Yes, we can. - Page 33

NirvanaMan · 02-20-2008, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

Well, you just said above that the President does not have much power, and I agree. To me, it's a figurehead job. And so symboligy is an important element to me.

I was hoping someone was going to point that out. I was expecting it to be GD and expecting it to be done so in a harsh tone, but just happy that someone bothers reading my ramblings just the same.

Alex · 02-20-2008, 06:38 PM

If the president is just a figurehead then what is the point of hating the current one since he can't possibly be responsible for any of the things you hate?

scaeagles · 02-20-2008, 06:49 PM

Indeed, Alex. But I regard the President as much more than a figurehead. The power of the veto, submission of budgets, commander in chief, major director of foreign policy....these are all powerful things.

NirvanaMan · 02-20-2008, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

If the president is just a figurehead then what is the point of hating the current one since he can't possibly be responsible for any of the things you hate?

Burn!!!!

lashbear · 02-20-2008, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NirvanaMan

I only want a President that will do two things:

Let me keep my own money
Let me keep my guns (or right to own them)

You bastards! Leave those money and gun caches were you found 'em.

Fine !! Vote for Charlton Heston.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NirvanaMan

One would likely need to have middle class folks employed in a large corporation

*waves Paw at NirvanaMan*

Not Afraid · 02-20-2008, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NirvanaMan

His VP and supporters can run under the slogan "You can do it, we can help."

There are quite a few marting campaign slogans that could be absconded for use by politics. There's a reason they're both called campaigns - it's just a bunch of marketing (which is why I am also very jaded - I see the marketing as too obvious).

How about:

You're in good hands with Obama
Just do it.
We try harder
I'd rather fight than switch. (McCain, perhaps?)
We've come a long way, baby.
Try it, you'll like it.
Think outside the box

Or, "With a name like Clinton, it has to be good"

Strangler Lewis · 02-20-2008, 07:36 PM

Since we've had any number of president-led military actions since World War II without a formal congressional declaration of war, I don't see how it can be said that the President is a figurehead.

innerSpaceman · 02-20-2008, 08:07 PM

As I've elaborated before, I think the figurehead status is in relation to domestic issues. Oh, I believe the Administration can have a big influence on Congress, and good use of the bully pulpit can be very powerful to the populace.

But I mostly think the power of the president lies in foreign affairs. So once I've determined that neither candidate A nor B will be Atilla the Hun, I don't much care which one wins. Hence, i pick the girl.

Cadaverous Pallor · 02-20-2008, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scaeagles

CP, are you suggesting that you don't want all aspects of Obama discussed here? If so, I'll step out, because i am not an Obama enthusiast.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevy Baby

Sorry if I took away from your thread - it was not my intention. I tried to focus on responding to some things being said here and once it stopped; I stopped.

Sorry for the hijack.

Eh, no worries. I knew when I started it that my "hey who digs Obama" thread would shortly become "let's post our disparate political views in a show of supposed debate but no one persuades anyone else" which I still dislike. Even as I am enthused about this race, I continue to stay out of political threads (oh wait, there's just one, and now this one, of course) so excuse me if I don't do much "debating".

Quote:

Originally Posted by mousepod

But if he's the candidate, here's the kind of thing that will make me worried...

clip from Chris Matthews' Hardball.

News flash - one idiot didn't do his homework for a freakin' interview.

I looked at the usual sources -Thomas etal - but I found this very cool site that compiles all sorts of data.

Clinton:

Quote:

Statistics: Hillary Clinton has sponsored 354 bills since Jan 22, 2001, of which 307 haven't made it out of committee (Extremely Poor) and 2 were successfully enacted (Average, relative to peers). Clinton has co-sponsored 1723 bills during the same time period (Average, relative to peers).

Obama:

Quote:

Statistics: Barack Obama has sponsored 129 bills since Jan 4, 2005, of which 120 haven't made it out of committee (Poor) and 1 were successfully enacted (Average, relative to peers). Obama has co-sponsored 545 bills during the same time period (Average, relative to peers).

The reason they did so "poorly" was due to being in the minority party. All of the site's wording aside - You mean to tell me that during all those years of experience, she didn't do much more than he did?

Quote:

Originally Posted by NirvanaMan

I only want a President that will do two things:

Let me keep my own money
Let me keep my guns (or right to own them)

<snip>

But, I have to vote cause well, I can't complain if I don't.

You're where I was after the Contract with America fell apart. All you can do is vote Libertarian, because they're the only ones that agree with you. Everyone else wants your money for one reason or another. Have fun, I know I did.

Not Afraid · 02-20-2008, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cadaverous Pallor

Clinton:Obama:The reason they did so "poorly" was due to being in the minority party. All of the site's wording aside - You mean to tell me that during all those years of experience, she didn't do much more than he did?

By "all those years of experience" you mean the 4 years Clinton was a Senat orbefore Obama became one?

02-20-2008, 06:38 PM	#322
Alex . Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,354	If the president is just a figurehead then what is the point of hating the current one since he can't possibly be responsible for any of the things you hate?
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02-20-2008, 06:49 PM	#323
scaeagles I LIKE! Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 7,819	Indeed, Alex. But I regard the President as much more than a figurehead. The power of the veto, submission of budgets, commander in chief, major director of foreign policy....these are all powerful things.
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02-20-2008, 07:36 PM	#327
Strangler Lewis Doing The Job Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In a state Posts: 3,956	Since we've had any number of president-led military actions since World War II without a formal congressional declaration of war, I don't see how it can be said that the President is a figurehead. __________________ Live now-pay later. Diner's Club!
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02-20-2008, 08:07 PM	#328
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	As I've elaborated before, I think the figurehead status is in relation to domestic issues. Oh, I believe the Administration can have a big influence on Congress, and good use of the bully pulpit can be very powerful to the populace. But I mostly think the power of the president lies in foreign affairs. So once I've determined that neither candidate A nor B will be Atilla the Hun, I don't much care which one wins. Hence, i pick the girl.
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