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Why Did I Refuse This Random Act of Kindness?
Your insights appreciated.
Setting: Starbucks, smallish college town in Wisconsin, Saturday morning, long line. What happened: A group of college boys were in front of us. One of them turned to us, asked us what we were having. I just smiled politely but my husband answered. The boy asked what size drinks. My husband answered. I said, "But you don't work here, do you?" His answer: "Not here, no. I do work at a Starbucks and I'd like to treat you two." He had some kind of a credit card he was flexing. I said no, turned and walked out of the Starbucks. I found it deeply disturbing that a college student wanted to treat us to two coffees and a bagel. I'm sure I hurt his feelings. I have no idea why I just turned and walked out. |
Not sure. Maybe because they were college students and in your subconscious you thought that it should be the other way around? Or perhaps somewhere in your subconscious you thought the card he had was stolen?
Trust your gut though. There was a reason you reacted the way you did. |
Because you didn't know what kind of strings may have been attached to this act of kindness. It was a nice gesture, but he'll be fine.
He was pimping Starbucks, nothing more. When I was working at Borders, I had coupons to give out that the company gave us managers for a free drink. It was to promote drinks in the cafe and as an apology if something didn't work out for the customer. It's free, but it's also a plea to be a devote customer. :) |
Are you sure he was a college boy, of did he just look young? (Maybe he was from corporate?) Anyway, I'm with BTD- trust your gut. Maybe a warning sign went off for a good reason, like perhaps it was a new card and he was being irresponsible with mommy and daddy's money, or it was stolen, etc. Could be he was legit, but something tripped your sensors...... Then again, you could just be a cranky old person.;)
(Kidding! I would have been a bit wary myself, but I really am a cranky old person.) |
You made the right decision...at least for some reason it feels that way.
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You made the right decision for you at that moment. It made you feel uncomfortable.
I would guess the young man had a gift card of sorts, probably was given it from his job. I am thinking he was trying to be nice and probably not too much into coffee. They do have gift cards and they do give them to the employees at times. Don't feel badly. I just wonder why you left instead of just saying 'No thanks'? Did they make you feel uncomfortable? Was this a different location than you are used to? Did you feel slighted? Again, you went with your gut and that is what you should always do. But, I just know that I have done things like that and so have my kids. I tried to give away Knotts Berry Farm tickets in front of KBF and people looked at me like I was crazy. I had received them free at the water park and didn't need all that I had. I think they did think they were being scammed. A question: do gift cards expire in that state? Here in CA they don't so that wouldn't happen here. |
I would've said "Grande Gingerbread latte for me please". But, i wasn't there and didn't have the gut to go by.
However, now I wish a college boy would drive by my house and drop me off a decaf version of said drink this evening. ;) |
It's a shame we live in a time and place where we feel uncomfortable when someone wants to be kind. But I would have done the same thing. At least I would have politely said "Thank you, but I'm fine." In fact I may have said something like "I'm still trying to decide what I'm going to order, you go ahead..." just to get him to leave me alone. It does seem strange, though. Perhaps he had a large gift card, and just wanted to use it up.
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Thanks, all. It's appreciated. :)
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Thanks for bringing it up, and letting us think about it a bit so we can know how to handle it if it comes our way. We hope not to hurt other people's feelings, but have to protect ourselves at the same time.
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"If it's free, it's for me"
I would have accepted the drink and if there had been a sales pitch I would have listened quietly for a few seconds and said, No, but thanks for Venti Soy No Foam Latte! Its true you have to be very careful these days. It seems everything comes with a string attached, even free string. But that doesn't mean you have to put your head in the sand either. Next time, just engage the person in a conversation, find out what its all about. Maybe you'll come away with a good story. |
The Starbucks line is like the communion line. It is a time to prepare your soul in happy anticipation and quiet contemplation of what you are about to partake in. (Unless the Starbucks line is too long--then it's a pisser.) While I would not have walked out, what he did was inexcusable.
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I've got no taste for your gut, but I'm gonna have to play devil's advocate and declare, from mine, that you were a tad rude, unnecessarily fearful, and socially inappropriate to simply refuse a too-rare kindness of an inconsequential nature in this crass day and age.
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How dare he! We must come together children and fight this scourge against society called, human interaction! Put on your Ipods! Talk on your mo-bile phones! Carry your laptop --- everywhere! Keep your eyes focused on your shoes and do not dare brush up against anybody. Do not smile at children. And do not offer up a good deed to anybody! |
Not that I would ever set foot in a Starbucks in the first place, but what's with all the paranoias? It's not like you were in a bar in Mexico and he was offering you lemonade in a plastic cup...
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Yeah and I'm not shy about talking with strangers. It's pretty much what I do as part of my assistant anthropologist gig.
Was it that the kind stranger was so much younger or male or that I was thinking in the back of my mind Maybe Tom has helped him but the stranger didn't want to say anything in such a public space* and I wanted Tom to myself for that brief time at Starbucks or ...? I don't know. I was unnecessarily rude. That much is for sure. The Case of the Starbucks Stranger remains a mystery to me. I'm usually a shade less bitchy. *Think something like psychiatrist and you're close. |
I think that's why Helen posted this thread- to try and figure out her response. I think she was acting instinctively, and I find it interesting that nearly all of the responses taking her to task for her actions are from the LoT guys. (Excepting GC and Rstar). Could it be that women's intuition was at work here? Oftentimes, it's so strong that it just kicks in and we react before we have time to think about it. I'm going with the idea that Helen knew something wasn't quite right here- she is not a rude or unintelligent woman, and I think her 'gut' knew something wasn't right. In fact, Helen is probably one of the most gracious persons on the LoT, so I totally disagree with the 'rude' assessments.
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Helen - you could always offer to buy the person behind you a drink the next time you're at a Starbucks to "right the cosmos" if you still feel bad.
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Right to be wary, wrong to walk out. Interesting reaction. I think we're missing some essential element, some environmental signal you picked up on that you don't remember or haven't shared.
But sometime people are nice because t occurs to them to be nice. Perhaps he had a bit of good fortune and was trying to pay back the cosmos by bringing a little sunshine into a random stranger's day. You just don't know. I think if you ever see him again,, you buy him a coffee, and just explain that it was an instinctual reaction you felt bad about later. Sometimes we just react strangely to things, but humans have a "first response" instinct for a reason. Even though it's not always the best response socially, instinct's first priority is survival. So "it is what it is" ((sorry GC) |
Did your husband walk out with you as well? He seemed amiable to the treat from what little you shared.
Perhaps it's Oedipal, the act of buying your drink somehow emasculating your husband, leaving you at their mercies - a subconscious quid pro quo that you didn't want to enter or even consider. That Latte, a steaming hot cup of illicit sex... That's my Freudian interpretation anyway |
When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras.
However, whether one should expect a horse or a zebra depends on context. Here, we can't decide if this was a random act of kindness, a sales pitch (which, though not the end of the world, is not a random act of kindness) or, perhaps, the third option: a piece of performance art/social experiment along the lines of Joshua Bell doing his thing in a busy subway to validate a pre-determined conclusion that people are cretins because they don't vary their routine to appreciate his efforts. It may be that on some level of absolute truth, we are wrong not to appreciate these efforts, but when the majority are insane, the sane must go to the hospital. I say this guy deserves some form of cartoon violence. Skillet, mallet and pie are too good for him. Since he was so polite, I would ask him to hold my burning sticks of dynamite while I got my own order and took it to go. |
What does your hubby think of your reaction, Helen? Perhaps he can offer some insight. If you think you just had a weird moment and feel badly about it, then just try and pay it forward sometime by buying a drink (anonymously) for a person of your choice. I think true Randoms should be as anonymous as possible anyway. Saves everyone from any awkwardness, and might encourage the recipient to pay it forward in kind.
I still stand by my assessment of Helen and I think she had more of a reason than meets the eye to react as she did. |
The only problem I see is that the guy went about things backwards. He started with the intrusive personal questions (which I also wouldn't have answered) and then followed up with the offer of a kindness.
He should have done it the other way around. "Hi, I work at another Starbucks and have this gift card with a few extra bucks on it and would like to get it out of my wallet, would you let me buy you your drinks in the spirit of the holidays?" or something and then when you say "how wonderful" then ask the personal questions. I would wonder if that is just what set you off, that he started out kind of rudely with it. A similar thing that happens to me is getting a call from someone who immediately asks "who's this?" when I answer instead of "hi, this is X, who am I speaking with?" things are going to start off on the wrong foot. |
Alex, that sounds how an experienced person may approach this.
I did catch that Helen was concerned that perhaps her husband had helped this person in some form at some time. Why that would seem wrong, I don't know, but, a persons reasons are their own {LOL, I almost said 'They are what they are...' but I recall GC starting a thread about that....:D }. Again, I don't think Helen did anything wrong, we are all allowed to do what we feel the need to do. But, I think it is interesting trying to figure it out. :D Like, the kid, perhaps he just got a raise or something and felt generous? Like a Starbucks 'bigwig'? Or, maybe, he quit his job and this was his way of screwing the company, 'Ha! I'm giving your coffee away!!!' And yes, I did just drink a cup of coffee and my mind is racing all over... |
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It just occured to me. I know why you did it!
You hadn't had your coffee yet! ;) |
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This story reminds me of those poor CM's at Disneyland who have the puzzling task of giving out "Dreams" to people who think they are trying to sell them something:)
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:p Actually, I don't know how I'd react. Maybe I'd have first asked him why? :coffee: |
I can relate, Helen. I've known myself to have very similar reaction, especially the "I have to walk away part." I have some gut negative reaction to a stranger's uninvited social "intrusion", and then I immediately realize, at least on some subconscious level, that it was a pretty lousy way to act to someone who's just trying to be nice/conversational. Then, not seeing any exit strategy that doesn't involve having to admit (explicitly or implicitly) that I acted like a jerk, I just get uncomfortable and want to just walk away and not have to deal with it. Ugh, I'm feeling uncomfortable just thinking about being in one of those situations.
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I think it is a combination of Alex and Rstar's comments: an unsolicited, rather intrusive question coupled with a preexisting condition (no caffeine) is a dangerous combination. At least in my house it is.:D
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I feel much the same as "the LoT guys", just to throw a monkey wrench in the theory :)
I can totally understand going with a gut reaction though. Sometimes there's no denying it. I really, really hate the term "women's intuition" though. You never hear about "men's intuition", as if there's no such thing, or that women are more in touch with the Force somehow. I do think that people are too jaded. As a teen/twentysomething I quite often ran into similar situations, from the "freaky young person" perspective. Remember this guy? I would have totally done something like that. Anyway, I wouldn't feel too bad, Helen, but I would definitely be more receptive next time. :) (and Alex is right, he went about it the wrong way.) |
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LOL Oh Lash, I can so see you doing this 'Oh, and why is this?? What do you mean?' {sort of like when you asked me what my hat meant 'System of a Down? What is that? What does that mean?' Very polite and very curious. :) } |
Oh, I think men can be just as intuitive as women, but I think when it comes to strangers and unsolicited approaches that women may be a little more deer-like in their responses. (The fight or flight instinct- I think we are probably more inclined to take flight than to fight) and such decisions are split-second in nature.* Again, I'm interested in hubby's take on the incident- does he feel since he was there that it was unwarranted? Would he have felt the same were he not there?
*Before anyone accuses me of sexism, I submit that I could kick my brother's butts when necessary, and if Eric and I were ever threatened I fear it would be me doing the asskicking, as he is very non-confrontational. |
I guess I think it was a strange way to react actually-
What difference does it really make that he was a young/college age man-do you think you would have done something different if he was older, or female? As rare as it is, sometimes people just do nice things for others. If this was indeed one of those times when someone just wanted to do something nice for someone else- it seems a shame to have reacted that way and perhaps jaded him from doing such things again. |
Or if Helen had taken the drink maybe something bad might have happened. So in the grand scheme of things, she totally did the right thing. What if she had taken the drink and got diarreah? It would be a vastly different thread.
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Helen posted this thread because she couldn't figure out why she had the response she did, and I think we'd all agree it was very unlike her. If it was common practice, she wouldn't have thought twice and certainly wouldn't be asking our opinion. I think it's not very helpful to point out the rather obvious 'that's a bit rude'- she knows that, she want so to understand why she did it. I think there are so many variables that could be involved that she may never really know, but I'm impressed that she's trying to figure it out.:coffee:
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There are certain situations where I react as Helen did, but I don't think I would react that way in that particular situation. What I do react to is solicitors coming to my door and people camped outside stores asking for donations. Those are the ones I tend to ignore or walk away from. That has to do more with my conception of "MY" space and an invasion thereof. Perhaps Helen feels the same way about Starbucks.
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But what does any of it matter now that Mr. Whipple has squeezed his last Charmin? |
I don't think it was rude at all.
If Helen had said, "Listen here, fella. You can take your drink and sit on it." THAT would have been rude... Once, in Monterey, I was filling up gas in Sand City. A guy pulled up to my car and opened his trunk. In the back of the trunk, there was a huge plasma screen TV. "Here, take it." He said. "Excuse me?" "It's my boss's, I quit today. I want you to have it because I hate my boss." For a split second I saw myself loading it into my trunk. But the other side of me thought better. It wasn't mine to have. I didn't buy it myself... It wouldn't feel right to me. So I told him, "No, thanks." He seemed surprised and pissed off, but I don't regret that. Besides, it could have been some sort of police sting or something.... |
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:D |
I must've been in a especially good mood that day. ;)
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I should have just had a party that day! I could have invited both the Baptists and JWs in for a religious discussion, too.
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The leading with the personal questions things is such a standard sales trick that I would just immediately shut down on the person no matter their ultimate intent. If you start with "what kind of car do you drive," "do you go to basketball games," "are you registered to vote in California," "what kind of coffee will you be having" are all immediate signs to me that the person wants something from me so I have no problem with shutting them down and then tuning them out. |
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Seriously though, the difference in this case is that they were in line to make a purchase - he wasn't making the drink, just offering to pay for it. Quote:
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Overall, I think we, as a society, are little too protective. I feel as though we should open up a little more to one another. I have been trying to figure out to respond to Helen's OP. I keep thinking that I am disappointed (generally speaking) that a simple "no thank you" was not used here. I do think that leaving the establishment was a bit much (unless it was simply out of personal embarrassment). Without being there, I suspect that the worst thing the gentleman was engaging in not the smoothest marketing. Optimistically, I want to believe he was trying to make the world a better place. I have been known to pay for people's meals at a restaurant. I remember Susan and I having an engaging conversation with the people at the next table one evening several years ago. They were there celebrating their anniversary. I was so touched by their story and their demeanor, that on our way out (we were seated and consequently finished before they did), we paid their dinner tab. We did it simply because we thought it would be an unexpected gesture that would (hopefully) make the world a better place. |
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As for the free stuff from people thing, I generally wouldn't take it now matter how nicely offered. At best I would have told this person "maybe the people behind me would like to take you up on it." Plus, some people just can't get behind the idea of "anonymous." A few years ago Lani and I were eating at IHOP on Thanksgiving (we do go all out for the holidays) and our waitress was also working a nearby table with something like 15 people. They left and we heard her mention to another staffperson that the table hadn't left any tip (and this was a table with many rowdy kids, etc.). So when we were done we left an extra $50 with a note explaining that some people suck, happy holidays, etc. (simply so she'd know it wasn't a mistake). Then she chased us down in the parking lot to thank us. I almost wanted to ask for the money back since she insisted on ruining it by turning it into a very uncomfortable situation (for me, other people would have been pleased as punch, I'm sure). Fully aware of the irony, I am much better at giving than at receiving. So I'd have no problem paying for the meal of that anniversary couple but if I were that anniversary couple I'd be pretty put out to find out that somebody had paid for it. |
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Alex: that is perhaps an aspect of your personality you may want to work on... inability to receive graciously is a flaw. Not as big a flaw as inability to give to others, of course, but neither is it something to be proud of.
(Not saying this to be insulting, I'm just putting it out there academically that you may want to explore the reasons you cannot allow yourself to be the recipient of kindnesses, especially in light of the fact that that denies the giver the pleasure of giving) Also, as embarrassing as it is to be thanked profusely for doing something when you'd hoped to "do your alms anonymously", if someone is willing to go that far out of their way to show their gratitude, don't punish them by negating your kindness. Just say thanks and move on. |
I don't consider it something I am proud of but something I am aware of and generally able to live with. I am aware of the reasons (or what I think are the reasons) this trait developed in me and aware that they are both irrational and produce a level of misanthropy that is unnecessarily off putting to others.
But while I am willing to share the fact of the way I am and how that impacts I am not willing to share the personal details on why I think it has developed as that is generally irrelevant. And of course I didn't do anything to let that waitress know I was in any way unhappy with her chasing me down to thank us. I said "you're welcome" and smiled and ah shucked as appropriate. While I might wish to avoid gifts and thanks, I can only thank of one time I was actually rude when they were forced onto me. Back in college I worked for a lady that insisted on cake and ice cream on every birthday in the group. I had told her that I didn't wish to observe my birthday and would appreciate if she skipped that for me. Then on my birthday I came in and there was a surprise party for me. I quite literally said "I'm sorry but you've put me in an awkward position. Either I sit here and smile and you think I was lying when I said I didn't want my birthday observed or I end up looking like an ungrateful asshole by leaving." Then I left. I've grown up since then and would never do that now (but have also been successful ever since in convincing my employers to ignore my birthday). |
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Ever so many years ago, when the lottery first came about I believe, my mother received a call: 'X' amount of free lottery tickets if you would listen to this guys sales pitch about a water purifier. Well, she was game and she always chatted up {or told off} door to door salespersons and so this young man comes around. Dressed in a suit, complete with a briefcase and the papers about the item he was selling. Us girlies were hanging around, as we did when any guy came around :D and we were watching her. We thought she was going to yell at him at some point, gee Wally, cuz that's what she did. But no, as this young man is sweating it in his tie and trying so very hard to speak in the best English he could, you could see by his face he was trying soo hard, my mother looks at him right in the eye, very curiously, 'So, you do this for a living?' and the young man says 'Yes, I do ma'am'. She tells him 'Gee, that's too bad. It is really boring'. We almost died for him and of laughter. He chuckled and I relaxed, I guess at that point he realized he just had to fork over the tickets and no more pressure. Sorry is this was off topic but I am laughing my arse off just remembering the incident. That's my momma. ;) |
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Also, I think you made yourself sound worse in that previous post than you deserved, given that you did actually do the aw schucking, etc. as appropriate. You discredit yourself unnecessarily, Alex... I'm starting to think that you think yourself a bigger b@stard than you ever possibly could be irl. |
You didn't make it seem like a demand for explanation. Just explaining that I am more self aware than it may seem since I generally only share the results and not so much the causes.
As for the second part, I just said it made me want to be rude not that I was rude. And it is true, in my head I was saying "40 demerits for you for chasing me down." If my life were an episode of Scrubs or Family Guy that would have been a moment of cutting away to a fantasy scene. |
Actually, there is something to "women's intuition" or so my consumer behavior/psych type classes tell me, though it often has more to do with a desire to communicate. Men tend to get very different intuition and it's not often the kind that needs to be communicated, just acted upon. I must be tired because I can't remember which of my classes this was for, but last Spring we watched a video where they had boys and girls at various ages, 4-5 9-10, etc respond to the same situations and almost invariably the girls acted one way and the boys acted a different way. It's not better or worse to be one or the other, it's just what it was, which could be genetics, conditioning, or even more likely - both.
But back on topic, I can understand the discomfort that may have come from the situation. No need to beat anyone into the ground over it, no need to figure much out - I just think the whole scenario seemed rather odd. I'm totally in Alex's corner with this one - it was asked entirely in the wrong order. Maybe it didn't warrant walking out, but... it is what it is. On the other hand, I prefer €'s analysis... I like caffeinated illicit sex. Or whatever that was. All I saw was sex. And illicit. |
Are you sure the offer of good deed came from a young college student and not a christmas woodland creature? If the latter, I think you chose wisely.
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Christmas Woodland Creature?
Whale day! |
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Well, nobody offered to buy me a starbucks this morning. However, a nice gentleman held the door open for me.
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:( Oh well! |
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Too bad you don't live down here - I'd treat you to a prettyful peppermint mocha. |
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No Peet's near the office, sorry to report. |
I happened to read the starbucks cup today, they've got a "promotion" called Pass the Cheer. Offer to buy the drink of the person behind you. Or the retelling of a story, to inspire cheer and paying it forward, or backwards.
Wonder if this is what the college student was all about? Quote:
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If everyone paid for the drink for the person behind them...then everyone paid for a drink. Don't you love it when it's all in our heads?
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Except for the last person in line.
I have to also think such a promotion is good for the tip jar. "Hi! I'm a great and caring person so I'd like to take this drive-thru opportunity to buy the drink of the next person in line. Here is $5 for that." Next person orders: "Hi, I'd like a small drip coffee!" Cashier: "That's $1.25 but the car that just left paid for your drink" followed by sound of $3.75 going in tip jar. |
I thought of that, too. Perhaps that's why the "college boy" asked "what are you drinking?".
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I have to admit that the woman in front of me in line this morning offered to pay for my peppermint mocha, being as she has seen me order it a million times before (we're on the same schedule)
and as I started to say "thats sweet, sure" I thought of Helen, and had to decline. I was so mortified that I was about to say yes, when one of the people I admire said no. I think I hate the giving spirit of the holiday season. |
This thread is interesting. I am one of those who will buy a cup of coffee for the person behind me but I do it year round if I have the cash to spare. I hate to feel that I am putting people on the spot or making them uncomfortable.
Ponine, did you have a bad feeling about what she was offering? |
I think this should only happen in the Drive-Thru line so everyone can remain anonymous. ;)
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So I walked into a Starbuck's this morning, and I said to the assembled throng,
"Your morning drinks are on me." Everyone cheered, and I was carried on their shoulders to the front of the line. And then I added, "Except I'm not actually going to buy your drinks, but I am going to donate the value of your drink to a charity of my choice. You should all go about your business now. Without coffee, to be sure, but with an unexpected sense of fulfillment and appreciation for the beauty of human nature." Needless to say, I was immediately dropped to the floor and swiftly beaten to death for my presumption. Or would have been if this had actually happened. And rightfully so. |
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I wonder if I could buy a coffee in the drive thru and say the guy behind me is paying for my drink
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So the very next time I went into that Starbucks...
(which would be this morning, a couple of Saturdays later) I order my usual tall nonfat decaf latte. The barista realizes she's made it high octane. Wait while I make you another, she says.
"Oh, I'll just take the one you made. It's not a big deal," I say. The barista offers to make me a decaf nonfat latte and give me the latte she already made - two lattes for the price of one. "No thanks," I say. I don't need two lattes. "I'll just take the one you already made. It's not a big deal." Upshot: the barista gave me a card for whatever my little heart desires next trip to Starbucks. Who knew this being nice thing really works?! |
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Haha.
Glad you had a good experience :) |
I've had that happen to me before. I've also been the recipient of an oops drink. The barista usually just asks, "would you like this?" It was great.
The barista at my mom's Starbucks makes fantastic gingerbread chai latte. Yum! |
Why is it worthy of note that the barista offered to give you what you had ordered and let you keep what you hadn't ordered rather than setting it aside to pass off to the next sucker?
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It floored me that she said anything. Many Americans bemoan the death of customer service. As far as I can tell, it never existed in this part of rural Wisconsin due to a confluence of cultural and economic factors. For a merchant to not operate in a cocoon of apathy is of note. You know the story about the English stationer who carries newspapers, cards, and letter paper but not pens or pencils? Fifty times a day, someone comes in and asks to buy a pen. "We don't do pens, sir," is always the answer, with a yawn thrown in. It's like that here. I'm glad the local Starbucks hasn't succumbed yet. |
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You need to keep visiting that Starbucks for freebies. |
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One often reads how the same personal injury is likely to yield far lower damage awards in midwestern communities than in coastal urban communities. This is commonly attributed to midwestern sturdiness and a culture that doesn't bray about entitlements but has a greater appreciation for life's pitfalls. Since, in the customer service context, supply typically follows demand, your take suggests to me that it's not sturdiness at all, but a pathological form of tightlipped Norwegian-bachelor-farmer shyt eating that prevents one from demanding even what one is indisputably due. |
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It just seems like common sense to offer to a.) remake the drink, b.) offer the "oops" drink and c.) offer a free drink, etc. for their next visit. |
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More than 1,000 Starbucks patrons treat next in line at Washington Starbucks store
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I've decided that skillet, mallet and pie don't quite do this well-intentioned madness justice. Thus, a new category: seltzer.
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I like the new Starbucks commercials. I think they're cute.
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I had a Starbucks hot chocolate today. It wasn't all that good. It wasn't bad, it was just, eh.
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