All About McCain - Page 144

Ghoulish Delight · 10-31-2008, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Hey GD - she's referring to the inquisition into Joe the Plumber and the anchor woman who dared to ask Biden tough questions, who then had her background dug into. Just for asking questions. That's what she's referring to.

And what does that have to do with first amendment rights?

Alex · 10-31-2008, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Hey GD - she's referring to the inquisition into Joe the Plumber and the anchor woman who dared to ask Biden tough questions, who then had her background dug into. Just for asking questions. That's what she's referring to.

I didn't read GD's link so I know nothing about this one other than what is in this very thread. However, if the quote is accurate then the bolded part here would seem to contradict you pretty directly:

Quote:

If [the media] convince enough voters that that is negative campaigning, for me to call Barack Obama out on his associations," Palin told host Chris Plante, "then I don't know what the future of our country would be in terms of First Amendment rights and our ability to ask questions without fear of attacks by the mainstream media.

That said, even if that is what she was talking about. Isn't looking into the backgrounds of people who end up in the media spotlight (and you pretty much have to blame McCain for that in the case of "Joe the Plumber")? I mean, if you're going to allow yourself to be used as a prop then people are bound to wonder who you are.

scaeagles · 10-31-2008, 08:27 PM

From what I've heard, and I may be completely wrong, Joe the Plumber was investigated in Ohio using government equipment by government employees to dig up dirt on him to try to discredit him, when all he did was ask a question. So, yeah, I suppose technically he can still say whatever he wants, but if that is true, that's pretty intimidating for anyone who simply wants to ask a questiion of a leader.

Ghoulish Delight · 10-31-2008, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scaeagles

From what I've heard, and I may be completely wrong, Joe the Plumber was investigated in Ohio using government equipment by government employees to dig up dirt on him to try to discredit him, when all he did was ask a question.

This appears to be true. But until shown otherwise all that it seems to be is an overzealous DMV idiot who misused their access to sensitive information. It happens in every single election on both sides. I wonder what would happen if a similar investigation to see how many times people with access to government databases pulled info on Obama, McCain, Biden.

But that's not even the issue. The issue is that one idiot breaking the law and invading someone's privacy is not equal to violation of first amendment rights.

Strangler Lewis · 11-01-2008, 08:26 AM

What was the "dirt" on the TV anchor beyond that her husband apparently was affiliated with McCain's campaign?

Tom · 11-01-2008, 10:26 AM

And Joe the Plumber is as much a part of the McCain campaign now as anyone. If he didn't want scrutiny, he should've respectfully asked McCain to stop using him. Joe apparently is even considering a run for Congress, so to say that all he did was 'ask a question" is disingenuous. The backgrounds of campaign workers and potential candidates have been fair game for a long time, for better or worse. It was wrong for it to be done by a government employee on government equipment, but I see no abrogation of his rights here, just normal scrutiny.

scaeagles · 11-01-2008, 10:35 AM

There was talk of her husband's DUI....I think. I can't recall exactly.

OK, Tom, campaign workers can be scrutinized. I would say that Michelle Obama has been campaigning for her husband, yet Obama and the Obamites scream "that's not fair" blah, blah, blah whenever she has been scrutinized.

The point is that there are very, very few people who ask Biden or Obama tough questions. Joe the Plumber started out as a guy that stood in a crowd and spoke to Obama and all he did was say "You're going to raise my taxes, huh?". Obama's response is the issue, but the goal of the Obama campaign has been to make Joe the Plumber the issue. NO ONE made Obama say he wants to spread the wealth around. NO ONE except Obama. And it was a window into what Obama the non-campaigner believes.

JWBear · 11-01-2008, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scaeagles

The point is that there are very, very few people who ask Biden or Obama tough questions.

That has got to be the funniest thing I've read all day. LOL!!!!

(That was a joke, right?)

flippyshark · 11-01-2008, 12:04 PM

No matter how hard I try, I can't seem to make Palin's remarks about the First Amendment into a reference about how Joe the Plumber was investigated. She seems, on the face of it, to be clearly saying that the media (not the Obama campaign) should not criticize her for "going negative" about Obama's associations, and that by doing so, they are endangering her right to free speech. Is there some missing portion I'm not seeing?

In any case, I don't get this whole Joe the Plumber thing. It really has me baffled. Am I supposed to regard him as a hero? Someone who represents me? Am I supposed to relate to him? Because I find him repulsive and tiresome. Obama's "spread the wealth" answer was stupid, and a gift to McCain that might as well have been wrapped in gold paper with ribbons of sizzling hot bacon. But, this bald, sour-faced plumber guy? He looks like the kind of humorless sh!thead that has occasionally threatened to beat me up at work. (Happens from time to time - big guy gets drunk, forgets he's watching actors in a show, and goes ballistic.) No thanks. I'm really puzzled by McCain's continued use of him. Yuck. (For all I know, he may be a total sweetheart of a guy, but he looks like someone central casting would choose if their script called for bouncer, goon squad guy or skinhead.)

innerSpaceman · 11-01-2008, 03:49 PM

And if he's an unlicensed plumber concerned about his taxes being raised ... because he's a tax dogder who has a back-taxes lien on his house ... who besides McCain is to blame for making him an instant fauxlebrity worthy of media attention and scrutiny?

There's nothing wrong per se with asking Obama a question about taxes (though perhaps a tax dodger shouldn't do that on camera), but it's not the question that made him the object of media attention. It was McCain mentioning him on national TV 26 times in the space of an hour.

10-31-2008, 08:27 PM	#3
scaeagles I LIKE! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 7,819	From what I've heard, and I may be completely wrong, Joe the Plumber was investigated in Ohio using government equipment by government employees to dig up dirt on him to try to discredit him, when all he did was ask a question. So, yeah, I suppose technically he can still say whatever he wants, but if that is true, that's pretty intimidating for anyone who simply wants to ask a questiion of a leader.
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11-01-2008, 08:26 AM	#5
Strangler Lewis Doing The Job Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In a state Posts: 3,956	What was the "dirt" on the TV anchor beyond that her husband apparently was affiliated with McCain's campaign? __________________ Live now-pay later. Diner's Club!
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11-01-2008, 10:26 AM	#6
Tom Valued member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 541	And Joe the Plumber is as much a part of the McCain campaign now as anyone. If he didn't want scrutiny, he should've respectfully asked McCain to stop using him. Joe apparently is even considering a run for Congress, so to say that all he did was 'ask a question" is disingenuous. The backgrounds of campaign workers and potential candidates have been fair game for a long time, for better or worse. It was wrong for it to be done by a government employee on government equipment, but I see no abrogation of his rights here, just normal scrutiny.
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11-01-2008, 10:35 AM	#7
scaeagles I LIKE! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 7,819	There was talk of her husband's DUI....I think. I can't recall exactly. OK, Tom, campaign workers can be scrutinized. I would say that Michelle Obama has been campaigning for her husband, yet Obama and the Obamites scream "that's not fair" blah, blah, blah whenever she has been scrutinized. The point is that there are very, very few people who ask Biden or Obama tough questions. Joe the Plumber started out as a guy that stood in a crowd and spoke to Obama and all he did was say "You're going to raise my taxes, huh?". Obama's response is the issue, but the goal of the Obama campaign has been to make Joe the Plumber the issue. NO ONE made Obama say he wants to spread the wealth around. NO ONE except Obama. And it was a window into what Obama the non-campaigner believes.
	Submit to Quotes

11-01-2008, 12:04 PM	#9
flippyshark Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 2,852	No matter how hard I try, I can't seem to make Palin's remarks about the First Amendment into a reference about how Joe the Plumber was investigated. She seems, on the face of it, to be clearly saying that the media (not the Obama campaign) should not criticize her for "going negative" about Obama's associations, and that by doing so, they are endangering her right to free speech. Is there some missing portion I'm not seeing? In any case, I don't get this whole Joe the Plumber thing. It really has me baffled. Am I supposed to regard him as a hero? Someone who represents me? Am I supposed to relate to him? Because I find him repulsive and tiresome. Obama's "spread the wealth" answer was stupid, and a gift to McCain that might as well have been wrapped in gold paper with ribbons of sizzling hot bacon. But, this bald, sour-faced plumber guy? He looks like the kind of humorless sh!thead that has occasionally threatened to beat me up at work. (Happens from time to time - big guy gets drunk, forgets he's watching actors in a show, and goes ballistic.) No thanks. I'm really puzzled by McCain's continued use of him. Yuck. (For all I know, he may be a total sweetheart of a guy, but he looks like someone central casting would choose if their script called for bouncer, goon squad guy or skinhead.)
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11-01-2008, 03:49 PM	#10
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	And if he's an unlicensed plumber concerned about his taxes being raised ... because he's a tax dogder who has a back-taxes lien on his house ... who besides McCain is to blame for making him an instant fauxlebrity worthy of media attention and scrutiny? There's nothing wrong per se with asking Obama a question about taxes (though perhaps a tax dodger shouldn't do that on camera), but it's not the question that made him the object of media attention. It was McCain mentioning him on national TV 26 times in the space of an hour.
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