The random political thoughts thread (Part Deux)

[Not Afraid]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Edited to add....the middle class squeeze? Right now, in spite of high oil prices, consumer confidence is high and the economy is doing well.

I got out of my car not 10 minutes ago and they were talking about how comsumer confidence was dropping.

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Not Afraid

I got out of my car not 10 minutes ago and they were talking about how comsumer confidence was dropping.

Who is "they"? Read the link I just posted.

[Not Afraid]

It was a new program on KCRW. Most likely NPR-related.

[innerSpaceman]

Whatever you think of her, that was a firebrand statement Pelosi made ... and I love her for that alone. I'm tired of politicians sounding so frelling tentative.

[Alex]

Somehow I doubt you'd love David Duke for firebrand statements alone so I doubt that is literally true. But at least she does say whatever she is thinking.

But if it is a conspiracy then why is Citco's gas so expensive too? Surely Bush and Hugo Chavez haven't come to a secret pact?

Why do people have such a problem accepting two things:

1) There are market effects that will at times cause increases in the cost of gasoline and heating oil and at other times cause a decrease in cost (such as through most of the '80s and early '90s).
2) There are market-distorting effects (such as Balkanization of blends, regulatory shifts, and taxation) that will almost always simply increase the cost of gas and heating oil.

When #1 and #2 are both creating increases then prices will go up quickly, particularly in speculative spot markets.

I have no particular problem with the idea that someone is gaming the system but so far haven't really seen anybody point to anything real other than simply crying "it costs a lot and those guys are getting rich!" The possibility that we have entered into oligopolistic pricing should be considered and if necessary break up the ownership a bit. But on the surface this doesn't look like it would have much effect since the commodity is already being sold in an open market and not at prices set by the producers. The same forces that appear to be causing this uptick and making oilmen rich are the same ones that made a ghost town of Houston in the early '80s, they're just moving in the other direction now.

I still haven't seen any of the Democrats calling for Bush's head on this provide an answer for how they would have prevented this or fix it. There was the one congresswoman this morning saying "Mr. President where is all the Iraqi oil you promised us!" I wonder what happened to no war for oil.

[innerSpaceman]

What happened to it is that no one believed it for a second. We invaded that country for oil, pure and simple. Every school girl knows that nasty dictators in countries with no valuable resources do not have their regimes changed by military means costing billions of dollars a month.

So, since the rebuilding of Iraq was designed to pour money into the hands of multinational corporations and not the economy of Iraq, the reconstruction has not gone as common sense would have envisioned it. Contrary to popular opinion, the reconstruction was not bungled by the Bush Administration. It went exactly as they designed. And yet - 3 years later - there is less oil flowing, less electricity, and less employment in Iraq than before the invasion. Most people consider that a failure, but the rebuilding effort was not designed to have more oil flow.

It should have been, and politicians of all stripes and the American people and the Iraqi people have every cause to be outraged that it's not. Because you shouldn't spend billions of dollars a month of the national treasury to have less oil flowing.

It would be heinous enough if Bush were serving the ecomonic interests of the U.S. in invading an oil-rich nation. What he's actually doing is far worse.

[scaeagles]

I disagree with that post on so many levels that I don't know which part to quote or what to begin with, but as it would simply lapse into a back and forth done so many times before, it isn't worth it.

Suffice it to say, then, I disagree.

[wendybeth]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I disagree with that post on so many levels that I don't know which part to quote or what to begin with, but as it would simply lapse into a back and forth done so many times before, it isn't worth it.

Suffice it to say, then, I disagree.

What iSm said in his post is precisely what I was thinking, so you'd no doubt disagree with me as well. I started to respond to Alex, and then I just threw my hands up in the air and switched threads. It absolutely amazes me that you cannot draw a line between the big business/political ties of this administration- a five year old would have no problem connecting the frikking dots. Make no mistake about it- the Bush regime will go down in history as one of- if not the most- corrupt this country has ever known. And guess what? You're not getting squat of what they have pilfered- instead, you get to pay and pay and pay, and when you're dead, your kids will pay. Maybe that works for you, but not me.

[wendybeth]

It would seem the Public Safety officials in our area are lacking in confidence these days: Fuel costs straining Public Safety budget . I'm sure this is a scenario being played out across the country.

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by wendybeth

a five year old would have no problem connecting the frikking dots.

So, WB, it comes down to people who do not see the world as you do being less mentally able than a five year old. That's nice.

I won't be quite as insulting - a junior high student would have no problem understanding market forces and supply and demand. No....I take that back. I know my 6th grade daughter understands them, and I bet it wouldn't be too hard to explain to my first grader, who is 6.

I won't comment on the historical comparison of corruption between administrations. Not worth it. But let's just say it isn't hard to find corruption that I consider to be much more severe.

What have they pilfered? What have they stolen? What am I paying and paying and paying for? I pay less taxes now than I used to under previous administrations. Inflation, even with energy prices surging, is minimal.

But, since I'm not a five year old, perhaps I just don't get it.