The random political thoughts thread (Part Deux)

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Strangler Lewis

Not if fit boys is what you're into and are hoping the other kid is, too.

Obviously. But we're not talking about a situation where it is known that the guy is into young boys. Foley knows it is an attempt at building a relationship out of sexual desire. Hastert has no way of knowing that and these emails are hardly strong evidence that it is true.

But you're right, it is sad to always have that stuff in the air. I coach a kid's soccer team, and one of the key pieces of advice at the orientation was never be alone with someone else's kid without another adult present.

But how do we know we can trust you to be alone with your kid? Incestuous child molestation is more common than all the other kinds.

You say this is sad but at the same time apparently feel that it should be assumed by Hastert, a presumably trusted colleague, is depraved on the basis on these emails.

Does not compute.

It doesn't compute that an adult can express interest in a young person without it being sexual? As I said, these emails aren't all that different from dozens I've seen written (and written myself on a few occasions) and yet there was no sexual interest. I will stand by my statement that if you put these emails among those emails you wouldn't be about to pick them out.

This isn't some kid with undeveloped impulse control who never learned appropriate boundaries. Like all the scandalous priests, he destroyed his own career.

Yes, he did. That's the point. He destroyed his career. Those emails would have been a pretty flimsy basis for another to destroy his career. And can you think of anything more damaging to a Congressman's career than the speaker of the house issuing a press release that he has asked the police to investigate you because you sent one former employee an email asking for a picture and said another former employee was fit?

Yes, in this case it would have turned out to be right, but it would have been an overreaction reminiscent of the trumped up child abuse cases of the late '80s.

Only in hindsight of the later letters are these emails obviously insidious.

I want to be really clear that I am in no way defending Foley, just the idea that Hastert should have called out all the dogs a year ago.

[Strangler Lewis]

Originally Posted by Alex Stroup

I want to be really clear that I am in no way defending Foley, just the idea that Hastert should have called out all the dogs a year ago.

Well, if he could put the same laser-like focus on this issue as the media has, then yes. However, he has 434 other scoundrels to worry about, plus himself, and he has a country to ruin, so I imagine he spends a lot of time wishing/hoping/assuming that a lot of s*** will just goes away.

[scaeagles]

There is another angle I've heard to this as well now, being that the dems have known about this for months as well and wished to have it times for release closer to the election. If so, that is as despicable as what I believe Hastert is possibly guilty of.

It is all conjecture, of course, except for the Foley part. I would not put it past republican leadership to try to hold the story until after the elections and the dems to try to hold the story until weeks before them.

[Alex]

Assuming Hastert did what you accuse him of earlier in this thread, do you really find using political dirt at a politically opportune time to equally as bad as protecting the career of a politician making inappropriate advances on children to avoid scandal?

The left wouldn't have a political football if Foley weren't a scumbag and either side would have used it if it dropped in their lap.

[scaeagles]

No, I'm saying if they knew 6 months ago they had a responsibility to disclose it at that time, the same as Hastert had the responsibility to disclose it. Hastert didn't want it to come out prior to the election. If the theories I have heard regarding the dems knowing as well are true, they should not have waited until now.

Anyone who knew this was going on and did not do anything about it in order to maximize political advantage in terms of timing is despicable, whether it was to protect a seat or damage a party. There was a something sick going on that needed to be stopped immediately.

The left has a political football, and in this case I really don't mind if they use it. A predator and the leadership protecting him deserve all they get. I just hope the dems weren't sitting on it for months the same as Hastert (allegedly - I could be wrong). Politics is politics, but this goes beyond some fund raising scandal or some other such thing.

It is always possible I am jumping to conclusions about Hastert.

[Moonliner]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

The left has a political football, and in this case I really don't mind if they use it. A predator and the leadership protecting him deserve all they get.

From the reports I'm seeing, it looks like a lot of people share your thoughts Leo. I really think this points to a disconnect between the republican leadership, their promotion of family values, and the people. I really feel like it's coming as a shock to some of these politicians that good people like you really believe in the message and not in the politicians who are just giving it lip service.

[JWBear]

I just heard this on the radio this morning and I haven’t had time to verify it… Apparently Foley's "interests" have been common knowledge on Capitol Hill for the last 5 years, and some staffers have been warning pages to avoid him. If this is true, so much for the “Haslert didn’t know the emails were sexual” defense.

[Alex]

According to this timeline, from a right-leaning source, the story was first given to the press in November 2005 but the St. Petersburg Times did nothing with it (presumably because they felt those early emails weren't sufficient or perhaps they were protecting a local politician). It also has the emails being provided to the FBI (though it isn't clear on which ones) in June of this year.

So it sounds like there were attempts and opportunities for this to hit the press much earlier than now.

[Alex]

The source on the pages having been warned about Foley is Matthew Loraditch, current president of the page alumni association. He says he was warned that Foley was gay and not to get too involved with him.

Loraditch has also, on some blog of his said that the Associated Press overstated his quote into a bigger warning than it was.

I wonder what we would think if presented with a warning from a Republican staffer to avoid someone because they were gay.

[Nephythys]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I'm mad. Like majorly pissed off mad.

The republicans have a pedofile predator in their leadership in Congress.

Granted no one is responsible for their behavior except themselves. But it looks like it was known for a year. And no one did a damn thing about it. He had a reputation among the pages as someone to stay away from.

Every person in the republican leadership who knew about this prior to it breaking should be kicked out of office. Hastert, whomever. And now Foley has the audacity to blame it on alcoholism? Hastert, who apparently knew about it, now has the chutzpah to say that there should be a criminal investigation.

I can't say I think Hastert is guilty of a crime. But he is guilty of the worst kind of politics, as it looks as if he was simply interested in protecting the seat. I am amazed that some people are crying politics at the timing of the release of this. What? That makes me sick. The politics were being played by republican house leaderhship.

Scum.

ah but what about this stuff?

-Foley is scum- but the Dems faked outrage is an insult.

Politics in general are making me sick right now- bleaugh!