All About McCain

[mousepod]

Originally Posted by Tenigma

I think the joint statement still got released by Camp McCain. Except that only half of the statement was joint, because there's a huge-ass long postscript that McCain's folks tacked on at the end that was not part of the original statement.

By the way there are reports that while Obama was waiting for McCain to return the call yesterday morning, McCain was busy visiting with Mrs. Rothchilde.

As for "had Obama done what McCain" did, a) Obama was already talking in private with Chris Dodd, Paulson, and others on a regular basis so that he could be apprised of what was going on. b) Did not want to inject the presidential campaign into the actual workings going on in the committee right now, so he stayed away on purpose. c) Would not have asked to postpone his debate with McCain because apparently Obama is more comfortable multi-tasking.

...can we have the election NOW, please?

Yesterday, I thought that the joint statement was half-joint, half-Obama.

[Tenigma]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Obama can do no wrong in their eyes. I may just not have read it, but has anyone even expressed concern or given a comment to you Obama is just as in the back pockets of the banks as anyone else treatise?

Actually that's not true. I'm an ardent Obama supporter but I do NOT support all of his stances on issues. I was rather aghast that he voted *for* FISA, for one. I'm grudgingly accepting a lot of his issues. I've traditionally been a single-issue voter (illegal immigration--a very typical conservative view and one that pits me completely in polar opposites with my otherwise libertarian conservative views--because as a legal immigrant I find line-cutters to be despicable and a personal affront to me). I not only voted for Bush in 2000, I voted for Tom Tancredo for 2004 (there you have it, I never said this publically before)--yeah he was not on the ballot. I was so pissed I wrote his name in.

So as you can imagine, I'm not particularly keen on Obama's views on immigration. Well, I'm not humongously supportive of McCain's, either.

Here's the thing. The reason I'm a supporter of Obama is because he is the right man for the right time. The depth and breadth of how much the Bush administration has ruined things in our country is almost unfathomable.

You know when I voted for Bush in 2000, it was because I didn't want to vote for Gore because to me Gore was Clinton 2.0 and I hated that Clinton didn't respect the office enough to keep his pants zipped there. And my thinking was, "Well, we need a change. How much harm can one person do?" Boy was I wrong.

I don't want a card-carrying AARP/qualify for Social Security/frail from torturous injuries senior citizen in the White House, with a barracuda teeth-bearing "young Earth man-walked-with-the-dinosaurs" Christianist fundie rubbing her hands in anticipation on the side. What a joke.

How in the WORLD can such an administration try to right the keel on our broken ship? Do people even KNOW how ridiculed we are around the world? This blind nationalism is KILLING US.

[scaeagles]

Ridicule amongst the rest of the world....I hardly care. Most of the rest of the world is run by dictators and would be considered second or thrid world. Even in our rough times, we have an unemployment rate that European nations would love. I get that you don't like it....I just don't care if the rest of the world ridicules us.

Tenigma, I don't mean no policy wrong for the Obama cultists. It is an image of the man as almost infallable and above the political fray. He plays politics same as every other politician, has his hands dirty some as every other politician, takes the money from special interests same as every other politician.....but for some reason he isn't like every other politician.

I get that people are excited about him and not about McCain. I'm voting for McCain, but I go from "because I have to" to "I believe in him" and every where in between almost daily.

I just don't think that there is a realistic view of Obama out there.

[sleepyjeff]

Originally Posted by Alex

The trouble is that there is essentially a 2 to many ratio in the swapping. It is going to pretty much be you and scaeagles taking the Republican line on positions. There are plenty of people who can take the Democratic line so really you're at a disadvantage.

You 2 pretty much always have to participate in the hypocrisy of actor-dependent position taking since there is no depth on your side. But for the other side they can take turns in it giving themselves the cover of sometimes not being involved in that hypocrisy. Once three or four people do it, the rest can step back and say "ah, that's not quite fair and I'm above it all." At least until their turn comes and then they get so say "yes, it might look hypocritical but if that is what was driving me wouldn't I have been hypocritical in all these other situations?" when in fact they were relieved of that burden by being in the majority position.

It really just emphasizes the structural disadvantage you two have on this board when it comes to arguing politics.

Well put.

There are other conservatives on this board besides the two of us.....they just don't seem to like the punishment as much as we do(I really want to put a smiley here, but I won't).

[Gemini Cricket]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I just don't think that there is a realistic view of Obama out there.

I don't think there can be any scaeagles approved view of Obama as long as anything positive is said about him in that view...


I agree with Tenigma's pov. I don't agree with Obama on everything. His anti-gay marriage stance for instance. But he does have a caveat to his stance, that gays should have the same rights as a opposite sex couple. In McCainland, gays would be invisible. So, I choose to get into the rowboat with fewer holes in it.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

I just don't think that there is a realistic view of Obama out there.

I think there is certainly a realistic view of Obama out there, and the fact that some of his supporters are starry-eyed (I think you overstate how many) doesn't mean that there isn't anyone who sees him realistically.

I see Obama as certainly a politician, and generally a pretty good one. He isn't an angel, as politics is a dirty business and you don't succeed at it without getting a bit of dirt on you. I don't expect that he will change the way Washington works in any significant way, but I support him because I agree with him on the majority of issues and think that he has essentially the right idea about where to lead the country. And I don't think I am an anomaly among Obama supporters, whatever you might think.

[Strangler Lewis]

It is an image of the man as almost infallable and above the political fray. He plays politics same as every other politician, has his hands dirty some as every other politician, takes the money from special interests same as every other politician.....but for some reason he isn't like every other politician

P.S. Avoid the Sarah Brightman version.

[Snowflake]

Of course, things can change in a nanosecond, but am I the only one who thinks McCain is just being pigheaded and stupid? The venue confirms the debate is still on, Obama will be there, how will McCain fare by not showing up? I don't get what he is trying to accomplish here, is he going to use this ploy to demonstrate his ability to lead? Correct me if I am wrong, isn't he a bystander?

McCain campaign won't commit to debate on Friday

By LIZ SIDOTI, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - John McCain's campaign expressed cautious optimism Thursday as congressional Republicans and Democrats agreed in principle on a $700 billion bailout of the financial industry hours before the two presidential candidates were to meet with President Bush on the crisis.

Even so, the action didn't appear to be strong enough to convince McCain to attend Friday's scheduled presidential debate. His campaign has said he wouldn't participate unless there was consensus between Congress and the administration, and a spokesman said the afternoon developments had not changed his plans.

"There's no deal until there's a deal. We're optimistic but we want to get this thing done," McCain spokesman Brian Rogers said.

Full Story, such as it is this moment, here.

In other news:

Palin defends Alaska-Russia foreign policy remark
By AMY WESTFELDT, Associated Press Writer

NEW YORK - Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin defended her remark that the close proximity of Russia to her home state of Alaska gives her foreign policy experience, explaining in a CBS interview airing Thursday that "we have trade missions back and forth."

Palin has never visited Russia and until last year the 44-year-old Alaska governor had never traveled outside North America. She also had never met a foreign leader until her trip this week to New York. In the CBS interview, she did not offer any examples of having been involved in any negotiations with the Russians.

Linkie here

Frankly, I think the worlds travelers of LoT have much more foreign experience than Palin and put my faith in their collective judgement and ability to lead in a very swanky style, thank you.

[innerSpaceman]

Originally Posted by scaeagles

Ridicule amongst the rest of the world....I hardly care. Most of the rest of the world is run by dictators and would be considered second or thrid world.

I can't even get past the first line in your post without commenting. What kind of rarified geopolitical air are you breathing, scaeagles, when you assume by "rest of the world," she meant the purported leaders of the governments of the rest of the world?


Why not assume she meant the REST OF THE WORLD, i.e., the other 5 billion people????


If those 5 billion people don't matter to you, will you kindly get the fvck off our planet!!!

[tracilicious]

A trade "mission"? Really?