Riding crop costumes go bye bye

[innerSpaceman]

CP is NOT making the statement that she finds overweight people unattrative; she is (if I read it right) simply pointing out that businesses tend to hire public-interactive employees who meet the model of standard attractiveness determined by the prevailing cultural concepts of WHAT SELLS.

Her restaurant example was perfect. Outside of show biz, I have found the hawtest of the hot to work, ironically in my opinion, waiting tables.



As for my personal explanation of the fit-the-role hiring practice, it's simply a matter of scrawny boys being shunted away from the canoe ride, and boys of any type being barred from serving on a Storybook Land boat. Guys with good legs would wear the Zlick-required laderhosen to get those Matterhorn jobs, and those with chicken legs might find themselves behind a turkey-leg ODV cart.

And, yes, every cast member would have to meet the standards of grooming that comprise the "Disney Look." On top of that, the cuter you were by mass-audience standards, the more likely to get a job in entertainment or a position of high public interaction, such as the tour guide position. I would treat attractions casting like actual casting, and standard qualities of good looks would indeed factor in. (Life's rough, and I myself would have to work in food service.)


My entertainment venture hiring practices are quite different from my friend determination practices, so please don't confuse the two.

[Prudence]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

My entertainment venture hiring practices are quite different from my friend determination practices, so please don't confuse the two.

When I was young and pretty and repeatedly turned down for jobs because I looked too cute to be competent, I swore that I would never make the same type of judgement about other people, regardless of the circumstances. Unfortunately, far too many people in this world are happy to continue such practices, defending themselves with the justification that it's just society's way.

And if it really is society's way, if that's just the way society is and it's never going to change, then odds are you, CP, and most everyone else here really does think fat = ugly. If it's so much of a given that whole industries can be forgiven for never hiring over a size 6, then why all the "but *I* would never think that way!" protest? If majority rules, and if the majority is as vast as has been implied (har har), then why not be forthright? Why not just say (and this is directed at no one in particular) that electronic conversations are all well and groovy, but damn, if you have to look at baggy knees below shorts one more time you're going to puke?

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Originally Posted by Prudence

When I was young and pretty and repeatedly turned down for jobs because I looked too cute to be competent, I swore that I would never make the same type of judgement about other people, regardless of the circumstances. Unfortunately, far too many people in this world are happy to continue such practices, defending themselves with the justification that it's just society's way.

People seem to think that from what I've said that I have never been judged by anyone for my appearance. I may have been skinny my entire life, but that doesn't mean I wasn't shoved against lockers or had my hair pulled by judgemental bastards who wanted someone to pick on for my appearance. I've had acne problems since I was 11 years old. For all of my childhood I was called names for being skinny, and as soon as we hit 6th grade, teasing shifted to being flat-chested. I matured later than everyone else and even then I still got sht for not fitting into society's standard mold. Only in my 20s have I become comfortable with my outward appearance, and felt any real confidence about it.

I've also always had friends of every shape, size, color, and description throughout my life.

And if it really is society's way, if that's just the way society is and it's never going to change, then odds are you, CP, and most everyone else here really does think fat = ugly. If it's so much of a given that whole industries can be forgiven for never hiring over a size 6, then why all the "but *I* would never think that way!" protest? If majority rules, and if the majority is as vast as has been implied (har har), then why not be forthright? Why not just say (and this is directed at no one in particular) that electronic conversations are all well and groovy, but damn, if you have to look at baggy knees below shorts one more time you're going to puke?

Because it's simply not true. I've always had friends of every shape, size, color, and description throughout my life. I know plenty of people that look nothing like my personal "type" but that I know to be truly attractive people.

The thing is that everyone can't be attracted to everyone. Can anyone honestly claim that they find EVERYONE attractive, because they're just THAT open minded? When you're drooling over a hottie in a movie, or a guy that you bumped into at the supermarket, you are judging someone due to their appearance. Good or bad, it's still a judgement, and that's still a part of the human experience.

While I can find real attractiveness in nearly everyone I meet (and I mean that, that is not PC bullsht) it doesn't mean that I think they're truly hot. "Hot" in my totally subjective, "I am hot for them" way. Am I supposed to want to sleep with everyone?

Of course my type isn't going to be your type. Among my many tastes is that I really dislike muscled men without chest hair. But in the end, there's an average that can be measured in our society. The odds may be that I agree with a lot of what is "standard", but the odds are equally good that there are going to be aspects of the standard that I don't agree with. Same goes for everybody.

More later...

[Isaac]

My problem is that a character in a theme park is being altered
because a few people are jealous they can't portray that character.

Talk about selfish.

[tracilicious]

Originally Posted by zapppop

My problem is that a character in a theme park is being altered
because a few people are jealous they can't portray that character.

Talk about selfish.

I'm sorry, if ever a post were deserving of the following smilie it's this one.

Oh yes, I am oh so sure that a few of the chubby girls were jealous and that's why they changed the costume. Never mind joining the 21st century, and trying to make CM's less of sex objects, or more likely the need for more versatile costumes that more CM's can wear to ease up staffing conflicts.

A character? It's the guest relations people. Don't they stand behind a desk most of the time anyways? Does someone really need to be hot to accept a complaint/compliment form? Who cares?!

[tracilicious]

Hmm...I don't think that CP and ISM are trying to make personal judgements. I think they are saying that DL should try to please the most people possible. And yes, more people want to see thin bodies than fat ones.

I don't agree, as DL is not a movie or a play, it is a theme park. I am not 12 or 13, so I don't go to ogle cast members. I want someone who is friendly above all else and knows how to do their job well. Highest common denominator be damned. If a cast member were dirty, or smelled bad or something, then I would take issue. If I want hotness, I can find it in my own home.

As far as my real life friends finding me attractive or not? I guess I don't care whether they want to jump in bed with me or not. I certainly don't find everyone I care about attractive. I don't want them to find me repulsive either, but what's the big deal if someone on this board or in real life doesn't find fat attractive? I'm sure there are plenty of physical features of many posters on this board that wouldn't make me drool with lust. I'm willing to accept that they feel the same way about me.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by tracilicious

I don't agree, as DL is not a movie or a play, it is a theme park. I am not 12 or 13, so I don't go to ogle cast members. I want someone who is friendly above all else and knows how to do their job well.

I agree completely. But ya know what? When I go to a restaurant, I'm looking for a good meal and not hotties to ogle. Low and behold, though, there they are! Meal after meal, restaurant after restaurant - the nicest restaurants have the hawtest waiters and waitresses.

Do they get a better tip? No, I base that purely on quality of service. But am I glad for the eye candy that I didn't look for in the first place? Yes, it makes my experience a tiny bit more enjoyable. The same can be said of Disneyland. And since it's the best of the theme parks, I might reasonably expect the cutest CMs. I put far more stock in the friendliest CMs, the most helpful CMs. But it's only going to make the situation better if that friendly, helpful CM is attractive.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Just to clarify, my previous comments were not meant to speak for any specific person, merely society as a whole.

[Isaac]

[Prudence]

So, to recap:

Disneyland should only employ "hotties" because they're an entertainment business and society doesn't want to look at ugly people.

Fat people are, by definition, ugly. The corollary is that skinny people are presumed attractive, except under certain circumstances particular to the individual.

This definition is accepted and unquestioned because it has been granted by the great entity known as "society," and one should never question or try to change society. Rather, one should throw up one's hands and say "it's what society wants." (Note that this usually means "it's what I want," but most people lack sufficient spinal fortitude to admit this and would rather say it's society doing the judging.)

As for me personally -- I'm not into pity "friendships." If I'm not good enough to serve you food or give you directions or process your complaint form or whatever, then why on earth would you want to interact with me socially?