Toby Keith - Advocate of lynching? - Page 4

Alex · 08-13-2008, 03:28 PM

Of course, there's also the issue of whether presenting a position in an artwork is the same as advocating the position.

LSPoorEeyorick · 08-13-2008, 03:33 PM

Indeed.

Strangler Lewis · 08-13-2008, 03:39 PM

Maybe. Could somone get away with a song called "Wives Wanted," that had lyrics about how a woman would keep her mouth shut, that talked about how a man could shut it for her without the law getting involved, that had the refrain, "Son, let me tell you why I beat your mother?" Would it make a difference if the song was written by hunky Toby Keith or some widow burner from India?

More seriously, I think the real human phenomenon of misguided yearning can be artistically portrayed. I just don't think the quoted lyrics come anywhere close to it.

Alex · 08-13-2008, 04:00 PM

I don't know. Again there is the question of where the line is between simply showing characters/ideas that are repulsive and actually advocating for those ideas.

I think we have a higher allowance for the former in novels and movies but not so much in representational art or music. I recently ran into this with Wanted. I watch violent movies about assassins and vigilantiism all the time and have no issues but I felt Wanted went a step too far and was trying to convince the audience there was something noble about the motivations (if not the actions) of what had just been shown. Another movie that triggered this response was Four Brothers. But I can watch The Transporter and not be bothered that a criminal life is shown without any opprobrium.

Can such allowances be found in music or is the assumption that all lyrics are autobiographical?

innerSpaceman · 08-13-2008, 04:13 PM

Unfortunately, all a song has to go by is itself. I wont even consider the music video in judging, for myself alone, the intent and theme of the song.

A play, movie or novel has much more to work with ... and not only in terms of time. As such, I tend to cut songs a lot of slack, but I also judge them entirely on their 3 minutes (extra slack included).

I can't judge this particular song just by the lyrics. I'd have to hear the music and the tone of the vocals ... and i simply don't want to.

Kevy Baby · 08-13-2008, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

... and i simply don't want to.

Not a big country music fan?

innerSpaceman · 08-13-2008, 06:28 PM

um, that would be a No.

Not a big lynching fan either .... though, like i said, i'll make an exception for anyone affiliated with a street gang.

CoasterMatt · 08-13-2008, 06:30 PM

What about Mormons?

Kevy Baby · 08-13-2008, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoasterMatt

What about Mormons?

Or them damn Methodists?

BarTopDancer · 08-13-2008, 08:14 PM

I seriously doubt the target audience of this song, or the related movie was the ultra liberal left leaning music listeners. I also doubt it's going to spawn a bunch of lynchings. If someone or someones were going to go lynch someone they probably had the idea long before this song came about.

Actually, I know it didn't spawn a bunch of lynchings. I'm sure we would have heard about it back in 2003 when the song was #1 on the charts for 5 weeks. If it didn't spawn them then, I doubt it's going to spawn them now.

08-13-2008, 03:28 PM	#31
Alex . Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,354	Of course, there's also the issue of whether presenting a position in an artwork is the same as advocating the position.
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08-13-2008, 03:33 PM	#32
LSPoorEeyorick scribblin' Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: in the moment Posts: 3,872	Indeed.
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08-13-2008, 03:39 PM	#33
Strangler Lewis Doing The Job Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In a state Posts: 3,956	Maybe. Could somone get away with a song called "Wives Wanted," that had lyrics about how a woman would keep her mouth shut, that talked about how a man could shut it for her without the law getting involved, that had the refrain, "Son, let me tell you why I beat your mother?" Would it make a difference if the song was written by hunky Toby Keith or some widow burner from India? More seriously, I think the real human phenomenon of misguided yearning can be artistically portrayed. I just don't think the quoted lyrics come anywhere close to it. __________________ Live now-pay later. Diner's Club!
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08-13-2008, 04:00 PM	#34
Alex . Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,354	I don't know. Again there is the question of where the line is between simply showing characters/ideas that are repulsive and actually advocating for those ideas. I think we have a higher allowance for the former in novels and movies but not so much in representational art or music. I recently ran into this with Wanted. I watch violent movies about assassins and vigilantiism all the time and have no issues but I felt Wanted went a step too far and was trying to convince the audience there was something noble about the motivations (if not the actions) of what had just been shown. Another movie that triggered this response was Four Brothers. But I can watch The Transporter and not be bothered that a criminal life is shown without any opprobrium. Can such allowances be found in music or is the assumption that all lyrics are autobiographical?
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08-13-2008, 04:13 PM	#35
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	Unfortunately, all a song has to go by is itself. I wont even consider the music video in judging, for myself alone, the intent and theme of the song. A play, movie or novel has much more to work with ... and not only in terms of time. As such, I tend to cut songs a lot of slack, but I also judge them entirely on their 3 minutes (extra slack included). I can't judge this particular song just by the lyrics. I'd have to hear the music and the tone of the vocals ... and i simply don't want to.
	Submit to Quotes

08-13-2008, 06:28 PM	#37
innerSpaceman Kink of Swank Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Inner Space Posts: 13,075	um, that would be a No. Not a big lynching fan either .... though, like i said, i'll make an exception for anyone affiliated with a street gang.
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08-13-2008, 06:30 PM	#38
CoasterMatt BRAAAAAAAINS! Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: One Step Beyond... Posts: 8,802	What about Mormons? __________________ Do you like my photography? Visit photosbymatt.tumblr.com to purchase prints!
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08-13-2008, 08:14 PM	#40
BarTopDancer Prepping... Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Here, there, everywhere Posts: 11,405	I seriously doubt the target audience of this song, or the related movie was the ultra liberal left leaning music listeners. I also doubt it's going to spawn a bunch of lynchings. If someone or someones were going to go lynch someone they probably had the idea long before this song came about. Actually, I know it didn't spawn a bunch of lynchings. I'm sure we would have heard about it back in 2003 when the song was #1 on the charts for 5 weeks. If it didn't spawn them then, I doubt it's going to spawn them now. __________________ Spork is the new MacGyver Postcards From My Edge
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