Hollywood's Writers' Strike

[NirvanaMan]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

Umm, huh? Those two statements are kinda contradictory, aren't they? By saying, "Let the market sort it out" you are precisely suggesting that people should be treated as commodities.

No, I'm not at all. I can't even see the correlation. My opinion is quite the opposite in fact.

Unless you are suggesting that the only items traded or dealt with in a free market are commodity goods.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by NirvanaMan

No, I'm not at all. I can't even see the correlation. My opinion is quite the opposite in fact.

Unless you are suggesting that the only items traded or dealt with in a free market are commodity goods.

Perhaps not "commodity" in the strict sense of no quality differentiation, however I dislike the concept of treating people's livelihoods as so much merchandise to be bought and sold at the whim of supply and demand. Sure, an employee may hold a modicum of power in the deal with the ability to walk away for a better deal, however that's not a luxury that everyone can afford and, as I mentioned earlier, industry is becoming more and more consolidated, whittling away options and imbalancing power towards those making the salary decisions. Unionization provides a check against that trend.

[NirvanaMan]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

however I dislike the concept of treating people's livelihoods as so much merchandise to be bought and sold at the whim of supply and demand.

Ah well then this is a point upon which we can most assuredly disagree good sir. I believe in personal responsibility in all things, including the control of ones livelihood. I don't believe it is up to the collective, society, government or unions to protect me or anyone in such things. It is up to the individual to ensure their skills and talents with which they chose to pursue a career are kept fresh and relevant enough to have value to an employer who will compensate them at a level commensurate with the expectations of said individuals lifestyle of choosing.

It's not so much a matter of treating people in such a way as it is in people bettering themselves in the pursuit of happiness be it inner fulfillment or material goods or experiences. Instead of waiting for someone to give you what you feel it is you need or deserve, it is the individuals responsibility to earn it and take it. If that is not an option with your current employer than one should seek alternative options.

Back to the commodity point briefly. I would argue that above most other forces in the employment world, it is unions that commodities individuals. Therefore, the beef should perhaps be with them. The unions don't negotiate on an individuals behalf (though they can defend one in certain proceedings) but rather negotiate and arbitrate for the masses. They roll everyone up to their job title be it writer, Welder I, Chassis Sub-Assembler or what have you. It is precisely this commoditization that in the case of unskilled labor removes the incentive to excel. I don't believe this is necessarily the same case with skilled talent, but the argument could still be made I am quite sure.

[JWBear]

Originally Posted by NirvanaMan

Ah well then this is a point upon which we can most assuredly disagree good sir. I believe in personal responsibility in all things, including the control of ones livelihood. I don't believe it is up to the collective, society, government or unions to protect me or anyone in such things. It is up to the individual to ensure their skills and talents with which they chose to pursue a career are kept fresh and relevant enough to have value to an employer who will compensate them at a level commensurate with the expectations of said individuals lifestyle of choosing.

It's not so much a matter of treating people in such a way as it is in people bettering themselves in the pursuit of happiness be it inner fulfillment or material goods or experiences. Instead of waiting for someone to give you what you feel it is you need or deserve, it is the individuals responsibility to earn it and take it. If that is not an option with your current employer than one should seek alternative options.

Back to the commodity point briefly. I would argue that above most other forces in the employment world, it is unions that commodities individuals. Therefore, the beef should perhaps be with them. The unions don't negotiate on an individuals behalf (though they can defend one in certain proceedings) but rather negotiate and arbitrate for the masses. They roll everyone up to their job title be it writer, Welder I, Chassis Sub-Assembler or what have you. It is precisely this commoditization that in the case of unskilled labor removes the incentive to excel. I don't believe this is necessarily the same case with skilled talent, but the argument could still be made I am quite sure.

With all due respect, hogwash!

Companies nowadays want one thing, the cheapest labor they can find. They have no interest, whatsoever, in your personal fulfillment. Having the proper skills and talents, no matter how up to date they are, will not guarantee good wages for you if there is someone who can do it for less pay. Corporations don’t give a damn about their employees, only profit.

Unions aren’t perfect, but they are a hell of a sight better than giving in to the mega corps, and becoming the virtual slaves they would have us be.

[Kevy Baby]

Originally Posted by JWBear

Companies nowadays want one thing, the cheapest labor they can find. They have no interest, whatsoever, in your personal fulfillment. Having the proper skills and talents, no matter how up to date they are, will not guarantee good wages for you if there is someone who can do it for less pay. Corporations don’t give a damn about their employees, only profit.

With all due respect, hogwash!

I deal with FAR too many people whose only interest is to see how little they can get away with in their jobs. Far too few people are held personally responsible. And I believe that this is MUCH truer on the employee level than it is on the upper management level.

I have experienced very few people who, when they make an effort to make themselves valuable to their employers, are not compensated. Just showing up is not of value to an employer - actually using your brain is. No, it is not a guarantee, but it is certainly gives one a MUCH higher probability of success. In the industry I am in (the printing industry: one of the largest in terms of sales volume in the US and the world), there is and has been a severe shortage of skilled employees. Consequently, the people who DO have the skills in their respective fields are well compensated. Those who chose to not keep their skills up-to-date are finding themselves making less and having a harder time finding work.

The laws on the books today are very much to the benefit of the employee. The employer is so handcuffed today, it makes it extremely difficult to "abuse" an employee in any way.

Most employees don't give a crap about their employers. They would leave at the first chance they got.

Would you pay the same price for a lower quality item?
Would you take a job that pays less if everything else is the same?