Tom Delay: Political hack, or nutjob? You decide.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

Originally Posted by Nephythys

I just love it when we can call someone who believes Christianity is the only way as a nut.

I wish Leo was here- I would like to hear his opinion, whatever it is.

Now, now. I don't think that believing that Christianity is the best way for someone to operate is bad. I am a Christian (a cafeteria Catholic) and I believe it is the best way for me to operate. Nobody's calling me a nutjob. Well, maybe they are, but probably not regarding that.

I have trouble with anybody declaring that their religious practices are the only way. "Definitive," I believe he said. Religion, by definition, is based on a faith. No definitive answer can come from it, only ideas and things one *believes.*

There are very valid life questions answered by all kinds of religions. Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Paganism... those are a small portion, but I have known friends who practice all of those who've garnered strength and 'answers' (which, really, are just things you figure out for yourself with the guidance of the people and influences around you) from their respective choice of religion. Imagine if you were born into a different culture than your own. You'd likely feel the same sense of loyalty to the set of traditions into which you were born. Knowing that, how can anyone say that one is better than the other?

I'd even go as far as to say that one can garner strength and get answers without religion. One of the kindest, most integretive people I know lives his life with empathy for the people, animals-- planet-- around him. He acts with more 'Christian' behavior than, frankly, I do. And he doesn't believe in a higher power. That's what works for him. I don't begrudge him a system that works for him simply because my own system is different. I'm just glad that he's the man he is.

Believing in Christianity? That's one thing. Believing it's a definitive answer? That's negating its very nature as a religion. Why else do you think there are so many songs and psalms and verses about *faith*?

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by Prudence

IAnd moral codes can vary widely even within a group such as, say, Christians.

Exactly, so how does that make it "definitive" if no one can even agree on what it is?

[Prudence]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

Exactly, so how does that make it "definitive" if no one can even agree on what it is?

It could be definitive for the individual; it's the application to a group that's problematic.

[Name]

Ladies and gentlemen, Christianity offers the only viable, reasonable, definitive answer to the questions of 'Where did I come from?' 'Why am I here?' 'Where am I going?' 'Does life have any meaningful purpose?' " DeLay said. "Only Christianity offers a way to understand that physical and moral border. Only Christianity offers a comprehensive worldview that covers all areas of life and thought, every aspect of creation. Only Christianity offers a way to live in response to the realities that we find in this world -- only Christianity.

I would say the nutjob aspect comes from the implied idea that christianity is the only answer and will save the world....I seem to recall another nutjob that has similar views about the muslim faith, he was so radical about it that he had some planes fly into some really tall buildings. I swear, if people were more tolerant of other faiths and thought about it a bit to look at the similarities in them all, the crap that goes on in this world would be greatly diminished.

I will not respond to attacks about this post, the comparing of Delay's comments to Usama are only there to give some perspective to the words uttered by both and the dangers of such idea's. I in no way intend to say that Delay is the same as Usama, however the idea's that other faiths are wrong is a dangerous one and an idea that has us in the predicaments we are in right now.

[LSPoorEeyorick]

Originally Posted by Prudence

It could be definitive for the individual; it's the application to a group that's problematic.

I believe that is what DeLay is saying-- that Christianity is definitive for all. "Christianity is the only... answer." That's a closed-minded statement, in my estimation.

[BarTopDancer]

Originally Posted by Nephythys

I just love it when we can call someone who believes Christianity is the only way as a nut.

I wish Leo was here- I would like to hear his opinion, whatever it is.

Food for thought:

Ladies and gentlemen, Judisim offers the only viable, reasonable, definitive answer to the questions of 'Where did I come from?' 'Why am I here?' 'Where am I going?' 'Does life have any meaningful purpose?' " DeLay said. "Only Judisim offers a way to understand that physical and moral border. Only Judisim offers a comprehensive worldview that covers all areas of life and thought, every aspect of creation. Only Judisim offers a way to live in response to the realities that we find in this world -- only Judisim.

OR

Ladies and gentlemen, Islam offers the only viable, reasonable, definitive answer to the questions of 'Where did I come from?' 'Why am I here?' 'Where am I going?' 'Does life have any meaningful purpose?' " DeLay said. "Only Islam offers a way to understand that physical and moral border. Only Islam offers a comprehensive worldview that covers all areas of life and thought, every aspect of creation. Only Islam offers a way to live in response to the realities that we find in this world -- only Islam.

As you can see I replaced "Christaniaty" with 2 other religions. Now would he be a nutjob or entitled to his views?

Imagine for a moment that our President and the Congressional majority were Orthodox Jews. They kept Kosher. Now imagine them outlawing the consumption of pork, shell fish and other non-Kosher food based upon their religion. Sure, he has the choice to just not partake in the consumption of said food but instead they decide that the rest of the country should not be allowed to parktake in the consumption of pork and other non-Kosher food because it's against the religion of the people in charge of the country.

What would you do? I highly doubt people would sit by quietly and let this happen. Would they be anti-Semetic? Would they be anti-Judisim? Or would they just be citizens who think the government stepped over the line.

[Prudence]

Originally Posted by LSPoorEeyorick

I believe that is what DeLay is saying-- that Christianity is definitive for all. "Christianity is the only... answer." That's a closed-minded statement, in my estimation.

And I guess I don't have a problem with him believing that. He's welcome to think that his brand of Christianity is the answer -- even the ONLY answer. Neither he nor anyone else is welcome to require me to live as if his or her brand of Christianity was the only answer.

Stated another way -- he's welcome to believe that wearing lederhosen on Thursdays is the only possible way to ensure eternal salvation. He might believe that anyone NOT wearing lederhosen on Thursdays is doomed to burn in the eternal hellfires. That alone wouldn't necessarily prevent him from being a good legislator. But don't expect me to run off now and change into short pants because it's for my own good, dammit.

Besides, I'd look awful in leather shorts. I'll bet they chafe.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by Prudence

And I guess I don't have a problem with him believing that. He's welcome to think that his brand of Christianity is the answer -- even the ONLY answer. Neither he nor anyone else is welcome to require me to live as if his or her brand of Christianity was the only answer.

Welcome to believe that his beliefs are definitive, of course. However, I still think that someone who believes that their own beliefs are definitive has a distorted view of reality. Nevermind that Delay wasn't even talking about his own beliefs, but rather Christianity in a more general sense. Now there's a REAL perception problem if one calls "Christianity" definitive. If no two people can agree in full as to what Christianity teaches, then how can one rightly declare the whole of the religion definitive?

I have my own beliefs, shaped largely by my identity as a Jew. However I'm not so deluded as to think that there is no chance that I'm wrong. I believe I'm right, but that doesn't make it definitive, let alone the only definitive answer.

[mousepod]

The President began this mission with very vague objectives and lots of unanswered questions. A month later, these questions are still unanswered. There are no clarified rules of engagement. There is no timetable. There is no legitimate definition of victory. There is no contingency plan for mission creep. There is no clear funding program. There is no agenda to bolster our overextended military. There is no explanation defining what vital national interests are at stake. There was no strategic plan for war when the President started this thing, and there still is no plan today.
Tom DeLay

Spoiler:

of course, this was him talking about Kosovo in '99. hypocritical nutjob.

[Not Afraid]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

If no two people can agree in full as to what Christianity teaches, then how can one rightly declare the whole of the religion definitive?

Having been raised a basically fundamentalist Christian, I remember distinctly the infighting over beliefs and practices between Christians, Baptists, Methodists, Episcopalians, etc. Do we baptize when born or when the child makes a choice? Do we sprinkle or emerse? On and on it went. There is not ONE WAY - even within Christianity.