Societal norms, the Moral Majority and a rant that feels so good

[Not Afraid]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

And another too many of us feel that just because we have judged someone and decided we don't want to interact with them that it is important that this person be told that they've been judged and found lacking.

Well, it may become self-evident when I've decided that a person's actions are "too stupid or their resulting behaviour too obnoxious" in my judgement for me to want to be around them, but I usually will try not to say something overtly - unless a particular situation calls for it.

I agree with what you said about behaviour completely. Everyone lives different types of lifestyles. There are some I agree with and other I do not. I've usually base my negative experience on my own personal experience and not one of a "higher morality". But, usually, it just gets down to people acting like idiots and i judge that I don't want to be around them.

So, judging IS important for me and my sanity. I just don't keep people around me that I judge to be "too stupid". Granted, deeming someone "too stupid" is a pretty indulgent determination, but....that's all I've got to go on.

[Alex]

Hey, by no means am I saying that people are necessarily good at judging others. Judging does not make one right. But we all do it and people have gotten mighty screwed up about what the right way to do it is, primarily by expecting the government to enforce our individual views on what proper behavior is. Also, the scope has gotten out of whack.

Somehow we have turned it around to where it is more acceptable to judge private behavior than public behavior.

I'm a very judgmental person, I just don't think my judgments should carry much weight with other people and simply try to use them to decide how I will live my life.

My problem with most organized religions (and most of the unorganized ones) is their insistence on the existence of a supernatural realm.

[wendybeth]

Perhaps the reason why we see so few examples of correct judging is that the only correct way to do so is to refrain from doing so.


Did that make any sense? Lol- the cold meds are kicking in!

[Prudence]

I don't necessarily think that judging is wrong, but in most cases it needs to be an internal act. I do think that we might benefit, as a society, if more people paid more attention to how others act and what consequences follow from those actions. Perhaps if more people noted that Action A tends to lead to Negative Consequence B there would be fewer people participting in Action A.

However, as I noted, that is in most cases appropriate as an internal exercise. I can observe Action A and evaluate it silently to myself. I can discuss Action A with my spouse back home later. And if I had children and if they happened to see Action A, it would be a really good idea to discuss that later as part of their education.

Baring any immediate threat to life or property, however, there is likely no need for me to approach those participating Action A and tell them that I don't approve. They neither need nor want my approval, and while I'm busy sticking my nose in, someone else is observing the negative consequences of my actions and making notes to tell their family later.

[Scrooge McSam]

Dammit Prudence.... This place doesn't make enough mojo for you to keep posting like this.

[Alex]

To refrain from judging is to have a life with no boundaries.

Is it wrong to stop hanging out with Bob because he's cheating on his wife? That's judgement. Is it wrong to not let your son spend the night at Greg's house, because Greg sells pot at school? That's judgement.

The only right way, in my opinion, to judge private behavior in others is through personal behavior of your own. There are two ways to judge public behavior in others: either you behave as you would with private behavior or society collectively decide on civil punishment (as we do with murder, rape, burglary, etc.). My personal libertarian view is that we've expanded societal civil punishment beyond its useful boundaries not just in the public sphere but into the private sphere where it doesn't belong at all.

But I have a strong moral ethic (just not a standard one) and I am constantly judging others by it and choose not to associate with those who fall too far from it. To not judge is to say that there is no such thing as right and wrong. I just say that not everything is a matter of right and wrong.

I don't know what the marital structure is in the OP, so I have no idea whether I think it falls into the category of something I would judge. But probably not.

[Crystal]

SacTown, baby, I Love You!

What happened over the weekend has really left me depressed. The people we've had a falling out with have been friends for many years. The wife became aware of my bi-sexuality, something she heard through the grapevine, and now has a need to put me down and treat me as though I am immoral.She feels the need to "save" me and told me I will regret the choices I have made in my personal life. Personally, I feel it really is none of her business, but because we have been friends for so long, it is really difficult to get past this. She is judging mine and SacTowns entire relationship on this one thing that she disapproves of.

SacTown and I have the strongest marriage of anyone I know. We have been married for 10 years, together for 15, and friends for 20. We are open and honest with each other, committed to our family and have strong morals and family values.We rarely argue, but engage in mature conversation in regards to any differences we may have. It really bothers me that someone who has little knowledge of the intricate workings of our marriage, someone who has enough marital problems of their own, should choose to judge us in this way.

Sorry for the long winded post, but, whew, I feel better already. Thanks!

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

Somehow we have turned it around to where it is more acceptable to judge private behavior than public behavior.

I'm a very judgmental person, I just don't think my judgments should carry much weight with other people and simply try to use them to decide how I will live my life.

Those two statements sum up my feelings exactly. Sure, I have a set of morals that I believe to be "right" that I live my life by, but I apply those morals to myself and do not expext others to abide by them. I definitely think they should, but I certainly am not so arrogant as to think that I've got all the answers and that it's my place to tell others how to live. Especially when it comes to things that are private decissions. If we're talking about public behavior that has some effect on other people, I'm more vocal about my judgement. But even then, at most I'll say my peace once and they can take it or leave it. If they leave it, like Alex, I make MY decission whether whatever it is is something that will keep me from socializing with them. But that's my decission, I don't expect the person to change.

[Scrooge McSam]

Welcome back, GD and CP!!!!!

[blueerica]

Originally Posted by Crystal

It really bothers me that someone who has little knowledge of the intricate workings of our marriage, someone who has enough marital problems of their own, should choose to judge us in this way.

I'm sad to hear that it came from someone you have known and been friends with for such a long time. I don't mean to judge her in return, but chances are, she's so outspoken because of her own insecurities in her marriage. When you can't lash out at yourself, lash out at the nearest person.

Sorry for the long winded post, but, whew, I feel better already. Thanks!

Should we all be so lucky to have a well-working marriage such as yours & Sac's !!!