFID in my library card. __________________ http://bash.org/?top "It is useless for sheep to pass a resolution in favor of vegetarianism while wolves remain of a different opinion." -- William Randolph Inge
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07-25-2007, 08:05 PM	#10
Alex . Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,354	That's fine. Doesn't bother me but I agree that governmentally mandated implantation would be bad (not so much that it is unacceptable in private employment practice) and would generally oppose it. I can't see why the idea of implantation itself is such a problem, as it doesn't bother me but that's a different issue from the "permanently tracked" one. Regardless of implantation we're already approaching permanently tracked status for people who have access to the right databases. And if implanted RFID doesn't come along we'll just slide towards other built in identification markers such as fingerprinting (which is what I was referencing earlier, we have a fingerprint scanner for access to our data center; if I don't submit to it I don't have my job), physiology (WDW's park entry machiens), retinal scanning, facial recognition, etc. I don't much care if the RFID chip is in my arm or on my arm, but personally if offered the convenience I'm going to choose in.
	Submit to Quotes