MLB '09

[scaeagles]

I'm a free market kind of guy, and admittedly know SQUAT about baseball. However, when I see a guy get 22.5 million per season (that's what it is, right? Something close anyway.) I think about what that represents in terms of what he gets for his performance. Please understand I do not know baseball AT ALL and my examples below may not be realistic, and I'm really looking to find out if he's worth that money in the opinion of the baseball fans here.

22.5 million is 138,888/game (162 game season). I'm not counting post season, but perhaps I should. Let's say he has an incredible season with 200 hits, 120 RBI and 40 HRs. I presume he is being paid this much because of offensive prowess rather than being an incredible defensive outfielder.

Now lets say I could get a guy for 7 million/season, just a good a defensive outfielder who will give me 140 hits, 80 RBI, and 25 HRs. The difference is 15.5 million for 60 hits, 40 RBI, and 15 HRs (but really, the HRS don't even matter...it's the RBI I'd figure).

Is he that much of a fan draw that he's worth that in ticket sales? Do the 60 hits, 40 RBI, and 15 HRs translate into a significant amount of wins? That's only about .25 runs extra/game.

I often run similar type numbers when looking at other athletes in other sports. I am equally flabbergasted when someone like the Cardinals Kurt Warner gets 13 million for a season. Even if they play 19 games and get to the SuperBowl again (win or lose), that's 685,000 for each game! Probably 25K per completion! It is amazing to me.

I wonder how long professional sports can keep this up before they go belly up. The NBA is already starting to experience major financial issues.

That was long than I wanted it to be. Just curious what the thoughts are here about the value of athletes. Again, more power to them if they can demand and get that type of salary. I just don't get it myself, and I love sports in general.

[Moonliner]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I'm a free market kind of guy, and admittedly know SQUAT about baseball. However, when I see a guy get 22.5 million per season (that's what it is, right? Something close anyway.) I think about what that represents in terms of what he gets for his performance. Please understand I do not know baseball AT ALL and my examples below may not be realistic, and I'm really looking to find out if he's worth that money in the opinion of the baseball fans here.

22.5 million is 138,888/game (162 game season). I'm not counting post season, but perhaps I should. Let's say he has an incredible season with 200 hits, 120 RBI and 40 HRs. I presume he is being paid this much because of offensive prowess rather than being an incredible defensive outfielder.

Now lets say I could get a guy for 7 million/season, just a good a defensive outfielder who will give me 140 hits, 80 RBI, and 25 HRs. The difference is 15.5 million for 60 hits, 40 RBI, and 15 HRs (but really, the HRS don't even matter...it's the RBI I'd figure).

Is he that much of a fan draw that he's worth that in ticket sales? Do the 60 hits, 40 RBI, and 15 HRs translate into a significant amount of wins? That's only about .25 runs extra/game.

I often run similar type numbers when looking at other athletes in other sports. I am equally flabbergasted when someone like the Cardinals Kurt Warner gets 13 million for a season. Even if they play 19 games and get to the SuperBowl again (win or lose), that's 685,000 for each game! Probably 25K per completion! It is amazing to me.

I wonder how long professional sports can keep this up before they go belly up. The NBA is already starting to experience major financial issues.

That was long than I wanted it to be. Just curious what the thoughts are here about the value of athletes. Again, more power to them if they can demand and get that type of salary. I just don't get it myself, and I love sports in general.

This is professional Baseball It's not so much about bats on ball as it is butts in seats.

138,000 per game, with an average seat price of $29.66 means that if Manny brings in an extra 4,000 fans per game (or significantly less fans if you include food and trinket sales) he has more than paid for himself. Plus the Dodgers get a percentage from away games also. If Manny brings in extra people on the road (and you know he will) then that amount also goes up.

I know that back in the day, Fernando Valenzuela regularly brought in an extra 8,000 or more every time he pitched.

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Moonliner

This is professional Baseball It's not so much about bats on ball as it is butts in seats.

138,000 per game, with an average seat price of $29.66 means that if Manny brings in an extra 4,000 fans per game (or significantly less fans if you include food and trinket sales) he has more than paid for himself. Plus the Dodgers get a percentage from away games also. If Manny brings in extra people on the road (and you know he will) then that amount also goes up.

I know that back in the day, Fernando Valenzuela regularly brought in an extra 8,000 or more every time he pitched.

That's the kind of thing that I'm wondering. If he is that much of a draw, then that's great. Knowing it is professional ball and it is about profit, I was wondering if it is possible that they get a return on that huge of an investment in one guy.

To me, though, in looking at the financial troubles of the NBA at present, I wonder how long it is before salaries price the average fan out of the ability to go to the game and the teams start to lose money. That salary will push up other salaries and eventually it becomes unsustainable. Or so I'd figure. I wonder when that point hits.

[SacTown Chronic]

I was looking at the 2005 NFL draft (the Alex Smith draft) yesterday and i was struck by how horribly some teams used their top-ten pick:

(1) Alex Smith - 49ers
(4) Cedrick Benson - Bears
(6) Adam Pacman Jones - Titans
(7) Troy Williamson - Vikings
(10) Mike Williams - Lions (Matt Millen, you truly suck)

Talk about your poo-poo platters. Not one of these guys is worth a fifth-round pick today.


And it's not like there was no talent available. The Cowboys got DeMarcus Ware at 11 and the Chargers picked up Shawne Merriman with the 12th pick.

It was stunning to see Aaron Rodgers fall to the 24th pick. Even a Niner-hater like me was disgusted when they passed on Rodgers to take Smith.

[Moonliner]

Word on the street in these parts is that T.O. is coming to the Redskins. Bleh.

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Moonliner

Word on the street in these parts is that T.O. is coming to the Redskins. Bleh.

Condolences.

[SacTown Chronic]

Originally Posted by Moonliner

Word on the street in these parts is that T.O. is coming to the Redskins. Bleh.

Please. Oh please. Oh please. C'mon Snyder, you know you want to.


Please.

[SacTown Chronic]

Even God hates the 49ers:

"As you guys know, our faith is the most important thing, so we went into it with the idea, ‘Where does God want us? That's where we're going to be,'" Warner said. "No matter what the money is or the situation, that's where we want to be. Very early in the process in San Francisco, as many good things that are out there and what they're building and coach [Mike] Singletary — I had a great time with him and I like what they're building — I just knew very quickly, this [Arizona] is where I was supposed to be.

"I told my wife probably 45 minutes into it that I just felt God say, ‘You're supposed to be in Arizona.' And I told her that. She tried to tell me to stay open [minded] but He just continued to confirm it and that's why on the way back, I called Mark and said, ‘Hey, let's get this thing done.'"

[Ghoulish Delight]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

To me, though, in looking at the financial troubles of the NBA at present, I wonder how long it is before salaries price the average fan out of the ability to go to the game and the teams start to lose money. That salary will push up other salaries and eventually it becomes unsustainable. Or so I'd figure. I wonder when that point hits.

A few things. Baseball tickets remain dirt cheap compared to every other pro sport, so they've got a ways to go. The Dodgers continue to pull in record attendance #'s, and with Manny that won't stop. Even with this hefty contract, the Dodgers have significantly reduced their payroll this season over last. So if having a name like Manny continues to fill seats in a down economy, he's worth it.

In terms of Manny's more direct financial impact, two other factors haven't been mentioned. Merchandising. We went to the first game that Manny played in for the Dodgers. By the time we arrived at the park, every 4th person had some sort of Manny merchandise. A big $ player, especially one as charismatic as Manny, is a merchandising sales engine. People don't just buy one Manny-cornrows wig and leave it at that. The money just keeps coming in.

The other thing to consider is that Manny was, without argument, the difference between the Dodgers making the playoffs and winning the first round vs. finishing the season out of the playoffs. I don't know what the teams themselves make from that, but I know that the player bonus for making it to the 2nd round and losing was about $120K. With a 40 man roster, that's near $5 million. So I figure the team must receive a decent bonus as well, on top of the added merchandise and other revenue.

[scaeagles]

Originally Posted by Ghoulish Delight

A few things. Baseball tickets remain dirt cheap compared to every other pro sport, so they've got a ways to go. The Dodgers continue to pull in record attendance #'s, and with Manny that won't stop. Even with this hefty contract, the Dodgers have significantly reduced their payroll this season over last. So if having a name like Manny continues to fill seats in a down economy, he's worth it.

In terms of Manny's more direct financial impact, two other factors haven't been mentioned. Merchandising. We went to the first game that Manny played in for the Dodgers. By the time we arrived at the park, every 4th person had some sort of Manny merchandise. A big $ player, especially one as charismatic as Manny, is a merchandising sales engine. People don't just buy one Manny-cornrows wig and leave it at that. The money just keeps coming in.

The other thing to consider is that Manny was, without argument, the difference between the Dodgers making the playoffs and winning the first round vs. finishing the season out of the playoffs. I don't know what the teams themselves make from that, but I know that the player bonus for making it to the 2nd round and losing was about $120K. With a 40 man roster, that's near $5 million. So I figure the team must receive a decent bonus as well, on top of the added merchandise and other revenue.

All really good points. One of the problems for the NBA is certainly their ticket prices. Last year I took my daughter and 3 of her friends to a Suns game for her B-day. 3 rows from the top of the arena, $65 per ticket. Ouch. I had a former player of mine give me two 3rd row tickets to the Suns-Lakers game last Sunday. Face value was $225 each. Double ouch (except to me they were free).