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€uromeinke, FEJ. and Ghoulish Delight RULE!!! NA abides. |
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#1 | |
Chowder Head
Join Date: Jan 2005
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"I refuse to believe in something that requires faith until I see irrefutable facts." The whole basis for faith is allowing yourself to know that the spirit is there without needing to have the hard and fast evidence. It is a freeing experience to allow yourself to be all the evidence you need.
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#2 |
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Or self-deluding. It exists because I believe it does is also a self-fulfilling prophecy for all the evidence you require.
I believe all kinds of things that require "faith." For example, I believe that Lani would never leave me when every personal experience would tell me otherwise. I just don't label as true anything that doesn't have evidence. So let me ask you, Kevy, how you decide which things that require faith are believable? As the old saying goes, don't be so open minded that your brain falls out. |
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#3 |
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I don't mean that to imply I think you've let your brain fall out. I have no interest in trying to talk anybody out of their faith (until they start making real world testable claims as evidence of it). I don't understand why anybody believes such things but I'm not too hepped up about it.
I'm just curious how you draw a line between believing Item A but not Item B when all that is required of either is faith. |
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#4 | |
Chowder Head
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#5 | |
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So it seems to me you don't accept it entirely on faith. You believe you have had experiences with show you that what you have faith in is true. You just can't share this evidence by its very nature.
I have never had any of these experiences. So when you say: Quote:
To me, without the experiences you've had, they both seem equally likely. To me, the only way to sort through everything is to require some evidence (and yes, to ultimately rely on people I trust to evaluate evidence) and the scientific method for 400 years has proven best (in my view) as discriminating among it all. So, once I have an experience where God talks to me and laid out the truth of the universe I'm sure I'll believe it. That is the nature of us. But the me-right-now will think the me-when-that-happens is probably delusional unless he can provide evidence. |
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#6 | |
ohhhh baby
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I really dislike the word "faith" these days. Too many connotations. "Faith" used to mean a lot of good things, but these days, it tends to describe a disreguard of facts. Truthiness. I've had my own spiritual moments, moments of connectivity, when I felt there was more at work here than I could prove even if I used both hands...but I'd never assume that anyone should feel as I do. I do believe that this is one of those things that you can only find if you want to find it. Of course that proves nothing. It could be that "your mind lets you see what you feel you need to see, whether it exists or not" or "people are only able to see the light when they're ready". I am inclined to believe a mixture of the two. Now there's a working paradox for you. Besides, I'd be disappointed in Alex if he went and had a religious experience.
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