The random political thoughts thread (Part Deux)

[Morrigoon]

I'm glad Obama won. I hate Hillary. Also, I have to admit being very impressed with the speech he gave last night. I know it's the usual political speechwriter stuff, but I admit to being somewhat swayed by how "presidential" he managed to appear last night. If we must have a democrat for president, I supposed I'd prefer him.

Very disappointed with Giuliani's failure to show. I'm not sure his campaign can really afford to focus on the large states at the expense of the small. Especially with the very first primary. He runs the risk of not being taken seriously by the media.

[Moonliner]

Originally Posted by Morrigoon

Very disappointed with Giuliani's failure to show. I'm not sure his campaign can really afford to focus on the large states at the expense of the small. Especially with the very first primary. He runs the risk of not being taken seriously by the media.

Giuliani took a pass on both Iowa and NH. If South Carolina and Florida don't go his way then you can start to worry.

[Morrigoon]

I know that's his strategy, but I think it will backfire. SC and FL don't exist in a bubble... those people are likely to be affected by his failure to show in the previous states.

[BarTopDancer]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Obama doesn't seem to care and will do things that I think will hurt the country because he thinks they'll be the right thing to do.

Can you elaborate?

Because right now I'm thinking of Bush, Iraq v2.0, the housing market, oil prices, impending recession.... because he thought it was the right thing to do.

[Strangler Lewis]

Originally Posted by blueerica

I am really not liking anyone this "political season," but I am happy that Obama won. I like how he used to talk, even if he's now moved to the stupid Jesse Jackson emphasizing-first-and-last-words style of speech. There's something about it that turns my stomach... not so much that his speeches come off that way, but that they didn't used to. Alas, doing stuff like that is what politics are all about.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought he sounded "blacker" last night. Much as I like him, and inflections aside, I thought it was a horrible, incoherent speech from an intelligent man.

[scaeagles]

I'm not sure if I should go about defending Bush on these things or not....there is only one thing that is really attributable to Bush in your list

First of all, the surge is working. The mistake is that we didn't surge immediately upon invasion.

Secondly, Bush has nothing to do with the housing market. This was a private banking practice of sub prime loans that irresponsible people used to purchase a house and when the rates went up they couldn't pay.

Oil prices? How is that his fault? Is there something he should be doing to influence OPEC nations to increase production? Or for India and China to reduce their increasing demand? The best thing he could have done is blanketly opposed by dems - drill for domestic oil. But that's not his call either.

Impending recession? What should Bush do to influence the economy? How? Raise taxes? That never spurs economic growth.

Honestly, the only thing there that should be laid at the feet of Bush is Iraq. Disagreement on that point is valid, but on the other points, they are outside his scope of control, and they should be. The problem is that whenever there is a problem everyone expects the government to impose policies and pass laws to solve the problem, and more problems are created by the solution more often than not. It is not the job of the government to fix everything. It is the job of government to stay out of the way. Obama does not share this philosophy, and this is why I don't like him.

I don't currently like most Republicans for the same reason - it isn't just Obama.

[BarTopDancer]

Originally Posted by BarTopDancer

Can you elaborate?

Because right now I'm thinking of Bush, Iraq v2.0, the housing market, oil prices, impending recession.... because he thought it was the right thing to do.

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I'm not sure if I should go about defending Bush on these things or not....there is only one thing that is really attributable to Bush in your list

I was really looking for an elaboration about things that you think Obama will do "because he thinks they are right" that you will take issue with. I don't want to get into a debate about Bush, because we both know we can beat that issue until it's dead and then beat it some more.

[scaeagles]

Obama believes it is right to raise income taxes on "the rich". Problem is that income taxes are a tax on the accumulation of wealth.

Obama wants a universal health care program.

Obama will pull our troops out of Iraq.

I don't trust Obama on foregin policy at all, but can only base my opinion on what he has said about Iran earlier in the campaign. I fear similar mistakes will be made with Iran that Clinton made with North Korea - giving away tech for a false promise of no weapons built, and even beyond that damage, again similar to Clinton with helping the Chinese development missile technology.

[sleepyjeff]

Originally Posted by Morrigoon

Very disappointed with Giuliani's failure to show. I'm not sure his campaign can really afford to focus on the large states at the expense of the small. Especially with the very first primary. He runs the risk of not being taken seriously by the media.

Actually, after seeing what happened to Hillary(who was advised by some of her former handlers to skip Iowa altogether), Rudy might be congratulating himself right about now.

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Honestly, the only thing there that should be laid at the feet of Bush is Iraq. Disagreement on that point is valid, but on the other points, they are outside his scope of control, and they should be. The problem is that whenever there is a problem everyone expects the government to impose policies and pass laws to solve the problem, and more problems are created by the solution more often than not. It is not the job of the government to fix everything. It is the job of government to stay out of the way.

So in short, when it comes to Presidential elections one should not listen to promises regarding domestic issues since Presidents really don't have the ability to deliver....Universal Health Care, immigration reform, even tax cuts are really the domain of congress. We've had 19 years of Republican Presidents(to 12 of Dems) since Roe v Wade and no change there either. Where Presidents have immense power is foreign policy and therefore that is where we should be looking to when choosing a President.

Strip away all the flowery talk and Promises of domestic Nirvana from all of these candidates and one is left with only a couple of gentlemen who are really qualified to be President.....neither of which finished above 4th place last night.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

It is not the job of the government to fix everything. It is the job of government to stay out of the way.

I do not give the government one-third of everything I earn so they can "stay out of the way."