The Gay Thread

[Kevy Baby]

I want to see the pictures of the consummation.

[alphabassettgrrl]

Very nice! Yeah, I love the mirror-image dresses, too.

[innerSpaceman]

Yes, it's a new world. Come What May. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCGX4FBJfNc&feature=share)

Arguably the most romantic song ever to grace the silver screen is sung on (what was at least once) an uber-hit television show between Two Men about their Love for Each Other! Pinch me!

:snap: :snap: :snap:

[Gn2Dlnd]

Very sweet, but why the urge to bitch-slap the incredibly popular (but not quite the phenomenon it once was) tv show?

[SzczerbiakManiac]

from So Let's Talk About.com (http://soletstalkabout.com/post/45838945526/heard-on-the-subway-talking-about-your-gay-son)
I was on my way to work, zoned out listening to some old school Shania Twain to get my life right, when two construction worker types got on the train at Penn Station. They were both middle-aged white guys with Long Island accents, mustaches, dirty jeans — the type of guys you’d expect to see on a building site. I caught a piece of their conversation when the music died before the song changed, and I decided to record them.

Normally, boring people and their boring conversations don’t interest me in the least, but the music dropped out right when Guy #1 said “My wife wants me to get fixed like a dog but I don’t see why she can’t just keep taking the pill.” That in itself isn’t inherently interesting, but the fact that he was openly discussing it on a public subway train made me hit the record button real quick to see what else would come out. I’ve been doing this for about 6 months now, trying to catch interesting things on the subway, but I haven’t had any luck so far because I ride boring trains.

Today was good though.

Guy #2: No more kids for you two?
Guy #1: No, she figures we’re both getting too old for a baby.
Guy #2: How is your boy anyway? Haven’t seen him in awhile.
Guy #1: Oh John’s good, pitching this year varsity.
Guy #2: He’ll definitely have the girls hanging around him now.
Guy #1: Yeah if he had any time for them.
Guy #2: Focused on baseball?
Guy #1: Focused on boys.
Guy #2: You’re ****tin me!
Guy #1: I kid you not. Came out to me and Mary Ann bold as daylight last year.
Guy #2: Well I’ll be damned! I’m not supposed to know it but I overheard Patrick Junior tell his sister he might be gay not two months ago.
Guy #1: We all saw that coming though.
Guy #2: You’re the second person to say that. How’d everybody see it but me?
Guy #1: It was just a feelin Pat. He was always a little soft, ya know?
Guy #2: I guess you’re right. But damn Charlie, we both have gay kids. What do we do now? Both our sons are gay.
Guy #1: We don’t do anything. We let em be gay and if some kid calls em a faggot we go to their house and raise hell with the parents like normal.
Guy #2: Well I guess John and Lucinda won’t be getting together like we thought awhile ago.
Guy #1: Guess not.
**long pause**
Guy #2: Hey Charlie, you thinkin what I’m thinkin?
Guy #1: I was for about half a second then it got weird and I started thinkin about somethin else instead.

By that point I was holding back a little tear, but they changed the conversation to something about a building code. I thought about posting the video but I don’t know how to blur people’s faces. Still, I thought this little exchange should be broadcast to the Internet.

And filed away under The Future of Dads with Gay Sons.

[innerSpaceman]

^ So Frelling Awesome.

[Alex]

Hope it's true, but it doesn't read like real conversation. But maybe it is just cleaned up.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

He should just post the audio.

[€uroMeinke]

Of course it sounds like one of the boys hasn't fully come out yet, so that would put him in an awkward situation, despite having a supportive father.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

What's the general feeling on LoT about the two marriage equality cases before the Supes this week?

It feels weird to go against my typical pessimistic nature, but I kinda sorta almost feel like we might have a chance at victory.

[alphabassettgrrl]

I'm hopeful, since the pro-8 side doesn't really have a case. But on the other side, the justices don't really want to legalize gay marriage...

Hoping, but not holding my breath.

[Kevy Baby]

It was reported that if the SCOTUS elects to not rule on the Prop 8 issue, that marriage between same sex persons would become legal in California - is this correct?

[alphabassettgrrl]

That should be correct, since the last ruling on Prop 8 was to overturn it.

[Alex]

DOMA down, minimal ruling on Prop 8 that knocks it down in California but has no precedent outside of the state.

[innerSpaceman]

It's unwise to read too much into the tea leaves of the justices' questions during oral argument - but I have to say the comments and queries (or is that queeries?) during the Prop 8 hearing made the Supreme Court look like a medieval institution and the justices seem as if they lived behind dusty cloistered walls.

So it looks as if they will try for a narrow ruling affecting only California - but since quite a few realize how ridiculous and untenable it would be to say something is unconstitutional in one state but not the others - it may very well be they will deny standing in the case and leave either the 9th Circuit decision or the district court decision in place. Either way, Prop 8 is dead in California - but it's looking very unlikely gay marriage bans will be ruled generally unconstitutional ... yet.

If the 9th circuit decision is left standing, that has valuable precedent that can be used in other cases. If just the district court decision is upheld, there's little future value of that broad and landmark decision.


DOMA, on the other hand, appears to be unquestionably and door nail dead, based again on the uncertain but certainly more crystal clear questions and concerns expressed at the hearing this morning. (The audio hasn't been released quite yet, as I write this, so I haven't heard with my own ears as of now.)

[SzczerbiakManiac]

How Sam got a copy of "Sophia the First" on DVD (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/13/dads-story-of-buying-sofia-the-first-dvd_n_3074141.html)
http://www.afterelton.com/sites/www.afterelton.com/files/2013/04/HebNYApl.png

[innerSpaceman]

Brilliant.

[katiesue]

A couple of weeks ago at Disneyland we saw a young man (maybe 5 or 4) dressed as a princess. Maddie said it made her happy to see it.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Love those sorts of stories. :)

[lashbear]

I'm spending far too much time on Facebook. I just spent a minute looking for the "Like" button on Katiesue's post.... :rolleyes:

[SzczerbiakManiac]

French National Assembly Finalizes Passage Of Marriage Equality (http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2013/04/23/1907531/breaking-french-national-assembly-finalizes-passage-of-marriage-equality/)

14 down and a lot more to go, but this is definitely progress!

[Gn2Dlnd]

So, Szb, you think Jason Collins might be making it easier for Wally to come out?

[lashbear]

Apparently he's the first NBA star to come out !! http://www.starobserver.com.au/news/sport/2013/04/30/first-nba-player-comes-out/103168

[Alex]

"star" is putting it a bit strongly. But good that it finally happened.

[lashbear]

I thought anyone who played professional basketball was considered by Americans to be a star....

...or is it just Wally?

[Alex]

This "star" is someone most basketball fans had never heard of (or, more accurately, had no reason to remember having heard of) and someone nobody who doesn't watch basketball had ever heard of.

That said, even as a bench warmer whose job is to commit a handful of fouls once a week most people would consider him to have a pretty sweet situation compared to the average person.

But if you want to go bigger, he's not just the first for the NBA, he's the first in any of the major American sports leagues (baseball, basketball, football, hockey).

[Gn2Dlnd]

Actual headline on front page of CNN - Barkley: We've all played with gays (http://www.cnn.com/video/?hpt=hp_t3#/video/bestoftv/2013/04/30/ac-barkley-smith-okafor-jason-collins.cnn) :D

[SzczerbiakManiac]

So, Szb, you think Jason Collins might be making it easier for Wally to come out?I certainly hope so!

But in all seriousness, I am overjoyed beyond belief that a major US professional team-based male athlete has finally come out. I didn't expect this to happen for at least 15-20 years. I also didn't expect there to be so much support for him. The nutbag responses have been surprisingly limited.

Three cheers to Jason!!!

[SzczerbiakManiac]

The meaning of Jason Collins' coming out (http://www.outsports.com/2013/4/30/4285134/jason-collins-gay-nba-meaning)
By Cyd Zeigler, co-founder of OutSports.comThe kids today will never know a world without an openly gay male pro athlete

I'm not afraid to admit it: I cried Monday. A couple times.

It's not that the coming out of Jason Collins is somehow the answer to all of our prayers or that those who continue to perpetuate homophobia in sports will now silence their quieting roar. I just kept getting emotional thinking about how far we'd come--those of us who've been fighting this battle for so many years--to now see something that many thought was impossible.

I thought about Dave Kopay. The former NFL player was the first former professional athlete to come out publicly when he shared his story in 1975. At the time, he expected a wave of athletes to follow, yet he hasn't even seen a trickle of men take his lead.

I thought about Pat Griffin and Helen Carroll and Sue Rankin and all the women who have pushed the sports world for so many years, long before I even came out, to accept them for who they are.

I thought about the gay athletes I'd written about over the years: Former college athletes like Andrew McIntosh and James Nutter, who considered suicide because of homophobia in sports; Wade Davis and John Amaechi, who weren't able to come out while they were in the pros; Alan Gendreau and Galen Dodd, who represent a wave of out athletes hoping to move into sports' elite levels.

But mostly, I thought about the kids. I was one of those once. I grew up in a basketball household on a healthy diet of Celtics-Lakers championship series. My dad was a local hero, able to hit his elbow on the rim at a time when dunking was against the rules. I was supposed to follow in his footsteps, but on the first day of basketball tryouts in junior high school, I had an all-consuming feeling that I just didn't belong. There's no doubt in my mind that being gay, just struggling with my sexuality and being teased for it by the other boys, kept me off the basketball court. Like many LGBT youth, I opted for individual sports--track & field and cross-country--instead.

Thanks to Collins, the young ones in Pee-Wee football today won't know a world without an openly gay male pro athlete. The teens in youth basketball, just starting to understand their own sexuality, will forever have someone to look up to, someone who looks like them. The young gay men playing college baseball today got a shot in the arm: They now know the sports world is ready for them.

If any of this isn't clear yet, it will be. Jim Buzinski and I have been saying for years now that sports is ready for gay athletes. One of ESPN's commentators Monday night said he'd talked to a bunch of people in the NBA. He said, "I don't think 'overwhelming support' is overstating it at all." That support, now counting the likes of Kobe Bryant, Dwyane Wade, Shaquille O'Neal and Steve Nash, will continue to grow. There will be a couple outlying detractors, but they will be just that: Outliers.

It's funny to me that this is a surprise to some. Former Major League Baseball pitcher Mark Knudson reminded me today on Twitter that he believes an out gay athlete simply won't work in the pros. I bet him dinner that Collins' story in the coming months will prove me right. I look forward to collecting.

Along with so many others, Jim and I have been taking the chisel to the homophobic wall around sports together for 14 years. It's been a long journey. Some people said this day would never come. We knew it would, we just didn't have any clue when it would be. It felt emotionally like the culmination of years of pursuing stories that amplified the voices of hundreds of LGBT athletes, and asking straight guys in the pros, simply, "How would you feel if your teammate came out?" Until recently, the mainstream sports media considered these topics off-limits. It's awesome to see them now pursuing the stories of people like Jason Collins along with us.

To be clear, this doesn't mean the fight is over. No single announcement can end decades of struggle. Collins' story is the latest in a growing chorus that is quickly drowning out the naysayers, the homophobes, the people who are clinging to a past when sports wasn't open to everyone.

This was also just the first chapter in Collins' story. When he is picked up by a team, it will be another milestone. When he takes the floor in the preseason, more ground will be broken. And when he steps onto the court in November during a regular season game...well, I intend to be there.

It was another step toward the end, it just wasn't the end. Another locker room opened up for a gay athlete. Another wall came down, but more are still standing.

Now with Collins marching in Pride parades and speaking his truth, the rest of the walls will come down that much more quickly.

[Kevy Baby]

In related news, it is rumored that a player in the WNBA will be announcing this week that they are straight.

[Alex]

Ha ha ha. Girls who do boy things are gay.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Out of curiosity, as someone who pays almost no attention to professional sports (possibly related to being called faggot and being beat up regularly by people who played sports, maybe just because I'm gay. Who can really tell?), are there any professional female athletes who are out? Or do you suppose they suffer the same fears of public/lockerroom/professional backlash as male athletes?

I feel a rant coming on that involves things like "of course everyone knows that queers don't play sports, but they can decorate the sh!t out of your house, and real women stay out of sports and car repair, because, well, dykes" but I'm going to bite my tongue because I know and love Kevy and I know he was just making a joke, but JESUS CHRIST.

BTW, not something I would ever, EVER post on FB.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

are there any professional female athletes who are out?Yes. Not a ton, but certainly more than the guys.

Wikipedia's Lesbian Sportswomen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Lesbian_sportswomen)

from MotherJones.com (http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/04/jason-collins-not-first-out-gay-pro-athlete)Jason Collins Is Not the First Out Gay Pro Athlete
—By Kate Sheppard

Although his coming out in Sports Illustrated is big news, NBA star Jason Collins is not the "first openly gay athlete in professional North American team sports," as some have claimed. Claiming as much implies that either women's sports don't matter as much (or don't exist at all), or that coming out is somehow less of a big deal for professional athletes who happen to be women. Here are just a few of them:

Retired WNBA star Sheryl Swoopes, who came out in 2005 when she played for the Houston Comets. (She later married a man.)
Brittney Griner of the WNBA's Phoenix Mercury.
Chamique Holdsclaw, former WNBA player most recently with the San Antonio Silver Stars.
Megan Rapinoe, member of the US Women's National Team, now playing soccer professionally in France.
Lori Lindsey, USWNT member in the 2012 Olympics who currently plays for the Washington Spirit in the National Women's Soccer League.

There have also been a number of out stars in individual sports—including Billie Jean King and Martina Navratilova in tennis and Orlando Cruz, a professional boxer.

There have also been other male professional athletes in team sports who have come out, even if they're not in the "big four" professional sports—like Andrew Goldstein, the goalie for Major League Lacrosse's Long Island Lizards.

[alphabassettgrrl]

I think it's more that women's sports don't get the attention that men's sports do, so fewer people cared that some of them were gay. It's also the idea that male athletes are the macho-est of the macho, and that is somehow perceived by the masses as incompatible with being gay. Of course, both of those assumptions are stupid, but you know. Women don't have quite the same problems with the macho nonsense.

I think other than the initial sensationalism, nobody will care who's gay so long as they play well. And that is how it should be.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

In regards to a female athlete coming out, I think there is a common assumption that all women athletes are lesbians, so when one actually does come out, it's regarded as a "no sh¡t" event. That assumption is incorrect, of course, but is exists nonetheless.
Women don't have quite the same problems with the macho nonsense.hear hear!

I think other than the initial sensationalism, nobody will care who's gay so long as they play well. And that is how it should be.That's definitely how it should be, but we're so very far away from that right now. I don't know how long it will take, but I am certain the more guys (and yes, unfortunately I specifically mean dudes) who come out, the sooner that will happen. The fundies will continue to get their knickers in a twist (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/01/church-cancels-leroy-butler-speech-over-jason-collins-tweet/), like they always have, but the rest of the word will move on without them.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Why We Shouldn't Let Gay People Play Basketball (http://www.buzzfeed.com/hunterschwarz/why-we-shouldnt-let-gay-people-play-basketball)

[Kevy Baby]

Ha ha ha. Girls who do boy things are gay.If we can't parody the ridiculous stereotypes, then the terrorists have won. Can't we think about the children people?

[Alex]

I'll go back and try to find some parody.

[Strangler Lewis]

Of course, he was drawn to the sport by the outfits. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/02/scott-norton-gay-professional-bowler-kisses-husband_n_2395921.html)

[lashbear]

So, New Zealand's legalised Gay Marriage. Now maybe Sam & Frodo have a chance.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Gays Beware with Jesse Tyler Ferguson and George Takei (http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/34201d7411/gay-beware-with-jesse-tyler-ferguson?rel=player)
be sure to watch the whole thing

[SzczerbiakManiac]

This may be more related to my inner geek than my outer gay, but it nonetheless made me smile.

Some Klingons Are Gay. Get Over It! (http://www.stonewall.org.uk/media/current_releases/8746.asp)
http://www.stonewall.org.uk/images/cm_images/klingon-left-fade.jpg
Stonewall's iconic "Some People Are Gay. Get Over It!" campaign is now in its sixth year and is set to reach a new milestone. The famous posters have appeared across Britain on buses and billboards, and have been seen in countries worldwide as part of the charity's international campaign against state-sponsored homophobia. Now Stonewall is boldly going where no charity has gone before, by translating the campaign into Klingon.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Truth

http://distilleryimage7.ak.instagram.com/8ed1ae64c7bd11e28fe822000a9e17dc_7.jpg

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Tomorrow is the big day (http://www.advocate.com/politics/marriage-equality/2013/06/25/supreme-court-tomorrow-decision-day). SCOTUS said they're going to rule on Hollingsworth v. Perry (Prop H8) and U.S. v. Windsor (DOMA).

My heart is racing.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

And, interestingly, the decisions will be released ten years to day (http://www.goodasyou.org/good_as_you/2013/06/marriages-cases-to-be-released-on-lawrence-v-texas-anniversary-ten-years-to-day.html) after Lawrence v. Texas struck down anti-sodomy laws.

[blueerica]

DOMA = no mo? (http://nbcpolitics.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/26/19151971-supreme-court-strikes-down-defense-of-marriage-act-paves-way-for-gay-marriage-to-resume-in-california?lite)

[SzczerbiakManiac]

And prop H8 is dead.

Today is a good day.

[innerSpaceman]

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/2837/ni46.jpg

[SzczerbiakManiac]

tee hee hee (http://socialitelife.com/photos/10-lol-pics-friday-july-19-2013/lol-pics-07192013-05)
http://cdn02.cdn.socialitelife.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/19/lol-pics-07192013-05-580x435.jpg

[Kevy Baby]

Hey Ernest Dronenburg Jr. (http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-san-diego-clerk-gay-marriage-20130719,0,2883541.story): don't be a dick.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

He seems like one of those people who is still pissed that miscegenation is legal.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Local Fox Affiliate Asks The City Of Detroit To Explain Joke (http://www.queerty.com/local-fox-affiliate-asks-the-city-of-detroit-to-explain-elaborate-fisting-joke-20130731/)

Bwa haa haa haa!
http://queerty-prodweb.s3.amazonaws.com/wp/docs/2013/07/1004819_10151815131602994_230977292_n-360x480.jpg

[JWBear]

We got invited to our first gay wedding!

[Kevy Baby]

I've DJ'd a couple of them, alas back in the day when it was just symbolic.

[lashbear]

Australian Conservative Pollies will BRIBE you to be straight. (http://www.samesame.com.au/news/local/10154/200-each-Coalition-to-fund-straight-couples.htm) Gay couples need not apply.

[Kevy Baby]

Australian Conservative Pollies will BRIBE you to be straight. (http://www.samesame.com.au/news/local/10154/200-each-Coalition-to-fund-straight-couples.htm) Gay couples need not apply.I would love to be there to get the $200 to donate to a pro-gay cause

[lashbear]

Well, now that we have a Preservative Government leader (who a lot of overseas people are comparing to GWB) you might get the chance...

[SzczerbiakManiac]

tee hee hee (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=530320383730207&l=016940ee57)
spoilering because it might be a tad unsafe for work
https://scontent-b-lax.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/q71/1457628_530320383730207_1813167800_n.jpg

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I realize they're referring to the old-fashioned meaning of "gay", but these still made me chuckle:
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/77/0f/a4/770fa49ed9b48e3534582e5fdb3542f0.jpg http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/ec/80/0e/ec800e487b35401fe677126a006ade23.jpgMore here (http://www.advocate.com/comedy/2014/04/10/tbt-suspiciously-gay-ads), if you're interested.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

To the Rams for being the first NFL team to draft an openly gay player (and the first Black player back in 1946 (http://www.outsports.com/2014/5/11/5706224/michael-sam-gay-st-louis-rams-nfl-draft-kenny-washington).)

To ESPN for having the courage (not that it should be courageous, but because 'Murica...) to repeatedly show Sam kissing (http://www.outsports.com/2014/5/10/5705202/michael-sam-espn-kiss) his (HOT) boyfriend after receiving the good news.

The Dolphins for reminding Don Jones his obnoxious comments (http://www.thephinsider.com/2014/5/11/5708612/dolphins-fine-suspend-don-jones-for-comments-following-michael-sam) are not appreciated.

OutSports for this biting sarcasm (http://www.outsports.com/2014/5/11/5706172/michael-sam-gay-kiss-gross-disgusting-straight).

[Strangler Lewis]

Typical. Another big black athlete just out to steal our white men.

[Scrooge McSam]

VSLM

[SzczerbiakManiac]

http://38.media.tumblr.com/0b91c4e16336f8fb812f706728f83bdf/tumblr_n1vyo7XHMk1snt6cyo1_1280.jpg

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Stonewall Inn to become an official landmark (http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Stonewall-Inn-Landmark-New-York-City-Vote-Greenwich-Village-Gay-Rights-Symbol-309328281.html).

[SacTown Chronic]

**** yeah, America! SCOTUS for the win.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Does this mean I get to marry my dog now?

[SacTown Chronic]

Yes, absolutely. What else can it possibly mean?

[alphabassettgrrl]

Whoo-hooo!!! Thank you, SCOTUS!

[Ghoulish Delight]

It does mean my traditional heterosexual marriage is rendered meaningless and ruined, so I gotta find SOMETHING else.

[SacTown Chronic]

Seems a small price to pay for innerSpaceman to have the right to make some guy miserable till death do they part.:D

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I've had an absolutely miserable week, but after reading this morning's news, I am elated!

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I don't know if this Grindr chat session is real, but it's funny (to me, at least) and may be particularly amusing to members of LoT:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CZ1uMLMWIAAf2-v.jpg

[Gn2Dlnd]

No, just high capacity.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

VG2DMJ because I'm literally LOL!

[alphabassettgrrl]

Hahahahaa!! I am indeed amused.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Just read the news about Orlando (http://www.advocate.com/crime/2016/6/12/least-20-dead-mass-shooting-florida-gay-club-video). I am simultaneously depressed, sickened, and furious.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Obviously it's WAY too soon to make a comparison, but there's a part of me that wonders if this will have a Stonewall effect.

[RStar]

It's absolutely horrible. What is wrong with people????

My heart goes out to all of those effected.