A Prop 8 challenge for swankers - Page 7

MouseWife · 10-21-2008, 09:17 PM

I've heard that commercial.

It is twisting something that happened. I really doubt that they aimed to teach that, kids aren't necessarily taught marriage, they are taught family. Perhaps one of the students has gay parents or had a question about it. Perhaps that child lives in a home where they make everything voodoo.

I don't buy that b.s. commercial. And, the way they say 'It really happened!'

And, thanks about the news about the signs.

I need to find where to go locally. I hear that you can pick up Obama shirts there....

Not Afraid · 10-21-2008, 09:25 PM

I simply cannot understand why anyone is for Prop. 8. No one is taking away the rights of churches. Churches can believe and accept whatever they want to believe and accept. Church is a choice.

Gay couples already adopt or have children, raise families, have their own children, buy property together - share everything that a married couple also share with any of the other legal benefits a married couple. Why shouldn't they have the same legal protection that other people do?

Marriage is a generic term shared by people both religious who care to marry in a sacred ceremony and those who simply want the many benefits that a married couple enjoy since they are already joined in a partnership. Why would anyone have an objection to these benefits:

joint parenting, adoption,foster care, custody, and visitation (including non-biological parents);
status as next-of-kin for hospital visits and medical decisions where one partner is too ill to be competent;
joint insurance policies for home, auto and health;
dissolution and divorce protections such as community property and child support;
immigration and residency for partners from other countries;
inheritance automatically in the absence of a will;
joint leases with automatic renewal rights in the event one partner dies or leaves the house or apartment;
inheritance of jointly-owned real and personal property through the right of survivorship (which avoids the time and expense and taxes in probate);
benefits such as annuities, pension plans, Social Security, and Medicare;
spousal exemptions to property tax increases upon the death of one partner who is a co-owner of the home;
veterans' discounts on medical care, education, and home loans; joint filing of tax returns;
joint filing of customs claims when traveling;
wrongful death benefits for a surviving partner and children;
bereavement or sick leave to care for a partner or child;
decision-making power with respect to whether a deceased partner will be cremated or not and where to bury him or her;
crime victims' recovery benefits;

More here (I think I have posted this before)

I haven't gotten into any arguments over Prop 8 and it is unlikely that will happen too often in Long Beach - although I have seen a few Yes on 8 signs.

Yes on 8 just doesn't make sense.

Ghoulish Delight · 10-21-2008, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not Afraid

I simply cannot understand

Fear, hate, prejudice, and lies.

Not Afraid · 10-21-2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

Fear, hate, prejudice, and lies.

What is this - the middle ages?

Cadaverous Pallor · 10-21-2008, 10:06 PM

I had a coworker say she couldn't decide how to vote on it. She said she thinks gov't should stay out of marriage. I said well, then vote no. She said she just couldn't pick and abstained on that one, and had already mailed her ballot.

She's such a nice person too, but man, am I livid.

I brought it up with another coworker because now I feel stupid for not talking about it sooner. Hopefully I can sway him, he seems kind of on the fence about it too.

Morrigoon · 10-21-2008, 10:15 PM

My standpoint is, I prefer an abstention to a Yes. Abstaining doesn't directly help gay marriage, but remembering that every yes vote requires an extra no vote to counter it, eliminating yeses will help the cause indirectly.

For people who can't be convinced to vote No, I'll settle for eliminating their yes by convincing them to abstain.

BarTopDancer · 10-21-2008, 10:19 PM

I'm so excited! I managed to convince one of my 'going to vote yes based upon the word marriage' co-workers that marriage is a verb these days, and allowing same-sex marriage isn't going to do anything to weaken her marriage. She thought about it over the weekend, and decided that she couldn't take away the rights of her Aunt. She voted no. Her husband couldn't get away from the term marriage and voted yes. She tried to convince him otherwise, but he just couldn't get around the term. If it was to allow marriage benefits and to call them civil unions (for everyone) he would have voted no.

I also made my own NO on 8 signs. Using the actual design of the signs I added white space and the verbiage "Please don't take away the rights of my friends". I'm going to make a few more "Don't Hate. Don't Discriminate" and if I'm feeling ornery "Can I vote on your right to marry?" and "marriage should be protected from the 'straights'. Brittany anyone? How about Madonna? Or McCain and his affair?".

Not Afraid · 10-21-2008, 10:43 PM

Why do I find it funny that Madonna - a fag hag if there ever is one - is being used to mock straight marriage.

Morrigoon · 10-21-2008, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarTopDancer

I'm so excited! I managed to convince one of my 'going to vote yes based upon the word marriage' co-workers that marriage is a verb these days, and allowing same-sex marriage isn't going to do anything to weaken her marriage. She thought about it over the weekend, and decided that she couldn't take away the rights of her Aunt. She voted no. Her husband couldn't get away from the term marriage and voted yes. She tried to convince him otherwise, but he just couldn't get around the term. If it was to allow marriage benefits and to call them civil unions (for everyone) he would have voted no.

I also made my own NO on 8 signs. Using the actual design of the signs I added white space and the verbiage "Please don't take away the rights of my friends". I'm going to make a few more "Don't Hate. Don't Discriminate" and if I'm feeling ornery "Can I vote on your right to marry?" and "marriage should be protected from the 'straights'. Brittany anyone? How about Madonna? Or McCain and his affair?".

Visible mojo, BTD!

BarTopDancer · 10-21-2008, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not Afraid

Why do I find it funny that Madonna - a fag hag if there ever is one - is being used to mock straight marriage.

I'm naming public figures out who probably don't have type of marriage that the Yes on 8 people are thinking of when they say protect marriage. Doesn't matter that she's a hag. They want to protect traditional family values. Madonna is anything but traditional.

Hetero's have done a great job of making a mockery out of the "institute of marriage". Divorce rate is around 50%.

10-21-2008, 09:17 PM	#61
MouseWife Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Da' Beach Posts: 2,957	I've heard that commercial. It is twisting something that happened. I really doubt that they aimed to teach that, kids aren't necessarily taught marriage, they are taught family. Perhaps one of the students has gay parents or had a question about it. Perhaps that child lives in a home where they make everything voodoo. I don't buy that b.s. commercial. And, the way they say 'It really happened!' And, thanks about the news about the signs. I need to find where to go locally. I hear that you can pick up Obama shirts there.... __________________ Summa' time....when the livins' easy.........
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10-21-2008, 09:25 PM	#62
Not Afraid HI! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 17,108	I simply cannot understand why anyone is for Prop. 8. No one is taking away the rights of churches. Churches can believe and accept whatever they want to believe and accept. Church is a choice. Gay couples already adopt or have children, raise families, have their own children, buy property together - share everything that a married couple also share with any of the other legal benefits a married couple. Why shouldn't they have the same legal protection that other people do? Marriage is a generic term shared by people both religious who care to marry in a sacred ceremony and those who simply want the many benefits that a married couple enjoy since they are already joined in a partnership. Why would anyone have an objection to these benefits: joint parenting, adoption,foster care, custody, and visitation (including non-biological parents); status as next-of-kin for hospital visits and medical decisions where one partner is too ill to be competent; joint insurance policies for home, auto and health; dissolution and divorce protections such as community property and child support; immigration and residency for partners from other countries; inheritance automatically in the absence of a will; joint leases with automatic renewal rights in the event one partner dies or leaves the house or apartment; inheritance of jointly-owned real and personal property through the right of survivorship (which avoids the time and expense and taxes in probate); benefits such as annuities, pension plans, Social Security, and Medicare; spousal exemptions to property tax increases upon the death of one partner who is a co-owner of the home; veterans' discounts on medical care, education, and home loans; joint filing of tax returns; joint filing of customs claims when traveling; wrongful death benefits for a surviving partner and children; bereavement or sick leave to care for a partner or child; decision-making power with respect to whether a deceased partner will be cremated or not and where to bury him or her; crime victims' recovery benefits; More here (I think I have posted this before) I haven't gotten into any arguments over Prop 8 and it is unlikely that will happen too often in Long Beach - although I have seen a few Yes on 8 signs. Yes on 8 just doesn't make sense.
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10-21-2008, 10:06 PM	#65
Cadaverous Pallor ohhhh baby Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Parental Bliss Posts: 12,364	I had a coworker say she couldn't decide how to vote on it. She said she thinks gov't should stay out of marriage. I said well, then vote no. She said she just couldn't pick and abstained on that one, and had already mailed her ballot. She's such a nice person too, but man, am I livid. I brought it up with another coworker because now I feel stupid for not talking about it sooner. Hopefully I can sway him, he seems kind of on the fence about it too. __________________ The second star to the right shines in the night for you
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10-21-2008, 10:15 PM	#66
Morrigoon I throw stones at houses Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Location: Location Posts: 9,534	My standpoint is, I prefer an abstention to a Yes. Abstaining doesn't directly help gay marriage, but remembering that every yes vote requires an extra no vote to counter it, eliminating yeses will help the cause indirectly. For people who can't be convinced to vote No, I'll settle for eliminating their yes by convincing them to abstain. __________________ http://bash.org/?top "It is useless for sheep to pass a resolution in favor of vegetarianism while wolves remain of a different opinion." -- William Randolph Inge
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10-21-2008, 10:19 PM	#67
BarTopDancer Prepping... Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Here, there, everywhere Posts: 11,405	I'm so excited! I managed to convince one of my 'going to vote yes based upon the word marriage' co-workers that marriage is a verb these days, and allowing same-sex marriage isn't going to do anything to weaken her marriage. She thought about it over the weekend, and decided that she couldn't take away the rights of her Aunt. She voted no. Her husband couldn't get away from the term marriage and voted yes. She tried to convince him otherwise, but he just couldn't get around the term. If it was to allow marriage benefits and to call them civil unions (for everyone) he would have voted no. I also made my own NO on 8 signs. Using the actual design of the signs I added white space and the verbiage "Please don't take away the rights of my friends". I'm going to make a few more "Don't Hate. Don't Discriminate" and if I'm feeling ornery "Can I vote on your right to marry?" and "marriage should be protected from the 'straights'. Brittany anyone? How about Madonna? Or McCain and his affair?". __________________ Spork is the new MacGyver Postcards From My Edge Last edited by BarTopDancer : 10-21-2008 at 10:24 PM.
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10-21-2008, 10:43 PM	#68
Not Afraid HI! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 17,108	Why do I find it funny that Madonna - a fag hag if there ever is one - is being used to mock straight marriage.
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