LoT Book CLub - Book 2 - Wind Up Bird Chronicle by Haruki Murakami

[wendybeth]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

When do we get to stop talking in spoiler tags?

Nevah!

Welcome to Spoiler Tag Hell. A cat will be along shortly to show you to your room.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I'm assuming at the spoiler tags will be dropped at the end of this week, which will make a full 4 weeks.

[wendybeth]

I feel at a bit of a disadvantage in that this is the first Murukami book I've read, but I am impressed enough to be okay with that. Better than okay. Sometimes, it seems like everything has already been said, done, exploited to death and there is nothing new in lit. I'm very happy to have (hopefully) discovered a 'new' author who makes me want to really read again, like I used to when I was in high school and college. I definitely plan on reading more of his works.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Okay I'm done. And since it's officially 4 weeks, shall we dispense with spoiler tags?

Regarding his passiveness, I'll concede that he's passive. But not in a "Oh well, what can I do?" kind of way. He never gives up on anything. It's more that he sits, fully analyzes a situation, and comes to the conclusion that the best course of action is inaction. He may not be doing much, but he does just enough to affect the flow of how things happen to him. He knows he can't change the course of the river, but if he puts a rock in the right place, it will alter the currents enough to suit his needs.

I don't know that I suspected that the "give me 10 minutes" woman was a manifestation of Kumiko, but I did suspect very early on that she was part of some sort of dream world. At least once, Toru had soemone in the house (Creta, if memory serves) when the phone rang. He let it ring, but Creta gave no indication of having heard it.

There are some very interesting simliarities between this and Hardboiled Wonderland. Certain particulars and parallels that cropped up in both. Definitely makes me want to read another to see if the trend continues.

[Alex]

For me, the key to Toru's behavior (in the last half of the book) is summarized in one sentence from when his uncle visits after learning of Kumiko's disappearance:

Originally Posted by Page 328

You ought to train yourself to look at things with your own eyes until something comes clear.

While this immediately gives rise to him sitting and watching faces in Shinjuku, it also is what he does for the rest of the book. He moves along with the forces in his life and just watches. He spends a couple months going down to the bottom of the well every day and just seeing what happens.

And during this time nothing new is really revealed to him or the reader about what is going on and yet through this process, when the moment of truth comes he has come to understand exactly what is going on and does what is necessary.


Another part that intrigues is from Kumiko's computer conversation with Toru.

Originally Posted by Page 492

"Going bad" is something that happens over a longer period of time.

I find the sentence interesting but does anything in the book really bear this out. Every instance of life changes I can find in the book happen with a sudden change of direction rather than a gradual one. Events so orbit each other exerting a gradual gravitational pull but rather carom about immediately and drastically changing things.

May has her motorcycle accident that puts her on one path and then her interacting with Toru in the well shifts her off into another direction.

Lt. Mamiya's life is completely changed in a single incident.

Creta lives live one way and then is knocked 90-degrees off with her suicide attempt and then again with her defilement by Noboru Wataya.

Nutmeg's life shifted with the brutal murder of her husband. Cinnamon after his encounter with the wind-up bird.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yeah, I kinda scratched my head over that too. Of course, it could just be a case of, well, just because someone makes an overreaching generalization about life, doesn't mean it's true. Even in a book.

Or, maybe the missing chapters tie it all together. When can we expect Lani to be finished translating them for us?

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

Yeah, I kinda scratched my head over that too. Of course, it could just be a case of, well, just because someone makes an overreaching generalization about life, doesn't mean it's true. Even in a book.

That's true, certainly. But Murakami emphasizes the sentence, repeating it several times over a few pages. So obviously it has some significance but I'm not sure what he sees it being, particularly since nothing gradual ever happens in the book other than Toru's understanding at the bottom of the well.

[Not Afraid]

I finished over the weekend and, I have to say that upon second reading, things seem to come together for me in many more ways. It may be because I have read muchmore Murakami and he explores similar themes in other books, but I see a cohesiveness in this book I didn't see before.

I have a few primary thoughts that have been surfacing and I thought I'd pose them as question here to discuss. I will finish formulating my own thoughts on these subjects and write something a bit later. But, for now, I want to see if you all have any thoughts on these questions.

What is the Wind Up Bird? What is it's meaning in the novel?

What is the significance of water in the book?

Discuss the layers of the characters in the book. There seems to be several parts that make up each character; the "worldly" identity and the "other", unconscious, or "core" identity.
___________________________________

I have to say that I am convinced that the lady on the phone and the person in the hotel room are Komiko - they are just the unconscious part of Komike that Toru doesn't recognize because he is only familiar with the worldly identity of Komiko. That was something that didn't gel with me the first time - but seems so obvious now.

Every character either experiences or speak of the "other" identity in the book. May talks about the mass inside, Creta sees her core when she is defiles by Norobu, Toru learns to tap into the unconscious world by visiting the well. Miyama experiences the "other" while in the well but can't grasp it, Cinnamon has cyberspace as his "other", Nutmeg exxperiences the other while on the ship. Norubu is the only character that has no "other" side revealed.

I read an essay about the book that explores this concept a bit further and suggests that Norubu was Toru's "other" but described it as a "nostalgic image". I will find that description and post it here. It is a difficult explaination but it seemed to make sense when I read it.

This book is so rich and complex that, I could spend hours thinking and discussing it. There are a thousand angles to approach it from and I wish we had the benefit of a face to face discussion.

[Alex]

Is not Norubu's "other" somewhat revealed in that Toru apparently beat him to death on the other side.

I wonder whether Norubu defiled Creta in our world or the "other" world. The parallels between Creta's pre-defilement (but post-suicidal) prostitution and Kumiko's pre-disappearance promiscuity seem strong.

I also feel a connection between Boris the Manskinner and Norubu and wonder if they might be the same malignant force. When Lt. Mamiya is unable to shoot Boris what did this imply?

[Not Afraid]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

I also feel a connection between Boris the Manskinner and Norubu and wonder if they might be the same malignant force.

Absolutely!

I will dig up the piece on nostalgic image when I get back.