Yes, we can.

[JWBear]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I am certain I will be slammed and flamed and whatever else for it, but I have said there is a some sort of Messiah complex on the left when it comes to Obama (and also that Obama is part of it). I have now heard several different people say this, so that suggests to me it is a democratic party talking point. It is also possible that line was just picked up by others because they liked it (and I'm not entirely certain who said it first). The line -

"Jesus was a community organizer, Pontius Pilate was a governor."

OK....how am I supposed to go down the road of there NOT being some form of messiah complex when this is being repeated?

It would depend entirely on who is repeating it, and why.

For the record, I have never seen Obama as a "messiah", just as someone who cares more about this country and its citizens than the Republicans.

[BarTopDancer]

Considering I don't believe Jesus is the "messiah"....

[Strangler Lewis]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I am certain I will be slammed and flamed and whatever else for it, but I have said there is a some sort of Messiah complex on the left when it comes to Obama (and also that Obama is part of it). I have now heard several different people say this, so that suggests to me it is a democratic party talking point. It is also possible that line was just picked up by others because they liked it (and I'm not entirely certain who said it first). The line -

"Jesus was a community organizer, Pontius Pilate was a governor."

OK....how am I supposed to go down the road of there NOT being some form of messiah complex when this is being repeated?

Though I will vote for him with some modicum of enthusiasm, I actually find the fervor of Obama's supporters somewhat offputting. I believe that skepticism and healthy mistrust of all who would rule should be standard operating procedure. You would never find me having a politician as my avatar as CP does.

[innerSpaceman]

The Republicans (Rush Limbaugh specifically) started the bit about referring to Obama as the Messiah, and it's been a Conservative talking point for months. Palin mentioned it again in her acceptance speech.


If his campaign or other Democrats are now riffing off it, it's only because the Republican party has made it quite the infamous insult.

[Alex]

I personally read it to be more of an attempt to throw it back in their faces uses their beloved religious examples than an attempt to equate Jesus and Obama (personally, for me, one has inspired many fewer wars and murders).

But I really don't understand the messianic thing. Obama thinks he is the one best able to lead this country to where he thinks it needs to be. Name me one person who has willingly run for president who doesn't think that.

But if we're going to compare messianic worldviews, I'll take that over believing yourself to be directly doing god's work which is certainly the messianic view of our current president.

[scaeagles]

You know, you are right Alex, when you say that the all people who wish to be President do so because they feel are best for the job. I'll go ahead and completely back off my thinking that Obama is a part of it. I do think, however, as Obama is a Christian man, that he does believe himself to be doing the lord's work. Of course there will be the retort that it won't dictate his policies, but of course it will to an extent, as his religious views will influence his thinking of right and wrong.

The messianic complex is more like a cult forming through a large portion of his supporters. I did a bit of research, and apparently almost immediately after Palin's speech at the RNC there were items being sold with this statement on it. It was first made publically, at least to my knowlege, by a representative from Tennessee (D. Steve Choen) who directly compared Obama to Jesus in his statement during a speech on the house floor.

“If you want change, you want the Democratic Party,” Cohen said. “Barack Obama was a community organizer like Jesus, who our minister prayed about. Pontius Pilate was a governor.”

If they are trying to throw it back in the face of the "religious right", that is a completely fine tactic. I just think it solidifies the whole messianic complex being discussed in the election - again, I will absolutely concede that it is not Obama himself, but a large portion of his supporters. It is clever, no doubt, but comparing Palin to Pilate might be seen as a bit extreme. i see no other way to interpret the "Pilate was a governor" portion of that.

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Strangler Lewis

Though I will vote for him with some modicum of enthusiasm, I actually find the fervor of Obama's supporters somewhat offputting. I believe that skepticism and healthy mistrust of all who would rule should be standard operating procedure. You would never find me having a politician as my avatar as CP does.

Shuffling my feet i look down contemplating the Reagan avatar I have wondering if I should change it.....

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Of course there will be the retort that it won't dictate his [Obama's] policies, but of course it will to an extent, as his religious views will influence his thinking of right and wrong.

Well, here's one. He actually says his religious views are dictating his policy toward gay marriage rights, and I think he's lying. His strategic electoral views are dictating his policy, I'm sure of it.

So it seems, whether they say so or not, what dictates a president's policies, whether by religious belief or not, is truly between them and their god.

[Strangler Lewis]

I just see it as an "oh yeah" joke about the Republicans maligning Obama's experience as a community organizer. If the shoe was on the other foot and the Democrats maligned a Republican's experience in a community or church organization, they'd be accused of being out of touch and expecting government to solve all our problems.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

If they are trying to throw it back in the face of the "religious right", that is a completely fine tactic. I just think it solidifies the whole messianic complex being discussed in the election - again, I will absolutely concede that it is not Obama himself, but a large portion of his supporters. It is clever, no doubt, but comparing Palin to Pilate might be seen as a bit extreme. i see no other way to interpret the "Pilate was a governor" portion of that.

I think you are missing the chronology here. Of course they're trying to throw it back in Palin's face, and of course the reference to governor means her.

In her red-meat speech, Palin was the one who threw the snarky Obama-is-Messiah reference into the national ring. It's been circling among Fundies for months via the right-wing nutjob talk shows and such. She's the one who brought the vile insult to the national stage, along with the disgusting demeaning of community service work.

It's fantastic quid-pro-quo to point out that Jesus did community service and Pilate was the governor. She's a fvcktard and, in this case, it doesn't much matter what effect this has on radical fundamentalists. It's brilliant turnabout that has us Democrats chuckling in good spirits.