Anti-flag burning amendment passes first hurdle

[€uroMeinke]

I guess we'll just have to burn crosses

[LSPoorEeyorick]

Originally Posted by wendybeth

Why on earth is the Republican party so hellbent on rewriting the Constitution?

And the worst part, for me, is that none of this fvcking shocks me anymore. The Republicans are defecating on our free speech? *looks at watch* Yup, that's right about on time.

To quote a movie I don't like, but which is apropos: "so this is how liberty dies..."

[Gn2Dlnd]

Originally Posted by ubergeek42

***Caution..Disturbing Image***

*Commodore adjusts monocle*

[Scrooge McSam]

You must spread some Mojo around before giving it to Prudence again.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

I love that Pen and Teller did that, GD. I didn’t know about it. Thanks. Plus, I kinda love any duo where one of them names his kid Moxie Crimefighter. Seriously, celebrities name their kids the dumbest effin’ things possible, but I just LOVE that one. Crimefighter! Awesome.

Anyway….

The flag represents something to different people. And it should. It can represent the American ideal/dream, which is what it means to my father. After September 11th, when every war mongering “Axis if Evil” mouth sputtering person was pasting flags all over their houses, vehicles, clothing, etc., I was horrified when my father, too, displayed the flag outside of his house. I said, “People are going to think you support what Bush is doing.” Which my father didn’t and doesn’t. He can’t stand that Administration at all. He’s the most liberal 72 year old ex-army dude I know. He just turned to me and said, “Fvck what other people think. I know what I think. And I’m supporting the idea of what this country is supposed to be and what I know it could be. I’m supporting the troops who have to go through this. I don’t love what’s happening right now, but I still love this country.” We argued for a while, because I agreed with what he was saying, but I still thought that his show of support was too much the same as those with whom he vehemently disagrees, and therefore his actual feelings and opinions were being accidentally misrepresented. We came to see it the same way, I guess, but the flag stayed put.

The flag could also symbolize everything someone hates about their government, and so I could understand why a person would burn one in protest.

In high school, when I could chose whether to stand or remain seated for the Pledge of Allegiance I chose to remain seated. And I was also grateful to live in a country where I was given that choice. I had problems with the inclusion of “God” in the pledge, and I wasn’t comfortable, at such a young age, pledging my allegiance to anything I didn’t know enough about. I’m not hugely patriotic or even nationalistic. I think “patriotic” is a dangerous word. I’m more interested in the world as a whole, and how we all fit together. I’d much rather have a flag that looked like a world map. I feel a strange connection to California as something that I belong to and that belongs equally to me, and for that reason I am actually moved and tickled every time I see the California flag. Or maybe that’s just ‘cause it has a friggin’ bear on it. I love it. I’d proudly fly that on my front lawn, if I had one. I saw a girl in NYC with the CA flag tattooed on her calf and I wanted to hug her.

But the American flag? I look at it and I think about all the tax dollars that go towards the bloated military budget. I think about the problems surrounding funding for public education. And though, like my father, I do feel a sort of love for this country because of what I believe Democracy represents, and what I think it could be if I really thought we had one. (And I don’t just blame the Man, or politicians and corporations, for it’s a grassroots government, and it’s the people’s fault if we’re not vigilant in our participation at all levels – the voting, the holding officials accountable, the not tolerating any bull****, because we seem to tolerate it quite a lot - myself *totally* included.)

Anyway, these kinds of debates often leave me feeling ineffectual and all kinds of stupid. Do I love this country exactly as it is? No. Do I love what I think this country for what I believe it could be? Yes. So, to me, that means I love my country. Though I still make no pledges.

Still, instead of the USA flag, I’d much rather hang this Langston Huges poem on my door:

Let America be America Again

Let America be America again.
Let it be the dream it used to be.
Let it be the pioneer on the plain
Seeking a home where he himself is free.

(America never was America to me.)

Let America be the dream the dreamers dreamed--
Let it be that great strong land of love
Where never kings connive nor tyrants scheme
That any man be crushed by one above.

(It never was America to me.)

O, let my land be a land where Liberty
Is crowned with no false patriotic wreath,
But opportunity is real, and life is free,
Equality is in the air we breathe.

(There's never been equality for me,
Nor freedom in this "homeland of the free.")

Say, who are you that mumbles in the dark?
And who are you that draws your veil across the stars?

I am the poor white, fooled and pushed apart,
I am the Negro bearing slavery's scars.
I am the red man driven from the land,
I am the immigrant clutching the hope I seek--
And finding only the same old stupid plan
Of dog eat dog, of mighty crush the weak.

I am the young man, full of strength and hope,
Tangled in that ancient endless chain
Of profit, power, gain, of grab the land!
Of grab the gold! Of grab the ways of satisfying need!
Of work the men! Of take the pay!
Of owning everything for one's own greed!

I am the farmer, bondsman to the soil.
I am the worker sold to the machine.
I am the Negro, servant to you all.
I am the people, humble, hungry, mean--
Hungry yet today despite the dream.
Beaten yet today--O, Pioneers!
I am the man who never got ahead,
The poorest worker bartered through the years.

Yet I'm the one who dreamt our basic dream
In the Old World while still a serf of kings,
Who dreamt a dream so strong, so brave, so true,
That even yet its mighty daring sings
In every brick and stone, in every furrow turned
That's made America the land it has become.
O, I'm the man who sailed those early seas
In search of what I meant to be my home--
For I'm the one who left dark Ireland's shore,
And Poland's plain, and England's grassy lea,
And torn from Black Africa's strand I came
To build a "homeland of the free."

The free?

Who said the free? Not me?
Surely not me? The millions on relief today?
The millions shot down when we strike?
The millions who have nothing for our pay?
For all the dreams we've dreamed
And all the songs we've sung
And all the hopes we've held
And all the flags we've hung,
The millions who have nothing for our pay--
Except the dream that's almost dead today.

O, let America be America again--
The land that never has been yet--
And yet must be--the land where every man is free.
The land that's mine--the poor man's, Indian's, Negro's, ME--
Who made America,
Whose sweat and blood, whose faith and pain,
Whose hand at the foundry, whose plow in the rain,
Must bring back our mighty dream again.

Sure, call me any ugly name you choose--
The steel of freedom does not stain.
From those who live like leeches on the people's lives,
We must take back our land again,
America!

O, yes,
I say it plain,
America never was America to me,
And yet I swear this oath--
America will be!

Out of the rack and ruin of our gangster death,
The rape and rot of graft, and stealth, and lies,
We, the people, must redeem
The land, the mines, the plants, the rivers.
The mountains and the endless plain--
All, all the stretch of these great green states--
And make America again!

[Scrooge McSam]

Originally Posted by Eliza Hodgkins 1812

“Fvck what other people think. I know what I think. And I’m supporting the idea of what this country is supposed to be and what I know it could be. I’m supporting the troops who have to go through this. I don’t love what’s happening right now, but I still love this country.”

Hurrah for your Dad! I enjoyed the flag. I loved the singularity of purpose that Americans can summon when situations call for it. It was the symbols that started coming later that started getting my goat. Every time I see a "Support the Troops" sticker on a 9mpg behemoth it just.. I can't talk about it

I got accused of treason yesterday at lunch. "Actively working against our government and our troops" was what she said. I played it cool. And I know nobody believes that, but anyway.

It was about Durbin. Big surprise, right? And now today, this. I really and truly don't know what to do anymore.

Originally Posted by Eliza Hodgkins 1812

I do feel a sort of love for this country because of what I believe Democracy represents, and what I think it could be if I really thought we had one. (And I don’t just blame the Man, or politicians and corporations, for it’s a grassroots government, and it’s the people’s fault if we’re not vigilant in our participation at all levels – the voting, the holding officials accountable, the not tolerating any bull****, because we seem to tolerate it quite a lot - myself *totally* included.)

But, I'm gonna keep trying. Come on, it'll be fun

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

Originally Posted by Scrooge McSam

But, I'm gonna keep trying. Come on, it'll be fun

Okay, but only because it's you who's asking.