This is some sort of sick joke, right?

[MouseWife]

Originally Posted by Not Afraid

Or, just different.

Just different, Lisa. We all are.

But, we all give in our way. I think you give to a lot of people of yourself. That is priceless.

[Not Afraid]

Originally Posted by MouseWife

Just different, Lisa. We all are.

But, we all give in our way. I think you give to a lot of people of yourself. That is priceless.

Of course. We are also fairly charitable for a one-income family. But, that'a a personal choice and not one that is put on display for the moral judgement of others. Especially when that moral code is so undeniably foreign.

[MouseWife]

Originally Posted by Not Afraid

Of course. We are also fairly charitable for a one-income family. But, that'a a personal choice and not one that is put on display for the moral judgement of others. Especially when that moral code is so undeniably foreign.

Respected.

See, I have no idea what you do {aside from giving of yourself} but I do not question your charity at all.

And, we don't have to wear our badges on our lapels for everyone to see what we do for whom and when.

[€uroMeinke]

I'd like to go back and explore something Alex mentioned in that fashion can be deceptive - i.e. what it attempts to represent about a person may not be true.

I think this is one of the fascinating powers of fashion - it is in fact a place that is almost acceptable to lie - fashion lets you wear cloths that enhance your best features and hide your worst. Fashion can make you seem taller, thinner, wealthier, edgier, or more sophisticated than you really are - sort of cart blanch role playing. Heck manny of you in other posts talked about judgements made about other people based more on how they were dressed rather than race.

There is power in image - and I just love how that all works. Look at this site and the people who turn away believing they aren't "swank" enough - that is both crazy and compelling.

At what point do people become the roles they play? Can the cloths we wear actually make us sexier, more sophiticated, cooler? At least in some cases it appears it can.

Art is Magic.

[MouseWife]

Very good points there.

No kidding. Girdles? {men and women} Push up bras, water bras. Umm...I don't know what guys use but......

As far as 'fashion' making us feel sexier...let's just say Maroon 5's video 'This Love'....sure made shopping for chonies more interesting for me.

I have never understood people who think they can't wear something. Fear? I don't know. I'll try anything on. BUT if I don't think it looks good I won't wear it. Pure and simple. Like NA said, not every look looks good on every body.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by Not Afraid

Have a good time in Boise, ISM. You're a better person than I am.

Please don't take offense. First of all, I haven't yet bought lunch for anyone from Boise. In fact, I will confess that - for a person of my income bracket - my charitable giving is atrocious (though for a person of my debt level, it's probably on target).

I certainly don't put any moral value on someone buying a $90 shirt or a $1,000 jacket. I'd like my moral alarm to stay silent at all price levels ... but it does go off for those $10K suits and those $250K cars. (Let me know when you're ready to spend that kind of cash, NA ... and we'll be talking more than lunch.)

Still, there's nothing wrong with someone plunking down $10K on a suit of clothes. It's just not what I would like to do.

* * * *

Originally Posted by €uroMeinke

Fashion can make you seem taller, thinner, wealthier, edgier, or more sophisticated than you really are - sort of cart blanch role playing. ... There is power in image - and I just love how that all works.

Very interesting stuff. It is a sort of role play (and, for many of us, note how often clothing veers decidedly into costume).

But I think it's limited to "play." For image projection, it only works till you open your mouth. Unless you are putting on a complete act, the look only works as a facade for people who don't actually interact with you. Very limited effectiveness, I'm afraid.

Fun? yes. Pulling the wool over anyone's eyes? Sorry, not with wool alone.

* * * * *

Originally Posted by Mousewife

Push up bras, water bras. Umm ... I don't know what guys use but .....

Well, I can't speak for anyone else ... but for this guy - - it's what I don't use that adds, umm, umph.

(If I don't wear underwear, my package is simply .... alarming. Ask anyone who's seen me in jeans on a commando day - - or, better yet, seen me in my red long johns of death!)

[DisneyDaniel]

Originally Posted by €uroMeinke

I'd like to go back and explore something Alex mentioned in that fashion can be deceptive - i.e. what it attempts to represent about a person may not be true.

In cases of art imitating life, here are a few examples, off the top of my head:
--Cinderella, with the help of the Fairy Godmother, gets magically dressed for the ball.
--Aladdin, with the help of Genie, becomes the wealthy suitor Prince Ali.
--The former NBC series "The Pretender" was about a character who pretended to be a different person by changed his clothing/appearance each episode.
--Jennifer Garner's character in the ABC TV-show "Alias" changes her outfits for different situations as a spy to suit the purpose.

Yes, one could say those are only fictional accounts, but these TV/movie/pop-culture examples send subcontext message that it's sometimes OK to be deceiving, based on how someone is dressed, if it fits someone's needs or objectives.

Originally Posted by €uroMeinke

I think this is one of the fascinating powers of fashion - it is in fact a place that is almost acceptable to lie - fashion lets you wear cloths that enhance your best features and hide your worst. Fashion can make you seem taller, thinner, wealthier, edgier, or more sophisticated than you really are - sort of cart blanch role playing. Heck manny of you in other posts talked about judgements made about other people based more on how they were dressed rather than race.

^ Exactly! Why is it that ... dressing in "black" or monochrome colors, or wearing "vertically stripped" clothes is suppose to make one look thinner or taller. Wearing a scarf, accessories, or jewelry can hide or enhance some features, etc.

Going back to the topic of Disney clothes, how many people specifically wear Disney-related clothes when they're going to a Disney park? A lot of people. Whether it's for reasons of style, pride, self image, or simply "dressing up" for a day at Disney, many people consciously wear Disney clothing to the parks like it's a routine. There's nothing wrong with that, of course, and it's probably a little fun to do so.

As for the original post about the high-priced--but lack-of-quality--Bambi and Donald shirts, I say it's the consumer's choice. Is the price outrageous for the product? I think so, as do many here. But if someone believes those shirts are worth the price, then they can just go ahead and buy them.

[€uroMeinke]

Originally Posted by innerSpaceman

But I think it's limited to "play." For image projection, it only works till you open your mouth. Unless you are putting on a complete act, the look only works as a facade for people who don't actually interact with you. Very limited effectiveness, I'm afraid.

Well, we are talking deception and not transforamtion here (though I think fashion can sometimes do the latter). You can do a lot with first impressions, and sometimes it's our clothes that open doors to opportunities we might not have were we otherwise dressed.

A push up bra might attract someone with a bias for breasts that starts the conversation the creates the realtionship where breast size doesn't matter. Yes the clothes don't change the truth, but the enable (and sometimes prevent) things to happen.

[Not Afraid]

I think clothes can do a lot of both harm and good to a person - especially initially. I can get so distraced by appealing - or moe often unappealing - visuals that I cannot concentrate on what the person is really saying. Maybe it is because I am primarially a visual person, but when clothing seems out of balance, distracting or just plain ugly, I have to make an extra effort to get past the visuals.

The effect of certain styles of dress has been used for shock value for ages. Punk clothing is a great example of in-your-face,look at me style that sends a message right away. But, that is an extreme example of what we all communicate to others right off the bat. But, I also think it has to do more than just with clothing. The entire presentation is important and can be very distracting. Fashion more than just clothing.

[innerSpaceman]

Oh, I agree with the communication aspect. I love the communication inherent in clothing ... but with the proviso not to put too much stock in it. After all, you never know who didn't bother to think what they were saying when they got dressed that morning (though there are many who are obviously trying to tell you something with their fashion de jeur).

I also get it about visuals, but I don't get too distracted by clothing (unless you've got Charlize Theron's Oscar bow about to eat your head from its perch on your shoulder). The biggest visual will always be someone's actual looks, their physical self, their facely visage. No degree of fashion can overcome that for the influence it has on others.

Fashion can accentuate, it can sometimes even compensate ... but it will never do as much -or say as much- as a pretty face, a warm smile, a perky pair, or some packed long johns.