Lost!

[BarTopDancer]

Based on what they've implicated so far, as well as the usual rules of time travel (both purely sci-fi rules, and theoretical rules), everything we've seen up to the point of Juliette setting off the bomb has always happened.

I suppose I should study up on my time travel rules.

[Pirate Bill]

everything we've seen up to the point of Juliette setting off the bomb has always happened.

And I am going to go out on a limb and say that the bomb didn't change anything. In fact, I think Faraday is wrong and the bomb has always been part of the incident.

[JWBear]

And I am going to go out on a limb and say that the bomb didn't change anything. In fact, I think Faraday is wrong and the bomb has always been part of the incident.

Here's a radical thought... Maybe Faraday knew that!

[sleepyjeff]

And I am going to go out on a limb and say that the bomb didn't change anything. In fact, I think Faraday is wrong and the bomb has always been part of the incident.

I just don't know.....If Whatever happened really always happened then why:


1)Charlotte, right before she died, told Faraday that he(Faraday) came up to her when she was a child and in a scary way told her to leave the Island and never come back? Now, he is dead and so far all we've seen is him talk to her in a calm(not scary) voice to leave the Island with her mother.....nothing was said about never coming back. Perhaps Faraday, in a small way, changed things even before setting off the H-bomb.

2)Did Faraday, biggest advocate of WHH, after 3 years of intense study off Island, come to the conclusion that things can be changed?

3)Did Ben, right after Alex was killed, say Widmore changed the rules?

4)Did Mrs Hawking go thru the bother of making sure Desmond took a certain path if he had always taken that path?

5)Do Charlie, Claire, Ana Lucia, Libby, and maybe even Christian keep popping up? Could it be that they are still alive in a Universe where the plane doesn't crash on the Island and that is why Charlie said to Hurley "Iam dead, but I am also here"???

[BarTopDancer]

The producers said they are not in purgatory, a dream or a snow globe. Maybe they are in the Twilight Zone.

[Stan4dSteph]

Between those two I'd lean towards Sobek...Taweret is a female god I believe and Egyptian Goddesses didn't wear short skirts(they wore long dresses) like our statue...but the male gods did.I already posted about Sobek. Nice to see that no one is reading my posts.

[scaeagles]

Who are you and how long have you been posting here?

[BarTopDancer]

I already posted about Sobek. Nice to see that no one is reading my posts.

I am! I remember that but I couldn't remember who posted it and I didn't search. I'll go stand in the corner and bow my head in shame. :(

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I just don't know.....If Whatever happened really always happened then why:


1)Charlotte, right before she died, told Faraday that he(Faraday) came up to her when she was a child and in a scary way told her to leave the Island and never come back? Now, he is dead and so far all we've seen is him talk to her in a calm(not scary) voice to leave the Island with her mother.....nothing was said about never coming back. Perhaps Faraday, in a small way, changed things even before setting off the H-bomb.If you were a 4 year old child and a man you didn't know came up to you and told you to leave the only home you've ever known, that would be scary. I seem to remember him making her cry, because he was crying. Either that, or sloppy writing.

2)Did Faraday, biggest advocate of WHH, after 3 years of intense study off Island, come to the conclusion that things can be changed? Here's a classic LOST cop out for ya - he was wrong.

3)Did Ben, right after Alex was killed, say Widmore changed the rules?This has nothing to do with the timeline because Ben hadn't traveled through time. He just had supposed rules with Widmore which Widmore broke. No real explanation for "the rules" yet, but it may have something to do with the passing of Others leadership from Widmore to Ben.

4)Did Mrs Hawking go thru the bother of making sure Desmond took a certain path if he had always taken that path?This is easy. The only reason he always takes that path is because Mrs Hawking always makes sure he does.

5)Do Charlie, Claire, Ana Lucia, Libby, and maybe even Christian keep popping up? Could it be that they are still alive in a Universe where the plane doesn't crash on the Island and that is why Charlie said to Hurley "Iam dead, but I am also here"???Sure. Or a dozen other options. Here are some easy ones. 1. They are inhabited by Jacob, 2. They are inhabited by Esau, 3. They are inhabited by Locke's ghost, 4. Hurley talks to the dead but in a different way than Miles does, 5. The island won't let them go to the afterlife, as it is a very needy island...

Any other questions? I'd love to make up more answers. As the show has shown that they can do anything they want, I can make up any theory I want and it is just as viable as what actually happens. So I no longer have any trouble with inconsistencies.

[BarTopDancer]

Any other questions? I'd love to make up more answers. As the show has shown that they can do anything they want, I can make up any theory I want and it is just as viable as what actually happens. So I no longer have any trouble with inconsistencies.

Will Sawyer lose his shirt for more episodes?
How come the water is so damn blue and there is little seaweed?
Are they still eating Dharma food?
How come the food drops stopped (though they may have answered that earlier in the series and I forgot)?
How did the polar bear skeleton get to Tunsia?
Why does the mover of the island go to Tunsia when the island is moved (and why didn't Locke end up there)?
Where are the kids and the kidnapped Losties?
What happened to the Othersville that they showed the kids and kidnapped Losties at?

They probably explained some of these already but I forgot.

[Ghoulish Delight]

But here's what's really gonna cook your noodle...

[Cadaverous Pallor]

*Will Sawyer lose his shirt for more episodes?

He better.

*How come the water is so damn blue and there is little seaweed?

I've been to places like that. The question should be, why do SoCal beaches suck so bad.

*Are they still eating Dharma food?

Is who eating it when and where?

*How come the food drops stopped (though they may have answered that earlier in the series and I forgot)?

That's a whole other story about the people who are dropping food and the problems they face blah blah blah

*How did the polar bear skeleton get to Tunsia?

Oh yeah, Tunisia. Um. I keep thinking of Poltergeist where they go into the closet but come out of the ceiling downstairs.

Greg: Tunisia is the Island's antipode. He is right. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antipodes)

*Why does the mover of the island go to Tunsia when the island is moved (and why didn't Locke end up there)?

Locke does end up there. See above.

*Where are the kids and the kidnapped Losties?

Long dead or brainwashed.

*What happened to the Othersville that they showed the kids and kidnapped Losties at?

It was only a front, but it was on the far side of the island and I don't think they've been near there since. I'm probably wrong.

[Pirate Bill]

*Where are the kids and the kidnapped Losties?

Long dead or brainwashed.

They're probably at the temple. When Dead Lock asked if this was everybody (referring to the group he rejoined after bringing the boar back for dinner) Richard said some were at the temple.

BTW, I just watched last week's CSI episode. Libby and Jacob are in it.

[BarTopDancer]

BTW, I just watched last week's CSI episode. Libby and Jacob are in it.

It's really bizarre to see Locke as a General on the West Wing. I remember it tripped me out when LOST! first started and it's doing it again. Such different characters.

[sleepyjeff]

Maybe Jacob does not want Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Sun and Jin to get on flight 815 and the flashbacks we are seeing are not him nudging them towards taking the flight but actually just the opposite; perhaps he went back in time(again?) and changed things so that this time they won't be on the plane if and when it does crash:

Kate: Jacob told her to "be good". Now we know that pre-815 Kate wasn't all that good so if Jacob was really there it doesn't compute...yeah, I know, he paid for the stolen item and got her off the hook and yeah, that could have led to her life of crime......but what if it is more straightforward than that, what if after Jacob touching her and telling her to be good she actually does go on to be good???

Jin and Sun: Same as with Kate, he told them one thing but we know that they end up doing quite the opposite.....perhaps this too is a "new" visit by Jacob and they do go on to guard their marriage better. If they did would they have ended up on that plane???

Sawyer: Perhaps Jacobs pen, in some way, softens the tone of Sawyers letter to Cooper....disapearing ink maybe???

Jack: Without that candy bar Jack may have given in to a burning hatred for his father at that moment in time....the candy bar Jacob gave him may have distracted him, just enough(a little push) to take Jack away from a bad path.

Then there's the two post crash visits:

Hurley: Notice what Jacob offered Hurley....a choice.....to get on the plane or not leaving the decision entirely up to the Hurley alone. This was really cool because up until this point Hurley has been told he has to go(Ben, Locke, Jack) or has to stay(Sayid, Jack) but here Jacob was telling him to choose.

btw: Jacob offered someone else a choice in this episode...Ben...which leads me to believe that Hurley, not Frank is the "candidate" for new Island leader...

Sayid: In order for the bomb to function Jacob needed Sayid on the Island...so he saved his life. Why he didn't save Nadia too? Maybe she was destined to die no matter what(I know, that's weak, but I got nothing else)

Now there was one other person who had a flashback during the season finale.....Juliet. This was pre-crash like many of the 815'ers but there was no Jacob.

No Jacob and yet she is key to making the bomb go off....what does this mean???


And of course............LOCKE: We see Locke fall from the window and laying there on the ground un-conscious, Jacob touches him and Locke awakens. We assume that what happened here is that Locke's life was saved here by Jacob and then Locke goes on to be crippled, meets Abbadon and goes to Australia for the walkabout.....leading to 815.

But what if this too was a new visit by a time traveling Jacob and after receiving the healing touch Lockes visit to the hospital was just for bumps and bruises and a mild concussion????

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Have to say, intriguing stuff. You hurts my brain meats.

[lashbear]

Sleepyjeff: are you a staff writer for Lost, by any chance?

GREAT post. :snap:

[sleepyjeff]

Sleepyjeff: are you a staff writer for Lost, by any chance?

GREAT post. :snap:

Thanks but all I am doing is trying to sort this whole thing out.....easier when I type it rather than chase thoughts. Basically I was trying to figure out how all of these things Jacob did led to our Losties coming to the Island but some things just didn't jive so I thought I'd see if things would jive better if he was doing just the opposite...I think they just may:D

[bewitched]

ABC has confirmed who the statue is: (http://abc.go.com/primetime/lost/index?pn=recap#t=162212&d=201648)

And as the camera pulls back, we see what we've been waiting to see since we first glimpsed that four-toed foot over three years ago... the towering, majestic statue of the Egyptian goddess Taweret (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taweret).

[mousepod]

We finally caught up with Lost over the weekend. I like it. Very pleased with where the story has gone so far... but still have the same trepidation that I did way back in Season 2... I wish I had faith that the writers won't fumble this...

[bewitched]

I agree with this observation, the entire finale did have a sorta Deus ex machina sort of feel to it....from Bernard/Rose/Vincent being "retired"...

I think Rose and Bernard are the "Adam and Eve" skeletons from the cave in season one.

Also, interestingly, Lindelof (one of the creators) noted at one point (in speaking of the skeletons):
There were certain things we knew from the very beginning. Independent of ever knowing when the end was going to be, we knew what it was going to be, and we wanted to start setting it up as early as season 1, or else people would think that we were making it up as we were going along. So the skeletons are the living -- or, I guess, slowly decomposing -- proof of that. When all is said and done, people are going to point to the skeletons and say, "That is proof that from the very beginning, they always knew that they were going to do this."

This also speaks to what is bothering CP...I do think that sometimes along the way they've had to say, "gee, we implied this because we wanted to go here and now we need to add these things in order for it ultimately happen and make sense."

[bewitched]

They went to Jacob's cabin. Ben said it was Jacob in there. Christian claimed he was Jacob at one point.

Not that saying something conclusively has ever stopped them from changing the "facts" on us.

When they put Esau in the picture and told us it was him that was Locke, it infers that there are two supernatural beings at play when we only knew about one. The inference is clear, as JW posted. Even if you don't go that far it still means that everything is up for questioning.

There are twists when characters do things we don't expect, there are twists when new information is revealed about existing circumstances. This is NOT a twist, because this character was not in play for the last 5 years.

I really don't know how else I can put it.

For my taste, the "clues" were far too vague. For all of the other surprises, there was an obvious, specific vacuum in the story that they filled.

There were whispers and killings and kidnappings - so we meet the others

Desmond was stranded, being kept from his wife, and a mysterious ship was looking for the island and Desmond - so we meet Whidmore.

There is an abundance of scientific equipment, and strange things like polar bears - so we learn about Dharma.

There are mysterious happening on the island in the form of the living dead, smoke monsters, et al. - so we learn about Jacob.

But this new guy? His effect is so overreaching, and dropped in so suddenly, it's a total hand wave. "Hey, everyone, check out this guy. He hates Jacob....oh and by the way he's responsible for pretty much everything that's happened."

All I can think is the end of the Simpsons Lord of the Rings spoof episode. "And they were rescued by, oooh, let's say Moe."

But they've been clear some time that there were two sides and that people needed to choose which side they were on. Most of us always assumed that meant the two sides were Ben and Widmore. They are now clarifying that the two sides are Jacob and "Esau" (and one would assume that Ben and Widmore are/were the de facto "leaders" of each faction). Personally, I don't consider that a bait and switch nor an obfuscation. They never said those were the sides. Sure, they implied, but I believe the implication was only a plot point to allow the story to become more fleshed out.

[bewitched]

I think my friend Mike and I may be the only two people who don't think he's evil. Heh.

I'm inclined to think he may be more a Judas figure (in the more modern interpretation that Judas was "chosen" by Jesus- as his most faithful servant, to "betray" Jesus in order to fulfill the prophesy of his resurrection).

On a similar note, I think Smokey didn't kill Ben because it (or he, if you are inclined to think he is aligned with the man in black) is unable to kill anyone directly "touched" by Jacob which brings me to another point...

That Jacob (as sleepyjeff notes) went out of his way to touch each of the main characters in their flashbacks. If you throw in the biblical references that have been part of the Lost mythology, I don't think it's a big leap to interpret this as Jacob "choosing" his disciples and ultimately "saving" them in the process.

Doc Jenson (on ew.com) theorizes that the bomb will send them all back to the moment that Jacob touched them but with all of the knowledge they've already accumulated and that they will eventually return to the island of their own volition to fight to save Jacob and the integrity of the island...hence, the "coming war".

they're coming.

(I personally think he didn't save Nadia because doing so wouldn't have "saved" Sayid...she still would have been killed by one of (supposedly) Widmore's cohorts and Sayid would have turned to a dark path in order to exact revenge and/or because he had nothing to live for. Nadia dying by being hit by a car makes it nothing more than a tragic accident, one which requires no act of revenge...and Sayid is thus "saved" from the dark path of vengence.)

[bewitched]

And yes, I am far too obsessed w/ Lost.



Miss me? :D

[Cadaverous Pallor]

(I personally think he didn't save Nadia because doing so wouldn't have "saved" Sayid...she still would have been killed by one of (supposedly) Widmore's cohorts and Sayid would have turned to a dark path in order to exact revenge and/or because he had nothing to live for. Nadia dying by being hit by a car makes it nothing more than a tragic accident, one which requires no act of revenge...and Sayid is thus "saved" from the dark path of vengence.)I actually like this explanation, and a lot of the other stuff you said made sense to me as well.

At this point I've already put my LOST brain into hibernation. See you 2010!

[BarTopDancer]

The more I watch the re-runs the more my heart breaks for them. Right now is the episode where Jin is begging Sun's father to let him marry her and agrees to work for him as a thug.

[Eliza Hodgkins 1812]

And yes, I am far too obsessed w/ Lost.



Miss me? :D

You may have single handedly redeemed the finale for me. I'll have to give it a rewatch soon.

[lashbear]

We've got Series 5 on DVD and we're going back re-watching it, seeing as how our viewing was interrupted by a lil ole USA trip, etc.....

Just finished the first three episodes. Watching them in sequence makes it SO much more understandable. :blush:

[bewitched]

We've got Series 5 on DVD and we're going back re-watching it, seeing as how our viewing was interrupted by a lil ole USA trip, etc.....

Just finished the first three episodes. Watching them in sequence makes it SO much more understandable. :blush:

I totally agree! It makes it SO much easier to put all of the little clues together. I can't wait for January...well other than the freezing and the snow and all.

[lashbear]

Richard seems timeless (even perhaps immortal)... and he has a LOT of eyeliner...

Richard (who doesn't actually wear eyeliner, it's just his eyelashes).

Just FYI, Nestor Carbonell's eyelashes are naturally very dark. He does not wear eyeliner.

He may not wear eyeliner, but there was actually an eyeliner reference to Richard in the show's dialogue (don't make me try and remember who said it, it probably was Sawyer...) That's when Greg & I noticed that he had very dark eyelashes.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

OMG, I started backing up in this thread and realized I have no fracking memory for any of this (including stuff I posted). I better brush up soon.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

He may not wear eyeliner, but there was actually an eyeliner reference to Richard in the show's dialogue (don't make me try and remember who said it, it probably was Sawyer...) That's when Greg & I noticed that he had very dark eyelashes.Nestor Carbonell does not wear eyeliner. That bit of dialog was an inside-joke because everyone thinks he does have eyeliner on. It was discussed on the Lost podcast.

[lashbear]

Ah - inside joke. Shame really, because Stoat's been hypothesising all sorts of theories as to why Richard might be wearing eyeliner - some of them were quite interesting. (we were waiting for the big Gay coming out scene where he takes Sawyer into the jungle and ravages him).

Now I can get Stoat to continnue to concentrate on the plot. :D We will be finished watching all the episodes by this weekend.

[BarTopDancer]

OMG, I started backing up in this thread and realized I have no fracking memory for any of this (including stuff I posted). I better brush up soon.

SRSLY!

[lashbear]

CP - must be the baby blocking your memory, it was only last April... (seems like yesterday to me... oh, that's right - it WAS) :D

[SzczerbiakManiac]

we were waiting for the big Gay coming out scene where he takes Sawyer into the jungle and ravages him.Well you're in for a treat. In Season 5, Richard does indeed take Sawyer out into the jungle but it's Sawyer who winds up ravaging Richard. It's pretty hot. Hopefully the Aussie censors don't cut the scene.

[lashbear]

Well you're in for a treat. In Season 5, Richard does indeed take Sawyer out into the jungle but it's Sawyer who winds up ravaging Richard. It's pretty hot. Hopefully the Aussie censors don't cut the scene.
You tease !! :p

[Cadaverous Pallor]

CP - must be the baby blocking your memory, it was only last April... (seems like yesterday to me... oh, that's right - it WAS) :DHah, I barely remembered this stuff week to week, it's all so bloody complex and silly...

...but yeah, we'll be back when it starts up again.

[RStar]

My plan is to wait untill the end of the final season, then go back and watch it from the begining. With hind site, it will be interesting to see if I can catch clues and little things I missed. And to see it with fresh perspective.

I joined the Lost University, buy I don't have a Bluray player with BD Live! capability, so I doubt I'll be able to participate. :(

Anyone else going to get season 5 on DVD and do the Lost University thing?

[Gemini Cricket]

.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Awesome art!


I'm really, really, really worried about this last season.

[Gn2Dlnd]

Yeah, but once it's done, Zombie Season!

[BarTopDancer]

Recap of seasons 1-5 in 8 minutes 15 seconds (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIFL104E9Ts).

Just watching that makes me realize I should re-watch season 5.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Wow, I feel better now.

[RStar]

Awesome art!

Yes, it is. But, it says "Boarding Pass" on it. Would you get on a plane that has artwork of a plane crash on it? :eek:

[€uroMeinke]

So, should I try the first season again and try to catch up?

[Cadaverous Pallor]

So, should I try the first season again and try to catch up?Heh. It's a long journey. If the first ep didn't grab you the first time...

[SzczerbiakManiac]

President won’t interrupt Lost premiere (http://marquee.blogs.cnn.com/2010/01/08/president-won%E2%80%99t-interrupt-lost-premiere/)

[bewitched]

My plan is to wait untill the end of the final season, then go back and watch it from the begining. With hind site, it will be interesting to see if I can catch clues and little things I missed. And to see it with fresh perspective.

I joined the Lost University, buy I don't have a Bluray player with BD Live! capability, so I doubt I'll be able to participate. :(

Anyone else going to get season 5 on DVD and do the Lost University thing?

If you go browse Doc Jenson's blog on EW (http://www.ew.com/ew/package/0,,20313460,00.html), he has a lot of info on exclusive info from the bluray; he also has all 10 underground art project posters (GD posted one of them) which supposedly contain hidden clues to the upcoming season. (Doc is also my favorite Lost geek authority on the web-- he has awesome theories.)

I seriously cannot wait until 02/02! I'm such a geek. (hmmm...we don't have a geek smilie...)

[bewitched]

So, should I try the first season again and try to catch up?

Absofreakinloutely.

[Gemini Cricket]

Arrrgh!

I feel like shooting myself in the face.

I just got a call from my friend who works in the casting office for 'Lost'. She wanted me to work as an extra for them for two days. Paid. Problem is, it's this Friday and next week Wednesday. Friday I have a third interview with a promising job, a meeting at work AND a date. Can't blow off two of those... AND if I get this job I will be working for them next week so Wed is out too.

Shooooooot! I could have been in a really fun scene which would have guaranteed me some face time on the show. F*ck f*ck f*ckitty f*ck.

Oh well.

I need this job.

If I don't get it, boy will I be mad.

:D

[Gemini Cricket]

Hmm. So luck crossed my path a second time. I report to the 'Lost' set tomorrow. Can't say what I'm doing or with whom... Call is freakin' 6:45a tho.
D'oh!!
:D

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Hmm. So luck crossed my path a second time. I report to the 'Lost' set tomorrow. Can't say what I'm doing or with whom... Call is freakin' 6:45a tho.
D'oh!!
:DYAY!!! :D :D :D How freaking awesome is that??

[JWBear]

Will you at least be able to tell us which episode you'll be in?

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Can't say what I'm doing or with whom...Because you don't know or because you're forbidden?

[Ghoulish Delight]

Hmm. So luck crossed my path a second time. I report to the 'Lost' set tomorrow. Can't say what I'm doing or with whom... Call is freakin' 6:45a tho.
D'oh!!
:D

Because you don't know or because you're forbidden?
Because he wants you to think the answers are "the nasty" and "Matthew Fox"

[katiesue]

Congrats GC!

[mousepod]

Awesome news, GC. (and I hope you get the job, too)

[Betty]

Nifty Neato!

[cirquelover]

Wow, our very own GC is going to be on LOST!! I can't wait to see your episode!

[LSPoorEeyorick]

So awesome!!!!

[Snowflake]

GC, for you I will watch an episode of Lost. That is positively fabulous! Keep this up and you will be a star and have to move back to California!

[Gemini Cricket]

My day on "Lost" was great. 12 hours. Whew!

I was in three scenes total.

2 with principal cast members.

I played a patient in one scene and a doctor in two others.

And that's about all I can say. Once it airs, I can tell all.

I'm not sure what episode number it will be. I can find out, I guess.

The crew was fascinated and a bit taken a back that I knew not the show. Which helped me, actually. I was not starstruck at all by these actors. And was able to act without fear.

I tried to finagle myself into saying a line, but failed.

I wish y'all could have been there. It was fun.

:)

[RStar]

That's cool GC! I'm a fan and will watch for you, but it would be eaisier if we knew what episode.

You know not the show? What, do you live on some deserted island some where??

;)

[Stan4dSteph]

Nice! Did you get paid? Does this count toward a SAG card?

[flippyshark]

VGCM! This is so cool! I can't wait to see.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I believe he would have to speak in order to get into SAG.

[Frikitiki]

Looking forward to the Premiere of Season 6 at the Sunset on the Beach event on January 30 in Waikiki. I heard that jay and jack are supposed to be coming over as well as ryan from the transmission podcast will be doing some tours. Sunset = Free, tours=$

[Betty]

This is so cool!

[CoasterMatt]

Yay! Finally a reason to watch Lost!

[Gemini Cricket]

I hear it's episode 11 of this season.
But not 100% sure.

[ToriBear]

We're not Lost fans at my house, but, we will watch it just to see you in it, Brad! :)

[Chernabog]

Do you get to oil up Matthew Fox in the episode?

[Frikitiki]

Just found out that the Sunset on the Beach event will not be the whole 2 hour show but just the first hour. Kinda bummed.

[bewitched]

Final season of Lost promises to make fans more annoying than ever. (http://www.theonion.com/content/video/final_season_of_lost_promises_to)

LOL, I'm afraid this might be me...:eek:

[RStar]

Are we annoying? I hadn't noticed.....

[sleepyjeff]

So, should I try the first season again and try to catch up?

Yes and I am so freaking jealous of you....you see, when I first started watching LOST it was late in season 2....so I went out and got season 1 on DVD and spent a weekend pretty much just watching LOST.

Now, with waaaay toooo long off-seasons and certain story-lines sometimes going weeks(or even years) before elaboration I often wish I would have just waited until the entire series was done so I could watch all of the episodes back-to-back-to-back:)

But it's way too late for me now:D

[RStar]

Well, Jeff, you can do what we plan to do. After the last season we are going to watch the whole thing over from the begining. After we find out the secret of the island, it will be fun to watch it all over again to pick up clues along the way.

I did the catch up thing also. I watch the premiere show and didn't think anything of it. But I got curious after hearing so many people talk about it, and a frien gave me season 1 for christmas after season 2. So I watched it and got hooked after about the 3rd episode, then I bought season 2 and watched it before season 3 started.

[sleepyjeff]

Well, Jeff, you can do what we plan to do. After the last season we are going to watch the whole thing over from the begining. After we find out the secret of the island, it will be fun to watch it all over again to pick up clues along the way.

I did the catch up thing also. I watch the premiere show and didn't think anything of it. But I got curious after hearing so many people talk about it, and a frien gave me season 1 for christmas after season 2. So I watched it and got hooked after about the 3rd episode, then I bought season 2 and watched it before season 3 started.

So you know how I feel.....it's like traveling long distance going 75mph for several hours and then all the sudden you come to a small town with a 20mph speed limit......and long red lights every single block.

[bewitched]

Are we annoying? I hadn't noticed.....


Well I'm not. :D


I watched all of the episodes during the week I was in bed after my knee/foot surgery last year and I really saw a lot that I had missed upon first viewing. I also think that it was easier to understand a lot of things because things that in real time had no significance 4 weeks later meant a lot more when seen 4 hours later. Not all series lend themselves well to quick, sequential viewing but I think in Lost's case it actually enhanced it.

[sleepyjeff]

777

Days, Hours, Minutes:)

[SzczerbiakManiac]

8 Unresolved Lost Questions (http://www.mania.com/8-unresolved-lost-questions_article_120159.html)
May not be work safe due to a swear word or two.

[bewitched]

**SPOILER**

First 4 minutes of the new season!! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymj1hXgGDFM&feature=player_embedded)


I can't wait for Tuesday!

[Frikitiki]

I get to see the first 60 minutes tomorrow!

[Frikitiki]

The 1st hour of the season premiere was amazing! There was a big reveal and some good explanations.

Here are some pictures from the premiere that took places on 1/30 here in Hawaii on Waikiki beach: http://www.flickr.com/photos/frikitiki/sets/72157623193642349/

Enjoy!

[Moonliner]

The 1st hour of the season premiere was amazing! There was a big reveal and some good explanations.

Here are some pictures from the premiere that took places on 1/30 here in Hawaii on Waikiki beach: http://www.flickr.com/photos/frikitiki/sets/72157623193642349/

Enjoy!

Lost on the beaches of Hawaii? Duuuuddde! Way cool. Of course there is not much in life that wouldn't be better on the beaches of Hawaii...

[scaeagles]

I look forward with great anticipation to this tomorrow. I wish a could access youtube at work to view those first 4 minutes. Frikitiki, I admit to a great deal of envy but am glad it has seemingly been worth the wait.

[Stan4dSteph]

The 1st hour of the season premiere was amazing! There was a big reveal and some good explanations.

Here are some pictures from the premiere that took places on 1/30 here in Hawaii on Waikiki beach: http://www.flickr.com/photos/frikitiki/sets/72157623193642349/

Enjoy!Awesome photos! What beautiful weather. That had to have been a fun way to spend the day.

[Frikitiki]

They were giving away t-shirts that said "LOST the final season 2010"on them when you turned in a program eval.

I'm thinking of putting it up on e-bay.

[sleepyjeff]

I wonder if the show is headed in a Sliding Doors direction?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztctgepaUOg

[mousepod]

I wonder if the show is headed in a Sliding Doors direction?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztctgepaUOg

I think I know where you're going with this one, but your link to the Aqua video just made me think of "Barbie Girl".

[sleepyjeff]

I think I know where you're going with this one, but your link to the Aqua video just made me think of "Barbie Girl".

Would it scare you to know that my Ipod has every single Aqua song ever made?

:D

[sleepyjeff]

HAPPY LOST DAY!

[scaeagles]

I just watched this (http://www.youtube.com/user/campetin?blend=3&ob=4&rclk=cth#p/u/1/elscvYI3wZI) trailer or promo or whatever it's called.

Somewhat spoilerish, but exceptionally cool.

[Stan4dSteph]

What the what?

So "it worked," the island sunk and they all went back to their not so great lives in LA, yet they are still back on the island after the hatch blew? So even though they changed the past, they are destined to be back on the island at that time and place? Or are their two parallel universes? It's going to be an interesting season.

I'm cheating by reading the Lostpedia, where someone else has done the work of pointing things out to me. That may help.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

What the what?

So "it worked," the island sunk and they all went back to their not so great lives in LA, yet they are still back on the island after the hatch blew? So even though they changed the past, they are destined to be back on the island at that time and place? Or are their two parallel universes? It's going to be an interesting season.

I'm cheating by reading the Lostpedia, where someone else has done the work of pointing things out to me. That may help.
That sounds like no fun at all.

I'm really sad about Locke. The only one who loved the island is dead and being usedby smokey/man in black to destroy it. I also just love his backstory. I wonder if his body willl end up in the temple. It would be fitting.

BTW, I half expect Sawyer to demand to dig Juliet up nnow that Sayiid is alive.

[BarTopDancer]

I really hope they aren't playing with alternate universes, but I suspect they are.

CP - I agree. But why are some people who die dead and others come back. Are they coming back as themselves? Is Sayid really Sayid? Or is he now Jacob?

Some random thoughts:

I don't think Locke is Locke. I think the dark guy (Esu? I can't remember his name!) is taking the shape of Locke so people follow him.

We know how that the ash around Jacob's cabin was to keep Smoky out and when they showed the broken line Smoky had gotten in the island. But why was Jacob saying "Help Me".

I'm starting to lean toward the religious aspect of it (Christian Sheppard, when Sayid was lifted from the water his arms were outstretched and he has a look similar to Jesus depicted in images...). I hope it's not the case but I'm starting to think it may be.

Did anyone else catch the Dharma logo on the shark in the underwater scene? I was so excited to finally see something.

It was nice to see the kidnapped characters, including the children. It was also nice to see Rose and Bernard, and Charlie... who was supposed to die. I wonder if Claire is pregnant again.

When did they shoot the flare off (was it season 1)? They did it for the signal transmission, I think. When they showed it Richard looked petrified. So is that the same flare that the Losties shot off or a different one?

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I really hope they aren't playing with alternate universes, but I suspect they are.It very much seems like alternate universes. At first I thought the bomb may have split them off into a different time-line, but it seems to be more than that. E.g., Hurley now considers himself to be "the luckiest guy in the world [universe?]." That's a huge change in personality. And Desmond was on the plane? He should have already been on the island entering the code every 108 minutes.

I don't think Locke is Locke. I think the dark guy (Esu? I can't remember his name!) is taking the shape of Locke so people follow him.Locke is dead. I don't think there's any question about that. Man In Black/Smokey is definitely masquerading as Locke and I don't think he's hiding that fact now.

Did anyone else catch the Dharma logo on the shark in the underwater scene?No, when was that? The opening when they were "flying" underwater at the beginning, showing the sunken island or when Sayid was being "drowned"?

[BarTopDancer]

And Desmond was on the plane? He should have already been on the island entering the code every 108 minutes.

Then Desmond disappeared. Did he move seats or is he time traveling again?

No, when was that? The opening when they were "flying" underwater at the beginning, showing the sunken island or when Sayid was being "drowned"?

When they were showing the sunken island. It was shortly before they showed the statue foot.

Yes, I am quoting myself:

We know how that the ash around Jacob's cabin was to keep Smoky out and when they showed the broken line Smoky had gotten in the island. But why was Jacob saying "Help Me".

Or was it to keep Smoky in the cabin. We learned that Ben can control Smoky and it looked like Smoky lived in a cave in the Others' village but now it seems that isn't the case.

[scaeagles]

It very much seems like alternate universes. At first I thought the bomb may have split them off into a different time-line, but it seems to be more than that. E.g., Hurley now considers himself to be "the luckiest guy in the world [universe?]." That's a huge change in personality. And Desmond was on the plane? He should have already been on the island entering the code every 108 minutes.


If the bomb worked, though, there would be no reason for Desmond to be pushing the button every 108 minutes.

[Ghoulish Delight]

My current theory is that the bomb "worked" in that it changed the timeline, but eveyone will still end up back on the island in the new altered timeline anyway With Jack's dad disappearing, John's knives getting lost, Charlie getting arrested, Kate back on the run with Claire as unintentional hostage, they aren't exactly living happily ever after in the alternate timeline

[Stan4dSteph]

My current theory is that the bomb "worked" in that it changed the timeline, but eveyone will still end up back on the island in the new altered timeline anyway With Jack's dad disappearing, John's knives getting lost, Charlie getting arrested, Kate back on the run with Claire as unintentional hostage, they aren't exactly living happily ever after in the alternate timelineYep, that's what I said. I guess we'll see if we're right.

[MouseWife]

[QUOTE=Cadaverous Pallor;313397]

I'm really sad about Locke. The only one who loved the island is dead and being usedby smokey/man in black to destroy it. I also just love his backstory. I wonder if his body willl end up in the temple. It would be fitting.
QUOTE]


Me, too. :(

I enjoyed the show but seeing him, in the plane in the 'after' shots, his conversations, made me sad.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Good point scaeagles, thank you. Do you think he and Desmond still met at the stadium years before?

Differences between flashsideways timeline and original timeline from Lostpedia (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Differences_between_flashsideways_timeline_and_ori ginal_timeline)

[SzczerbiakManiac]

When Sayid was looking at his passport, the blurb in English on the right said if it's found in IRAN it should be returned to the nearest police officer. Wasn't old Sayid from Iraq?

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I loved seeing all the characters come back, even briefly. Charlie, Claire...the actor playing Boone aged too much, despite the ton of makeup they put on him (not HD friendly).

I especially loved that moment when Bernard made it back to his seat. A tailie no more. :)

[sleepyjeff]

Do you think he and Desmond still met at the stadium years before?



I don't he did, although Jack did recognize him so who knows. The thing is, Desmond was there training for a race organized by Charles Widmore(who wanted to find the Island)....does Charles still want to find this Island even though it's at the bottom of the Ocean???

[BarTopDancer]

What if the "nuke blast" wasn't actually a bomb blast and instead was everyone jumping time. We *think* they stopped time jumping but maybe they didn't.

[RStar]

What if the "nuke blast" wasn't actually a bomb blast and instead was everyone jumping time. We *think* they stopped time jumping but maybe they didn't.

Interesting idea, but then how is there a different timeline when the plane didn't crash, and the island is under water?

Could Jacob and the man in black be Greek gods, and the Island be Mt. Olympus or Atlantis?

[BarTopDancer]

Interesting idea, but then how is there a different timeline when the plane didn't crash, and the island is under water?

Could Jacob and the man in black be Greek gods, and the Island be Mt. Olympus or Atlantis?

Why not? We're making assumptions based upon what we know which are leading our line of thinking down a path that may be completely incorrect.

We know that when Juliet pounded on the bomb the screen turned white. We also know that the screen turned white whenever they would jump time.

We know that there have been time jumps already. Why couldn't there be a completely alternate universe where the plane never crashes? We 'think' we know that Jack recognizes people on the plane. But is it a can't place them look or a I know for sure I know them from somewhere, why don't they recognize me look.

Was the red mark on Jack's neck from the turbulence (somehow) or the explosion/time jump?

Was Desmond really on the plane or was he jumping through time and ended up on the planet for a few moments.

[sleepyjeff]

Was Desmond really on the plane or was he jumping through time and ended up on the planet for a few moments.


Usually Desmonds jumps thru time have only been to places he has been to in the past.....so he either was:

1) On the plane all the way from Sydney to LA
2) Never on the plane.
3) On the plane in Jack's mind only.
4) We(and Jack) witnessed more than one alternate flight 815....one with Desmond and one without(perhaps this has something to do with Charlie)

or

5) Desmond now has a new skill;)


Speaking of Desmond.....last we heard of him he swore off the whole Island affair but was warned by Hawking that his part wasn't finished.

Since then we have not seen Desmond but Hawking's plan to explode the H bomb was carried out; which leads me to believe that her plan extends beyond the H-bomb and that Desmond does indeed have a part to play:eek:

[BarTopDancer]

but Hawking's plan to explode the H bomb was carried out

We assume we did, but you know what happens when we assume.

How do we really know the bomb went off? What proof do we have?

After 5 years of LOST I don't consider the alternate timelines, alternate universes or Juliet saying "it worked" confirmation.

[sleepyjeff]

We assume we did, but you know what happens when we assume.

How do we really know the bomb went off? What proof do we have?



Good point....perhaps it didn't go off(but what proof do we have that it didn't)

Perhaps what we are witnessing is what happens if the bomb denonates(plane?) and what happens if it does not??? Kind of a Schrodingers Cat exercise.....maybe the whole point of LOST is to answer the age old question, once and for all, "if a tree falls in the forest..."

:)

[Moonliner]

So to sum up, so far the season of Answers is really just more questions.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yes, and anyone who expected otherwise hasn't been paying attention.

[BarTopDancer]

Basically ;)

But we know that smoky is Esau/Not!Locke and the ash keeps him at bay.
We also know that Sayid and Sawyer are still smoking hot.

[scaeagles]

We also know that a whole bunch of others live in the Temple. Unless I missed that before.

[bewitched]

Sheesh, I have lots of thoughts but I want to throw this out there about Sayid:

If we stick with the idea that Jacob/the island is about redemption and we remember that he touched all (well almost) of the main characters sometime in the past in an effort to save (or bestow redemption upon) all of them, then I think he finally "saved" Sayid.

I don't remember his exact words to Hurley, but I believe they were very close to, "they are the only ones who can save him."

Remember young Ben? When he was shot, Richard told Kate and Juliet that he wouldn't remember anything and that he would never be the same. Did he just give Sayid a "reboot"? The one factor that would otherwise always keep Sayid from being redeemed (at least in his mind) was all of the bad things he did in the past. If those memories are gone and he is "changed", i.e. left with his essential "Sayidness" is he not, in effect, saved (redeemed)?

I bring this up because here's what I think:

Setting the sideways timeline aside for the moment, I think these last 5 seasons have been rife with the idea of redemption, that who you are is not made up of any one (or any several) moments in time; there is an essential character to us all which gets obscured by life. I think Jacob sees the good in people and believes that when you bring the good in each person to the surface, you advance mankind as a whole (a step forward). With that in mind, I think we are going to see, one by one, each character's redemption whether by Jacob's instruction or through his hand. He's clearly dead, but not gone. And I think this is what was meant by having to choose...you have to choose faith, and therefore redemption and if you don't, by default, you choose the dark side.

And yeah, Sayid is still hot.

[Betty]

Certainly the concept of having choice keeps coming up.

I wonder if Sayid will now be Jacob (or visa versa).

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I wonder if Sayid will now be Jacob (or visa versa).If so, I vote we call him Jayid. ;)

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Oceanic 815 - Side by Side (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-1qzelSWpE)

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Amazon is taking pre-orders for Lost: The Complete Collection (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0036EH3WK)

[scaeagles]

I am not usually a spin off kind of guy, but I'd love some sort of Lost prequel show when this is over. That'd be cool.

[JWBear]

Finally had a chance to watch it.

It seemed to me that Jack almost didn't recognize himself in the mirror (just before he found the mark on his neck).

When Sayid was lying "dead" by the pool, I think the ghost whisperer guy new (or suspected) he wasn't dead and didn't want to say anything to Hurley.

I don't think Jacob necessarily represents "good", and Esau "evil". I have a feeling it's going to turn out to be more like the "Vorlon=order/Shadows=chaos" situation in Babylon5.

I still think the guy playing Jacob is hot.

[sleepyjeff]

Finally had a chance to watch it.

It seemed to me that Jack almost didn't recognize himself in the mirror (just before he found the mark on his neck).



I wonder if there is any relation to Jacks's neck mark and Daniels neck bandage....does anyone remember how he got the bandage on his neck?

[RStar]

Why not? We're making assumptions based upon what we know which are leading our line of thinking down a path that may be completely incorrect.

We know that when Juliet pounded on the bomb the screen turned white. We also know that the screen turned white whenever they would jump time.

We know that there have been time jumps already. Why couldn't there be a completely alternate universe where the plane never crashes? We 'think' we know that Jack recognizes people on the plane. But is it a can't place them look or a I know for sure I know them from somewhere, why don't they recognize me look.

Was the red mark on Jack's neck from the turbulence (somehow) or the explosion/time jump?

Was Desmond really on the plane or was he jumping through time and ended up on the planet for a few moments.That's true, it could have been a time jump. Let's say when Juliet hit the bomb it didn't go off, but they jumped in time instead. That would explain a few things, like the fact that they survived an explosion that should have also made a bigger hole than that. It would also explain how the hatch had been finished before it was blown up.

In fact, perhaps there are many different timelines. I love this stuff!

Oh, and I think Desmond has been on the planet all along....

;)

[sleepyjeff]

That's true, it could have been a time jump. Let's say when Juliet hit the bomb it didn't go off, but they jumped in time instead.

Why not both?

That would explain a few things, like the fact that they survived an explosion that should have also made a bigger hole than that.

Actually, I think Sayid just took the fissionable part of the hydrogen bomb....so the crater probably was just about right. Nevertheless, the crater we are looking at was from Desmonds fail-safe key, not Jacks bomb.......unless they are one in the same:eek:

In fact, perhaps there are many different timelines.

I think you've got it!

[sleepyjeff]

We assume we did, but you know what happens when we assume.

How do we really know the bomb went off? What proof do we have?



In the enhanced series recap before the season premiere the captioning states clearly "bomb detonation".

fwiw

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I don't think Jacob necessarily represents "good", and Esau "evil". I have a feeling it's going to turn out to be more like the "Vorlon=order/Shadows=chaos" situation in Babylon5.
This makes me wonder if Jacob has killed people (or rather, made other people kill each other) for less than "good" purposes. Esau has definitely done so. I don't think Jacob has done anything malicious, but I'm not a walking LOST encyclopedia...

[JWBear]

This makes me wonder if Jacob has killed people (or rather, made other people kill each other) for less than "good" purposes. Esau has definitely done so. I don't think Jacob has done anything malicious, but I'm not a walking LOST encyclopedia...

It wouldn't suprise me. We know his followers have used violence in his cause.

[sleepyjeff]

What about Walt?

If we are to take what we saw last week as a timeline split...in other words, there are now 2 Jack's(one on the Island and one not), two Sawyers(one on the Island and one not), two Kate's, etc.......

What about those who crashed on the Island but already got back before the Oceanic 6?

What will Walt say to himself if he ever meets himself?

....jeeesh, no wonder this kid is special, there's two of em;)

[BarTopDancer]

Amazon is taking pre-orders for Lost: The Complete Collection (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0036EH3WK)

From my most recent experience, the price will drop significantly within a few months of release. The much anticipated Farscape boxed set was released for $120 or $150 and a few months later it dropped to $63. Now it's $59.99

I am not usually a spin off kind of guy, but I'd love some sort of Lost prequel show when this is over. That'd be cool.

Bite your tongue!

In the enhanced series recap before the season premiere the captioning states clearly "bomb detonation".

fwiw

Oh, well if you want to get technical about it :p

What about Walt?

We better find out more about Walt. If he was so damn special (we were told that how many times? and we went on a rescue mission and found the other island because of him, why?) we need to know why. If it turns out it was just a plot vehicle I'm going to be pissed. I don't care of the actor is now 16, 6ft2 and baritone. I want to know!

[bewitched]

I say no, no, no to a spin off. For me, the most satisfying ending will be one that has answered the big questions (and a relatively high number of the smaller ones) but has left just enough unanswered that I am still ruminating over the series' meaning long after it's over.

(I do, however, want to be assured that Vincent is safe. :D)

[Gn2Dlnd]

I'd be surprised if Vincent doesn't turn out to be Jacob. And the Hurleybird.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Walt is the best evidence that the writers made all this up as they went along.

Any show that knows they are going to be reshooting the same scenes over and over again, even 5 years down the line, is NOT going to cast a child. He couldn't even stay young enough to last more than a short while. As a result, we may have a split timeline but we are not going to see Walt and Michael in LA X, unless they go the soap opera route and cast the role with a new kid.

It's a bummer, since I liked their story a lot.

[Frikitiki]

we knew they were shooting from the hip. Michael Emerson was only supposed to be a short part and ended up being a regular and one of the most intriguing characters on the show.

[bewitched]

Walt is the best evidence that the writers made all this up as they went along.

Any show that knows they are going to be reshooting the same scenes over and over again, even 5 years down the line, is NOT going to cast a child. He couldn't even stay young enough to last more than a short while. As a result, we may have a split timeline but we are not going to see Walt and Michael in LA X, unless they go the soap opera route and cast the role with a new kid.

It's a bummer, since I liked their story a lot.

The writers vehemently argue that they always had a story to tell and that they knew it would take them 6 seasons to do it (and in fact told the network that at the begining).

Having said that, I don't think having Walt in the original story means anything (re them not knowing where it's going). The sideways timeline is clearly not a continuation of what would have happened had the plane never crashed, things vary like Shannon, Michael and Claire not being on the plane. There is every possibility that in the sideways timeline Walt never existed in Michael's reality.

[Ghoulish Delight]

I'm sure it's a little of both. They may have had the broad strokes of the story arc in mind, however the details of how they were going to get from A to B had to at the very least have a lot of flexibility built in.

Among other things, it would have been lunacy to plan for a 5 year show (that was their original plan, stretched to 7 after it proved successful) and not have a way to deal with unexpected things like cast members leaving, popularity waning, unexpected popularity of what they thought would be a minor character.

The way I figure it, they had big picture things like, "The island is moving in time", "there was a society of scientists there beforehand", and "the island is a complex analogy for the greek concepts of hades and the river styx" or whatever it turns out being. But the details of who is working with whom, or against whom, or the mechanics behind how and why the island might be moving in time would by necessity had to have remained fluid.

[BarTopDancer]

They always said they had an ending and a 5 year plan (it was supposed to end last year but the writers strike extended it). What's left as filler is up to debate if they had that planned out. I think some of it was, but a lot of it seems like they got distracted by a shiny object and followed it a different direction.

[bewitched]

we knew they were shooting from the hip. Michael Emerson was only supposed to be a short part and ended up being a regular and one of the most intriguing characters on the show.

I stick with what I said earlier:

This also speaks to what is bothering CP...I do think that sometimes along the way they've had to say, "gee, we implied this because we wanted to go here and now we need to add these things in order for it ultimately happen and make sense."

I would add that there have been wrenches thrown into their plan (i.e. Micael Emerson) that they have decided to incorporate into the story and/or had to explain them away. I also think the idea that they had planned the story from the begining doesn't mean they had the entire story fleshed out; it merely means that they had their story arc, they knew the story they wanted to tell. The specifics have been fleshed out as circumstances changed and the story was being told.




eta: Of course now I could just sum up my thoughts as, "I agree with GD."

[lashbear]

LOST Series 6 starts in Australia tonight - although they are showing TWO episodes back to back. Maybe we'll catch up to you guys one of these days.

[bewitched]

Until you west coasters have a chance to watch I'll just say:


"What?!"

and

"Noooo...not Sayid!"



And something to think about that Michael Emerson said in an interview:

"What if you saw what the show meant, but couldn't recognize it?"




Until tomorrow....

[Ghoulish Delight]

"Noooo...not Sayid!"
:mad: errr, that's kind of a spoiler, no?

[bewitched]

Not in the way you think, it's more of a commentary. So...don't worry, the comment shouldn't ruin anything.


I also posted above a "cryptic spoiler" that Michael Emerson gave which makes me REALLY scratch my head.

[BarTopDancer]

Still a spoiler. And I finished the episode. Anything that hasn't been aired is a spoiler. Just have some courtesy and don't post something someone else could construe as a spoiler without spoiler tags and everyone will be happy.

LB - Season 6 started last week with LAX 1 and 2. Is that what you saw tonight?

[lashbear]

Yep - a retrospective 1 hour catchup, then the first two episodes - another two hours, for a three-hour total LOST-fest. I really enjoyed it.

...I didn't spot Brad, though. :D

[lashbear]

and I wanna know after watching the first two episodes...

They said that spring / pool should have been clear. I take it the red stain to the water was caused by the death of Jacob (if he is in fact dead - one never knows, really - I mean, who was that talking to Hurley? Was it Nasty Man-in-black/Esau/UnLocke/Smoky ?)

[lashbear]

Or was it to keep Smoky in the cabin. We learned that Ben can control Smoky and it looked like Smoky lived in a cave in the Others' village but now it seems that isn't the case.
I think it was to keep Smoky/UnLocke in. And I think that Ben only thinks he can control the smoke monster. He's got to be not so sure now...

[katiesue]

I love that they air the previous weeks episode in a pop up "Lost for Dummies" edition. It helps my mass confusion.

[Stan4dSteph]

:mad: errr, that's kind of a spoiler, no?Err, why are you opening the thread before you've seen this week's episode? Seems pretty basic to me.

[katiesue]

I agree with Steph. If you don't want to know don't look. I always look cause I need all the spoilers I can get to try to figure out what's going on :)

[scaeagles]

I thought we had a rule that once an episode had been televised that nothing was from that episode was considered to be a spoiler. This was to prevent everything in a thread from being in spoiler tags. it is the responsibility of the person who hasn't yet seen it to avoid the thread.

[BarTopDancer]

Yep - a retrospective 1 hour catchup, then the first two episodes - another two hours, for a three-hour total LOST-fest. I really enjoyed it.

...I didn't spot Brad, though. :D

Yup, looks like you guys are a week behind us.

As for the spoiler issue.. yes, if you look it's your own damn fault. But to post something like "well all I'll say is......" is.. I dunno. It rubbed me the wrong way. Sorry.

[sleepyjeff]

I got to wonder.......in Season 3 we have Sun shooting a woman(name escapes me) who Jack is then forced to operate on.

In Season 5 we have little Ben shot by Sayid.....and then taken to the Temple to be healed.

In Season 6 we have Sayid himself the victim of a gunshot wound also taken to the temple to be healed.

Why was the first woman not taken to the temple?

This show is starting to rub me the wrong way:mad:

[BarTopDancer]

I'm digging Rousseau-ified Claire. I wonder if she is "infected" the same way Rousseau's team was. I think Sayid is.

On another board they are thinking Claire is Smoky. I'm going to be pissed if everything and everyone is explained off as being manifestation of Smoky.

[bewitched]

As for the spoiler issue.. yes, if you look it's your own damn fault. But to post something like "well all I'll say is......" is.. I dunno. It rubbed me the wrong way. Sorry.

K, wait...so if I would have said, "When (specific thing) happened to Sayid, it really sucked." would have been fine but, "Nooooo, not Sayid!" isn't.

I see Lost 2 hours before most of you. I try to be very cognizant of the fact that if I come in here and say anything, I might ruin it for others. Having said that, I'm not the only one who sees it in an earlier feed and I do think, since this thread is rife with spoilers, it is my responsibility not to look in here if an episode has been aired and I haven't seen it.

I don't believe what I said spoiled anything...however, I am sincerely sorry if I ruined anyone's viewing of last night's episode.




FWIW...

My commentary was directed at Sayid possibly having been infected and is now "dark". Of all of the characters, I believe Sayid is the one who has redeemed himself the most. To lose that redemption on chance seems unfair. On the other hand, I believe that it further fleshes out the themes of faith, redemption, fate and free will.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yes it's read at your own risk, but when someone starts a post specifically saying they are being cognizant that people haven't seen it yet, I am lead to believe that I can safely read the post w/out there being spoilers. And in my book you posted the equivalent of, "This episode doesn't end well for Sayid." No, there were no specifics, and that's not exactly the biggest shocker in the world, but watching the episode knowing for sure that the green pill was definitely not going to be helping Sayid rather spoiled the dramatic tension of the episode.

I guess I'll follow a strict policy of not opening this thread on Tuesdays.

[bewitched]

Yes it's read at your own risk, but when someone starts a post specifically saying they are being cognizant that people haven't seen it yet, I am lead to believe that I can safely read the post w/out there being spoilers. And in my book you posted the equivalent of, "This episode doesn't end well for Sayid." No, there were no specifics, and that's not exactly the biggest shocker in the world, but watching the episode knowing for sure that the green pill was definitely not going to be helping Sayid rather spoiled the dramatic tension of the episode.

I guess I'll follow a strict policy of not opening this thread on Tuesdays.

As I said, I am sincerely (no sarcasm) sorry that my comment ruined the experience.

[BarTopDancer]

On one hand, it was agreed that once the episode aired it was free game. It's general internet status-quo these days, message boards threads = ok, FB/Twitter = bad. At least in my circles of the internet. On the other hand, with most of LoT in the Pacific time zone sometimes it doesn't occur to not open a thread. At least for me.

I read at Television Without Pity and over there it is my own damn fault if I open their episode specific thread.

Maybe we can use spoiler tags for 24 or 48 hours after airing? That way someone who hasn't caught up (The Lashes as a prime example) can read without being spoiled. Or for that matter, since the Lashes are a week behind, maybe we should just use spoiler tags for a week? It shouldn't be that hard, we do it in movie threads for several weeks after opening date.

Just a suggestion.

[Gn2Dlnd]

I know better than to open this thread until after I've watched the episode. Of course, if someone's watched the episode in some flash-forward time zone before it's available for me, I might forget. Hmm. So, reminder to me, don't open this thread after 6pm on the night the episode airs, until after I've watched it.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Maybe we can use spoiler tags for 24 or 48 hours after airing? How about we just agree not to say "I know you haven't seen it yet on your coast, so I won't post a spoiler...oh wait, yes I will."

It needn't be more complex than that. ;)

[bewitched]

Sheesh.

Okay, hows about I just don't post in this thread until a couple of days after an episode airs? Presumably, that will satisfy everyone.

Trust, if I'd had a freakin' clue that saying, "Nooooo, not Sayid!" was such a episode defining/spoiling statement, I wouldn't have gone anywhere near there...seriously...who the fvck knew?

I regret that my mea culpa is unsatisfactory to some of you. I will make damn sure it doesn't happen again. Presumably, everyone else will take note and learn from my experience as well.

And yeah, I know I'm now being a b!tch. And really, since the horse is now dead, I don't care. :rolleyes:

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I regret that my mea culpa is unsatisfactory to some of you.
I accept your apology (guess I should have said so) - I'm saying that this is a singular occurrence and not something we need to make rules about.

[Stan4dSteph]

Sheesh.

Okay, hows about I just don't post in this thread until a couple of days after an episode airs? Presumably, that will satisfy everyone.I'm just not going to post here anymore. That should solve the pesky problem of me living in the incorrect time zone.

[Snowflake]

Well, since I will only watch Lost when the Brad episode airs, doesn't bother me one iota. ;)

[mousepod]

Since I don't normally post in this thread, it might be inappropriate throw my .02 now, but...

I almost never watch Lost when it's on "live". Sometimes I watch it a day late, sometimes almost a week. Since I know that it starts airing at 5:00 my time on the East Coast, I make sure not to open the thread starting from that moment until the time I've completed watching the episode. The same goes for Survivor.

If this was the Soooo thread, I'd say that spoiler tags would be appropriate, but in a specialized thread like this, why is there even an iota of an issue?

I don't get it.

[BarTopDancer]

I don't get it.

It's LoT, we make things difficult when they don't need to be.

:D

[Gn2Dlnd]

I'm just not going to post here anymore. That should solve the pesky problem of me living in the incorrect time zone.

You can't YAGE from the Lost Thread. The Thread brought you here for a reason, and will bring you back.

[Ghoulish Delight]

If this was the Soooo thread, I'd say that spoiler tags would be appropriate, but in a specialized thread like this, why is there even an iota of an issue?

I don't get it.Again, the only reason I had an issue with it is because the post specifically started by saying it wouldn't have any spoilers.

[sleepyjeff]

You can't YAGE from the Lost Thread. The Thread brought you here for a reason, and will bring you back.


Rolling on the floor laughing my butt off funny.....

:snap: :snap: :snap: :snap: :snap: :snap:

[lashbear]

Don't use spoilers for me, cos I often come here looking to get me some prior knowledge (I read the last page of mystery novels, too.)

You can't YAGE from the Lost Thread. The Thread brought you here for a reason, and will bring you back.
VGn2DLM !!! :snap: :snap: :snap:

[Ghoulish Delight]

Our experience in labor and delivery at a hospital is far too fresh in my memory for that episode. That whole scene was a ridiculous series of, "That would never happen. No way that would happen. Not a chance in hell that would happen."

[sleepyjeff]

I doubt if the following can spoil anything but it is based on spoiler information/speculation so read at your own risk:)



If Hurley plus Sawyer equals Jack, and Sayid minus Hurley equals Locke plus Locke how many Lockes equals Sayid?

[JWBear]

Our experience in labor and delivery at a hospital is far too fresh in my memory for that episode. That whole scene was a ridiculous series of, "That would never happen. No way that would happen. Not a chance in hell that would happen."

But it's the alternate space/time "happy" Lost world. So it's OK! <Tongue firmly in cheek>

I also thought that there was no way Kate would be driving that cab all over LA and not be caught. Every cop in SoCal would be looking for it.

I doubt if the following can spoil anything but it is based on spoiler information/speculation so read at your own risk:)



If Hurley plus Sawyer equals Jack, and Sayid minus Hurley equals Locke plus Locke how many Lockes equals Sayid?



That made my head hurt.

[katiesue]

I also thought that there was no way Kate would be driving that cab all over LA and not be caught. Every cop in SoCal would be looking for it.

I thought that too. And don't cabs have GPS stuff on them so the cab company can see where they are? It's not like NY where there are cabs everywhere, a cab sticks out a litttle more in LA.

[sleepyjeff]

HAPPY LOST DAY!!!

[BarTopDancer]

About tonight's episode

and become the next Jacob... I swear the first thing that came into my mind is the Dread Pirate Roberts. If they turn this into some sort of Princess Bride thing I'm going to be irritated

[Stan4dSteph]

So now we sort of know what the numbers mean, but what happens now that #4 (Locke) is gone?

[BarTopDancer]

So now we sort of know what the numbers mean, but what happens now that #4 (Locke) is gone?

Someone suggested that the equation has changed and the total is now different. It would be hilarious if the sum of the numbers in the end was 42.

There's also the issue of Kate's name not being listed.

Wonder if the blond boy is Aaron, or youngJacob starting over.

[scaeagles]

Maybe aaron is young jacob.

[sleepyjeff]

I am starting to wonder if Aaron, Jacob, Blonde Boy, MiB, Smokie and the Candidate are all one in the same.....which would explain why MiB can't kill Sawyer.

[BarTopDancer]

They can't kill Sawyer because Sawyer brings the sexy.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

So now we sort of know what the numbers meanI still don't understand what they mean. Yeah, Jacob scrawled them on the cave next to people's names, but what does that actually mean?

In the flash-sideways, Locke is still with Helen. During the marriage conversation, Helen suggests they have a Vegas wedding with just her parents and Locke's father. In Locke's original backstory, his father "stole" Locke's kidney and caused Locke to become handicapped. In the FS, Locke is still handicapped and apparently on good terms with his father. So how did he lose the use of his legs in the FS?

[scaeagles]

I caught that too, SM. Found it odd and way too blatant for the writes to miss, right?

[Pirate Bill]

Also, Ben working as a European History teacher in the FS. But Young Ben was on the island in 1977 when the atom bomb went off. How? What? Huh?

[Stan4dSteph]

Also, Ben working as a European History teacher in the FS. But Young Ben was on the island in 1977 when the atom bomb went off. How? What? Huh?I thought all of the women and children were sent away on the sub.

[Pirate Bill]

I thought all of the women and children were sent away on the sub.

Ah. I forgot about that. Now it's not so much a question of "what is he doing there" as it is "what's he going to do now"...being a former inhabitant of the island and all.

[BarTopDancer]

I caught that too, SM. Found it odd and way too blatant for the writes to miss, right?

Nothing is unintentional.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

I'm curious what the significance of Helen's black nailpolish is. Possibly just foreshadowing (sideshadowing?) Locke becoming the Man in Black?

[sleepyjeff]

---If Rose's boss is Hugo, why on Earth didn't she say "hello" to her boss on the plane?


---So far we've seen both Kate and Jack have looks on their faces which indicated some sort of deja vu.....was it just me or did Locke kinda have a lost memory come back to him when he was getting wet from the sprinklers?

---If MiB is stuck with Locke's face(as Illana indicated) does that mean Christian, who appeared to Sun and Lepidus after MiB was seen walking around as Locke IS NOT the Smoke Monster/MiB?

---Are the names we didn't see on the cave wall more significant then the ones we did? Kate? Lepidus? Hume?

[Ghoulish Delight]

---If Rose's boss is Hugo, why on Earth didn't she say "hello" to her boss on the plane?
Maybe she only knew his name, not what he looks like.



---If MiB is stuck with Locke's face(as Illana indicated) does that mean Christian, who appeared to Sun and Lepidus after MiB was seen walking around as Locke IS NOT the Smoke Monster/MiB? Why would it necessarily mean that? She said he's stuck as Locke now, that doesn't mean he couldn't be someone else before. Maybe he can no longer change because Jacob's dead, or some other thing that's changed since he was Christian.


---Are the names we didn't see on the cave wall more significant then the ones we did? Kate? Lepidus? Hume?There's always been allusions to the fact that no all of the survivors were equals. The Others always referred to things like "He's one of the good ones". So the fact that some names are there and others aren't isn't really a surprise. I wouldn't say that the names that aren't there are more significant, it just begs the question of what the difference between the names that are there and the names that aren't is.

[BarTopDancer]

---If Rose's boss is Hugo, why on Earth didn't she say "hello" to her boss on the plane?

Maybe she only knew his name, not what he looks like.

He said he just bought the company. Maybe he didn't own it when they were on the plane. Or, maybe she'd rather not say hi to the owner of a company who may or may not have any idea who she is.

[bewitched]

Or maybe they knew each other and were just sitting in different places therefore not interacting.


Regarding the "candidates" names in the cave and the little blonde boy notLocke was chasing...

23- Shephard

Does it refer to Jack or Aaron (who, since Claire is Christian's daughter is, indeed, a Shepard)?

[Ghoulish Delight]

Does it refer to Jack or Aaron (who, since Claire is Christian's daughter is, indeed, a Shepard)?
Smoked Lox said that Jacob came to each person and guided them to the island, so that wouldn't be Aaron. I suppose it could be since linear time obviously doesn't matter, but it'd be kinda odd that the 6 number would refer to 5 adults and 1 unborn person.

[bewitched]

Smoked Lox said that Jacob came to each person and guided them to the island, so that wouldn't be Aaron. I suppose it could be since linear time obviously doesn't matter, but it'd be kinda odd that the 6 number would refer to 5 adults and 1 unborn person.


But that brings up questions:

Was Christian Shepard (when seen on the island) really Jacob? If so, he touched Aaron.

Why did Claire survive to give birth to Aaron when babies never survived to be born on the island?

Why was Claire hanging out in the cabin where Jacob supposedly dwelt? (Yes, I know most now assume that the being in the cabin was MIB, but was it really?)

Can we believe MIB when he says Jacob was "guiding" them to the island? Or was it a case of redemption? As of now (until proven otherwise), I think anything the MIB says should be viewed with a jaundiced eye, especially when it's pretty clear he's attempting to manipulate Sawyer into his corner. I think it is in his (MIB) best interest to cast doubt on Jacob in order to manipulate things in his favor and prevent the ascendancy of a "substitute".


Another question bothering me is if it was Jacob's list, why hadn't Locke's name already crossed off?

[katiesue]

Couldn't Shephard be Claire as well?

[bewitched]

Couldn't Shephard be Claire as well?

Absolutely.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Why did Claire survive to give birth to Aaron when babies never survived to be born on the island?I seem to recall Juliet mentioning something about the lateness of Claire's term when she arrived on the island which allowed her to survive. But the drug may have also played a part.

[Stan4dSteph]

Couldn't Shephard be Claire as well?But Claire's last name isn't Shephard.

[BarTopDancer]

But Claire's last name isn't Shephard.

Not legally. But her dad is a Shephard. That logic will rule Aaron out since his dad wouldn't be a Shephard.

[katiesue]

But Claire's last name isn't Shephard.

But Sawyer is up there as Ford which is his "real" last name. How do we know that Shephard isn't Claires?

[BarTopDancer]

But Sawyer is up there as Ford which is his "real" last name. How do we know that Shephard isn't Claires?

Claire's last name is Littleton. Probably her mother's last name.

[JWBear]

I don't think it's going to be Claire. She has the "sickness".

Why is it so hard to believe that "Shephard" referrs to Jack?

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Why is it so hard to believe that "Shephard" referrs to Jack?Agreed, especially since in that cave they showed some very specific flashbacks of Jacob touching people, including Jack.

[bewitched]

I don't think it's going to be Claire. She has the "sickness".

Why is it so hard to believe that "Shephard" referrs to Jack?

I think it most likely is Jack.

I do not think it is Claire.

I am intrigued by the possibility of it being Aaron.


I'm still curious as to whose list it really is.

[JWBear]

I love Lostpedia (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page).

These are bits from the current episode's page's (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/The_Substitute)"Cultural References" section:

James Ford is listening to The Stooges' "Search and Destroy." Which contains the lyrics, "I am the world's forgotten boy; the one who searches, searching to destroy," and "I'm the runaway son of a nuclear A-bomb". The lyrics also plead "Somebody gotta save my soul."

The cave that the Man in Black takes Sawyer to can be a reference to this philosophical concept attributed to Plato. The idea that people live their lives and form ideas that are not indicative of reality is mirrored in the Man in Black's view that Jacob manipulated everyone he brought to the Island into believing certain ideas.

Sawyer and the Man in Black descend "Jacob's Ladder" and arrive at a cave formerly inhabited by Jacob. A Jacob's Ladder has significance in both the Jewish and Christian religions, having many interpretations, among them that it is a bridge between heaven and earth. Saint John Climacus (also known as John of the Ladder) wrote a book called "Ladder of the Divine Ascent" which uses Jacob's Ladder as an analogy for the ascetic life. It is frequently read by Orthodox Christians during the Lent season before Easter. The episode "The Substitute" aired the night before the start of non-Orthodox Lent (Ash Wednesday) (which does not coincide with Orthodox Great Lent).

Jacob manipulatess people to the island who are possible candiates for his job and there were only 5 left until the death of locke. Willy Wonka invite's 5 children into his chocolate factory under the guise of a tour so that he can find a replacement.

In one of his flashes-sideways, John Locke (at the time a bald, wheelchair-bound teacher) asks for Earl Grey tea. Given their fondness for all things science fiction, this was likely a nod on the producer's part to Sir Patrick Stewart, who played both Captain Jean-Luc Picard (who always requested Earl Grey tea and was bald) and Professor Charles Xavier (a bald, wheelchair-bound teacher).

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Wow, Willy Wonka. Talk about throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. :rolleyes:

[JWBear]

The producers are known to purposely load the show with cultural references. Is the Wonka resemblance intentional or a coincidence? I don't know, but I wouldn't put it past them.

[Ghoulish Delight]

The Wonka seems particularly like a stretch since it starts out with, "If you remove one of the people, THEN it matches exactly!" I always question a "reference" that relies on "if you change something about this situation, it totally matches this other situation."

[lashbear]

So are we going to refer to him as:
MIB
Smoky
NotLocke
Unlocke
Smoked Lox

We should try to keep our nomenclature the same so we don't get confused ;)

I quite like Unlocke, but since he has been other people as well, then MIB (Man In Black) also gets my vote.

What do Y'all think?

[Ghoulish Delight]

I will continue to refer to him with whatever name carries the most comedic effect at the time of posting.

[scaeagles]

Around my office he is referred to as Flock, for Fake Locke.

[katiesue]

I also saw LockeNess used somewhere.

[RStar]

I've been calling him Smokey Locke for lack of a better name. But I like UnLocke!

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Smocke?

[sleepyjeff]

Ah, remember the oh so innocent days of "Nothenry" and "Benry"?

I am not 100% sure this fake Locke character is the MiB so for now I am just going to go with -Fake Locke-, or Flocke if that is preferred.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

I am not 100% sure this fake Locke character is the MiBReally? Why? Seems to me they've made every effort to make that clear.

[scaeagles]

Which is why he probably isn't.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Which is why he probably isn't.Riiiight. If that's the way we're going, then what exactly is the basis of any conversation regarding the show again?

[bewitched]

Riiiight. If that's the way we're going, then what exactly is the basis of any conversation regarding the show again?

Rampant speculation?

[lashbear]

The Internet Anagram Server ("I, Rearrangement Servant") says that "John Locke Smokey" really is:

Shlock Omen Jokey

It all fits.

[bewitched]

Whom did the blond headed kid (Jacob? Aaron?) mean when he said, "you can't kill him." to NotLocke?

Hmmm...the 1st time around I thought he meant Jacob. But now I don't. Did he mean Sawyer?

And what's up with Sawyer being able to see him but not Richard?

[SzczerbiakManiac]

Because Sawyer is a "candidate"?
<shrug>

[Ghoulish Delight]

He was behind Richard, he could have run away before Richard turned around.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Rampant speculation?You mean, ignore what actually happened on the show and make things up? Ask endless questions about things they have already made clear?

IMO, running around in circles for no reason other than to show that we're "thinking outside the box" clutters the conversation to the point where the real questions up for debate are lost in the noise.

[sleepyjeff]

Seems to me they've made every effort to make that clear.

Such as?

I lean towards thinking Flocke and MiB are the same person(after all, Jacob did say "looks like you found that loophole") but I do have some doubts.

[JWBear]

IIRC the lost producers have confirmed that it is smokey/MiB that is now in Locke's form. I'll try and dig it up after work today.

[Cadaverous Pallor]

Such as?

I lean towards thinking Flocke and MiB are the same person(after all, Jacob did say "looks like you found that loophole") but I do have some doubts.Such as? The quote you just provided is proof enough.

[bewitched]

You mean, ignore what actually happened on the show and make things up? Ask endless questions about things they have already made clear?

IMO, running around in circles for no reason other than to show that we're "thinking outside the box" clutters the conversation to the point where the real questions up for debate are lost in the noise.

There's always the possibility of a differing perspective on what is, and is not, clear.

Not to mention the fact that rampent speculation is sometimes fun.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Looking at the list of names (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Candidate) on Lostpedia (not sure if all of the lighthouse names have made it up there yet...actually I know they haven't because Wallace at 108 isn't listed_ a couple observations:

1. Miles is alive, but his name is crossed out. Last we saw Rose, she was alive and her name is crossed out, though we don't know what happened to her and Bernard after the bomb/flash. Claire's name is also crossed out, questionable whether she should be counted as "alive"

2. Kate is the only name that isn't crossed out that has a number that isn't one of The Numbers.

I'm racking my brain, I forget how Jack learned that Claire's his sister.

[BarTopDancer]

Looking at the list of names (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Candidate) on Lostpedia (not sure if all of the lighthouse names have made it up there yet...actually I know they haven't because Wallace at 108 isn't listed_ a couple observations:

1. Miles is alive, but his name is crossed out. Last we saw Rose, she was alive and her name is crossed out, though we don't know what happened to her and Bernard after the bomb/flash. Claire's name is also crossed out, questionable whether she should be counted as "alive"

2. Kate is the only name that isn't crossed out that has a number that isn't one of The Numbers.

Not sure if the crossed out means alive or dead, instead I am thinking it's candidate vs. not candidate.

I'm racking my brain, I forget how Jack learned that Claire's his sister.

I think he found the name and staked out the house in Australia. Or Christian told him on the island. I know it sounds like I am randomly thinking of things but those two stick out in my mind.

----------

It was established last week, or the week before that MIB has taken Locke's shape. [blanking on her name] said he couldn't change shape now.

Rampant speculation was super fun the first 5 seasons. They are answering questions (more than they are tossing up new ones) and to start speculating on the answers they are giving us is going to provide a never-ending story. Established canon (answered questions) is canon no matter how much fanon wants to be something else.

[JWBear]

They answered where the numbers come from. Cool.

Soooo.... Any bets on who David's mother is?

[BarTopDancer]

They answered where the numbers come from. Cool.

Soooo.... Any bets on who David's mother is?

Kate is a criminal on the run and wouldn't have a house
Claire is his sister
He doesn't seem to have any ethnic traits so I am guessing Sun, Rose and Anna Lucia are out.


That leaves Juliet, Shannon and Danielle. I'll guess Danielle.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Could be his wife from his original life.

[BarTopDancer]

Could be his wife from his original life.

It's LOST!, it can't be that simple ;)

[bewitched]

Well, it's not tomorrow, but since "spoilering" (if not speculation) is rampant...

Who the f is "Wallace"? (At 108*, the point Hurley was told to turn the wheel to.) Speaking of which...Lighthouse wheel/Donkey wheel; how are they related?

Cave= dark= MIB
Lighthouse= light= Jacob
(I just KNOW it's not going to be that cut and dry)

Christian and MIB are not one and the same. Claire said she was hanging with her father and a "friend"-- friend=NotLocke. So, who (or what) the hell is Christian?

I read on another board that "Littleton" was on the lighthouse list...I didn't see it myself though.

"Linus" was crossed out. (Did anyone catch the #?)

Question for anyone who remembers from a few seasons ago:

Ben had a list of survivors; was it a list just of the kids, or of "candidates"? I wonder where he got said list because he thought he had been interacting with Jacob the whole time when I think it's somewhat clear that he had actually been being guided by MIB all along which brings up another thought...

Jacob said it was too late for the people still at the temple because someone (something?) bad was coming (to the temple); which leads one to wonder if Miles will be around (or eligible) for much longer (possibly why his name is crossed out). Everyone assumes the temple is Jacob's domain but is it really MIB's instead (after all, Smokey dwelt there at some point)?


And maybe I'm just contrary but I have to say that a big part of the fun of Lost (even in this last season) is continuing speculation on what it all means, including whether or not what we've been told (or led to believe) is the truth is, in fact, such. But that's me.

[bewitched]

Kate is a criminal on the run and wouldn't have a house
Claire is his sister
He doesn't seem to have any ethnic traits so I am guessing Sun, Rose and Anna Lucia are out.


That leaves Juliet, Shannon and Danielle. I'll guess Danielle.

Danielle's too old.

There's Libby, Penelope, Ilana (my personal choice based on David's coloring and her connection with Jacob), Charlotte, Nikki, hmmm...it seems like I'm still missing a couple....

[bewitched]

I think there's been a lot of speculation about one of the overriding themes of the show being free will vs destiny. Jack has always done what "needed" to be done; what he "should" do. What if he is offered the world (or the island, as the case may be), and he chooses not to take it? It has certainly been hinted that he is the chosen one.


(I'd really like to hear Alex's ruminations on how/whether free will plays into any of this.)

[bewitched]

I'm racking my brain, I forget how Jack learned that Claire's his sister.

It was at Christian Shepard's funeral (Claire's mother told Jack she'd lost her daughter on flight 815).

[Ghoulish Delight]

Christian and MIB are not one and the same. Claire said she was hanging with her father and a "friend"-- friend=NotLocke. So, who (or what) the hell is Christian?

But she was clearly aware that, while he looks like Locke, he's not Locke. So I don't think it rules out, and I think it remains by far most likely, that Christian is MIB/Smokey and she's just on board with the shape-shifting. Especially since MIB-as-Locke didn't exist for most of the 3 years she said she spent with "her friend".

Linus was 117. Forgot to add him to the alive-and-crossed out list.

And maybe I'm just contrary but I have to say that a big part of the fun of Lost (even in this last season) is continuing speculation on what it all means, including whether or not what we've been told (or led to believe) is the truth is, in fact, such. But that's me.Surely, but at some point the "throw absolutely everything at the wall and see what sticks" becomes overkill. Sure, the CIA could be giving mind controlling drugs to the Loch Ness Monster who is actually a diplomatic emissary from the race of aliens that crashed in Roswell and that actually created the island to amuse their child-king, and that absolutely nothing we've been shown for the last 6 seasons ever actually happened in the character's universe. But that would seem to have made creating 6 seasons of show that showed something completely different a pointless exercise for the producers.

There are already plenty of mysteries on the table. For instance, what exactly are "candidates" and what does "replacing Jacob" mean? What are Jacob and MIB, why are they so interested in candidates. Why are these people we've been following candidates, and how do the concepts of free will vs. destiny come into play? That's a TON to think and speculate about without further assuming that the little we do no is simply wrong. Actually, I find it far more interesting to assume everything is true, just true in a way that we don't yet understand. So when they show the name "Shephard", associated with one of the #'s that Jack has been dealing with, and then immediately show Jack, speculating that somehow the name might refer to some other people that aren't even named Shepherd...just seems an unnecessary distraction.

Of course, then there's the whole MIB-out-of-nowhere crap. I still call b.s. on that, so maybe the Locke Ness monster isn't far behind, what do I know.

[Ghoulish Delight]

It was at Christian Shepard's funeral (Claire's mother told Jack she'd lost her daughter on flight 815).
Aaaaah, right, thank you!

[Ghoulish Delight]

Well, it's not tomorrow, but since "spoilering" (if not speculation) is rampant...
Since Gemini Cricket doesn't watch the show, there's no one west of Pacific Time that's watching, once it's aired in Pacific Time spoilers are fair game.

[bewitched]

But she was clearly aware that, while he looks like Locke, he's not Locke. So I don't think it rules out, and I think it remains by far most likely, that Christian is MIB/Smokey and she's just on board with the shape-shifting. Especially since MIB-as-Locke didn't exist for most of the 3 years she said she spent with "her friend".

But she made a distinction between her father and her "friend" and that she lived with both of them. She then specifically referred to NotLocke as her "friend" (i.e. not her father).

[bewitched]

Duh. 108= sum of the "candidate" numbers.

But still, WTF is Wallace?

[Ghoulish Delight]

She said "her father"? I missed that. When Jin first asked her if she'd been alone, she said, "No, I was with my friend". Then when somked lox arrived she said, "This is my friend". I never heard "father".

[BarTopDancer]

She said "her father"? I missed that. When Jin first asked her if she'd been alone, she said, "No, I was with my friend". Then when somked lox arrived she said, "This is my friend". I never heard "father".

Two different sentences - one was that her "father" told her who took Aaron. The other was she was "with my friend".

It is possible that Christian was MIB when they all left. For all we know, if Smoky wasn't stuck in Locke form now (done for a purpose obviously) he'd still shapeshift into Christian. But Smoky is stuck in Lockeform from now until they tell us otherwise - which I don't think will happen since IIlana (that's her name!) said he can't change anymore.

[Ghoulish Delight]

Yeah, other resources confirmed, I just missed the line. That does open the possibility that Christian isn't MIB, if she makes a distinction between NotLocke and her "father". Or it may just mean she's confused, or purposely misled.

[SzczerbiakManiac]

For those who were still on the fence* about FLocke being the Smoke Monster, we now have 100% confirmation from multiple sources. Last night's enhanced version of "Substitute" confirmed that FLocke is the Smoke Monster. In addition, Darlton unequivocally stated the same thing on the most recent Lost Podcast.


*I was not part of that group

[Ghoulish Delight]

Ben had a list of survivors; was it a list just of the kids, or of "candidates"? I wonder where he got said list because he thought he had been interacting with Jacob the whole time when I think it's somewhat clear that he had actually been being guided by MIB all along which brings up another thought...
Actually, Ben admitted to never having seen Jacob. So perhaps he never interacted with either Jacob or MIB and just lied the whole time. Though he certainly could have spoken with one of them, thinking it was Jacob, without actually having seen them.

[Gemini Cricket]

I saw the actor who plays Ben on The Soup the other day. He's pretty funny!