The random political thoughts thread (Part Deux) - Page 349

JWBear · 09-11-2008, 06:17 PM

IMO, attempting to deny someone their right to vote is tantamount to treason.

sleepyjeff · 09-11-2008, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWBear

IMO, attempting to deny someone their right to vote is tantamount to treason.

How do you feel about the whole Alice Palmer affair?

JWBear · 09-11-2008, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sleepyjeff

How do you feel about the whole Alice Palmer affair?

What has that to do with denying someone their right to have their vote counted?

sleepyjeff · 09-11-2008, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWBear

What has that to do with denying someone their right to have their vote counted?

Well, if your candidate is not even on the ballot due to some smart lawyering by her oposistion wouldn't you feel somewhat disenfranchised? Obama got everyone but himself kicked off the ballot.......yeah, he wanted every vote to count.........for him.

innerSpaceman · 09-11-2008, 06:23 PM

And I'm not gonna say the McCain camp is behind this without any evidence ... but I've never even heard allegations that this was ever done to disenfranchise Republican voters. Caging and other such shenanigans have always been exclusive (again, to my knowledge) to negatively affect groups likely to vote Democratic.

As such, until anyone can provide examples to the contrary, I consider this a page strictly from the Republican Book of Dirty Tricks. If McCain's not behind it, it's being done for his benefit ... and he needs to come out forcefully against it and take demonstrable steps to stop it. Otherwise, if he benefits, he's complicit in voter fraud.

If not treason, that's high crimes and misdemeanors before he even gets a chance to officially commit some in office.

innerSpaceman · 09-11-2008, 08:43 PM

I don't know about this Palmer incident, but my general study of Obama's political trajectory leads me to believe he played much dirtier in Illinois politics and has gotten cleaner at the game as he's moved from Senator to presidential candidate.

It's a little simplistic to say, because John McCain hasn't always been Mr. Clean Whistle, but my following of his trajectory is that he ran a fairly clean presidential campaign last time (undone by the dirty tricksters) and is running a fairly dirty one this time around.

So Obama is rising from corrupt campaigning and McCain is descending straight down into it.

I don't consider either an angel, and don't put dirty deeds as president beyond either's reach. But clearly I don't like what McCain is becoming, while I think Obama is improving. That, in itself, is reason to vote for Obama in the contest between them.

Morrigoon · 09-12-2008, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

I don't consider either an angel, and don't put dirty deeds as president beyond either's reach. But clearly I don't like what McCain is becoming, while I think Obama is improving. That, in itself, is reason to vote for Obama in the contest between them.

I have to say that I've been really enjoying following your thought process on who to vote for. I mean that in a totally non-sarcastic way, because given your original position, it's been interesting watching you decide where to go from there.

innerSpaceman · 09-12-2008, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morrigoon

it's been interesting watching you decide where to go from there.

Don't mistake me, then. It's not "reason enough" for me to vote for him, though it's one of many reasons Obama's a better choice than McCain.

I reject both of them. The election in November is about my civil rights, and both major party candidates stand in the way of that.

Tom · 09-11-2008, 08:56 PM

I have routinely been given misleading information by those seeking signatures on ballot proposition petitions. I always assumed it was workers paid by the signature doing whatever they could for an extra buck, rather than coordinated misinformation by the campaigns.

scaeagles · 09-11-2008, 09:06 PM

I believe that every political candidate would eat the other if it meant victory. Those candidates who manage to stay above the fray have surrogates who do the dirty work for them, often times with blessings, sometimes without, and still at other times with a "I don't want to know" type attitude for plausible deniability.

Politics is a brutally dirty game and I don't happen to think one side is any cleaner than the other.

09-11-2008, 06:17 PM	#1
JWBear Worn Romantic Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Long Beach California Posts: 8,435	IMO, attempting to deny someone their right to vote is tantamount to treason. __________________ Unrestrained frivolity will lead to the downfall of modern society.
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09-11-2008, 06:23 PM	#5
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	And I'm not gonna say the McCain camp is behind this without any evidence ... but I've never even heard allegations that this was ever done to disenfranchise Republican voters. Caging and other such shenanigans have always been exclusive (again, to my knowledge) to negatively affect groups likely to vote Democratic. As such, until anyone can provide examples to the contrary, I consider this a page strictly from the Republican Book of Dirty Tricks. If McCain's not behind it, it's being done for his benefit ... and he needs to come out forcefully against it and take demonstrable steps to stop it. Otherwise, if he benefits, he's complicit in voter fraud. If not treason, that's high crimes and misdemeanors before he even gets a chance to officially commit some in office.
	Submit to Quotes

09-11-2008, 08:43 PM	#6
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	I don't know about this Palmer incident, but my general study of Obama's political trajectory leads me to believe he played much dirtier in Illinois politics and has gotten cleaner at the game as he's moved from Senator to presidential candidate. It's a little simplistic to say, because John McCain hasn't always been Mr. Clean Whistle, but my following of his trajectory is that he ran a fairly clean presidential campaign last time (undone by the dirty tricksters) and is running a fairly dirty one this time around. So Obama is rising from corrupt campaigning and McCain is descending straight down into it. I don't consider either an angel, and don't put dirty deeds as president beyond either's reach. But clearly I don't like what McCain is becoming, while I think Obama is improving. That, in itself, is reason to vote for Obama in the contest between them.
	Submit to Quotes

09-11-2008, 08:56 PM	#9
Tom Valued member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 541	I have routinely been given misleading information by those seeking signatures on ballot proposition petitions. I always assumed it was workers paid by the signature doing whatever they could for an extra buck, rather than coordinated misinformation by the campaigns.
	Submit to Quotes

09-11-2008, 09:06 PM	#10
scaeagles I LIKE! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 7,819	I believe that every political candidate would eat the other if it meant victory. Those candidates who manage to stay above the fray have surrogates who do the dirty work for them, often times with blessings, sometimes without, and still at other times with a "I don't want to know" type attitude for plausible deniability. Politics is a brutally dirty game and I don't happen to think one side is any cleaner than the other.
	Submit to Quotes