Lost season three - right around the corner

[scaeagles]

Season three begins October 4. Found a link to two season three promo trailers - nothing spoilery at all, just enough to make me look forward to it.

I don't recall if this was posted in a long lost Lost thread, but this season will be 7 new episodes in a row, a couple months off, and 13 more new episodes in a row. I'm glad because that helps story arcs so much.

Season three promos (http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/2006/08/season-3-promo-trailer.html)

[mistyisjafo]

I'm not sure I'm even excited about Season 3 yet. I've almost gotten to the point where I'm sick of Lost. But seeing those promos help a little. I'm hoping we get more answers this year!

[BarTopDancer]

Yay for Lost. I have to put it behind me during the summer. I forgot all about the season finalie. Now I am excited again.

[tracilicious]

I can't get excited until the stupid season two dvd comes out. It's so hard to avoid spoilers.

[Stan4dSteph]

Yeah baby! Holy crapola that was great.

They made Jack cry again! I want to go give him a hug. I love that we're finding out what happened after the breakup. So Jack must feel all kinds of guilt; he probably blames himself for his dad going back to drinking.

I still can't quite figure out what they're trying to get out of him. That holding cell is creepy!

Don't forget the episode is 61 minutes long.

[scaeagles]

Good stuff, good stuff, good stuff. Lost delivers. Now that the ep has aired on the west coast I'll not use spoiler tags.

A disappointment - not once was the season ending scene addressed in the opener, being the Portuguese speaking men who contacted Desomnd's old girlfriend to say they had found something. That would be about my only disappointment.

Loved the opening. The cage is creepy, isn't it. Sawyer provided great comic relief with the bear cage. I think the kid in the other cage was a plant....but it was so obvious to be a plant that he probably wasn't a plant.

And Fake Henry's name! Even though it is now known to be Ben, he will always be Fake Henry to me.

[Prudence]

I had no laptop and our voice/music theory lessons were cancelled, so I felt no great urge to stick around for class last night. Therefore - yay! Got to watch it on teevee as it aired! It's the only show BT will sit and actually watch with me. The beginning was great. I thought we were getting pre-island back story, but no. Did the plane breakup seem odd to anyone else?

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I admit it, the promos were right - in the first 5 minutes I was hooked all over again. :D Loved the bit with the Steven King book - which was probably The Stand. Also one of my favorite books. Makes me feel a bit for the new chick, but still, wtf do they want with the prisoners?
Did the plane breakup seem odd to anyone else?Actually, it seemed consistent to me with the "big magnet in the hatch made the plane crash" concept. Ripped apart in mid air.

After watching this I realized there are so many characters that this is one of the slowest moving shows in history. You just know that at some point they're going to bail from Jack etal and go check out what's going on with everyone else. I hope they keep the story moving at a decent pace this time.

I seem to remember that Hurley was one of the prisoners at the end of last season. Am I confused? (Apparently.)And Fake Henry's name! Even though it is now known to be Ben, he will always be Fake Henry to me.I was kinda bugged by that being the climax of the show. "Omigod, she said Ben!!!" Um, ok, his name is Ben. And that tells me what exactly? (I'm sure real LOST nuts have already found the name Ben littered all over earlier episodes. No, I'm not visiting those sites.)

[Ghoulish Delight]

I seem to remember that Hurley was one of the prisoners at the end of last season. Am I confused? (Apparently.)They told him to go back.

[JWBear]

...Loved the bit with the Steven King book - which was probably The Stand....
It was Carrie (You can see the title on one of the books just before the "earthquake" begins.)

[xharryb]

Not quite as action packed as I might have liked for an opener, but they did dive right into story mode so I'm fine with that. I find it interesting getting to know the Others. I'm curious what their motives are actually. I think I'll be more into it next week when we get back to the rest of the characters.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

I wasn't excited until we actually started watching it this morning.

I loved the new lady. She was appealing from the first, and I look forward to the possibly developing conflict between herself and NotBen.

So not only are they not stranded savages, they're suburban book clubby? I really look forward to learning more about them.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I look forward to the possibly developing conflict between herself and NotBen.You mean NotHenry? Some folks are now calling him Benry. ;)

[SzczerbiakManiac]

This is an interesting thread (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25099) about the weird rings seen on the outside of the plane right before it crashed. I noticed this last night and replayed it several times in slow-mo to try to get a clue. This post (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1003817&postcount=15) has some nice screen shots of the event.

A theory posited in that thread has me quite intrigued: Could Smokey have brought the plane down? Before you answer, look at these screen shots:
http://img481.imageshack.us/my.php?image=untitled974qk.jpg
http://img481.imageshack.us/my.php?image=untitled659ck.jpg
(they took me a long time and several retries to load, but it was worth the wait)

Hmmmm....

[Babette]

Was the gorilla cage guy the same guy who was under the house before the bookclub? What is a suburban neighborhood doing isolated in the middle of a lush island? Where can I buy a dress like Kate's?

Just wondering.

[JWBear]

Was the gorilla cage guy the same guy who was under the house before the bookclub?....
No, it was Ethan.

[scaeagles]

OK....here's my theory.

I think the others want Jack to join them.

They are willing to provide him with information that he desperately wants (the dossier). They have separated him from Kate and Sawyer, who have been allowed (though briefly) to interact. They are setting it up for Kate and Sawyer to get some love action which will alienate Jack. Rather than creepy FakeHenryBen or Unbearded Bearded man, they have him interacting with a soft spoken pretty girl who is trying to win him over rather than alienate him.

Juliette could win me over. She is one nice looking female.

[katiesue]

What happened to Kate between the beach and the cages? Her wrists were all cut up from the handcufs.

[Stan4dSteph]

What happened to Kate between the beach and the cages? Her wrists were all cut up from the handcufs.My guess is she didn't react well to the implication that the next two weeks were going to be unpleasant.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

You mean NotHenry? Some folks are now calling him Benry. ;)

No, I mean NotBen. Because I'm not partial to what "some folks" do, and he'll never be Ben to me. He'll be Henry.

[RStar]

OK....here's my theory.

I think the others want Jack to join them.That's my theory also, but that they want all three of them. That's why they chose them, and now they are trying to break them down so they will become one of them. That's what Ben was talking about when he told Juliette "Nice job" after she got Jack to buckle, cry, and submit.

[scaeagles]

Maybe...but I think they are going to use Sawyer and Kate to work Jack rather than wanting Sawyer and Kate as well as Jack.

And as far as submitting....getting someone to drink water when dehydrated is submitting? Maybe. Submission to me doesn't mean something that keeps your strength up.

Unless, of course, the food and water are drugged....(evil laugh).

[RStar]

That's true, Sayer and Kate are the two people he is the closest to. And he kept yelling "Where are my family, my friends?" at first.

And I have a feeling that the will never succede in getting Jack to join them 100%, if that is what they are trying to do. He may play like an other for a while to figure them out. But I'm sure the writers would realize that it would'nt be that interesting for him to become an other.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

No, I mean NotBen. Because I'm not partial to what "some folks" do, and he'll never be Ben to me. He'll be Henry.Dude! Call him whatever you want, I don't care. I was just making an observation. I thought "Benry" was amusing, nothing more. :rolleyes:

[scaeagles]

I will be offended at anyone who doesn't call him FakeHenry. So there.

[RStar]

If I call him FakeBenry will you still be offended?;)

[Ghoulish Delight]

Okay so: Both Eco and Locke have received visions "from the island" that have proven accurate. And now Desmond predicted the future.

Did Desmond have a vision? Or is he in on the pre-determination secret? Are they all living in some sort of loop that Desmond's observed before? Hmmm.

[RStar]

Okay so: Both Eco and Locke have received visions "from the island" that have proven accurate. And now Desmond predicted the future.

Did Desmond have a vision? Or is he in on the pre-determination secret? Are they all living in some sort of loop that Desmond's observed before? Hmmm.

Yeah, it almost seems like when the hatch emploded it gave them some kind of powers or something.

And how come nobody (except Chrley, briefly) thinks it's funny that the hatch emplodes, distroying everything in it, but the people survive, and are scattered around the island (and Desmond had his clothes blown off, but not a mark on him)?

{{{{{:confused: :confused: LOST :confused: :confused: }}}}}}

[CoasterMatt]

I call Shark Jump on Lost Season 3 :p

[BarTopDancer]

I really don't like the direction this is going with the Others. I also don't find myself sitting entranced, watching nor do I find myself rushing home from hockey games to watch it on Wednesday night.

I'm kinda sad about it.

That there are hardly any posts after the shows speaks volumes from this board, where last season it seems no matter how busy we were we posted our thoughts and now, nothing.

[scaeagles]

To the contrary....I love what is going on with the others, I'm just not finding time to post about it. No jump the shark as far as I'm concerned, and I look forward to it every Wednesday.

[RStar]

While I still am enjoying the mystery, I too do not like the direction of the way the others are treating Jack, Kate, and Sawyer.

[Ghoulish Delight]

While I still am enjoying the mystery, I too do not like the direction of the way the others are treating Jack, Kate, and Sawyer.
Dude, they locked their leader in a room and let an Iraqi interrogator go to town on him. Would you expect them to give them milk and cookies?

The show's still got me.

[katiesue]

I'm kind of meh about this season so far. There's too much now to keep track of and they just seem to keep heaping more stuff on.

I'm still taping it and I watch it but I'm not as excited about it as I was the first season.

[Stan4dSteph]

I'm enjoying it all so far. I am extremely intrigued by what the Others want from Jack. It's harder to cover all of the story lines that are going on right now, since the characters are spread all over.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

Dude, they locked their leader in a room and let an Iraqi interrogator go to town on him. Would you expect them to give them milk and cookies?

The show's still got me.

I'm LOVING this season, about as much as I did the first. The beginning of the second frustrated me, but 'Henry Gale' and Eko brought the show back home for me, and I am digging the individual character developments so far. Love the tension between Ben and Juliet, etc. Good stuff.

I am curious to know, since the Others have the survivor's dossiers, if there treatment of their prisoners is based on who the Others perceive them to be. Okay, that was confusing. What I mean is that Jack's past essentially paints him as a good man. Whereas Jake and Sawyer are criminals before they land on the island, and it seems the Others view them as criminals.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Count me in as still among the faithful :cheers:

Now we know why there are polar bears, but as to why they thrived so well in a jungle environment...

[Stan4dSteph]

Oooooooooooh.

[scaeagles]

You just have to love to hate Ben.....the main thing that caught me was the whole con thing, him telling Sawyer that he was good, but that they were better. This could be referring to the Sawyer pace maker thing. It could be referring to the whole stuff in the jungle on the main island with the fake bearded Zeke. Or does it mean there is still a big con going on?

[Gn2Dlnd]

I'm still in love with this show. Is it two more or three more episodes in the mini-season?

I think there's not much discussion because there's so much exposition going on. Like - Why are Kate and Sawyer being kept in cages and away from Jack? Why is it important to broke-nose whether or not Kate loves Sawyer? Who has cancer? Probably Ben, and how far are they willing to let Jack get with a scalpel before yelling "Psych!"? Psychic Desmond Network. The return of Boone. Who the hell are the new beach hotties? There are two islands? What's going on with Sun, Jin, and Sahid? Hurley's starting to lose weight. Where is Rancho los Otros in relation to the Hydra Station? How are they receiving information from the outside world? Are the Others stranded, prisoners, or an experiment? Who is Carl? Why do the Others keep castaway costumes around? Where's the Frenchwoman hiding? What's with the polar bears, and why would they need the Stars and Stripes Forever to play when they win a fish biscuit? Who 8 the bunny? And why would Sawyer use the word "bunny," insted of "rabbit"?

Can't wait for season 7, the Zombie Season.

[RStar]

Dude, they locked their leader in a room and let an Iraqi interrogator go to town on him. Would you expect them to give them milk and cookies?
No, but you can only stand to watch someone beat on the characters you grew to like for so long. I'm just wanting the storyline to get back to the rest of the group more now.

Part of my impatience may be from the fact that this is the first season I watched in real time. The first two I saw on DVD.

[scaeagles]

I adds to the drama for me. I was amazed at how uncomfortable I was when Sawyer was getting the hell beaten out of him. That never happens to me....it is typically just a character in a show.

I like how the story is progressing, but there are still a lot of loose ends that need to be tied up. Monster. Numbers. Black Rock. French Chick. Etc.

[RStar]

I adds to the drama for me. .
You do?;)


I like how the story is progressing, but there are still a lot of loose ends that need to be tied up. Monster. Numbers. Black Rock. French Chick. Etc. And no more button to push, what happends to the electromagnetic magic? People fortelling the future. Sayid, Sun & Jin. Why and who are the others......

Plenty to go on here!

[€uroMeinke]

I like how the story is progressing, but there are still a lot of loose ends that need to be tied up. Monster. Numbers. Black Rock. French Chick. Etc.

There's a French Chick on the show? Why didnn't anyone tell me?

[RStar]

There's a French Chick on the show? Why didnn't anyone tell me?
Well, she's an interesting combo of Murphy Brown and Rambo (with much more hair), if that sort of thing turns you on. :rolleyes:

[€uroMeinke]

Well, she's an interesting combo of Murphy Brown and Rambo (with much more hair), if that sort of thing turns you on. :rolleyes:

As long as she has the accent she's in

[Cadaverous Pallor]

As long as she has the accent she's inYup, totally has the accent.

You need to Netflix the first disc and see if it grabs you...though the French chick doesn't show up for a bit.

[scaeagles]

Now that was a freakin' spectacular episode. Except they killed Eko. :(

A few points of interest and/or wonderment.

First, that Locke did not see black smokie monster. It was something different. I had assumed they were the same. Remember how he told Eko he saw a bright light? Hmmm.....

Who was the one eyed man on the camera?

Is Juliet playing Jack? Are Ben and Juliet in on this together? Are those even Ben's Xrays? I'm thinking there's some hugely elaborate con going on, but the only thing that makes me think perhaps not is that it surely seems as if Jack wasn't supposed to see them because how the hell would the others have known that lady was going to be mortally wounded?

And apparently old Smokie is going to be on the prowl looking for other losties to whoop up on.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Remember when Ben said they WERE trying to make Jack think it was his choice, but they had to give up on that?

Baloney. It's the old "We're letting you in on the con" con. Sawyer pulled it with one of his chicks. Make Jack think they've given up conning him, have Juliet, whom Jack now hates, try to play like she's being subversive, and thus Jack "chooses" to "stop" being manipulated by actually saving Ben.

[scaeagles]

I think the same thing, GD, except for the fact that Jack only saw the Xrays because that other chick was shot. They could not have known that.

Plus, I don't see Jack ever intentionally killing someone on the table. The medical oath and all.

Sayid was back....where were Jin and Sun?

[Stan4dSteph]

Jack's head must be spinning trying to figure out "who's zoomin' who." I know mine is. Can't wait to see more next week!

[JWBear]

...First, that Locke did not see black smokie monster. It was something different. I had assumed they were the same. Remember how he told Eko he saw a bright light? Hmmm......
I took the exchange to be about the implosion of the hatch, not Lostzilla

[Ghoulish Delight]

I think the same thing, GD, except for the fact that Jack only saw the Xrays because that other chick was shot. They could not have known that.If the Others have shown anything it's that they are adaptable. That may not have been their original plan, it may have accelerated things, but rest assured it was no accident that he saw those x-rays and that Ben was fully aware that he would.

[Nephythys]

*sigh* Lost lost me last season- I figure I will buy the DVDs and watch it that way. I miss too much on the regular seasons.

I caught bits last night while I was doing laundry- figured it was Eko who would not last....*heavy sigh*

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Plus, I don't see Jack ever intentionally killing someone on the table. The medical oath and all.Like GD said:Make Jack think they've given up conning him, have Juliet, whom Jack now hates, try to play like she's being subversive, and thus Jack "chooses" to "stop" being manipulated by actually saving Ben.

I didn't like the episode because nothing really happened to Eko except that he died. He chased his tail for no reason and was killed by the monster for no reason. He revealed nothing to anyone, including us. Lame.

[scaeagles]

One other interesting point of note....remember in season two when the tailies found the abandoned station, and in that abandoned station was a crate they opened? Inside that crate they opened was....a glass eye. Perhaps this belongs to the man with the eye patch we saw on the TV monitor in the last episode?

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

The last episode may be my favorite of the series. I love season 3 and hug it to my breast like a cuddly teddy bear.

My understanding of Eko's death was that the actor wanted off the show, since he felt that there was not really enough to explore about his past after being given such a stellar flashback the last season. I actually liked the resolution. Before, he had a spiritual awakening and the "monster" spared him (also flashed some sort of video montage at him, but never knew what that was about.) The monster is some mechanical gadget cloaked in smoke. I like how, in the episode where he died, he seemed to come to a different conclusion about himself, his faith, etc. And the result was that the monster rejects him. It ties into some theories about individual character redemptions. I'm also wondering if the "monster" is something separate from the "Others" we've gotten to know.

[Prudence]

I am so not thrilled by the new people. Where the hell have they been for two seasons? All of a sudden they're joining in on the expeditions? Right now they're about as interesting as damp toast. Did we not have enough characters to care about? Now we have more that are meaningless? I'm getting peeved.

[scaeagles]

More good stuff last night. I like how Jack played it.

Three months until 14 straight.

[Ghoulish Delight]

More good stuff last night. I like how Jack played it.
He did take a bit of a gamble that they actually gave a crap about Ben, especially with Juliette having shown him a plan to kill him. Of course, I believe that plan was a super secret double blind bluff, and maybe Jack figured that out too, but it's still a gamble.


Three months until 14 straight.So was this the last new episode until then?

[MouseWife]

That is what I got. There weren't too many episodes as it was.

I also saw that in Eko's death, EH1812. He was at peace. I don't know why he was 'rejected' but I think he was fine with it.

I also don't see what is up with the newbies. Is it because they don't have to pay them as much? Did someone not budget for the main characters pay to go up as the show became more popular, or something like that? *sigh* But I love to watch.

And, I will also watch it all again on DVD when it comes out.

[Stan4dSteph]

So was this the last new episode until then?Yes. Nothing new until February.

[BarTopDancer]

I think Juliette wants Ben to die, but no one else does. From the look on Zeke's face and the reaction from the other Others I think they would be lost without Ben.

I wish that Kate had told Jack they had nowhere to run. Though I still wonder if the second island is truly an island. We wern't shown how Jack, Kate and Sawyer were transported. They just showed the boat at the dock that Michael and Walt took.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I wish that Kate had told Jack they had nowhere to run. Though I still wonder if the second island is truly an island. We wern't shown how Jack, Kate and Sawyer were transported. They just showed the boat at the dock that Michael and Walt took.The others mentioned a submarine. And it's hard to argue with what Ben showed Sawyer.

I don't believe Juliette at all. It was all part of their plan to get Jack to "decide on his own" to save Ben.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

I am a little baffled at why they chose that moment for the ending. "We can't leave without you." "Why?"

Why? I mean, I know they're supposedly on a second island, but... it seemed really anticlimactic and rough for a cliffhanger.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

I loved the episode, though I don't think Lost deserves to have two season finales JUST because they take lazy breaks to introduce new crap shows.

You know, Groundhog's Day was brilliant. And two hours. If I had to watch similar scenarios over and over and over again for 24 episodes, even with Bill Murray, I'd shoot myself. Daybreak is a drama and does not star Bill Murray. Granted, I'd probably just wake up all over again and have to watch Daybreak all over again and have to shoot myself all over again, endlessly, until I figured out another way.....

But back to Lost, I think Kate was too distraught to be thinking straight, and it really seemed like her screaming about not being able to leave him was just a tongue tied way of trying to tell him that she wasn't sure any of them could leave, period. If I'm wrong, it still doesn't bother me much.

As for the new people, maybe they'll die soon, just like all the other new people they brought on last year. Bernard should get a medal just for being alive. Man, would have been so much cooler if they brought Rose and Bernard along for the Eko death ride.

[BarTopDancer]

LOST! is back tonight. New time - 10pm. 9pm is a recap episode.

[cirquelover]

I can't wait, the dvr is set and ready just in case I'm not home.

[scaeagles]

I just love the story telling on this show. Nice to get some background on Juliet. Even when Ethan doesn't say anything Ethan is creepy. I didn't see the bus thing coming, but as soon as it happened, I figured they were Others. Until that point I really hadn't expected that Juliet was taken to the island against her will - or at least was being held there against it.

[BarTopDancer]

I am very interested to know what Ben really said. I *know* they showed us his lips moving (though upside down) so we can decipher it.

I don't trust Juliet and I'm not sure I trust Alex. I think we're being set up for something. That brainwashing room though... dude.

[sleepyjeff]

I don't trust Juliet and I'm not sure I trust Alex. I think we're being set up for something. That brainwashing room though... dude.

Never mind Juliet...Kate may have been brainwashed too. Notice in the brainwashing room scene that both Alex and Kate were not nearly as affected by it as Sawyer. Now that could be because Sawyer is a guy and so is Karl...and the film was made for a guy: but I think both Kate and Alex have been there before.

1) Early on Kate was told by Ben to prepare "for the worse two weeks of her life" and when she was being brought to the cage near Sawyer her hands were in pretty bad shape from the cuffs.....a simple walk from the beach should not have been that bad for her hands in the cuffs; she was tied down to something.

2) Alex said, when they were looking to rescue Karl "this is the only place I haven't looked" ....could that be because she didn't want to look there as it was a place she remembers badly?

[sleepyjeff]

WOW! First Walt's comic book with a floating Emerald colored city; then Henry Gale(Ben)..now this............


Guy with red shoes dead under a pile of rubble.

There's no place like home....there's no place like home!

:snap:

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Oz is surrounded by an endless desert which you have to fly over...an endless sea is pretty analagous.

[Ghoulish Delight]

First the Oracle was a different black lady, now the Oracle's a white lady. Make up your minds!





Oh, this isn't the Matrix?

[BarTopDancer]

Where is Mrs. Clue?

[sleepyjeff]

First the Oracle was a different black lady, now the Oracle's a white lady. Make up your minds!







The thing I don't get about the Oracle type lady/jewler is why she is even there? If Desmond is destined to do this thing and no matter what he tries he will end up doing it then why the need to even tell him he must?

Unless Juliet is right, and free choice does still exsist:confused:

[sleepyjeff]

Oz is surrounded by an endless desert which you have to fly over...an endless sea is pretty analagous.

....the ocean is a desert....la, la, la la la la la :D

[JWBear]

....the ocean is a desert...

...With its life underground,
And a perfect disguise above.

[sleepyjeff]

I don't expect every single episode to be a edge of your seat blockbuster but when the Network goes on an all out media blitz touting "3 MAJOR QUESTIONS ANSWERED" one would expect that it would at least be an ok episode.

This, it was not. Slow and plodding and Jack is becoming less and less interesting every time he gets major screen time.

As for the 3 "MAJOR" questions.......The whereabouts of the stewardess was not a question on anybodies radar screen that I've talked to; The meaning of Jacks tatoo was more of a curiosity than a "major" question; and the one big question that they actually did answer---what happened to the kids---was not answered even barely satisfactory....everyone already knew that the others took them and it was already alluded to that it was for "their own good".....why did they take them and what are they doing to them is really what we want to know....that was not answered!

So ABC, in a pathetic effort to bump up Losts numbers for a single week managed to make those who only watch the show casually wonder "huh....were those important questions?" and probably make them think that "if this is one of the better shows I'd hate to see one of the average ones". Worse than that though; they managed to betray their most loyal fans.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Plus, I call bullsht on the scenes with Sawyer and Kate and Alex's boyfriend. He was conscious, he was coherent, and he seemed to be willingly answering questions in a forthcoming manner...and they just kinda went to sleep? BULLSH!T. Why were they not grilling the hell out of him? Those scenes were useless, we learned nothing, the characters learned nothing. The only info imparted was that Kate and Sawyer now know that there's a town with backyards on the island. I'm sure they could have found another way to inform them of that without leaving the major plot hole of, "there's no way in hell they don't ask the kid every single question they ever wanted to ask." Just leave the kid unconscious and incoherent, let him babble one or two things about backyards, and then have him run away while they sleep. Grrrrrr.

[CoasterMatt]

So, um, is Lost, lost?

[BarTopDancer]

I think Lost is becoming a lost cause.

Jack's tats wern't even on my radar.

What did the flight attendant say they were there to watch? I missed it.

Did anyone notice the Dharma symbol on the podium when they went to deliver Ben's note? It looks like a tree.

[sleepyjeff]

Plus, I call bullsht on the scenes with Sawyer and Kate and Alex's boyfriend. He was conscious, he was coherent, and he seemed to be willingly answering questions in a forthcoming manner...and they just kinda went to sleep? BULLSH!T. Why were they not grilling the hell out of him? Grrrrrr.

Yes...that drove me nuts too. Every time a lostie has someone in front of them who may be able to answer some big questions they ask stupid questions instead. Jack, for instance, had a chance to aske both Cindy and Alex(and even Tom and Juliet for that matter...although they probably woudn't answer) pertinent questions like "what, for the love of lucky ducks, is going on here?"

[sleepyjeff]

.

What did the flight attendant say they were there to watch? I missed it.

Did anyone notice the Dharma symbol on the podium when they went to deliver Ben's note? It looks like a tree.


Just "watch"...she didn't elaborate as far as I could tell. Watch the end of the World? Watch brain washing movies? Watch Jack and the survivors?

Who knows......?

I think they are going way too far out of their way to make us think that the others are Dharma.....which makes me think they are not.

[CoasterMatt]

watching the detectives?

[BarTopDancer]

I think they are going way too far out of their way to make us think that the others are Dharma.....which makes me think they are not.

The way she was looking around, and started to say something and then came back with "it's complicated" started the wheels spinning. They may not be Dharma, but they are being watched.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Just "watch"...she didn't elaborate as far as I could tell. Watch the end of the World? Watch brain washing movies? Watch Jack and the survivors?

Who knows......?She didn't say at the time, but I think the later inference was that they were there to watch Juliette's sentencing and/or execution.

[sleepyjeff]

She didn't say at the time, but I think the later inference was that they were there to watch Juliette's sentencing and/or execution.

I am going to have to go back and look. Are there any kids in the "trial room"?

You're probably right but this just brings up a whole mess of new questions:

I mean; can you just hear Cindy now "C'mon kids, we're gonna go watch what happens to the bad lady":eek:

[Ghoulish Delight]

I mean; can you just hear Cindy now "C'mon kids, we're gonna go watch what happens to the bad lady":eek:

*shrug* I went on a field trip in elementary school to a court room to watch criminal proceedings. It's a good civics lesson.

[sleepyjeff]

I never thought of it that way. Backyards and lessons in law and order....and even a Spinal Surgeon zoo;)

Speeking of which...anyone notice that Jack didn't press the "warning" button a third time? Smart move. Not only does he not get zapped but he doesn't have to go thru the agony of figuring out how to gain a yummy biscuit; instead he gets to complain about the cheese sandwich not being grilled:)

[BarTopDancer]

I swear she said something after Jack said "watching what" but it was mumbled and then Jack went off with "you have to be kidding me blah blah blah"

[sleepyjeff]

^I just got thru watching that scene over and over again(even in close caption, just in case).

Right after Jack says "watching what" she pauses; maybe to think of an answer that Jack will understand or maybe because she is perplexed that Jack didn't know...but the only thing she says is "yes honey" to the little girl.

Regarding the kids watching the trial: I watched this scene over again a couple of times. All the people in the room sitting down look to be about the same height...they could be kids but then it would only be kids and no adults. Julliet does appear to be much taller than all those seated so maybe they are kids or maybe she is up on a dias of some sort.

Also: After watching this episode pretty much all over again it seems to me that Isebella has similar mannerisms to an android. Could just be her personality but one has to wonder if maybe she is the monster. The French lady once called the monster a "security system" and Tom called Isebella a "sheriff"......?

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Also: After watching this episode pretty much all over again it seems to me that Isebella has similar mannerisms to an android. Could just be her personality but one has to wonder if maybe she is the monster. The French lady once called the monster a "security system" and Tom called Isebella a "sheriff"......?Eh, I'd just toss that into my absolute hatred for Juliet's character/actress. Seems that with both of them they don't want to give anything away so they're told to NOT ACT at all. :rolleyes: I am so sick of Juliet. They keep cutting to her face for a reaction and her face never changes. She always has that dumb non-committal not-really-a-smile smirk on her face. "Am I sad at this outcome? Am I happy? Am I sad or happy but trying to hide it? You don't know!!!" :mad: It's so stupid. I hope this whole show doesn't devolve into that "you guess my emotion" BS. As if there isn't enough that's hidden. :rolleyes: :mad: :rolleyes:

</rant>

[sleepyjeff]

Regarding the kids watching the trial: I watched this scene over again a couple of times. All the people in the room sitting down look to be about the same height...they could be kids but then it would only be kids and no adults. Julliet does appear to be much taller than all those seated so maybe they are kids or maybe she is up on a dias of some sort.



Another thing that bothers me about that scene...kids or not why did no one who was facing Julliet look back over their shoulders to see what the commotion was all about. Seems to me that if one is in a closed door meeting and someone knocks on the door and a loud argument then ensues at least a few heads would turn....not one did:confused:

Eh, I'd just toss that into my absolute hatred for Juliet's character/actress. Seems that with both of them they don't want to give anything away so they're told to NOT ACT at all. :rolleyes: I am so sick of Juliet. They keep cutting to her face for a reaction and her face never changes. She always has that dumb non-committal not-really-a-smile smirk on her face. "Am I sad at this outcome? Am I happy? Am I sad or happy but trying to hide it? You don't know!!!" :mad: It's so stupid. I hope this whole show doesn't devolve into that "you guess my emotion" BS. As if there isn't enough that's hidden. :rolleyes: :mad: :rolleyes:

</rant>

Rant uderstood...so much of this show seems to be having the actors act coy for coys sake and nothing more. It's like the old days of the Soviet Union where all of their diplomats were instructed to act like they might be spying in order to help hide those who really were.

[sleepyjeff]

Tonight is another episode of Lost.....can't be any worse than last weeks:)

[BarTopDancer]

It annoys me that they are toating it as a "must see" episode. So far every "must see" episode has been a complete let down.

I did see Jinn and Sun in the previews, so maybe we will get back to them.

[sleepyjeff]

It annoys me that they are toating it as a "must see" episode. So far every "must see" episode has been a complete let down.

I did see Jinn and Sun in the previews, so maybe we will get back to them.


I know..."must see" is the kiss of death usually.

If they get back to Jinn and Sun then it stands to reason we'll get to see Sayid too. I hope so as his character tends to act a bit more logical then Jack, Sawyer, Locke, and Kate.

[Stan4dSteph]

The writers indicated their displeasure about the promotions department on the official podcast. I would be pissed too. It only makes people annoyed.

[scaeagles]

The episode isn't even over yet, but this is exactly what this season needed - a great Hurley episode.

The scene with Sawyer teaching Jinn English was just priceless, and Hurley was great. What a hysterical episode....while I haven't been as annoyed as most with the last few episodes, this was just was was needed.

[sleepyjeff]

No questions answered but a boat(or vw bus) full of new ones:

1) Was that a map Sawyer had in his hands?
2) How is there still air in the tires?
3) What killed Roger WorkMan in the first place?
4) Where are they going to get gas once that miraculously still-full tank runs out?
5) Cars on an Island? Since we have never seen anyone actually circle the "Island" yet how are we sure this even is an Island?

I liked this episode(any episode that isn't Jack centered is better than those that are) ok, but I would like even more to have at least a few questions answered for a change.

Also:

Did the writers just pull a fast one on us? Is this their way of getting away from having to figure out a way to explain the numbers?

If so then what other big mysteries will be "answered" with similar brush offs?

[cirquelover]

I'm pretty sure it was a map of the island.

I want to know why was there gas, air in tires and the battery was still charged? I've never seen an engine full of plants startlike that!!

I don't understand what you mean about the numbers being answered?

[sleepyjeff]

I don't understand what you mean about the numbers being answered?


Just the whole thing about the numbers being just luck...good or bad. I fear that a connection between Hurleys numbers and the hatch numbers will never be explained....and that this episode, in a way, was the writers way out from ever having too.

[Stan4dSteph]

It was a blueprint or schematic, but serves the same function as a map.

Can't wait to see more about the creepy eyepatch guy next week. Also, Locke does stupid things with a computer AGAIN!

[Ghoulish Delight]

The episode was good, but when it started, I was hoping for more of the island weirdness of old. But I still liked it, nice to have a fun character piece as a break from the plot that wasn't going anywhere anyway. Loved the meteorite/asteroid moment. I think I vaguely remember there being a TV on in the background of someone's flashback in a previous season that mentioned it in passing, but I could be wrong.

[sleepyjeff]

The episode was good, but when it started, I was hoping for more of the island weirdness of old.


Sky Blue VW.

It's the Libyans and their after the Flux Capacitor;)




Hope that was weird enough for you:)

[Ghoulish Delight]

They were just after their plutonium, no way they knew about the FC.

[RStar]

I have a car in my driveway that I have not used for 4 years. I start it every year or so. I hvae not put air in the tires or gas in the tank. I do have to charge the battery before I start it. So if the van had only been there for for 4-6 years, it's possible. But since the 70s? doubt it. Of course the island does have Polar Bears. And a tall ship in the middle of it (Dude, how does that happen?:D ).

Oh, and the van had a dead battery, that's why they had to jump start it down the hill. The 8 track was a cool touch. And Cheech Marin as Hurley's dad? Priceless.

Did you notice the checken hitting the ground after the asteroid? :snap:

[sleepyjeff]

They were just after their plutonium, no way they knew about the FC.

That was back in time....now they want the FC;)




--------------------------------------------


Everything that happens to Hurley may be a self-realized prophecy....

1) He was worried something bad would happen to Ms. Tanaka and bam, a rock from outer space hits the place.

2) He's hungry and food falls from the sky.

3) He tells Charlie "death finds me" and Vincent shows up with a dead mans arm.

4) He didn't believe the car would start and it didn't.....when he did believe it did.

5) He was worried that Libby would leave him and she did...so to speak.

6) He was worried that his friend would leave him and he did...after winning a lottery that he must have thought, at least a little, he might win

Maybe Hurley does make his own luck.

Maybe this is what Juliete meant at the book club about free choice.....do some of the others have the ability to make things happen just by wanting(or fearing) them to happen?

Like making a bus hit your ex-husband or a plane with a spinal surgeon on board crash nearby;)

[RStar]

I got to thinking about it, and that Roger Workman guy would have been much more decayed (or eaten away) if he had been there in a jungle dead for 30 years. Is it possible it had only been 3 or 4 years and he worked for Ben? Was he in the van trying to get off the island, and the others shot him?

[sleepyjeff]

I got to thinking about it, and that Roger Workman guy would have been much more decayed (or eaten away) if he had been there in a jungle dead for 30 years. Is it possible it had only been 3 or 4 years and he worked for Ben? Was he in the van trying to get off the island, and the others shot him?

Getting a VW up to 88mph in the jungle can be quite hazardous.;)

Seriously though; He may have been trying to get away from the others with the van....which leads to a question I posted earlier: Are they even on an Island?

[Stan4dSteph]

Seriously though; He may have been trying to get away from the others with the van....which leads to a question I posted earlier: Are they even on an Island?Yes. The car got on the island the same way the rest of the Dharma crap got there: on a ship. How do you think they got all of the materials to build the hatches?

[sleepyjeff]

Yes. The car got on the island the same way the rest of the Dharma crap got there: on a ship. How do you think they got all of the materials to build the hatches?

Of course; if you want to be logical about it:blush:

I saw posted on another board that it is unlikely Roger was killed while driving the VW.....the keys were in his hand not in the ignition:eek:

[Stan4dSteph]

I saw posted on another board that it is unlikely Roger was killed while driving the VW.....the keys were in his hand not in the ignition:eek:That lucky rabbit's foot doesn't seem to have served him very well.

I want to dig through all of the papers in that van. I hope someone takes a look back there.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Cheech is old.

[sleepyjeff]

More fun stuff:

This last episode may have contained a lot more info than one might have noticed after watching it just once,

The song at the end of the show Shambhala coupled with a brief glimpse of Hurleys comic book back in season one and finally the weird Ice Station ending of Season two may all tie together if you let your imagination go:)

[mistyisjafo]

:throwing my hands in the air in disgust:

That's it! I can't take this show anymore. I've removed it from my Tivo. There are too many weird story lines, nothing leads to anything, everything leads to nothing, and I stopped caring about anyone. Anyone else feeling this way?

[katiesue]

Yes - it's still on my DVR list but I have about 10 or so episodes unwatched. I just can't keep it all straight and I no longer care to try.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I'm still hooked. I guess I figured out long ago that they obviously aren't going to be giving straight answers until the show is almost over. So, not expecting any answers, I'm not disappointed when they don't come.

[mistyisjafo]

I'm still hooked. I guess I figured out long ago that they obviously aren't going to be giving straight answers until the show is almost over. So, not expecting any answers, I'm not disappointed when they don't come.

You've got more patience than I do.

[mousepod]

posted by me, 5/25/2006
As I watched the full episode of Lost (always keeping an eye on the clock - I've been having to wake up at 4:30 for work this week) - a feeling of dread slowly began to creep up. It's still subtle, but it's one that I had during the first few episodes of season one. I'm not sure what exactly to call it, but it's something akin to the feeling I got around the 5th season of X-Files. I'm worried that there really is no "solution" to the show.
Perhaps there are answers - we get a couple of those every episode - but every 'answer' they reveal just raises more questions.
Am I entertained? Sure. But I expect answers. At some point. Really.
Whatever the mythology of the Lost Universe is, it better explain everything, and I mean everything.
I watched every single episode of the 9 seasons of X-Files (plus the movie, plus the spin-off series) and have yet to understand the full conspiracy-story arc - though I've read a few 'scholarly' fan interpretations.
All I'm saying is - there better be a bible for the scriptwriters of Lost.
(Oh - and I need to get some sleep.)

I'm still watching... and waiting.

[€uroMeinke]

Hmmm - I've seen the first three episodes from season one, maybe I should just wait to see if this ends well and pick it up after the fact.

[sleepyjeff]

Speculation is half the fun for me.

Like right now I am thinking about some of the biblical overtones going on...when Kate and Sawyer escaped that karl kid said something about "God loves you as he loved Jacob"........ok then.

Jacob had a son named (Ben)jamin.

Jacob had a wife named Rachel(Juliets sister was also named thus)

Jacobs brother has decendents that include a one Aaron(Claires baby) unless I am mistaken.

Jacobs mom...Sarah(Jacks ex-wife).

Jacks Dad is named Christian.

The name of the actor who plays Jack is interesting too in that Jabob was just that.

[mousepod]

When Jack and Juliet were on the boat and the music swelled up, H turned to me and said, "If this turns out to be a religious message, I'm going to throw my shoe through the TV screen."

[Stan4dSteph]

The writers have stated that they have a full vision for the show, as in they know how it will end and are aiming to keep the series run to that timeline. Seeing as how they've stated that and I'm sure they're aware of the X-Files pitfall, I believe they won't drag the series out. I'm still enjoying it.

[sleepyjeff]

Lost is on tonite.........:)

[JWBear]

Lost is on tonite.........:)

Yes, I hope I can stay awake until 10:00. (Typing that makes me feel so old...)

[sleepyjeff]

Yes, I hope I can stay awake until 10:00. (Typing that makes me feel so old...)


If you find yourself eating dinner before 5:00 O'clock, then you're old;)

[scaeagles]

We had dinner tonight at 4:45 (well, my daughter had a basketball game at 6:00).

[JWBear]

If you find yourself eating dinner before 5:00 O'clock, then you're old;)

Not much chance of that. I don't get off work until 5:30.

[BarTopDancer]

I really enjoyed tonights episode. Back to the basics.

Someone needs to keep John away from the electronics.

I wonder, now that the house was blown up if the Others will be able to get above ground on the "island".

[sleepyjeff]

.

I wonder, now that the house was blown up if the Others will be able to get above ground on the "island".


I doubt if even the writers know that yet;)

Actually, I wonder if Mr. One Eye played John like a fiddle and wanted him to press 77.

[JWBear]

...Someone needs to keep John away from the electronics....

Seriously!! I hope the rest of the Losties back at the beach gang up and beat the sh*t out of him when they find out he deprived them of yet another place with civilized comforts!

[Ghoulish Delight]

Poor John. He had himself a whole bunch of buttons AND a hatch...and he went and blew it all up.

This was a really good episode. We learned something...these guys are willing to die in a blink for whatever they're protecting. They are willing to choose to die rather than risk giving out information. Damn.

Seeing as how they've stated that and I'm sure they're aware of the X-Files pitfall,They've actually explicitly said that they want to avoid the X-Files disaster.

[Stan4dSteph]

So, does anyone speak Russian? I want to know what the two Others were saying to one another before EyePatch shot the woman.

[BarTopDancer]

I wonder if eye-patch guy was one of the guys from the end of last season. Weren't those guys speaking Russian? I wonder what the relationship is.

[Stan4dSteph]

I wonder if eye-patch guy was one of the guys from the end of last season. Weren't those guys speaking Russian? I wonder what the relationship is.One of the people from the scientific research station? No, he's been on the island since they saw him from the Pearl.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Where is Mrs. Clue?

Dead, you know.

[BarTopDancer]

One of the people from the scientific research station? No, he's been on the island since they saw him from the Pearl.

True. Maybe they are inter-related somehow.

Dead, you know.

Thankfully! I really disliked her character.

[sleepyjeff]

So, does anyone speak Russian? I want to know what the two Others were saying to one another before EyePatch shot the woman.

I don't speak Russian(not even in the shower)...but some folks over at lostpedia do.




Klugh: Mikhail. Mikhail! You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have another way [out].
Klugh: We cannot risk it. You know the conditions.
Mikhail: There is another way.
Klugh: They captured us. We will not let them to get into the territory.
Klugh: You know what to do. That's an order.
Mikhail: We still have another way!
Klugh (in English): Just do it, Mikhail.
Mikhail: Forgive me. (shoots)

from lostpedia.com

[sleepyjeff]

Patchy also mentioned durring his episode that he was a Big Nadia Comaneci fan...same birthday and all.

That is not the only coincidence though between Nadia and Patchy.

Patchy was working at a Dharma Station called "The Flame".

Name of Nadia's first gymnastic team...."The Flame"

-----------------------

Also, the Theme Song to The Young and the Restless a very long, never ending soap opera(sound familiar?) is called "Nadia's Theme"...named for the very same Nadia.

[BarTopDancer]

WTF?!

[Stan4dSteph]

That was cool. Now another character has a link to Jack's dad!

Locke definitely has his own agenda. It looks like we'll find out more next week.

[Ghoulish Delight]

CP and I couldn't remember where exactly we last saw Jack 2 episodes ago. Anyone?

[BarTopDancer]

CP and I couldn't remember where exactly we last saw Jack 2 episodes ago. Anyone?

Operating room on the "other" island.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Operating room on the "other" island.
But what was the last emotional state we saw him in? What did he say, what was said to him? I'm drawing a blank as to whether seeing him playing football followed logically from the last time we saw him, or if it implies that he, say, had some quality time in Karl's brainwashing room-o-fun.

[BarTopDancer]

But what was the last emotional state we saw him in? What did he say, what was said to him? I'm drawing a blank as to whether seeing him playing football followed logically from the last time we saw him, or if it implies that he, say, had some quality time in Karl's brainwashing room-o-fun.

Oh um. I think the last time we saw him was when he made Kate promise to not come and find him. It doesn't follow logically that he would be happy and playing football. I'm not sure if I would go so far as to say he has spent time in the brainwashing room-o-fun (though it is highly possible) or has just become complacent to his situation.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Oh um. I think the last time we saw him was when he made Kate promise to not come and find him. No, there was the whole Thailand/tattoo episode with Juliette's trial and Jack in the cage.

[BarTopDancer]

No, there was the whole Thailand/tattoo episode with Juliette's trial and Jack in the cage.

Oh ya. Then um. I got nothing. But I have it recorded.

I still don't think he was in a place where playing football was the next logical step.

[Stan4dSteph]

But what was the last emotional state we saw him in? What did he say, what was said to him? I'm drawing a blank as to whether seeing him playing football followed logically from the last time we saw him, or if it implies that he, say, had some quality time in Karl's brainwashing room-o-fun.Quite possible. He went willingly in the boat with the Others to return to their camp from the satellite prison island.

He could be brainwashed, or he could be faking it in order to learn more about them. He's smart enough to know when he might need to bide his time and wait for escape another day.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Quite possible. He went willingly in the boat with the Others to return to their camp from the satellite prison island.

He could be brainwashed, or he could be faking it in order to learn more about them. He's smart enough to know when he might need to bide his time and wait for escape another day.
Aaaah, right. Yeah, I was trying to remember if there was something where he seemed to at least be cooperating, and, yes, the trip on the boat would be that moment. So yeah, it could go either way: brainwashing or biding his time.

[sleepyjeff]

Jack is trying to save Juliet by helping Ben and perhaps even becoming the "Others" new Surgeon(Ethan).

Patchy has "memories" of John. Maybe Patchy is like Desmond?

[scaeagles]

It is somewhat odd that the others know all of the losties rather well.....

[sleepyjeff]

Well, if anyone can't wait to find out what is going to happen Wed. night.............Re-watch the pre-view that aired at the end of the show last week(youtube: Lost 3x13 US) than watch the preview that was aired last week in Canada(youtube: Lost 3x13 Canada). A key sentence uttered by one of our Losties is finished in the Canadian version. Warning; this may spoil the show for you.

But if you can't wait, the info is pretty good:)

[Gn2Dlnd]

Is it subtitled? I don't speak Canadian. :(

[Ghoulish Delight]

Lost producers Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse were guests on KCRW's The Treatment. It was a good interview, definitely got me excited about things to come. But one thing was indeed worrisome.

The host asked the inevitable, "Do you have an end point?" question. Their response was that it's important to have an end point, that the audience deserves an end point, that it would be difficult to write without an end point because they wouldn't know how to pace the story. But they never gave an end point. They didn't even say that they have an end point and just aren't revealing it. And then they started saying things like, "You have to balance the creative side with the business side."

Uh oh.

[BarTopDancer]

Crap. What happened to their 5 year plan and avoiding the X-Files syndrome?

:(

[sleepyjeff]

..... "You have to balance the creative side with the business side."

Uh oh.

Oh, no....Twin Peaks and X-Files flashbacks---must cover ears and sing la la la la la la la la la la:D

[Stan4dSteph]

Lost producers Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse were guests on KCRW's The Treatment. It was a good interview, definitely got me excited about things to come. But one thing was indeed worrisome.

The host asked the inevitable, "Do you have an end point?" question. Their response was that it's important to have an end point, that the audience deserves an end point, that it would be difficult to write without an end point because they wouldn't know how to pace the story. But they never gave an end point. They didn't even say that they have an end point and just aren't revealing it. And then they started saying things like, "You have to balance the creative side with the business side."

Uh oh.that's not what they've said on the podcasts. Likely they are hedging their bets. They are not totally in control of things. ABC has a say as well.

[sleepyjeff]

BEST EPISODE EVER!( well, at least until I calm down from my excitement )



I loved when Alex told John that Ben was manipulating him, that Ben makes people do things and think it was their idea..........totally not getting what she was really saying, John went ahead a did Bens bidding.

Loved the part where Locke broke into Bens home....Ben sounded very frightened, but I think he was scared of his daughter, not an intruder. Seems to be an odd home life there. He has pictures of her everywhere, he seems to love her very much, but yet he must know that she would, all things being equal, see him dead.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

Thanks the gods for a Locke/Ben episode. I've been a faithful viewer but the last three episodes were a downward spiral for me. But I LOVE the fire and crackle between Ben and Locke. And I really enjoyed the action and pacing and quiet all intertwined in this episode.

Drew Goddard did wonders with individual Buffy episodes when the over all arc of the series was struggling. I see he worked his magic again last night. Whoo!

[scaeagles]

I was losing some interest, but then since Kate and Sawyer escaped I've really enjoyed it again. Sadly, though, it looks as if they will once again be in captivity.

The whole thing with Locke's dad at the end, though.....that was major on the creepy side. The others must have had him for a while, since the pulse apparently made it impossible to navigate back to the island.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

Ah, see, I became engrossed with the Other-side of life, and once Kate and Sawyer returned to the Island...things became less interesting. And I'd have felt better about things if Sayid was allowed to behave as intelligently as he once did. But last week's was pretty exciting and last night's was great.

The Hurley bus episode was a disaster. My God, I hated that episode.

[katiesue]

I finally spent a Saturday and caught up on all my episodes so now I'm current. Last nights was definately an improvement.

[scaeagles]

The Hurley bus episode was a disaster. My God, I hated that episode.


How funny. I loved that episode.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

How funny. I loved that episode.

Goodness, gracious. There were a few scenes/moments that made me laugh out loud, but over all I thought it was one of the worst episodes of the series. My friend and I were nearly pulling out our hair we had so many problems with it. Just goes to show, to each his and her own. Heh.

[Stan4dSteph]

The whole thing with Locke's dad at the end, though.....that was major on the creepy side. The others must have had him for a while, since the pulse apparently made it impossible to navigate back to the island.It doesn't matter if he came via "The Box."

[sleepyjeff]

The whole thing with Locke's dad at the end, though.....that was major on the creepy side. The others must have had him for a while, since the pulse apparently made it impossible to navigate back to the island.



Maybe Lockes Dad was on the plane the whole time

He may have been among the tallies captured that first night.

Hurley must have seen a Sawyer on the manifest durring that episode in which he discovered that there was no Ethan.

But if Sawyer was on the manifest that could only mean that another man by that name was on the plane since I am sure the Australian authorities would have deported James Ford..not Sawyer
__________________

[RStar]

How funny. I loved that episode.

Me too! It was such a breath of fresh air to have some fun and levity in the show. It was getting so disheartening seeing our favorite characters treated so badly. One can only watch pain for so long....

[scaeagles]

Interesting episode.....certainly not a pleasant way to go, eh?

[Ghoulish Delight]

I didn't like this episode. Something about the pace. It was cute that they filled in the gaps from the previous appearance of Nikki and Paolo, but the payoff wasn't really worth it. Plus, I just don't buy the, "She was so focused on the diamonds that they never mentioned finding another freaking hatch." A little too over the top.

But damn does she look good in a bikini.

[scaeagles]

Yeah, that's why I called it "interesting". I didn't like it either and was trying to be nice.

[Stan4dSteph]

I thought it was well done. Great twist at the end. Now we know why the "dead" characters kept having flashbacks!

I liked the way we saw the same scenes from other episodes, but from the perspective of people on the fringe. Funny that the two found the hatch earlier, and no wonder Paolo wanted to go to the Pearl!

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I'll never believe that Sawyer would throw diamonds into a grave. He's still Sawyer, right? I'm almost annoyed that they had him do that.

I liked the episode even though it was basically self-contained and went nowhere. It was like the writers were saying "check us out, we're just f'n around this week" in a playful way, and I kind of enjoyed that. I liked all the references to things I'd forgotten from episodes past.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I suppose I was a bit set up for disappointment. In the same interview we heard earlier with the producers, they said that they knew people thought Nikki and Paolo were lame and out of left field, but to just hang in there because in a couple weeks their appearance was going to pay off and that the audience would understand them and they'd be just as integral as any of the other survivors.

Not so much, imo.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Hurley must have seen a Sawyer on the manifest durring that episode in which he discovered that there was no Ethan.

But if Sawyer was on the manifest that could only mean that another man by that name was on the plane since I am sure the Australian authorities would have deported James Ford..not Sawyer
__________________Don't know if this is where you were going with this, but this begs the question...would Locke's dad have been traveling under the name "Sawyer" because he is (or was posing as) THE Sawyer, the one that conned James' mom and inspired him to take the name?

[JWBear]

Two things:

1) Now we know what Locke was watching when he got the visit from the son of the woman his "father" was going to con - it was Expose!

2) Did anyone else notice the smoke monster noise (mechanical clanking) just before the male spiders showed up?

Good episode, though I will miss the pretty that was Paulo.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Two things:

2) Did anyone else notice the smoke monster noise (mechanical clanking) just before the male spiders showed up?
Yup, that's what had both Nikki and Paolo on alert before they noticed the spiders. It would have been a good red herring for the audience had the male spider "twist" not been telegraphed 30 minutes before.

By the way, I don't see any reason to believe that it's not really Locke's father. His mom would have to be in on that, or somehow be mistaken about the paternity because when he came for the kidney, she was pretty insistent that he was indeed his father, even after he found out it was a con.

[JWBear]

Yup, that's what had both Nikki and Paolo on alert before they noticed the spiders. It would have been a good red herring for the audience had the male spider "twist" not been telegraphed 30 minutes before.

By the way, I don't see any reason to believe that it's not really Locke's father. His mom would have to be in on that, or somehow be mistaken about the paternity because when he came for the kidney, she was pretty insistent that he was indeed his father, even after he found out it was a con.

I put father in quotation marks because he was never a father to Locke in any way that counts, other than being a sperm donor.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

I hated it. HATE IT! It wasn't the pay off we were promised for having to put up with their appearances earlier in the season. And though I don't mind them being bad, unlikable people, I DO mind them being completely boring people. And integrating them into the plane crash scene only felt like a bad rehash. Not to mention the utter pointlessness of including Boon and Shannon (bad wigs and all) unless we learned something more about them (i.e. revealed an additional connection they had to one of the Lost-ers).

Introducing guest appearances (like Arty in the first season) is a good thing to do. Introducing a separate plot arc involving new characters that NO one cares about is bad, IMO. You can do something new and clever with the existing folk without wasting anyone's time. My patience with the show was already thinning and this just made it worse. At this point, I think I'd be happier just watching Ben all the time. He's at least as interesting as he was when he first arrived on the show.

And I have a friend who liked it and was creeped out by how these two died but all I could think was, "Good riddance. You got the end you deserved, you morons."

And Sawyer would NOT have tossed the diamonds in the grave if he were written in character. If they'd showed, over time, that he was becoming resigned to never getting off the island, I could by it. But it just felt like forced contrition. Bah. BAH!

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

Don't know if this is where you were going with this, but this begs the question...would Locke's dad have been traveling under the name "Sawyer" because he is (or was posing as) THE Sawyer, the one that conned James' mom and inspired him to take the name?

When it was first revealed that Locke's father is a con man, I assumed he'd turn out to be THE Sawyer. Not sure about all the plane manifest stuff, but I do think they'll turn out to be one and the same.

[Ghoulish Delight]

And I have a friend who liked it and was creeped out by how these two died but all I could think was, "Good riddance. You got the end you deserved, you morons.""Things don't stay buried on this island." Me thinks that we, unfortunately, may not have seen the last of those two.

So, I've been pondering what the producers said about whether they have an end game planned or not. At this point, my most optimistic guess is that they've got an agreement with ABC in which they've said, "Okay, we'll go ahead and string this along as long as you want to milk it, on the condition that you give us enough advanced warning before pulling the plug to write and shoot some number of episodes and wrap the story up as intended."

Not the best scenario, and a recipe for more episodes like this last one, but it's unrealistic to think that ABC wouldn't want to keep it open ended and at least in my hopeful scenario they won't just cancel the show mid-season and force them to slap together some hurried unsatisfying ending a-la X-Files or Arrested Development.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

"Things don't stay buried on this island." Me thinks that we, unfortunately, may not have seen the last of those two.

Not the best scenario, and a recipe for more episodes like this last one, but it's unrealistic to think that ABC wouldn't want to keep it open ended and at least in my hopeful scenario they won't just cancel the show mid-season and force them to slap together some hurried unsatisfying ending a-la X-Files or Arrested Development.

Damn it. STAY BURIED, YOU TWO. That's an ORDER!

Oh, damn it.

And, I think the writers/producers know two things: What the island IS. And as far as I know, that's all they've promised. And if that's true, I'd like to believe it explains the Dharma Initiative and the Others.

What I don't think they've resolved (because they cannot predict actors wanting out of their contracts early - take the actor who plays Eko as an example, etc.) are the story arcs for most of the characters. I think they're uncertain of specific plot developments that are created for the individual characters. More troubling, I'm not entirely sure they know why they've created all these connections and coincidences between the characters....what the overall payoff would be.

I think that Walt was supposed to play a more important role on the show, but when they writers (far later than they should have) realized the glacial pacing of the show would make it very difficult to keep Walt a young boy, they realized he'd have to be written off. [My guess, anyway.]

I think the show should have planned for a 3 season arc. Season 1 - the survivors. Season 2 - Ben and the others. Season 3 - Resolution. For me, this show can't behave like the X-Files, where the majority of the episodes (and the more interesting, IMO) weren't related to the overall alien arc. Lost really needs to keep on target. There can be cool random stories revealed in the flashbacks, so long as they're well done, but at the end of each episode we should be closer to the goal line.

[Ghoulish Delight]

More troubling, I'm not entirely sure they know why they've created all these connections and coincidences between the characters....what the overall payoff would be.
I'm fairly certain they know this. Now that it's crystal clear that the others have full, detailed background info on everyone, and know who is "good" and who is not (even if we don't know what makes them such), I think it's obvious that the writers/producers know WHY they have all that info, why everyone is there, and why all of their paths crossed. I'm also pretty certain that it's tied directly to what the island is, so if they know one, they know the other.

5 seasons/100 episodes were the original numbers I heard. They're still well within that, but I'm sure no one could have guessed or hoped that it would be as successful as it was out of the gate. And ABC may have been willing to take risks when it was at the bottom of the heap, but now that they have a winner, sadly, the risk-taking is likely to subside. But they're hopefully smart enough to realize that an X-Files-esque fizzle will spark massive geek-filled riots. Honestly, I'd be surprised at this point if they go beyond 5 seasons.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

I'm fairly certain they know this. Now that it's crystal clear that the others have full, detailed background info on everyone, and know who is "good" and who is not (even if we don't know what makes them such), I think it's obvious that the writers/producers know WHY they have all that info, why everyone is there, and why all of their paths crossed. I'm also pretty certain that it's tied directly to what the island is, so if they know one, they know the other.

I hope you're right. I'm fairly certain you are. But some of the connections must blow up in their faces if they're forced to kill off cast members before they intended. No matter what they say, I'm convinced that Ana Lucia and Libby were nixed because of the DUIs. And if I'm right about Walt being ditched because of the age issue, Michael's character was probably greatly revised to fit that change in the storyline.

All said, then, they aren't lying. They know where things are supposed to end up, but they have to make tricky changes now and again to deal with unpredictable blips now and again.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I think that Walt was supposed to play a more important role on the show, but when they writers (far later than they should have) realized the glacial pacing of the show would make it very difficult to keep Walt a young boy, they realized he'd have to be written off. [My guess, anyway.] That's another thing they addressed in the interview. Yes, they were very aware of the aging problem and decided that the best way to deal with it was to remove him for a while, with plans to bring him back in a way that would allow any changes to make "sense" in the context. Who knows what that means, but they seemed to be indicating that Walt would return, play a role, and perhaps still be the same actor.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

5 seasons/100 episodes were the original numbers I heard. They're still well within that, but I'm sure no one could have guessed or hoped that it would be as successful as it was out of the gate. And ABC may have been willing to take risks when it was at the bottom of the heap, but now that they have a winner, sadly, the risk-taking is likely to subside. But they're hopefully smart enough to realize that an X-Files-esque fizzle will spark massive geek-filled riots. Honestly, I'd be surprised at this point if they go beyond 5 seasons.

Meant to respond to this, as well. I've only read that the show will go on for 5 season and 5 season only. I thought that was their plan all along, even if the show was a HUGE success. At this point, I think it would be a HUGE mistake to drag it out past 5. But I say this because I'm feeling dragged along in the 3rd. And I don't have a problem with slowly paced shows. I loved the first season of Carnivale. When the creator was made to increase the pacing, everything was thrown off balance and forced and it really hurt the show. Ah, well. Thems the breaks.

[Ghoulish Delight]

All said, then, they aren't lying. They know where things are supposed to end up, but they have to make tricky changes now and again to deal with unpredictable blips now and again.

That's the nature of this kind of show. They are writing it as they go and they constantly have to balance the overall story with the realities of working with real actors as well as gaging and adjusting to audience reaction. They mentioned that with the big hiatus this season, they're writing and shooting episodes further in the future than they have in previous seasons and it's been a challenge to not have that more immediate audience reaction to help steer them.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

That's another thing they addressed in the interview. Yes, they were very aware of the aging problem and decided that the best way to deal with it was to remove him for a while, with plans to bring him back in a way that would allow any changes to make "sense" in the context. Who knows what that means, but they seemed to be indicating that Walt would return, play a role, and perhaps still be the same actor.

The freaky island ages him. I could buy that. Glad it was address and surprised that I assumed correctly. My assumptions usually make an ass out of me. Heh.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Meant to respond to this, as well. I've only read that the show will go on for 5 season and 5 season only. I thought that was their plan all along, even if the show was a HUGE success. That's what I had hear too...until this interview. They were asked point blank if there was a target end time or # of episodes and they failed to give a straight answer. Basically they said that they have an end point to the story mapped out, that the audience deserves a clean ending, but business and creativity need to be balanced. It was worrisome, but like I said, my optimistic interpretation is that they've been assured by ABC that they'll have fair warning and given a chance to actually write and shoot an ending rather than getting the plug pulled willy-nilly.

[JWBear]

I hope you're right. I'm fairly certain you are. But some of the connections must blow up in their faces if they're forced to kill off cast members before they intended. No matter what they say, I'm convinced that Ana Lucia and Libby were nixed because of the DUIs. And if I'm right about Walt being ditched because of the age issue, Michael's character was probably greatly revised to fit that change in the storyline.

All said, then, they aren't lying. They know where things are supposed to end up, but they have to make tricky changes now and again to deal with unpredictable blips now and again.

The writer/producer of Babylon 5, J. Michael Straczynski, has said that, when he was creating the show, he came up with a way to write out every major character, should he need to, in a way that fit into the overall show arc. Smart.

[BarTopDancer]

Meh.

And spiders :(

[Betty]

This last show bugged me. I kept saying - just like Sawyer - who are these people? (and why am I supposed to care.)

The flashbacks bugged me - like they were trying to convince me that these 2 people have been there all along - when they weren't. I could have accepted it easier if it had progressed the overall story.

I didn't buy them not saying a thing about the hatch - especially her since she wasn't trying to hide the diamonds there.

And what about the spiders - there are these spiders all over the place and this is the first time anyone has encountered them?

Overall - I just wished the regular characters would advance.

[Stan4dSteph]

I don't understand the sentiment about the characters never being there from the beginning. There are a lot of survivors we have never seen. People in the background. I guess I just don't really see it as a bad thing to have looks at minor characters.

[BarTopDancer]

And what about the spiders - there are these spiders all over the place and this is the first time anyone has encountered them?


That kinda bugged me too. But just like those spiders we haven't seen much other jungle life (other spiders, snakes, lizzards, etc...) either.

It was creepy how she opened her eyes at the end. I wonder if she is going to claw her way out (and we will have to accept that she was able to get air under there).

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

I don't understand the sentiment about the characters never being there from the beginning. There are a lot of survivors we have never seen. People in the background. I guess I just don't really see it as a bad thing to have looks at minor characters.

I don't mind a character showing up like Arty (sp?) the dude killed by dynamite. That was awesome and added to the show, IMO. It's a fun way to include guest appearances in more than just flashbacks. But this was just poorly done, IMO.

[BarTopDancer]

I figured out my problem with the episode (besides the spiders).

We have had weeks of booooooooooring and disappointing episodes. Then we had 2 really great episodes with action and progression. Then this. I've read that questions from the first season were answered but I've long forgotten what it is they answered.

It wasn't that the episode was bad. It was just a break. No forward movement. We were asked to think that they wouldn't tell anyone about the hatch, the toilet, the TVs and that the Others were coming for Jack. Had we had 8 weeks of non-stop progression then perhaps this would have been a nice break. It was a break we weren't ready for.

If that flashback was way back when, that does ask [again] how did the Others know about the Losties. It was interesting seeing how Zep I mean Ben explained how he got people to do what he wanted.

The previews for next week look good. But I'm not getting my hopes up.

I've lost interest in the show to the point where I now walk out of the house to go out at 10pm instead of sitting at home waiting impatiently for Lost to come on.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I disagree. The Hurley episode was a break as well and I loved it. I don't require or expect every episode to reveal something earth shattering. Heck, I appreciate the occasional break in story episodes because, with a minimum of 2 seasons to go after this, they obviously are going to be creating more questions than they answer for a while.

This was just a bad episode with poorly developed characters, thin plot devices, and poor pacing.

[sleepyjeff]

So the fence is, after all, to keep the smoke monster out....

or is it?

Juliet said ....as Kate glares at her "alright, we don't know what it is but we know it doesn't like our fences".

The way that is phrased, it could mean that the fence was built for something else and it is just happenstance that smokie can't get thru it.

--------------

[scaeagles]

A fine episode indeed.

I was to the point of trusting Juliet. Now I am not so sure.....she was playing Kate until Smokie was about to get them and then she gets through the fence to save herself, telling Kate she in fact was aware of a weakness in it.

Does she know what it is?

Next week looks great....
I love when Sayid become Sayid the Interrogator. He plays it so well, and I think the interaction between him and Juliet will be even better than it was between him and Ben.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I enjoyed the episode but they're still getting themselves into issues that really don't make sense, IMHO.

Dumping the girls in the jungle but leaving Jack and Sayid behind...huh? I have a feeling we'll never get an explanation for that, except that the writers wanted to have the girls fight in the rain and get muddy. Jack could have stayed unconscious that long indoors with the canister but Sayid was supposedly outside and should have woken up the same time the girls did.

Seeing Kate kick the sht out of that bitch really made my evening. I hate both the character and the actress equally. Also out of character, I thought, was how Kate somehow instantly forgave her for the handcuff thing. She totally should have punched her and pushed her into the sound fence. Wouldn't you want to kill the chick who locked you up, tortured you, kept your friends hostage, etc etc? BTW, did Juliet wake up next to Kate in the forest, happen to have handcuffs on her, and handcuff them together? Or were they handcuffed but Juliet discovered the keys in her pocket? Why in hell would the Others set them up either way?

And why would Sayid and Kate let Jack bring Juliet with? She hasn't proven herself in the slightest. If the Others leave someone behind, you don't take them in! What happened to Sayid the protector?? (I do not watch previews for next week so I'm sure there'll be more about this, but their shrug shoulders attitude just made no f'n sense.)

GD pointed out to me (credit where it's due) that Sawyer is a con man and shouldn't have any trouble getting people to like him if he wanted them to. All the awkwardness makes for fun TV but makes no sense in light of his character. I was kind of irked that he got credit for the boar feast also. Was it because he brought beer? :rolleyes:

Even the good episodes include so many out of character moments that it's pretty annoying.

On the good side....John's conversion is awesome, dealing with Jack back at camp should be fun.....the show will continue to have my attention, that's for sure.

[JWBear]

My take on it is that Juliet didn’t get gassed. She dragged Kate out into the jungle and handcuffed herself to her. She was only pretending to be asleep. She knew the fence was off because she either turned it off herself, or found it off when she dragged Kate out.

I think her plan was to get Kate’s trust so that she would have another person on her side. She didn’t want to be left alone, so joining up with the Losties was better than staying at the Barracks by herself.
.

[Ghoulish Delight]

My current suspicion is that Juliet and Kate were purposely dragged out and cuffed together to give Juliet a chance to gain her trust. That much would make sense. What doesn't make any sense is Kate being completely unphased by the fact that the two of them were dragged into the jungle but Jack and Sayid were left where they dropped (how did Juliet know to find Sayid?). Why does Kate not question this at all?

Why doesn't anyone ever question anything? Why didn't Kate and Sayid grill Alex's boyfriend. Why doesn't anyone ever ask, "What the fvck is the Dharma initiative?" Above all else, that's becoming the most implausible thing about this show and it's really starting to grate on me.

And yes, I call shenanigans on the Sawyer thing.

ETA: What JW said, that was my other theory on Kate and Juliet. Which, of course, still leaves her loyalties ambiguous as she could be trying to gain their trust for one of many reasons.

[Stan4dSteph]

Is it too much to think that after 3 months on the island, some of the characters might be changing? I don't see it as so far out of character for Sawyer to see that given his situation, faking nice isn't going to cut it this time. If something goes bad, he has nowhere to run off to, which up to now I'm sure he did on a regular basis. I doubt he stayed anywhere more than 3 months at a time.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Is it too much to think that after 3 months on the island, some of the characters might be changing? I don't see it as so far out of character for Sawyer to see that given his situation, faking nice isn't going to cut it this time. If something goes bad, he has nowhere to run off to, which up to now I'm sure he did on a regular basis. I doubt he stayed anywhere more than 3 months at a time.
He thought he was facing living without food or shelter. He would have at least TRIED to turn on the con-man charm. I don't buy for an instant that, as good a con man as he was, that he had no clue how to make a woman with a baby smile. I'd buy the episode if he tried that for a while until people saw through it. But to make it out that he is completely incapable of getting people to like him turns him into a thin caricature instead of a believable character.

[Stan4dSteph]

I guess I'm just not as nitpicky. Oh well, I enjoy watching and don't sweat the details.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Sorry, didn't mean to offend you by not agreeing with the writing choices.

[sleepyjeff]

?Question...is Juliet still working for Ben or not?

If she is; why do they need her at the Beach with the other Losties? Seems to me they could have gotten anyone from the beach that they wanted using Micheal. The only person on the beach I can think of that would not have gone off with Micheal to rescue Walt would be Claire.

So; if Juliet is still working for Ben....what does she want with Claire? Aaron, would be the obvious answer. Fertility doctor and a baby born on an Island that doesn't have a high birth rate. Is she being sent there to study Aaron....or to protect him?

Assuming time is shifting, or what have you ie: Desmond and his flashes.....could Aaron be Jacob? Ben? Christian?

[Stan4dSteph]

I think Juliet might be a plant for the Others. It's hard to tell at this point.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

He thought he was facing living without food or shelter. He would have at least TRIED to turn on the con-man charm. I don't buy for an instant that, as good a con man as he was, that he had no clue how to make a woman with a baby smile. I'd buy the episode if he tried that for a while until people saw through it. But to make it out that he is completely incapable of getting people to like him turns him into a thin caricature instead of a believable character.

I think the difference is that the castaways KNOW he's an ass. It's probably harder to turn on the charm, and be believable, if you're aware that people already know what you're capable of.

I imagine pre-island, if he was trying to scam Claire, pretending to love a baby might not have been so hard. But pretending to care about a baby when he's already been heard talking about how he could give a fig about them? Well...I didn't find some of that part of the episode too hard to swallow.

That people would turn to him as a leader? That I find hard to swallow.

I enjoyed the episode because I do like the actress who plays Juliet (have since I saw her in Gia) and I do like her character. Not sure she's trustworthy in general, but I understand why Jack trusts and cares for her.

But like you I can't stand that the characters don't ask questions. They don't, I guess, because the producers aren't willing to answer them. But it makes their characters look really, really stupid.

And though I get that Kate would want to beat Juliet up because she lied to her, beating her up earlier in the episode because she's *jealous* of her connection to Jack was just stupid and nasty. Not necessarily out of character, I guess.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I imagine pre-island, if he was trying to scam Claire, pretending to love a baby might not have been so hard. But pretending to care about a baby when he's already been heard talking about how he could give a fig about them? Well...I didn't find some of that part of the episode too hard to swallow. But he seemed utterly confused when Hurley told him that Claire would like it if he gave her a blanket. Not, "She won't buy me being nice," but, "Huh? Why would I give her a blanket?" For me, when they are going at great lengths to drive home the implication that everything on the island is happening, that everyone person who is there is there, because of who they are and what their character is, I don't think I'm that off base in expecting some logical character progression. The show is all about character. It just felt incongruous, exaggerated and thrown in for comic effect. Much the same way I felt about the exaggerated, "They're so focused on the diamonds that they are completely flippant about finding another freaking hatch!" from the Paolo/Nikki episode. I felt they sacrificed character for a gag.

[Stan4dSteph]

I enjoyed the episode because I do like the actress who plays Juliet (have since I saw her in Gia) and I do like her character. Not sure she's trustworthy in general, but I understand why Jack trusts and cares for her.She is interesting. I'm not sure what I think of her at this point. I still think she might be an Other plant. I also think she might just be out for herself at this point, so she may still betray the Losties for her own self-serving interests.

[sleepyjeff]

What if???

What if when Jack and Kate return and someone mentions to them that Nikki and Paulo died..... they say "who"?

What if when Jack and kate return one of them, in passing, asks where's Bernard or Rose.....and the beachies respond........"who"?

What if Sawyer wasn't just being a jerk when he kept saying "who they heck are you?" to Nikki and Paulo?

[scaeagles]

Wow. I didn't see that coming. I was getting played like Jack.

So I'm figuring they are after Sun? Was Juliet promised a way off the island if she did this? They must have another way off the island with the sub gone.

Great episode.

[Ghoulish Delight]

ETA: What JW said, that was my other theory on Kate and Juliet. Which, of course, still leaves her loyalties ambiguous as she could be trying to gain their trust for one of many reasons.

Yup, I figured this was a possibility. Bolstered through the whole episode by the rather rigorous way they were implicating the exact opposite. The only thing that really surprised me was that they told us.

Great episode all around.

[sleepyjeff]

The only thing that really surprised me was that they told us.



Which of course is making me want to be too clever by half again and say that perhaps Juliet will turn out to be on the Losties side later on:eek:

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Which of course is making me want to be too clever by half again and say that perhaps Juliet will turn out to be on the Losties side later on:eek:I wouldn't be surprised if they were able to turn her to the Losties side eventually, because they've made her into a pretty sympathetic character.

I am so happy it turned out the way it did. I get to hate Juliet, hooray! :D I saw it coming, too, which is rare for me. If her story were true, how would she know exactly where Ethan hid his stash, exactly how to open it? Why would Claire flare up precisely when she showed up? If they hadn't shown us that it was all rigged, it would have been a very crappy episode indeed.

Juliet has been on the island for just over 3 years....the newspaper said September twentysomething 2004.....she arrived on the island just before 9/11.

There is a very serious reason why they need people to give birth on this island. The women "keep dying" but they keep trying. The one specific woman "knew the risks but got pregnant anyway". If there's something special on the island - power source, God in a bottle, what have you - they still don't need to have people give birth there. They could just keep sending people in. If you set up an archaeological dig or a base in Antarctica, it's not vital that you have babies there. I can't fathom why this is so deadly important that they'd hijack people's lives and blackmail them into staying by threatening the lives of their relatives.

Theory - Juliet's sister didn't really have cancer, Ben and company just infected her with something the same way they infected Claire.

[scaeagles]

I doubt that theory....she wasn't pregnant until after she was in remission, so why would Ben and the Other have wanted her before then?

[Ghoulish Delight]

Which of course is making me want to be too clever by half again and say that perhaps Juliet will turn out to be on the Losties side later on:eek:Juliet's in it for herself. She's not doing it our of some great loyalty to Ben, she's doing it because it's the only way she thinks she can get off the island. IF she sees a way to side with the Losties and get off the island, she would, but she is far too aware of how much control Ben has over things so it would take an extraordinary circumstance.

[Stan4dSteph]

Juliet's in it for herself. She's not doing it our of some great loyalty to Ben, she's doing it because it's the only way she thinks she can get off the island. IF she sees a way to side with the Losties and get off the island, she would, but she is far too aware of how much control Ben has over things so it would take an extraordinary circumstance.I agree that she's in it for herself, which makes me think that perhaps she is planning to double cross Ben and the Others in the end.

I can't wait to see Jack's reaction when he realizes he's been played by her, it that is indeed the case.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

I'm just going to say that, finally, I loved an episode of Lost from beginning to end. It's been a while...

[Ghoulish Delight]

I agree that she's in it for herself, which makes me think that perhaps she is planning to double cross Ben and the Others in the end.

I can't wait to see Jack's reaction when he realizes he's been played by her, it that is indeed the case.
I'd be surprised if that were the case. She doesn't seem to be thinking that far ahead. While she doesn't have any great love for Ben at this point, I think she still respects his power over what goes on on the island. I think she can be persuaded (especially if, say, Locke convinces her that Ben let him blow up the submarine) but at this point I'm pretty sure she is on board with Ben for the sole reason that she doesn't see any other way off the island.

[sleepyjeff]

Of course there is the possiblility that Jack and Julliet are in this together(Recall the look the two shared on the boat leaving Alcatraz). Perhaps they are both trying to defeat Ben at a critical time.

Ben must need Juliet to do something very important and at a very definate time on the beach with our Losties. It can't be just a mere kidnapping as he could have gotten Micheal to do that for him more or less. I don't think it is to spy either as they don't seem to lack any info about the Losties.

[sleepyjeff]

The answer to the entire show has been right in front of my face:

Last night they played the hit song Downtown, for the third time in the shows history.


Llyod Braun was a key figure in the early going of this show.....and another show too(Seinfeld)

Interestingly enough, that show also played this very same song right after this exchange:

WILHELM: (pleased) Well then, I guess you'll be heading downtown then,
huh?
GEORGE: Oh, yeah. Downtown. Definitely.
WILHELM: Well, I'm very interested to see how this thing turns out.
GEORGE: (to himself) Yeah, you said it. (to Wilhelm) Uh, excuse me, Mr
Wilhelm. Uh, do you really think... Well, is this downtown trip really
necessary, you know, for the project?
WILHELM: Oh no, you've got to go downtown, George. It's all downtown.
Just like the song says.
GEORGE: The song?
WILHELM: There's your answer. Downtown.

So the answer is hidden within the lyrics of the song.

[Monk's]

George and Jerry in a booth.

JERRY: The song Downtown? You mean the Petula Clark song?

GEORGE: Yeah.

JERRY: You sure he didn't just mention it because you happened to be

Going downtown?

GEORGE: I think he was trying to tell me something, like it had some

sort of a

meaning.

JERRY: Okay, so how does it go?

GEORGE: 'When you're alone, and life is making you lonely, you can

always go...'

JERRY: '... downtown.'

GEORGE: 'Maybe you know some little places to go, where they never

close...'

JERRY: '...downtown.'

GEORGE: Wait a second. 'Little places to go, where they never close.'

What's a little place that never closes?

JERRY: Seven-eleven?

GEORGE: 'Just listen to the music of the traffic, in the city. Linger

on the sidewalk, where the neon lights are pretty.' Where the neon lights are

pretty. The Broadway area?

JERRY: No, that's midtown.

GEORGE: 'The lights are much brighter there. You can forget all your

troubles, forget all your cares, just go...'

JERRY: '...down town.'

GEORGE: 'Things'll be great, when you're...'

JERRY: '...downtown.'

GEORGE: I got nothing, Jerry. Nothing.

JERRY: Well, 'don't hang around and let your troubles surround you.

There are movie shows...

[BarTopDancer]

So, was the sub really there to get people off the island or just as a prop? They showed Juliet getting off the sub but never being put on the sub. Ben mentioned the sub as a way to keep his people happy - in the context of people are happy to be here and will defend the island but they need to know they have a way home [and then something about even if it's not an option].

Also, Ben was born on the island, as was Alex and maybe a few other people. When did the fertility issues start taking place?

Anyone else catch the Dharma logo on one of the doctors jumpsuit when Juliet lost the mother? Are the Others part of Dharma?

[sleepyjeff]

So, was the sub really there to get people off the island or just as a prop?

I was thinking the same thing. And why make Juliet take a pill if the approach to the Island is underwater? It's not like she's going to be peeking thru the periscope and checking her sextant(?)?


Also, Ben was born on the island, as was Alex and maybe a few other people. When did the fertility issues start taking place?

Both were "born" on the Island...but I don't think that is where they were concieved there(this was hinted at in the last show when Juliet wanted to try having a woman concieve in Miami, then go to the Island for the birth) Don't know if this means anything but in the middle ages fathers named their son's Benjiman if they lived thru their mothers dying in childbirth.



Anyone else catch the Dharma logo on one of the doctors jumpsuit when Juliet lost the mother? Are the Others part of Dharma?


Nice spot, I didn't catch that.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I can't mojo sleepyjeff for making me actually want to watch Seinfeld for the first time in my life. :snap:

Forgot Juliet's sister had cancer first, right...

[thecorndogwalker]

Okay, Desmond saved Charlie's life again. Although I had this strange feeling that Charlie might actually die. But this was all a little hook to watch this new character fall out of the sky (literally) and it not being Desmond's girl, although she said his name..

Was it Desmond's girlfriend who was seen at the last scene of season two?

Oh I much liked last week's episode better!

[CrazyLegs]

This weeks was interesting all right will see what happens in the next 4 i think they said it was.

[Stan4dSteph]

The omnipotent woman (Ms. Hawking (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Ms._Hawking)) from Desmond's previous "flashback" was in the photo with the monk on the monk's desk in the monastery. :D I thought there had to be a reason there was that deliberate camera angle, so I rewound and paused my DVR.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Okay, Desmond saved Charlie's life again. Although I had this strange feeling that Charlie might actually die. But this was all a little hook to watch this new character fall out of the sky (literally) and it not being Desmond's girl, although she said his name..

Was it Desmond's girlfriend who was seen at the last scene of season two?

Oh I much liked last week's episode better!
The book he found in the backpack was Catch 22 in another language. Were I a betting man, I'd guess that the parachuter is connected to the Russian (or whatever they were speaking) dudes on the boat that Penny hired to find Desmond (thus the photo).

[sleepyjeff]

...this new character fall out of the sky (literally) and it not being Desmond's girl, although she said his name..

Was it Desmond's girlfriend who was seen at the last scene of season two?



It wasn't Desmond's girlfriend(Penny). She didn't say "Desmond"...she said "Desmond?"*.

*At least according to closed captioning.

[Ghoulish Delight]

It wasn't Desmond's girlfriend(Penny). She didn't say "Desmond"...she said "Desmond?"*. CDW meant the other girlfriend, the one he apparently jilted to join the monastery. As for the inflection of "Desmond", that could either "Desmond?" as in, 'I've only seen photographs so I'm not sure, but are you Desmond?" Or it could have been, "I'm severely injured, barely conscious, and had little hope of ever actual finding him, so am I really seeing Desmond?" So really, that doesn't give much of a clue. The only real clue was the book, in a foreign language.

[sleepyjeff]

CDW meant the other girlfriend, the one he apparently jilted to join the monastery. As for the inflection of "Desmond", that could either "Desmond?" as in, 'I've only seen photographs so I'm not sure, but are you Desmond?" Or it could have been, "I'm severely injured, barely conscious, and had little hope of ever actual finding him, so am I really seeing Desmond?" So really, that doesn't give much of a clue. The only real clue was the book, in a foreign language.

You're right...I had not considered that.

One other clue would be the ABC website......The girls name is not Ruth(his former girlfriend) it is Naomi.

Also, the foriegn language of that book is Portugese(which is also the language that our snowbound friends at the end of season II were speaking).

[sleepyjeff]

A few more thoughts on the parachutist Naomi:

The name Naomi comes from the bible.....book of Ruth.

In Lord of the flies the kids find a Parachutist dangling from a tree limb...diff being this one was dead.

Best line from last nights episode: Charlie, upon hearing that the satalite phone doesn't work.."shocking"

:)

[Stan4dSteph]

In Lord of the flies the kids find a Parachutist dangling from a tree limb...diff being this one was dead.I thought the one in Lord of the Flies was up on the top of the mountain propped up against a rock? I did think of Lord of the Flies too though.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

For a split second, when we first see Charlie hit with an arrow, I thought, "Finally!" But I quickly realized that it was just one of Desmond's visions.

I liked the episode well enough. I enjoy watching Desmond's flashbacks. Where "Brotha" comes from amused me. And the episode was written by the awesome dude who writes Y the Last Man! Cool.

[sleepyjeff]

I thought the one in Lord of the Flies was up on the top of the mountain propped up against a rock? I did think of Lord of the Flies too though.


You are correct...it was rocks, not a tree. "Beastie from the sky"

[thecorndogwalker]

Great Episode last night, the last scene was a shocker. Although the parachute girl is hanging onto her life. I shall believe she has no idea what she is saying. Will be interesting to hear her story.

Juliet, what do I make of you? Well its safe to believe she is just covering her ass and wants to get off the island, so she is doing anything possible. I kindve like her!

Was nice to see Sun and Jin spotlighted. Eager to see how the next couple of episodes play out...

[scaeagles]

I'm a little freaked out that the Russian guy is still alive. Didn't they check for a pulse when he had his encounter with the fence?

That was quite the shocker about what parachute girl said.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

If they really have found the plane full of dead bodies then we're talking a whole other level of weirdness here. Alternate dimension or mass conspiracy.

I'm betting that she was wrong, that she's thinking of some other plane, or something.

[Stan4dSteph]

I'm betting that she was wrong, that she's thinking of some other plane, or something.Or Dharma rigged up a fake flight 815 and made it look like everyone died.

I'm wondering what parachute woman said when Desmond and Mikhail were working on her. Anyone find a translation online? Mikhail said that she was thanking him, but I have a feeling it was something else...

Poor Sun. I hope they are able to figure out a way to save her.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Good episode with one lame moment. Juliette saying "I hate you." I mean, I guess I'm glad that they finally made it explicit that she's not doing anything out of true loyalty, just out of an absolute desire to get home and believing through Ben is the only path there, as I presumed. But that scene was so cheesy. Bleh.

[thecorndogwalker]

Poor Sun. I hope they are able to figure out a way to save her.




I am sure that since the timeline on the show is only 90 days that has passed, I am sure that Sun's 2 months could probably last until the end of the series.... I hope they figure out.. but did you catch what Juliet said, she was going to get Kate's info... which means that Kate might be preggers as well, since she did the nasty with Sawyer, eh, James... And since all the men's sperm count is so high on the island....

[Clara]

darn me passing out from complete exhaustion...missed another epi

[JWBear]

...I'm wondering what parachute woman said when Desmond and Mikhail were working on her. Anyone find a translation online? Mikhail said that she was thanking him, but I have a feeling it was something else...

According to someone on another board, she said "I'm not alone" in Italian.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

Good episode with one lame moment. Juliette saying "I hate you." I mean, I guess I'm glad that they finally made it explicit that she's not doing anything out of true loyalty, just out of an absolute desire to get home and believing through Ben is the only path there, as I presumed. But that scene was so cheesy. Bleh.

I call upon the Powers of Eloquent Language to say DITTO that.

[sleepyjeff]

I'm a little freaked out that the Russian guy is still alive. Didn't they check for a pulse when he had his encounter with the fence?

That was quite the shocker about what parachute girl said.

If they really have found the plane full of dead bodies then we're talking a whole other level of weirdness here. Alternate dimension or mass conspiracy.

I'm betting that she was wrong, that she's thinking of some other plane, or something.

There has got to be multiple realities(timelines) going on here.

1) Rose and Bernard don't exist(the only mention of them is between Kate and Sawyer...two people who were far away when the hatch blew)

2) Nikki and Paulo were strangers to Sawyer.....and we have never seen Jack or Kate interact with them or even mention their names....Jack and Kate were both with Sawyer, far away from the hatch, when it imploded.

3) Now we have possibly two Eye Patch Guys......one was killed. Either he wasn't really killed(which seems improbablye given the graphic nature of his death) or there are two of them.

4) Looks like we also have at least two planes now too. One crashed on the Island with survivors and one crashed somewhere with no survivors. I think there may even be more than that....like one with Rose and Bernard on board and one with Nikki and Paulo, etc.

5) Desmond has saved Charlies life something like 4 times now.....this suggests at least 4 possible different realities in itself.

6) Back in the very first part of season one Rose mentioned that she recoginzed the sound the monster was making.....could this be because she, like Desmond, has done this all before?

7) When Kate tried to get the jump on Juliet with the pool cue, Juliet ducked the attack and nailed Kate to the floor effortlessly....almost like she had done it before.

8) Sun and Kate have noticed that Jack doesn't seem like Jack anymore.....could it be that it is Jack but a Jack from a different timeline?

[RStar]

Could Eye Patch guy faked it with an Alkaseltzer in his mouth? Could he have simply healed (Like he suggested will happen with parachute girl)?

And what happened with Locke's dad? Is he with the others and Locke? And where are they? I think they will be back as I saw Locke in the trailer for the next epi.

[sleepyjeff]

Could Eye Patch guy faked it with an Alkaseltzer in his mouth? Could he have simply healed (Like he suggested will happen with parachute girl)?



I suppose that is possible. However the question than becomes....why? Why would he fake his death and how did he even know Locke would throw him into the field to fake it?

Which brings me to another point. Right before EPG was thrown into the barrier by Locke he was about to say "The John Locke I knew was a para..."

Everyone focused on what he didn't say....paraplegic. The focus should have been on what he did say though...."The John Locke I knew..."

In other words, this guy already knew John. How did he already know him? Perhaps in a previous life?

[Ghoulish Delight]

Everyone focused on what he didn't say....paraplegic. The focus should have been on what he did say though...."The John Locke I knew..."

In other words, this guy already knew John. How did he already know him? Perhaps in a previous life?

Interesting theories, but might be reaching a bit far. They've established several times that the others have tons of info on everyone. The John Locke he "knew" could easily refer to him having seen whatever files they have.

The fence may have left him not quite dead, left to be healed by the island.

The end of the Paulo/Nikki episode established that Sawyer did know them, he was just being an obtuse ass.