Disney's Dubious Path to 9/11

Gn2Dlnd · 09-06-2006, 04:56 PM

Wow, a "moon bat" and "teh dummer" in the space of two posts. Anyone care to make it a trifecta?

Unfortunately, Alex, those who watch this film will now be able to say to their friends, "That a-hole Clinton called off an attack on Bin Laden when the marines were right outside his front door!" I know without a shred of doubt that I'll be having this conversation in the near future. Probably with people in my own family. It doesn't matter if it's true or not, they saw it on teevee. Does it matter that the Clinton administration was roundly ignored by the Bush White House on this topic? No. Because in a movie on tv it said something different.

I'm sure the last 50 years of history have had something to do with everything that followed. Your point is that it doesn't matter. My point is that it does. We have a responsibility to teach the truth to schoolchildren. What happened to the lessons learned back in 5th grade when we watched the Watergate hearings on tvs rolled into classrooms from the AV department?

Have we given up on all critical thinking because it "doesn't change anything"? I don't think so. It's just that the really loud percentage of Americans who have done so, make it seem like the rest of us have.

Alex · 09-06-2006, 05:02 PM

I didn't say it was my view that people who get upset about representations of history in movies is "teh dummer" just that this was pretty much the consensus view here earlier this summer (when I was the one arguing against it).

I make no point that it doesn't matter. Everything matters from a historical point of view. An ABC docudrama that will be watched by 12 million people (and discounted out of hand by half of them) doesn't matter a whole lot but of course it matters. And the historical errors should be corrected.

My point isn't that history isn't important but rather that "blame" is not a historical concept. "Blame" is a personal subjective concept. "Blame" whoever the hell you want because even if everybody agrees 100% on what physically transpired each individual will be able to assign "blame" differently and support it to their own satisfaction with the facts on hand.

wendybeth · 09-06-2006, 05:08 PM

I'm in the midst of a conversation about the Clinton administration and terrorism at another site right now, and am in no mood to rehash it all over again. That said, has anyone actually read the commission report? They make it very clear that the Clinton administration took terrorism extremely seriously and were repeatedly hamstrung by a Congress and Senate more concerned about domestic 'affairs' (and blue dresses) than terrorism. Clinton was a hell of a lot more proactive than given credit for, and it really pisses me off when people lay the blame at his door rather than do the research and stop trying to rewrite what actually happened. I doubt anyone in those towers or on those airplanes on 9/11 were too concerned with whatever political party their fellow victims were affiliated with- on that day they were all just human beings trying to survive.

09-06-2006, 04:56 PM	#1
Gn2Dlnd Parmmadore Jim Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Casita del Queso Posts: 3,810	Wow, a "moon bat" and "teh dummer" in the space of two posts. Anyone care to make it a trifecta? Unfortunately, Alex, those who watch this film will now be able to say to their friends, "That a-hole Clinton called off an attack on Bin Laden when the marines were right outside his front door!" I know without a shred of doubt that I'll be having this conversation in the near future. Probably with people in my own family. It doesn't matter if it's true or not, they saw it on teevee. Does it matter that the Clinton administration was roundly ignored by the Bush White House on this topic? No. Because in a movie on tv it said something different. I'm sure the last 50 years of history have had something to do with everything that followed. Your point is that it doesn't matter. My point is that it does. We have a responsibility to teach the truth to schoolchildren. What happened to the lessons learned back in 5th grade when we watched the Watergate hearings on tvs rolled into classrooms from the AV department? Have we given up on all critical thinking because it "doesn't change anything"? I don't think so. It's just that the really loud percentage of Americans who have done so, make it seem like the rest of us have. __________________ Does anyone still wear a hat?
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09-06-2006, 05:02 PM	#2
Alex . Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,354	I didn't say it was my view that people who get upset about representations of history in movies is "teh dummer" just that this was pretty much the consensus view here earlier this summer (when I was the one arguing against it). I make no point that it doesn't matter. Everything matters from a historical point of view. An ABC docudrama that will be watched by 12 million people (and discounted out of hand by half of them) doesn't matter a whole lot but of course it matters. And the historical errors should be corrected. My point isn't that history isn't important but rather that "blame" is not a historical concept. "Blame" is a personal subjective concept. "Blame" whoever the hell you want because even if everybody agrees 100% on what physically transpired each individual will be able to assign "blame" differently and support it to their own satisfaction with the facts on hand.
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09-06-2006, 05:08 PM	#3
wendybeth Nevermind Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 7,847	I'm in the midst of a conversation about the Clinton administration and terrorism at another site right now, and am in no mood to rehash it all over again. That said, has anyone actually read the commission report? They make it very clear that the Clinton administration took terrorism extremely seriously and were repeatedly hamstrung by a Congress and Senate more concerned about domestic 'affairs' (and blue dresses) than terrorism. Clinton was a hell of a lot more proactive than given credit for, and it really pisses me off when people lay the blame at his door rather than do the research and stop trying to rewrite what actually happened. I doubt anyone in those towers or on those airplanes on 9/11 were too concerned with whatever political party their fellow victims were affiliated with- on that day they were all just human beings trying to survive. __________________
	Submit to Quotes