Katrina Response Mismanagement

[Scrooge McSam]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Of course, it has just been announced that a large portion of the city - including the French Quarter and a large portion of the business district - will be open again to the public by the end of the week. I'd say that's moving pretty well. Of course, no credit should go to the feds - it's all too little, too late.

Oh geez, you're killing me over here LOL

Why in the world would anybody need to congratulate Bush because portions of the city that only saw slight damage are re-opening?

OK... I'm game. I'll give it a shot.

Thank you, Mr. President, for insuring that the original French settlement that became New Orleans was constructed on high ground hundreds of years before your birth. Way to plan ahead there, guy!

Feel better?

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Scrooge McSam

Oh geez, you're killing me over here LOL

Why in the world would anybody need to congratulate Bush because portions of the city that only saw slight damage are re-opening?

OK... I'm game. I'll give it a shot.

Thank you, Mr. President, for insuring that the original French settlement that became New Orleans was constructed on high ground hundreds of years before your birth. Way to plan ahead there, guy!

Feel better?

Well, in that case, why is it the problem of the feds that so much of it was built below sea level? If it weren't, there would be no disaster. My post was primarily out of sarcasm - the thing that is frustrating to me is that the feds get no credit for anything that goes well, only criticism for what does not.

And actually, I find it sad that I expect that the feds should get any credit for anything that goes well. I am a states rights guy - but I am also a state responsibility kind of guy.

I take it upon myself to be as prepared as I can be. I honestly do not expect anything from the government should there be a disaster. I buy insurance - health, home, blanket liability. I have tried to be as prepared as possible by always having a few cases of water in the garage, the cars tuned up, etc. Can everyone afford to do this? Certainly not.

I expect my state to be prepared. I expect the city of Phoenix to be prepared. I do not expect that the feds should have to come rescue me.

This is why I have so much more disdain for the governor and mayor than i have concern about the preparedness of the feds. To me, it is about their lack of preparation rather than the feds being slower than they should have to respond. And to see them whining like the immature brats that they are makes me ill. "Where's the help?", screamed the mayor, while the people he failed are the ones requiring it. "why is FEMA so slow collecting the dead?", whined the governor, while the dead are there because of her irresponsibility.

To me, it isn't about whether the feds will be able to save me next time. To me, it's about the morons who were so unprepared that hundreds are dead because of it. And they themselves turned away much of the humanitarian aid (from the red cross) that they were whining wasn't there to help them.

That is what make me ill.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I take it upon myself to be as prepared as I can be. I honestly do not expect anything from the government should there be a disaster. I buy insurance...
I expect my state to be prepared. I expect the city of Phoenix to be prepared.

So what's the difference between you buying insurance and expecting your insurance company to fulfill the promise you paid them for should something befall your home that's too catostrpohic to pay for out of your own pocket vs. a state/state's residents sending tax money that fund FEMA and expecting FEMA to fulfill the promise to support them when something happens that's too catostrophic for them to handle?

Yeah, the state dropped the ball and didn't pay their deductible, but if your home colapsed tomorrow, would you rather your insurance company squabbled with you about deductibles that morning, or start the process of getting things taken care of and deal with that crap later?

[wendybeth]

What was the state to do? Strong-arm the feds for the funding? Here is an article that lays out much of what I've been reading and hearing about these past few weeks: Did it have to happen?

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

So what's the difference between you buying insurance and expecting your insurance company to fulfill the promise you paid them for should something befall your home that's too catostrpohic to pay for out of your own pocket vs. a state/state's residents sending tax money that fund FEMA and expecting FEMA to fulfill the promise to support them when something happens that's too catostrophic for them to handle?

I mentioned I'm a states rights/responsibility kind of guy.

I look at the federal government - regardless of which party or who is in charge - and see incompetence. This is why I support a smaller federal government, and this is where GWBush has failed me. Sadly, the republicans are no longer the party of smaller government. I can't say the dems are either. I'd go libertarian if they didn't have primarily whackos as their candidates, but that's another story.

Scrooge mentions that no city can handle its own forced evacuation. How, then, are the feds to do it? The feds have no right to do it, and in fact weren't asked to help in the evacuation. I could be wrong - I have vague recollection that some help was requested 12 hours or so before it hit, but that's enough time? I would guess using the literally hundreds of busses might have been a good way to start helping those who couldn't get out. Yes, there was certainly traffic congestion trying to get out of NO, but there weren't people dying on the highways because they couldn't wait the traffic out.

The feds cannot be responsible nor expected to plan/prepare for the events can take place in any municipality. This is what local government is for. I believe that everything is managed - or at least should be - better at the local level.

Anyway, back to the GD quote -
The government is not an insurance agency. They have no obligation to protect me as an individual. There was a case a while ago - some may recall it, but I can't site the time period or even where - regarding a law suit of someone who had called 911, but the police didn't get there in time to prevent the crime. The supreme court, I believe - and again, it might have been an appeals court - ruled that the police force is not a private security force and cannot be expected nor required to be there in time to assist you in your time of need. There are broader implications of this rulig going across government.

And regarding the comparison to an insurance company, I would say the feds are acting a lot like one - bailing out a lot of people who would be losing everything. I don't think they are reneging on their commitment whatsoever.

While slow in response, the failure here was not on the part of the feds. It was on the part of the locals. Sure, I hope the next time they are faster, but I am not counting on it. Nor should anyone. It is a local responsibility.

[Scrooge McSam]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

This is why I have so much more disdain for the governor and mayor than i have concern about the preparedness of the feds. To me, it is about their lack of preparation rather than the feds being slower than they should have to respond. And to see them whining like the immature brats that they are makes me ill. "Where's the help?", screamed the mayor, while the people he failed are the ones requiring it. "why is FEMA so slow collecting the dead?", whined the governor, while the dead are there because of her irresponsibility.

Isn't it funny how 2 people can read a situation so differently.

My take... A couple of year before the storm, the city's laid out the plan and it's insufficient. Right there in black and white. The city is telling the fed in no uncertain terms "We do not have the resources to handle a disaster of this magnitude". Period.

NO CITY ON THE FACE OF THIS EARTH CAN HANDLE ITS OWN FORCED EVACUATION.

Try to imagine a forced evacuation of Los Angeles. Go on, try! Move on to New York and give it a good think. That one will bust your head open. Now we have options. We can fix these levees, but it's gonna cost a few million. I know "Freedom's on the march" and all and money's tight, but we could sure use it.

[SacTown Chronic]

Originally Posted by Scrooge McSam

Thank you, Mr. President, for insuring that the original French settlement that became New Orleans was constructed on high ground hundreds of years before your birth. Way to plan ahead there, guy!

That Bush guy is a genius!

Originally Posted by Motorboat Cruiser

What was the first reason?

Waking up after a drug binge and seeing Ann Coulter in bed next to you.

*shudder*

[innerSpaceman]

MB makes a great point. While I really do think it's a good thing that Bush verbally accepts responsibity at his Buck-Stops-Here Oval Office desk, I would really like to see actions backing up those words. It is indeed one thing to say you take responsibility and another to actually take that responsibility.

I'll give him some time before judging him on that score, but cronyism would have to be wiped out of every federal agency, FEMA removed from the auspices of Homeland Security, tons more heads on pikes to spend more decapitated time with their families, financial directions reversed to fund disaster prevention instead of mop-up, and the emergency-preparedness of this nation drastically revised from top to bottom and demonstrated to be adequate to the task.

That would be responsibility. Other than that is platitudes.



And yeah, the Louisiana and New Orleans governments suck, too. But, as I'm from California, that's not my province of legitimate complaint. For the record though, I disapprove of the lametard way they handled this crisis.

[Ghoulish Delight]

What MBC said. I think if you go back and find my posts, you'll see a lot of things like "every level" and "from top to bottom" when I'm talking about what went wrong. I'll scoff nearly as loudly if and when I hear their appologies.

But 1) LA and NO officials have little to do with me and 2) I know little about their track records. So yeah, from my perspective, I really really hope that focusing on Bush will continue to wake people up to the fact that our country elected an ineffectual leader, to put it nicely, and that it won't happen again. It's not about right or left, it's about incompetance. And that fact that Georgie is admitting a mistake (notice he still hasn't said he himself made any mistakes, just that he takes responsibilities for other people's mistakes) when, as MBC points out, he has NEVER done that before shows just how badly things went. Because if he can stand in front of the world and continue to talk about Iraq in glowing terms, things have to really be well beyond "in the sh!tter" for him to do such a thing.

[wendybeth]

There is no doubt that the state and local government dropped the ball here, but isn't that where FEMA is supposed to step in? When it's too big for the locals to handle, or the infrastructure is so damaged they can't? The entire Gulf Coast area was practically blown off the friggen map, and he was still on vacation..... Still, I suppose I should cut him some slack- after all, didn't the media say that everything was okay? (Still can't find where they said that, but I'll keep looking).