The random political thoughts thread (Part Deux)

[LSPoorEeyorick]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

Well, the words say "Uneducated people end up in the military." I'd like to know what the offense in that statement is.

Yes, I've been waiting for that answer for several days. My conclusion is that they're reading it into the statement.

[Nephythys]

Maybe because there are plenty of "uneducated" people who do not choose the military- and there are plenty of people in the military who have a greater education than some in the private sector. To imply that choosing the military meant you had no choice because you are too uneducated to know any better or choose any better is insulting.

There are options outside the military-

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by Nephythys

To imply that choosing the military meant you had no choice because you are too uneducated to know any better or choose any better is insulting.

Once again, that's NOT what the statement said, that's what people have read into it. It did NOT say "If you choose the military, you're uneducate." It said "If you're uneducated, the military is nearly your only option." You may decide it IMPLIES that, but let's try sticking to the actual statement he made instead.

Maybe because there are plenty of "uneducated" people who do not choose the military

Two-thirds of people who take the ASQT don't pass. And of the 1/3 that pass, some portion never make it into active duty. So yes, there are a large number who do not choose military, though not for lack of trying. And of those that don't choose military, most of them don't make a living wage. So, to updated the claim a bit, people unable to succeed in the education system are left with little viable option that will net them a livable earning beyond applying for military service.

[SacTown Chronic]

Link

A school bus driver fired after she reportedly made an obscene gesture at President Bush has filed a union grievance in an attempt to get her job back.

The 43-year-old driver, whose name was not released, was driving middle school children back to school after a zoo visit on June 16 when the president and Republican Rep. Dave Reichert drove slowly by in a motorcade.

From the bus, the children waved; with the windows down in their car, Bush and Reichert waved back.

That's when the driver gave the president the finger, according to Reichert and Issaquah superintendent Janet Barry.

"The congressman hadn't seen it, but the president turned to him and said, 'That one's not a fan,'" said Reichert spokeswoman Kimberly Cadena.

"That one's not a fan" Nice one, Mr. Bush.

"The bus driver was not terminated for making an obscene gesture at the president. The bus driver was terminated for making an obscene gesture in view of the students," Niegowski said. "That's not the role modeling we need for our students."

[innerSpaceman]

I have to say that, now I've heard a bit more of what was said immediately BEFORE the too-quoted comment-of-death, soldiers were not the subject of the sentence at all.

Show me where in the sentence he mentions soldiers? Why did people assume he was talking about the education of potential soldiers, when his prior sentence reveals he was talking about Bush's education, and about George W. StupidAss Bush getting stuck in Iraq?

The assumption that he was talking about soldiers or students who might become soldiers was made up out of whole cloth. Almost any sentence taken out of its context can be alleged to be about anything. If I use the word "you" in a sentence and only my previous sentence revealed who "you" was, any hack could present my second sentence and claim the "you" was anyone.

So, I hereby revise my earlier opinion. I was misinformed and led to believe Kerry was taking about No Child Left Behind. Um, he wasn't. From what I've read of the more complete remarks, he was talking about George W. Bush, and it was Bush who is "stuck in Iraq" - a phrase which applies to soldiers, true ... but is perfectly applicable to the President of the U.S.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

So, I hereby revise my earlier opinion. I was misinformed and led to believe Kerry was taking about No Child Left Behind. Um, he wasn't. From what I've read of the more complete remarks, he was talking about George W. Bush, and it was Bush who is "stuck in Iraq" - a phrase which applies to soldiers, true ... but is perfectly applicable to the President of the U.S.

Yes, that I believe is true. Basically, there are 3 things going on.

1) He was talking about Bush and the speech was written to specifically mention Bush in that line, he screwed it up

2) The way he read it, it COULD reasonably have been interpreted as "If you fail at school, you'll end up in the military." That's been what I've been talking to, choosing to ignore the manufactured outrage and discus what I found to be an interesting side topic unintentially breached by the misstatement. Even assuming he did really mean (or Freudianly mean) it as spoken, to me that's the "worst" interpretation of the joke. That got me thinking of No Child Left Behind and how it was tailored to steer more and more youth towards military service.

3) Opponents of Kerry took a false logical leap and decided that "Bad students end up in the military" is the same as "Everyone in the military is uneducated/stupid." Thus, outrage.

So, there you have it.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

I have to say that, now I've heard a bit more of what was said immediately BEFORE the too-quoted comment-of-death, soldiers were not the subject of the sentence at all.

Was it only three days ago that I pointed out the same thing? With linkies? It seems so long ago now.

See post 1599. And relive the future of today.

[innerSpaceman]

Hmmm, no links in your post 1599, but I believe you if you say you provided this information previously. Sometimes I skim these threads that get my blood boiling, so as to keep my cystolic within healthy range.

Sorry if I missed it.


I'm back now.

[Gn2Dlnd]

^ Oh, oops. It was a quote, not a link. But the quote was from the link in Nephythys' OP #1595.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Originally Posted by Nephythys

I have every right to be as hostile about what I consider vile politics as you do- because I have seen plenty of nasty comments from you about conservative politics.

No, you haven't.

Having just scanned through my 1,186 posts, I'm unable to find the nasty comments to which you refer. I've ridiculed the preznit's bad grammar. I've spoken up about anti-gay bias. I've ranted about willful misrepresentation of facts (Disney's Path to 9/11, John Kerry). I've railed against the mismanagement of the Katrina disaster, and I've called Tucker Carlson a dick. None of which rise to the level of "Kerry is a fvckin idiot who can't take responsiblity for his own words. Yeah you doofus- it's a Republican smear to point out that you are an insulting gasbag. God he is loathsome."

Please do not misrepresent me. Please do not willfully misinterpret what I post. Please don't think it's clever to use my negative characterization of your behavior on the board in your sig line, it's not. Last of all, I will not put you on ignore, nor will I play "cute board feud" with you. The importance of addressing the outrageous things you post far outweighs the irritation I experience in doing so.