A Prop 8 challenge for swankers - Page 53

innerSpaceman · 11-05-2008, 11:42 PM

I guess just before.

Because if I have to pull out my dick near the Mormon Temple Lawn to protest their stance on gay marriage, I'm gonna wanna do something else with it besides peeing.

CoasterMatt · 11-05-2008, 11:47 PM

My father in law voted no on 8 - he's Catholic, but he voted for his fellow Americans, not for the church.

I can't wait to hear him talk about this topic again (as GC can attest, he's quite the talker).

innerSpaceman · 11-05-2008, 11:52 PM

I think that lawyer is being awful pessimistic.

The matter is going to go before the very court that said Marriage Rights are a fundamental constitution right. Case law or no, I don't think they'll have much problem determining the vote was an improper revision of the Constitution.

Furthermore, liberal court or no .... courts don't like their jurisdiction being undermined, and this court won't take kindly to this attempted end-run around their historic civil rights ruling.

There may not be guiding precedent, but the California Supreme Court has every motivation and reason to find some way find Proposition 8 a revision and not an amendment ... and thus invalidate it.

This would NOT be a major victory to me. This was much more important than gay marriage rights in California. Just as America once was to the world, California is a beacon of progress and liberty to the rest of the nation. Even while they mock us, they always end up following our lead toward a more enlightened future.

But gay rights by judicial fiat is a far cry from gay rights by the will of the voters. Even if those rights are reaffirmed by the court, it's not the kind of fire that will spread throughout the country.

A great opportunity has been lost.

There were no plans of action voiced at tonight's rally, to the great disappointment of many. I happen to think Goonie's plan to start straight away on a countervailing ballot initiative is the way to go. It shouldn't be too hard to get the necessary signatures to put this on the ballot in 2 years if we strike while the iron is hot.

Morrigoon · 11-06-2008, 12:07 AM

Does anyone know the process for filing it?

innerSpaceman · 11-06-2008, 12:22 AM

No clue on this end.

Wish I'd had a camera tonight, there were some great signs.

A couple were about Separate Drinking Fountains for Gays ... one with great illustrations.

A really cute one with a picture of Sesame Street's Bert and Ernie emblazoned with the banner "Gay Love."

I think my fave was "My Pedophile Priest Supports Traditional Marriage."

Thanks to Ghoulish Delight, the one I carried - "What Does My Marriage Have To Do With Yours?" was a big hit ... but I have to wonder if it didn't make one too many cute single gay guy think I was married. Uh-oh.

I think I had the most fun in the first hour when we were all standing halfway in the street on all four corners of the Santa Monica / San Vicente intersection, waving hundreds of signs and chanting cool slogans ... and getting fantastic honk support from passing cars and busses. It was really high energy, fun and awesome.

After a while though, the crowd ended up taking over the entire intersection and stopping traffic on Santa Monica Boulevard ... which was kinda fun for a moment ... but stopped all the fun traffic flow, and undoubtedly turned driver support to driver upset.

Afterwards, we all wandered down San Vicente to the main program and listened to some inspiring and some not-so-inspiring speakers/

I got the feeling they were trying mostly to molify the crowd. And I didn't feel like thanking all the people for their hard work in a failure political campaign. And I didn't much feel like hearing this was just another step in the long march toward civil rights ... even though of course that's what it is.

But it was certainly nice to be among the like-minded crowd, at once warm-hearted and passionate, kind and angry. Very specially nice to be among some of my subscriber friends, and so touching to have Heidi and Tom there to lend their wonderful support. I am so moved.

Thank you all for you kind and wonderful support on this important human rights issue. The LoT of You are a Lot of Good.

Moonliner · 11-06-2008, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

Wish I'd had a camera tonight, there were some great signs.

The protest made the news scroller on Good Morning America today.

~MS~ · 11-06-2008, 08:14 AM

Can I just say how proud I am that while it sucks major arse that 8 passed, my little no name county said NO to 8 and as of this morning is the ONLY county that will issue same sex marriage licenses until orders from the state to cease are issued. Our county clerk did admit that there might be a question on the validity of the marriages performed today but that until he was DIRECTED by the state to cease and desist he would issue licenses to any who applied. It doesn't help the over all situation but it does make me feel that our efforts to say No to 8 were successful locally if not statewide.

Strangler Lewis · 11-06-2008, 06:20 AM

Well, the lawyer was wrong because Thurgood Marshall wasn't on the Supreme Court that eliminated separate but equal. He litigated those cases.

I don't think it's an ex post facto law any more than the Defense of Marriage Act was. It doesn't punish. More to the point, it tells the government how to act going forward. Jerry Brown has said that he will defend the marriages already enacted, and he will defend the law as well. If he can pull off this trick, then I suppose married gay couples could go to Massachusetts or some other friendly place and not have to get married again to be considered married.

As to black support for Proposition 8, why should we be surprised? Pick your oppressed group. The experience of racism has never automatically caused sweeping empathy for other cultural groups that experienced racism, nor has it caused groups to wake up and challenge the sexism in their own cultures.

SacTown Chronic · 11-06-2008, 07:19 AM

Blacks on the whole seem to be more religious than whites in this country. And why not? God's certainly earned their loyalty, you ask me. And yes, generally speaking, they are over-the-top homophobes. When pressed about the homosexuality thing, they use words like 'faith' and 'sin'.

I've been doing a slow burn on this Prop 8 crap. Thinking about what it means...to the Gay and to the rest of us. And I've reached a conclusion:

Fvck them. Fvck every one that would lift a finger to deny rights. Fvck every white, black, and green "Christian" who insists on bossing me around with their bible. Fvck every single one of them who had their child out in the rain, waving signs at passing motorists. These people wouldn't understand compassion and grace even if they were fvcked in the earhole with their beloved Bible by Jesus Christ himself.

Yeah, fvck them.

innerSpaceman · 11-06-2008, 09:44 AM

Yeah, yeah, i know.

Eye for an eye and we're all blind.

I was pretty blind with rage. But, yeah, there's no excuse.

Heheh, I won't pancake it. I said it. I felt it. I regret it.

11-05-2008, 11:42 PM	#1
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	I guess just before. Because if I have to pull out my dick near the Mormon Temple Lawn to protest their stance on gay marriage, I'm gonna wanna do something else with it besides peeing.
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11-05-2008, 11:47 PM	#2
CoasterMatt BRAAAAAAAINS! Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: One Step Beyond... Posts: 8,802	My father in law voted no on 8 - he's Catholic, but he voted for his fellow Americans, not for the church. I can't wait to hear him talk about this topic again (as GC can attest, he's quite the talker). __________________ Do you like my photography? Visit photosbymatt.tumblr.com to purchase prints!
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11-05-2008, 11:52 PM	#3
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	I think that lawyer is being awful pessimistic. The matter is going to go before the very court that said Marriage Rights are a fundamental constitution right. Case law or no, I don't think they'll have much problem determining the vote was an improper revision of the Constitution. Furthermore, liberal court or no .... courts don't like their jurisdiction being undermined, and this court won't take kindly to this attempted end-run around their historic civil rights ruling. There may not be guiding precedent, but the California Supreme Court has every motivation and reason to find some way find Proposition 8 a revision and not an amendment ... and thus invalidate it. This would NOT be a major victory to me. This was much more important than gay marriage rights in California. Just as America once was to the world, California is a beacon of progress and liberty to the rest of the nation. Even while they mock us, they always end up following our lead toward a more enlightened future. But gay rights by judicial fiat is a far cry from gay rights by the will of the voters. Even if those rights are reaffirmed by the court, it's not the kind of fire that will spread throughout the country. A great opportunity has been lost. There were no plans of action voiced at tonight's rally, to the great disappointment of many. I happen to think Goonie's plan to start straight away on a countervailing ballot initiative is the way to go. It shouldn't be too hard to get the necessary signatures to put this on the ballot in 2 years if we strike while the iron is hot.
	Submit to Quotes

11-06-2008, 12:07 AM	#4
Morrigoon I throw stones at houses Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Location: Location Posts: 9,534	Does anyone know the process for filing it? __________________ http://bash.org/?top "It is useless for sheep to pass a resolution in favor of vegetarianism while wolves remain of a different opinion." -- William Randolph Inge
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11-06-2008, 12:22 AM	#5
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	No clue on this end. Wish I'd had a camera tonight, there were some great signs. A couple were about Separate Drinking Fountains for Gays ... one with great illustrations. A really cute one with a picture of Sesame Street's Bert and Ernie emblazoned with the banner "Gay Love." I think my fave was "My Pedophile Priest Supports Traditional Marriage." Thanks to Ghoulish Delight, the one I carried - "What Does My Marriage Have To Do With Yours?" was a big hit ... but I have to wonder if it didn't make one too many cute single gay guy think I was married. Uh-oh. I think I had the most fun in the first hour when we were all standing halfway in the street on all four corners of the Santa Monica / San Vicente intersection, waving hundreds of signs and chanting cool slogans ... and getting fantastic honk support from passing cars and busses. It was really high energy, fun and awesome. After a while though, the crowd ended up taking over the entire intersection and stopping traffic on Santa Monica Boulevard ... which was kinda fun for a moment ... but stopped all the fun traffic flow, and undoubtedly turned driver support to driver upset. Afterwards, we all wandered down San Vicente to the main program and listened to some inspiring and some not-so-inspiring speakers/ I got the feeling they were trying mostly to molify the crowd. And I didn't feel like thanking all the people for their hard work in a failure political campaign. And I didn't much feel like hearing this was just another step in the long march toward civil rights ... even though of course that's what it is. But it was certainly nice to be among the like-minded crowd, at once warm-hearted and passionate, kind and angry. Very specially nice to be among some of my subscriber friends, and so touching to have Heidi and Tom there to lend their wonderful support. I am so moved. Thank you all for you kind and wonderful support on this important human rights issue. The LoT of You are a Lot of Good. Last edited by innerSpaceman : 11-06-2008 at 12:27 AM.
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11-06-2008, 08:14 AM	#7
~MS~ One Happy little Missy! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 658	Can I just say how proud I am that while it sucks major arse that 8 passed, my little no name county said NO to 8 and as of this morning is the ONLY county that will issue same sex marriage licenses until orders from the state to cease are issued. Our county clerk did admit that there might be a question on the validity of the marriages performed today but that until he was DIRECTED by the state to cease and desist he would issue licenses to any who applied. It doesn't help the over all situation but it does make me feel that our efforts to say No to 8 were successful locally if not statewide. __________________ "Sometimes Miracles Hide"
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11-06-2008, 06:20 AM	#8
Strangler Lewis Doing The Job Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In a state Posts: 3,956	Well, the lawyer was wrong because Thurgood Marshall wasn't on the Supreme Court that eliminated separate but equal. He litigated those cases. I don't think it's an ex post facto law any more than the Defense of Marriage Act was. It doesn't punish. More to the point, it tells the government how to act going forward. Jerry Brown has said that he will defend the marriages already enacted, and he will defend the law as well. If he can pull off this trick, then I suppose married gay couples could go to Massachusetts or some other friendly place and not have to get married again to be considered married. As to black support for Proposition 8, why should we be surprised? Pick your oppressed group. The experience of racism has never automatically caused sweeping empathy for other cultural groups that experienced racism, nor has it caused groups to wake up and challenge the sexism in their own cultures. __________________ Live now-pay later. Diner's Club!
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11-06-2008, 07:19 AM	#9
SacTown Chronic the myth of the dream Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,217	Blacks on the whole seem to be more religious than whites in this country. And why not? God's certainly earned their loyalty, you ask me. And yes, generally speaking, they are over-the-top homophobes. When pressed about the homosexuality thing, they use words like 'faith' and 'sin'. I've been doing a slow burn on this Prop 8 crap. Thinking about what it means...to the Gay and to the rest of us. And I've reached a conclusion: Fvck them. Fvck every one that would lift a finger to deny rights. Fvck every white, black, and green "Christian" who insists on bossing me around with their bible. Fvck every single one of them who had their child out in the rain, waving signs at passing motorists. These people wouldn't understand compassion and grace even if they were fvcked in the earhole with their beloved Bible by Jesus Christ himself. Yeah, fvck them. __________________ Is it the fingers, or the brain that you're teaching a lesson?
	Submit to Quotes

11-06-2008, 09:44 AM	#10
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	Yeah, yeah, i know. Eye for an eye and we're all blind. I was pretty blind with rage. But, yeah, there's no excuse. Heheh, I won't pancake it. I said it. I felt it. I regret it.
	Submit to Quotes