"Why Believe in God" ad campaign

[wendybeth]

Any society is going to form rules to survive. I would argue (even though I believe in God) that religion was a useful tool to give the ruling person/group ultimate power to implement those rules. Hammurabi declared his laws as divinely inspired, but it certainly seemed to help keep his people in line and cement his authority. I think that humans are largely social animals, and I tend to follow the idea of social contract as our motivation to stay out of trouble, trouble being whatever is deemed a negative social action by the larger group.

[flippyshark]

Even moreso, moral and ethical standards change in ways that foster the continued survival and flourishing of a group. Back in more tribal times, morality, laws and religion tended to be highly "us vs. them" (out of brutal necessity) with "us" given divinely favored status. In this very different world, the in-group grows ever larger and more inclusive, and our laws and morality slowly shift to accomodate.

Back in the day, "thou shalt not kill" meant "don't kill one another within our tribe." Read your Bible and you'll find that ruthless slaughter of the other guy was not just the norm, it was commanded by the deity.

Of course, the classic "reciprocal ethic" (the Golden Rule) predates any Judeo-Christian tradition by centuries. You'll find it in ancient Mesopotamian religion, Hinduism, Taoism, and on and on. And even that core ethical notion is (and always has been) open to debate.

[Morrigoon]

Originally Posted by flippyshark

Of course, the classic "reciprocal ethic" (the Golden Rule) predates any Judeo-Christian tradition by centuries. You'll find it in ancient Mesopotamian religion, Hinduism, Taoism, and on and on. And even that core ethical notion is (and always has been) open to debate.

This supports my theory that all religions have it "a little right", and that the real "truth" is that there is a superior being who has tried many different ways to communicate with us.

[flippyshark]

Another quick thought - There is scarce little in the teachings of Jesus that isn't also found in earlier traditions. It isn't that Jesus was saying anything terribly innovative, but more that Christianity succeeded (in its pre-Constantine days) because it sought to bring its ethic to a broader community, essentially making the in-group more diverse and inclusive. There was a price for admission (exclusivity; you couldn't be Christian and still belong to your former religion) but Christianity succeeded in the ancient marketplace of religions (and boy was that a buyer's market!) in part by breaking down some social barriers, at least within its own house.

[wendybeth]

Raising the ancient equivalent of the Third Estate to a position of moral superiority was a good move, actually. It set the stage for many a revolution by the masses, especially when Christianity was adopted as the religion of the realm. It was a good time to be a cheesemaker. (Sorry, NA).

[Not Afraid]

Originally Posted by Strangler Lewis

Master Pangloss taught the metaphysico-theologo-cosmolonigology. He could prove to admiration that there is no effect without a cause; and, that in this best of all possible worlds, the Baron's castle was the most magnificent of all castles, and My Lady the best of all possible baronesses.

"It is demonstrable," said he, "that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end. Observe, for instance, the nose is formed for spectacles, therefore we wear spectacles. The legs are visibly designed for stockings, accordingly we wear stockings. Stones were made to be hewn and to construct castles, therefore My Lord has a magnificent castle; for the greatest baron in the province ought to be the best lodged. Swine were intended to be eaten, therefore we eat pork all the year round: and they, who assert that everything is right, do not express themselves correctly; they should say that everything is best."

For truly this is the best of all possible worlds. Nothing like a good Candide quote to make the day a better place to be.

Originally Posted by flippyshark

Another quick thought - There is scarce little in the teachings of Jesus that isn't also found in earlier traditions. It isn't that Jesus was saying anything terribly innovative, but more that Christianity succeeded (in its pre-Constantine days) because it sought to bring its ethic to a broader community, essentially making the in-group more diverse and inclusive. There was a price for admission (exclusivity; you couldn't be Christian and still belong to your former religion) but Christianity succeeded in the ancient marketplace of religions (and boy was that a buyer's market!) in part by breaking down some social barriers, at least within its own house.

I've been talking lot about how Christianity is driven to convert others to their beliefs. I'm not sure how this same concept plays out in other religions - I certainly have no Muslims coming to my door. I think Buddhism is more "religion" or attraction rather than promotion. I am not familiar with the specifics of other religions to know if other have the "Go, be a fisher of men" concept. I find the way that concept has played out in our culture to be very interesting.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Yay, cheesemakers.

[wendybeth]

Originally Posted by Gn2Dlnd

Yay, cheesemakers.

And the purveyors of fine cheese products, as well.

[blueerica]

Originally Posted by wendybeth

Originally Posted by Gn2Dlnd
Yay, cheesemakers.
And the purveyors of fine cheese products, as well.

Indeed. I won't go off topic too far, but I've found a lovely new (to me) cheese.

Interesting that this topic came up again, since I recently discussed this with a colleague of a different mindset than I.

[Strangler Lewis]

How does this support that theory?