Mouseadventure?

[FEJ]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

Oh, GD and CP are in for it now. Because I will never stop needling anyone who Beta-tested that ESPN quest - which had absolutely wrong wording in two sections, resulting in two purportedly incorrect answers when foolishly interpretted using the English language.




Also - I must question the wisdom of using some of the best players ever born to Beta test the game. A certain high-level staffer confided in me after MouseAdventure that the quests were running far longer in reality than they did in Beta, to the point where they even had to cut one quest from the game mid-morning. I don't know who the other Beta testers were, but the likes of GD and CP are not going to provide you with a running time for average contestants!

They were not the only beta testers...

[Babette]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

Also - I must question the wisdom of using some of the best players ever born to Beta test the game. A certain high-level staffer confided in me after MouseAdventure that the quests were running far longer in reality than they did in Beta, to the point where they even had to cut one quest from the game mid-morning. I don't know who the other Beta testers were, but the likes of GD and CP are not going to provide you with a running time for average contestants!

I agree with that. People who have been successful in previous games cannot give an accurate estimate of the time an "average" team will take. Some of the beta quests seemed to go quicker than they should have. Part of that may have been from redoing a quest that previously had bugs. So, one person already had an idea of the expected outcome, and could non-verbally nudge along the other tester to the clue locations. Love you Bro!

But, I think it is good to use them for getting out the bugs. A more experienced player knows the game and can really overthink the possible scenarios ahead of time and make sure it works. Then the players (and staffers) don't have to run around like chickens with their heads cut off on game day.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by Babette

I agree with that. People who have been successful in previous games cannot give an accurate estimate of the time an "average" team will take.

Yeah, which is why we weren't really looking too much at time when we were doing it. It was more about finding errors, looking for ambiguities, and getting a general "easier than average" or "harder than average" feeling.

As for the ESPN zone one, I had major trouble doing the puzzle part of that, so by the time I found out what it was asking, I didn't pay much attention to the question itself. Speaking of...was there a "starter piece" to that puzzle already placed in the grid?

[Alex]

Ponine, do you know who you spoke with about access issues? Everybody should have been very clear that there were access issues (I tried to track down everybody in a wheelchair specifically to tell them) and then when you took that specific quest there should have been another warning (though I overburdened the people at that station so I wouldn't be suprised to learn that it was inconsistently given). The other Redwood Creek quest could be done without ever having to use stairs or other inaccessible areas of RCCT.

Steve, I wasn't present for your expression of disagreement on the ESPNZone quest. So I don't actually know how you read the question. I have on doubt you had a valid reading that I never thought of, it happens all of the time. Could you explain?

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

Steve, I wasn't present for your expression of disagreement on the ESPNZone quest. So I don't actually know how you read the question. I have on doubt you had a valid reading that I never thought of, it happens all of the time. Could you explain?

First of all - let me be clear that the ambiguity in the quest language had nothing to do with us bungling this quest. We knew what the quest was "looking for" and we plain and simple missed it. (Heheh, third time's the charm for walking around the ESPN building ... when the third time's after the game is over.)

Actually, I'd have to have the decoded grid question in front of me to explain the problem (and yes, GD, there was a starter on that - - thank goodness). I wish I had written it town, because my memory fades fast nowadays.

But basically, it was because the decoded question read, "If there are any duplicates on the list" rather than something like "if any items on the list are duplicated." There were no duplicates on the list. Our problem was that we - by unfortunate coincidence - neglected to decode one of the words. The winning word. And so when we couldn't find a majority among the (incomplete) list of bobbles, we thought we were dealing with a trick question because there were no duplicates on the list.

Another potential ambiguity arose from use of the generic word "item." Of course, you didn't want the quest instructions themselves to give away the ESPN location ... but many of the Sports (such as football, basketball) are also "items" that are displayed in various locations on the ESPN exterior. Again, the line "it will bobble your mind" clearly indicated the quest was looking for the bobbles. But when at first we don't succeed, we don't hesitate to look for trickery at MouseAdventure!


Anyways, maybe you should use our team for Beta tests from now on. We are drawn to potential ambiguities like moths to a flame, and we are scoring more and more like average players!


(A side note - - I will not be able to respond to any reply from Alex till later this evening. They've blocked the LoT from my office computer network (haha, it took them long enough) and, well, you'll be reading a lot less of me around here from now on, I'm sorry to say.)

[katiesue]

Ponine, do you know who you spoke with about access issues? Everybody should have been very clear that there were access issues (I tried to track down everybody in a wheelchair specifically to tell them) and then when you took that specific quest there should have been another warning (though I overburdened the people at that station so I wouldn't be suprised to learn that it was inconsistently given). The other Redwood Creek quest could be done without ever having to use stairs or other inaccessible areas of RCCT.

Our team was clearly told when we picked up that quest that there could be access issues and that if we couldn't/wouldn't do it to come back and there would be an alternate provided. It did get crazy at that station toward the middle of the day so I can see how not everyone got the information.

We did the long for the first time and did ok. We almost finished the last quest right before time was called. We spent wayyyyyyy too much time on a couple of quests where we should have just taken a penalty and moved on.

The eye spys were fairly easy. We only had to look for two of them.

It was a really fun, crazy day. Huge kudos to Alex and staff for pulling it off!

[Ghoulish Delight]

We tested in the very early stages, and weren't timed. We were just looking for accuracy and general assessments of difficulty.

Of course, there was some imformal observation of time. So when the version of the Disnyland quest (which I guess was cut?) took over an hour, even with 3 people splitting up and combining efforts, scaling back was definitely immediately discussed.

[innerSpaceman]

Yep, that was the one. Well, they can always use it at a future M.A.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

GC - yes, the Brother Bears are definitely Bears. Very cool guys. I wish they posted - they're not even on MP, I don't think.

Beta testing was annoying for me because I had to go to work in the middle of it. I missed most of that day, but it hardly matters because I was completely useless anyway. They had us do puzzles only, which everyone knows is GD's turf. All the other stuff that I usually help with wasn't there so I was revealed to be a puzzle idiot. Alex handed both of us a copy of each puzzle and I was forced to work alone...I was rather embarrassed to be so completely outed as a moron. I'll take a page out of iSm's book and add my excuse - Alex said the beta versions are always harder, because scaling back is easier.

iSm - I totally feel for you on the bad start in DCA. I did work on that puzzle, and got it wrong too. It's so awful to start off on the wrong foot, especially in Scramble.

Even so, enough with the excuses! Next time is another chance for true glory, as they are doing an Enchanted Race, which means us Masters will have to cough up the mothballs and really compete. I predict we will destroy your excuse #53 - "I skipped an MA and lost the feel for it." We'll be back in the fall!

[Cadaverous Pallor]

The Brother Bears (from Spring 2005)